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Old 10-11-2021, 10:23 PM   #1
PlanoDano
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Default More reloading questions

As far as reloading I have always said I did not need another hobby but I have now made the jump. A few beginner questions.

1. load data from different sources has big difference in Max load
example 7mm-08 with 162 eld-x Staball 6.5
hornady max 45.7 gr.
hodgdon max 47.8
which do you believe, start with most conservative and work up if necessary.

2. On the internet I see people shooting 3 round groups to pick a load
a. is this enough shots per load?
b. I have always shot better than anyone I shoot with but I know I am capable of pulling a shot, or adding torque. Will something like a leadsled help? (looking at leadsled dft 2) I have never used one of these and am suspect that they might even increase the odds for error.

3. The spray on lube on the case after you run the brass through the sizing die. Is it really necessary to remove it? If so when? just before priming?
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Old 10-11-2021, 11:22 PM   #2
DFWPI
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I am no professional by any means, but dabble. I lube the cases, remove the primer and resize and then have started throwing them in my sconic cleaner.

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Last edited by DFWPI; 10-11-2021 at 11:44 PM.
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Old 10-12-2021, 12:23 AM   #3
Kong
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Number 1 is start on the bottom end and let the gun tell you what the max load is, just find the sweet spot and look for pressure signs. The max loads vary for a multitude of reasons and is merely a number on a piece paper I pay little attention to. Let the gun decide,

2a Itís personal preference but I typically shoot 3 unless I feel like I shanked one for whatever reason

2b Lead Sleds are awesome and will help tremendously but be warned their really hard on the optics. I have a few but I prefer a heavy 18Ē sand bad that pinches the gun yet still letís it move some.

3 Yes you want it removed IMO to keep it out of the chamber for the most part but you can run what you brung if you wanted to a skip it.
I run my brass through a media tumbler just prior to priming but then again Iím OCD so you may choose to go a completely different route


These are my opinions and if you ask 10 people your likely to get 12 answers but itís all simple if you work your way up on the powder and pay close attention to pressure signs.
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Old 10-12-2021, 12:15 PM   #4
LWD
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On 1, there's a few possibilities. Some powders have a great deal of lot-to-lot variation. With Win760/H414 it's not uncommon to see 2+ grains difference from one lot to another. I have no experience with StaBall 6.5, so I don't know if that's the case. It could also be from different testing methodologies or equipment. The Hornady data starts at 38.6 grains; the Hodgdon data starts at 42.5 grains. This is interesting as the Hornady spans more grains than the Hodgdon. It's a wider spread—7.1 grains versus 5.3. I would have expected them to be closer. I don't have a good answer for you, but this is odd. Start low and work up.

On 2, if it's a hunting rifle, I do 3. If it's a target or varmint gum I'll do 5.

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Old 10-12-2021, 12:53 PM   #5
Mike D
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1). There are many variables and different test methods that are not consistent across manufacturers. Also some people like Hodgdon will use a generic bullet and provide a safe load that will work with multiple bullets.

2). I would avoid the lead sled. Like stated above they are hard on the rifle and especially optics and in some cases can introduce bad habits. You likely wonít have the lead sled when hunting so donít use it as a crutch on the bench.

3). Depending on the case lube you may not have to remove it. Hornady one shot dries and leaves little to no residue and it claimed to not need removal. I use imperial case wax so it should be removed.


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Old 10-12-2021, 06:19 PM   #6
Texas Grown
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Since this is new to you, and for saftey's sake, pick one powder in your book's list for that cartridge. And start 10% below max. Then work up to max with that powder only. I like five 3-shot groups or three five shot groups with one weight of powder. And look for signs of pressure on each case after each shot. Take notes. And review when I get home for a journal on a given gun. After all that, I advance the powder load. How much depends on the powder, the cartridge, and how much the case will hold before reaching the "recommended Max Load". If you do not know what to look for as to cases and excessive high pressure, just do a little research on it. Some of the books will help you out in this area. The Hornady 3rd Edition book used to be my secondary bible when I was first starting. And was pretty accurate on most load data back then. I've since upgraded and taken on more since some things change over time.

