Question for the LEO

[flyby]

I realize he could never admit it or else risk being sued for harassment, but like I said, I would never do that if he was simply trying to protect us all in any way possible.

Nope, pretext stops are perfectly legal. I often tell people I make LOTS of stops for minor violations. Not to write tickets, but looking for dope. I'm K9, so that's a large part of my job. You can call it harassment, but it's not. And from what you said, I would say he was looking for narcotics. Same type of questions I ask.

[Lungbustr]

Nope, pretext stops are perfectly legal. I often tell people I make LOTS of stops for minor violations. Not to write tickets, but looking for dope. I'm K9, so that's a large part of my job. You can call it harassment, but it's not. And from what you said, I would say he was looking for narcotics. Same type of questions I ask.

So for you, you get the legal pretext stop for whatever violation. At this point no matter what, you have the right to have the dog sniff the exterior of the vehicle if you choose to, correct?

[PSD Ryan]

So for you, you get the legal pretext stop for whatever violation. At this point no matter what, you have the right to have the dog sniff the exterior of the vehicle if you choose to, correct?

No. We have to be reasonable in the time it takes to get the dog there, and we have to have reasonable suspicion. For example, the stop i described with the meth i got. Had i asked to search and she said no, because she was leaving a location known for narcotics (with the reports and personal experience to back that up), engaged in activity known for narcotics (playing the gambling machines for an extended period of time), and she was really nervous, I've got enough reasonable suspicion i could have asked for a dog for a free air sniff.

If i see a car just driving, stop it, ask to search, and they say no, but i don't have any reason to believe they have narcotics, I'm probably not so good to waste 15 minutes of their time (and mine) waiting for a dog.

That's part of why a good line of questioning is important on random stops where you don't have much else to go on.

[Jon Stewart]

Been retired for 16 years and my last 10 years was plain clothes so it has been 26 years since I was a patrol officer but I do remember that all or most of my stops were called in. The best I can remember I always identified why the stop was made but I asked a lot of questions before releasing the driver even though most of the time a warning was given. That is police work. Most of the time a drivers mouth gets them a ticket rather than a warning. Officers are out there protecting people unknown to them, trying to keep the peace and in most cases helping people.

I know every officer on here could tell stories about their jobs experiences forever but here is one example I would like to give. I was in a marked unit at a 4 way stop when I observed a car approaching the stop and not slowing down. The driver ran the 4 way stop. I pulled the driver over, approached and I noticed the driver was holding his license and other required info in his hand and out of the drivers window. I asked if he knew what he had done and he told me"Officer I was driving with my head up my ***". I went back to the cruiser and checked the driver out on LEIN . He came back clean so I walked up , handed him his paperwork and told him to have a good day. He got out of his car and asked me why I didn't give him a ticket. I told him if he would have asked me why I stopped him, I would have written him a ticket. He thanked me and drove off. I know to this day that guy will never run that sign again.

On the other hand if I am asking few questions and as someone suggested on here, I am told it is none of my business, that person would get a ticket.

I would ask that all cooperate with LEO when contacted. If you have done nothing wrong you should have nothing to worry about. These are really bad times out there for LEO who are trying to do their jobs protecting the public.

[IowaHunter]

This is an interesting thread.

I got pulled over for speeding last fall in KS. I was doing 74 in a 55. Hand the guy my license, CHL, and insurance. He comes back and says, "Thanks for carrying, more good people need to do that." Still got the ticket but we had a good chat on guns. It was my first ticket in 19 years. He'd make a great neighbor and Texan.

[jcso139]

Well every situation is different. Im not rude or an a-hole just for the sake of it. If they just act normal and friendly so am I, obviously this is optimal for all parties. If they wanna pry and try to ask a bunch of unnecessary questions I stop that immediately. Sometimes I just laugh at them and their silly questions. Like when I get pulled over on the way to work and the first thing I get asked by a really strange cop is if I have ever been arrested for burglary or broken into houses. No moron, these dark colored clothes that say Exxon on them are FRC's and I'm obviously not out breaking into houses at 4am, I'm heading to work. It takes all kinds to make the world go round I guess. Some of these guys either have an extremely steep learning curve ahead or need to find new employment. To be a good cop you really need to be a people person on some level you know? Some folks are strange and just don't have it.

Funny you say that about wearing an Exxon shirt and being stopped.......about 4 years ago I stopped a vehicle in high drug/prostitution area because he was acting suspicious and was about 3am and as I had seen him driving around in the area for over an hour.....long story short he had an Exxon shirt and had been working for Exxon for 35 year and admitted he was looking for prostitute before work.....people have skeletons. He was extremely embarrassed and I hope changed his ways.

[Artos]

It sure makes a difference in regards to how often you get pulled over & the type of ride you are in. We have more per capita LE down here in deep S.TX than anywhere in the nation I reckon...seems like every hotel on 83 is stocked up with Black & Whites, BP, GW, etc.

