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Whats Going On With East TX!

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    Whats Going On With East TX!

    Since I grew up through all of these East Tx changes, Ill throw my somewhat educated analysis out there.

    When I was a kid, in the late 60s and early 70s, any deer was a good deer. People in East tx often ate primarily off the land. They farmed and hunted for food. Deer ate gardens and crops. Farmers ate the deer year round. As that generation of farmers died out and their kids moved to cities where they could actually make a living, old farms became overgrown with prime deer habitat and a culture began a gradual change.

    People began to view deer not only as pest and/or food but as sport and trophies. Most of the farms remained in the hands of the next generation ,although now in much smaller parcels, but thats where those city kids came home for Christmas and hunting season. The deer got less year around pressure and the brown its down culture started fading into the 80s yet very few folks realized the potential for monsters. Yes a few were killed but most lived and died without even being known.

    Then all heck broke loose in the 90s! It was no longer cool just to shoot a deer and peer pressure accelerated the changes. TPWD put in place much stricter and harsher fines for poaching and antler restrictions which was a fantastic move. Some of the old holdouts just couldnt afford it anymore.

    On top of new regulations came the thing that saved more young deers lives than anything in hunting history! TRAIL CAMERAS!!! Before cameras, lots of folks just figured that if they didnt shoot that 3 year old, their neighbor would. Now after cameras, we can see the same deer year after year and watch his progression. No more adrenaline shock when a nice buck walked out. Now, instead of oh-my-gosh , BANG! its, "Thats Ol Long2. Hes 4. Boy will he be a monster next year". On top of that, now people that had no idea there was a monster on their property now have pics of them and have incentive to hold out. I repeat...nothing in huntings history has saved more young deer than trail cameras. they ended the Browndown mentality. Noone i know celebrates a 2 year old 8pt unless its a kids first deer anymore.

    This is just part of the story though. Here comes Hurricane Rita. it rips right into the east tx coast line and continues with 100mph winds all the way up to Lufkin/Ratcliff. A few years later, here comes Ike and it tracked just West of Rita with the same result over the rest of East tx. What a mess it made of the forest. it blew down large percentage of the pine overstory. A biologist friend once told me , "Bucks have a hard time making horns from pine straw". He was right but now instead of old growth pine, the entire piney woods was broken into large swaths of opening that immediately grew high quality browse. Beauty berry, green briar, youpon, black berry honey suckle, etc. This new browse also became unhuntable thickets. Now even highly pressured public land had hiding spots no hunter was going and had them in abundance. The result of this was an older age class deer and a mature buck somewhat less experienced with hunters.

    There is more to be told but in summary, East Tx is now situated to produce bigger bucks than at any other time in history. Those thickets are now holding a mature age class of deer. the holding capacity of the land is much larger and the available nutrients are better. Couple that with the recognition that a true monster is possible, and you will now see hunters continue to take greater deer than ever before in East Tx.

    Steve Barclay
    Last edited by GarGuy; 03-28-2016, 09:09 AM.

    #2
    Good to see East Texas deer doing so well. I grew up hunting Houston County, between Lovelady and Crockett. Our family had that lease for 27 years. Early on, I was brought up
    "If you see a buck, you better shoot it because you might not see it again".

    East Texas hunting has come a long way since those days.

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      #3
      I just hope the logging will slow down on all the cutting of hardwoods. I saw some beautiful oaks cut this past season, stacked up, ready to load, and the loggers pulled out leaving them to rot. Those oaks don't grow overnight. And, mass is a big staple of east Tx deer's diet.

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        #4
        Originally posted by Bayouboy View Post
        I just hope the logging will slow down on all the cutting of hardwoods. I saw some beautiful oaks cut this past season, stacked up, ready to load, and the loggers pulled out leaving them to rot. Those oaks don't grow overnight. And, mass is a big staple of east Tx deer's diet.
        Good point on the hardwood. One of the benefits of the hurricanes was the wildly expanded hardwoods. Suppress oaks got good sunlight with the pine overstory gone and i am seeing small timber making bumper crops.

