Trad guys: Longbow arrow flight help

[DRT]

Chew…Have you bareshaft indexed your shaft rotation? Which direction are your shafts turning whilst naked?

I rewatched your slo mo and it looks like your shaft is oscillating/paradoxing counterclock wise. Then the fletchings take over and kick the shaft to a clockwise spin.

There's a lot of discussion on this. Mainly about all shafts having a natural rotation.
A good discussion on AT in the general archery section.

https://r.tapatalk.com/shareLink/topic?url=https://www.archerytalk.com/threads/which-way-does-you-arrow-naturally-spin-bare-shaft.6041049/&share_tid=6041049&share_fid=16462&share_type=t&link_source=app

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[Bisch]

Bobby, you don’t need to worry about that!!

Bisch


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[Sika]

If I execute anything other than a perfect release arrow flight is severely affected - it will fishtail. A stiffer arrow will exhibit this more, because it will not correct as easily.

[Bisch]

Trad guys: Longbow arrow flight help

Any arrow that is not spined correctly will exhibit crappy arrow flight. The more off of correct that the spine is, the worse the flight will be. It dosen’t matter if it’s too weak or too stiff. A crappy release will also make an arrow go wonky, but if the tune is good, it should correct itself quicker/better than if not tuned well.

Bisch


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[DRT]

Bobby, you don’t need to worry about that!!

Bisch


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I doubt most of us need to worry about that. But it's kind of interesting.

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[Briar Friar]

I have six arrows that are all fletched. Not quite to the point of starting over with bare shafting. Everything I read said left-wing helical right-wing helical doesn't matter so how could it switch directions in mid-flight? I'm open to any discussion on the laws of physics. [emoji16][emoji16]

But I think I see what your saying.

It may not be a problem. However if true…

First… its squandered/ usurped energy…initial kinetic energy squandered mid range translates to lessened down range energy. I prefer to complement the rotational energy (maybe centripetal force) not redirect it. Go left go left go left GO RIGhT! No rifle shooter would dream of redirecting bullet spin after its left the barrel…it would destabilze the projectiles flight, trajectory and effective range. Same same but different.

Second…it may be whats causing your erratic flight…its what happened with my current setup. I am shooting right handed and was right fletched with a funky flight. Bareshafts told me I had consitent form, correct spine and a left spin. I fletched left and funk went away. Drift will likely occur and does change sight alignment to sight picture.

My other longbow… arrows… are fletched right because thats where the bareshafts told me they were going. I know one of our TBH Wheel bow Gurus shoots right handed Prime but fletches left helical for his wheel bow…because thats what his bareshaft rotation told him to fletch for.

Field experiment…Load up in your vehicle and drive circles left really fast then yank the steering wheel right. Though the vehicle goes right…the vehicle mass rolls left. Yank hard enough right and the vehicle will rollover to the left not the right. Same same but different.

The perceived CCW rotation may be simply from contact of some sorts.

Consider shucking fletches off at least one shaft for continual form training purposes and immediate bareshaft rotation indexing.

[Chew]

It may not be a problem. However if true…

First… its squandered/ usurped energy…initial kinetic energy squandered mid range translates to lessened down range energy. I prefer to complement the rotational energy (maybe centripetal force) not redirect it. Go left go left go left GO RIGhT! No rifle shooter would dream of redirecting bullet spin after its left the barrel…it would destabilze the projectiles flight, trajectory and effective range. Same same but different.

Second…it may be whats causing your erratic flight…its what happened with my current setup. I am shooting right handed and was right fletched with a funky flight. Bareshafts told me I had consitent form, correct spine and a left spin. I fletched left and funk went away. Drift will likely occur and does change sight alignment to sight picture.

My other longbow… arrows… are fletched right because thats where the bareshafts told me they were going. I know one of our TBH Wheel bow Gurus shoots right handed Prime but fletches left helical for his wheel bow…because thats what his bareshaft rotation told him to fletch for.