Right now my daily drive can be anywhere from 250-400 miles per day & I will admit I speed, but rarely ever over 5mph as safety/citations are really kinda tied to staying employed. I simply don't get pulled over or tail gated by LE any longer being in a white 3/4 ton truck.

Now when I was in my later model Z71 Suburban that screamed narco-mobile, I was getting pulled over contstantly...swerving (my favorite, after following for 10-15 mins), speeding & other excuses to check out my cased vehicle.

[jshouse]

Well every situation is different. Im not rude or an a-hole just for the sake of it. If they just act normal and friendly so am I, obviously this is optimal for all parties. If they wanna pry and try to ask a bunch of unnecessary questions I stop that immediately. Sometimes I just laugh at them and their silly questions. Like when I get pulled over on the way to work and the first thing I get asked by a really strange cop is if I have ever been arrested for burglary or broken into houses. No moron, these dark colored clothes that say Exxon on them are FRC's and I'm obviously not out breaking into houses at 4am, I'm heading to work. It takes all kinds to make the world go round I guess. Some of these guys either have an extremely steep learning curve ahead or need to find new employment. To be a good cop you really need to be a people person on some level you know? Some folks are strange and just don't have it.

i have a buddy that stopped a guy in a rental wearing slacks and a nice polo with the logo of a very large international company on it, the guys story was he was a safety inspector and was on his way to Memphis to teach a fire safety class. among some generic fire safety pamphlets/paperwork in the back seat he had a brand new fire extinguisher that happened to have about 15lbs of heroin inside of it. it all came out during the interview.

[Wayno]

All of this is good info, but I just want to say again, I appreciate all the LEO's work in trying to keep crime off the streets. I am always courteous and respectful to them and appreciate it when they are courteous and respectful to me. They are welcome to pull me over any time if this is what they are doing...as long as I don't get a ticket.

[jshouse]

i have a buddy that stopped a guy in a rental wearing slacks and a nice polo with the logo of a very large international company on it, the guys story was he was a safety inspector and was on his way to Memphis to teach a fire safety class. among some generic fire safety pamphlets/paperwork in the back seat he had a brand new fire extinguisher that happened to have about 15lbs of heroin inside of it. it all came out during the interview.

and what I meant to say at the end was that a large majority of officers would see what the guy is wearing, listen to his story, and issue a citation or a warning and be done. "interdiction guys" dig deeper and ask questions, this guys interview and story details were horrible, and that's what got him caught.

[systemnt]

Couldve been looking for a new career.

[GarGuy]

Let me preface this story with the fact that i totally support what yall are doing. You just have to be careful. Here is one first hand.

When i was managing a Walmart Supercenter, one of my pharmacist was shapely, 30 year old black girl. Supper smart and ambitious young lady who was living with a railroad engineer. Well one night, he had to pull out on a train at 3am for a several day run and didnt want to leave his vehicle on the yard. She got up, pulled on(only) a gown and flipflops, hopped in his Mercedes and dropped him off at work 4 miles away. No purse, no wallet, no ID. She headed home to get a little more sleep before she had to be at work at 8am.

She is driving home when a city police stopped her and gave no reason for the stop. He asked her where she had been and she told him. He asked who the car belonged to..once again she told him. Now understand she was very scantly dressed and he ordered her out of the car. She refused and asked what grounds he had for the stop. She tried to phone her fellow but the cop grabbed her phone out of her hand and drug her out the window. She resisted Im sure! That resulted in her being thrown on the ground , cuffed, and hauled to the jail holding area where she was cuffed to a chair and forced to sit there with all kinds of drunks jeering at her near nudity.

Shortly after 8am, she was allowed to call the store as she was terribly frightened that she would loose her job and Rx lic. As soon as the police chief made it to work, we were able to explain and she was shortly freed. My store had a good working relationship with the city and PD so we were able to mediate the situation but there were hard feelings for a LONG time.

Gotta be careful...

[PSD Ryan]

Had she gotten out of the car when asked and remained compliant, there probably would have been no issue.

If her story added up, i run her off verbal and her return is good, and the car comes back to who she says it does, I'd probably give a warning for not having her dl with her and move on to my next target.

[tvc184]

Had she gotten out of the car when asked and remained compliant, there probably would have been no issue.

If her story added up, i run her off verbal and her return is good, and the car comes back to who she says it does, I'd probably give a warning for not having her dl with her and move on to my next target.

That seems pretty much it. The intent of law enforcement should be to find bad people.

The officer might have been technically legal to get her out of the car by force. Had I been his chief and found that he drug an unarmed female in a nightgown out a window for driving without a license, the officer would most likely be in the unemployment line. I will go out on a limb and say an officer that does that has issues and likely a history of abuse or unprofessional conduct. If it is a small department then there is a good chance that he has already been run off by another agency (allowed to resign) for the same kind of problem but then hired by the small department looking for "veteran" officers that they don't have to train.

Just speculating of course.......

[Pullersboy]

I've not read the entire thread, but I did read enough to see several good answers to the question. So, I'll refrain. OP, the correct answers have been given.