Remember, not all guns are the same. Some will handle greater pressures than others. Some will exhibit higher pressures with one powder that another gun of the same or similar make may not reach. That's why it's always best to start low and work up. They are all different, just like people. And each has certain powders it likes, just like each person likes differnt foods.


Edit: I agree with MikeD's #2 and #3 (as well as #1). And would like to add about the case lube. I do not know if your doing this. But cases get lubed before being sized. Running a case without lube could get you a stuck case. (Again, I don't know if that is what you meant.)



And if you need to trim your brass, do so after resizing. And not before.

Last edited by Texas Grown; 10-12-2021 at 06:30 PM.
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Old 10-13-2021, 01:22 AM   #7
PlanoDano
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Thanks all.
1. All agree, start low and work up. Texas Grown added to pick one powder. I will do this as I was going to try three (h380, h4350, and staBall 6.5), I will pick one.

2. All agree Lead Sled is hard on rifle especially optics. Kong and LWD mention it can help with accuracy when developing loads. My concern was that while being a good shot, is my good accurate enough for load development with 3 round groups.
Caldwell treats Vets very good so I ordered one just in case. I have sold and gave away (to family) guns and scopes to where I am supporting only 3 cartridges. I am only running NF optics now so they might get a test.

3. I used hotshot and was surprised how normal it felt after drying and sizing hence the question. I have already primed the cases and decided to take a few minutes with shop towel to each case before adding powder. Next batch I will pass through vibrator between sizing and priming.
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Old 10-13-2021, 08:18 AM   #8
muzzlebrake
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I have a lead sled that I haven't used in 20+ years.
I used bags until recently when I found one of these. Good for shooting off the bench at local ranges. https://www.amazon.com/Caldwell-Stin.../dp/B01N1W0X31
I still like my bags and bipods for some stuff as it is much easier and simple to use.
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Old 10-13-2021, 08:29 AM   #9
Kong
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You absolutely need to pick one powder at a time to play with and as far as the Lead Sled goes, if you use it sparingly you will be fine to develop a load. If you have cheap optics your results will probably not be favorable when your finished if you use it a bunch but if you have higher end optics they will normally take a beating for a while before giving up the ghost.
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Old 10-13-2021, 02:12 PM   #10
PlanoDano
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kong View Post
You absolutely need to pick one powder at a time to play with and as far as the Lead Sled goes, if you use it sparingly you will be fine to develop a load. If you have cheap optics your results will probably not be favorable when your finished if you use it a bunch but if you have higher end optics they will normally take a beating for a while before giving up the ghost.
I have moved almost exclusively to NightForce simply because I want durability. The only problem is they are not light.
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Old 10-13-2021, 08:35 PM   #11
Mike D
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PlanoDano View Post
I have moved almost exclusively to NightForce simply because I want durability. The only problem is they are not light.

And unless you are running the ATACR the glass is just ok.


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Old Yesterday, 08:42 AM   #12
imyomama
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so many variables ... keep in mind pressures may change in summer vs cold winter depending on the powder you use .. my 308 loads make the bolt hard to open some times in hot weather.

personally i'd work my way up and watch your chrono .. speed is the best indication along with watching your primers.

getting that 3 rd test is just the beginning of finding your sweet spot .. bullet seating depth and throat erosion will play a part too depending on the caliber you shoot and how much you shoot... Friend of mine started shooting matches frequently and he was blown away how much those variables change in his 6mm creed. at the rate he shoots , he will be putting in a new barrel every year ... but he has noticed the numbers change even during the season ... it doesn't take long to shoot a few thousands rounds a year once you get into this game , and extended shooting strings are hard on barrels too.. if you don't shoot allot and LR , i don't think you'd notice .. but if you do and keep a log , it starts to show in the data...

all i'm trying to say is, it's going to be a constant trial and error game , especially if you shoot allot ..

my2c.
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Old Yesterday, 09:19 AM   #13
muzzlebrake
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And every time you replace the barrel you have to start all over again because no two barrels are ever exactly the same. Then there is the new barrel break in and so on. As the barrel wears and throats erode down toward the muzzle chamber pressures drop and velocity changes and recipes have to be adjusted etc etc etc. Fun and games
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