Field experiment…Load up in your vehicle and drive circles left really fast then yank the steering wheel right. Though the vehicle goes right…the vehicle mass rolls left. Yank hard enough right and the vehicle will rollover to the left not the right. Same same but different.

The perceived CCW rotation may be simply from contact of some sorts.

Consider shucking fletches off at least one shaft for continual form training purposes and immediate bareshaft rotation indexing.

Good stuff. I feel like I'm at an engineering lecture at A&M.

Is it even possible to see the rotation direction on a bareshaft? I have trouble picking it up with it fletched.

[DRT]

They say mark the shaft with a sharpie at 12 o'clock on the string. Shoot it at 3 to 5 feet into the target and see if it indexes clockwise or counter clockwise.
Personally I think it's bull****.

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[Briar Friar]

What DRT said. A loose nock fit in the shaft could show erroneous rotation…a dab of hot melt glue will help fix the nock in the shaft.

I got started on this path after I read some old archery books and periodicals of oldtimers shooting RH but fletching LH to accomodate the natural shaft rotation and fletching clearance.

Conversely…Devils Advocate…Ive read on here and elsewheres where too much spin can detract from penetration. Ive been tinkering with straight fletched but right wing feathers to spin the arrows more slowly left.

[Briar Friar]

Reapplying deleted spake:

After raising, killing and shucking my own turkeys, cutting feathers and fletching my arrows…I have found that the outer side of right wings curve right thereby forcing the wing left. Outerside of left wings curve left thereby forcing the wing right. Synopsis…use left wing for right helical and right rotation. Use right wing for left helical and left rotation. I think this may be counter to common conception.

[CamoQuest]

On two different bows from about 6' I get an 11 o'clock counter clockwise spin. That's starting with a mark at 12 o'clock. I haven't tried any of our other trad bows.

Coming from a compound background, my target arrows were fletched to match the spin of whichever bow they were shot from. Two bows had left helical, one had right. Same applied to Daniel's bows and arrows. The two strings that shot right helical were made by the same builder, the other strings were built by someone else and had a different direction to the twist. I'm pretty OCD with arrows, and I felt better knowing they spun true once leaving the bow. I've been fletching this way for a while, ever since I watched a video from Levi Morgan on the topic. Not that I'll ever match Levi, lol, but hey, if it makes a person feel better...

[CamoQuest]

Reapplying deleted spake:

After raising, killing and shucking my own turkeys, cutting feathers and fletching my arrows…I have found that the outer side of right wings curve right thereby forcing the wing left. Outerside of left wings curve left thereby forcing the wing right. Synopsis…use left wing for right helical and right rotation. Use right wing for left helical and left rotation. I think this may be counter to common conception.

That's interesting. Now I'm going to have to go look at our wild feathers, vs the left wing and right wing that are store bought. I wonder if the curve is the same.

[DRT]

There was also discussion on serving wrap direction influence on arrow rotation.


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[Briar Friar]

That's interesting. Now I'm going to have to go look at our wild feathers, vs the left wing and right wing that are store bought. I wonder if the curve is the same.

Darn goofy thing is the front end of the tucked/inner portion of a left wing feather will work for left fletching and left rotation because it has a slight right curve…but not the whole thing. The tip end of the upper part of a left wing curves upwards which subsequently is to the left…which will promote a right rotation.

I hope I got that correct.

About a year or two ago…I was given some supposed left wing commercial feathers for left fletch and got to comparing after my turkey slaughter then realized they were actually left wing uppers and promoted right rotation due to left curvature
I was stumped had to dig around and figure aerodynamics of a wing (bird/airplane) to break down low pressure and high pressure relating to lift and torque.
“Why did God develop feathers that create high pressure and low pressure on the same side of feather?” Lift and torque

[mikebyrge]

Just seeing this Bobby but I’ve got 125gr broad heads and field points. I’m “old school” but I bet a 1916 alum arrow with a 125-150 grain head head would be good.

I’ve got some fletched if you want to try them.