        You are certainly right though, the ones going to the pallet mill wont be helping any.

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          #5
          My analysis: there are no deer in east Texas!

          (Trying to keep all the hunters away.... ).

          I grew up hunting near Groveton and now hunt near Lovelady. I wouldn't change it for the world. I will always have a place in ETX to hunt (or hope to).

          Couple the great deer with the great folks and it's as good as gold!

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            #6
            Cotton gins left and the deer grew...not to mention the formation of leases on prior "open" land where the management was managing to put lead into whatever deer the dogs ran by.

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              #7
              Houston county still seems to have the if it's brown it's down mentality hard to manage a herd when every decent up and coming buck gets plugged at 2 1/2 or 3 1/2 just cause the neighbor is hunting his sons and old lady's buck tags it's happening on both sides of us but we are still trying to manage it

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                #8
                Originally posted by Cjconner View Post
                Houston county still seems to have the if it's brown it's down mentality hard to manage a herd when every decent up and coming buck gets plugged at 2 1/2 or 3 1/2 just cause the neighbor is hunting his sons and old lady's buck tags it's happening on both sides of us but we are still trying to manage it
                There are spots of that left but its fading fast. The county as a whole sure doesnt have that mentality now. Thus the growth of a 278 inch deer. I lost a couple of 3 year olds this year as well but the fact is, they were darn nice deer that would never have made it past 1.5 20 years ago.

                Actually, you make my point. Who was managing deer on the property you now hunt 30 years ago?
                Last edited by GarGuy; 03-28-2016, 10:18 AM.

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                  #9
                  Originally posted by d_e_smith View Post
                  Cotton gins left and the deer grew...not to mention the formation of leases on prior "open" land where the management was managing to put lead into whatever deer the dogs ran by.
                  Houston co still has cotton gins and the new state record was killed on the edge of a cotton field. Deer love cotton seed too.

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                    #10
                    Originally posted by Cjconner View Post
                    Houston county still seems to have the if it's brown it's down mentality hard to manage a herd when every decent up and coming buck gets plugged at 2 1/2 or 3 1/2 just cause the neighbor is hunting his sons and old lady's buck tags it's happening on both sides of us but we are still trying to manage it


                    I don't think it's the locals with this mentality. I think it's the public land hunters making it hard to manage deer over there. It's hard work but free. And for the guys who only go once or twice a year they want to take anything they can get. I hunt public land and I understand because this was once my mentality. I now hunt almost every weekend and have personal goals at management. I no longer take younger deer and make decisions to better the deer. I personally wish more people would hunt archery and take does. I would shoot 2 does every year if I could track them down! Lol. Garguy do you happen to have an idea of the buck to doe average in Houston county?

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                      #11
                      Originally posted by FLASH_OUTDOORS View Post
                      I don't think it's the locals with this mentality. I think it's the public land hunters making it hard to manage deer over there. It's hard work but free. And for the guys who only go once or twice a year they want to take anything they can get. I hunt public land and I understand because this was once my mentality. I now hunt almost every weekend and have personal goals at management. I no longer take younger deer and make decisions to better the deer. I personally wish more people would hunt archery and take does. I would shoot 2 does every year if I could track them down! Lol. Garguy do you happen to have an idea of the buck to doe average in Houston county?

                      I dont have data. I do know its far better than it once was. I get pics of and see lots of does at my feeders but my hand corn piles run about 5 to one BUCKS over does.

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                        #12
                        Originally posted by GarGuy View Post
                        There are spots of that left but its fading fast. The county as a whole sure doesnt have that mentality now. Thus the growth of a 278 inch deer. I lost a couple of 3 year olds this year as well but the fact is, they were darn nice deer that would never have made it past 1.5 20 years ago.
                        I hear ya I believe it's just still like that in the area I'm at. there are a lot of high fence places coming in that have helped with the happy trigger finger folks just wish I could get our surrounding neighbors to get on board but it's hard to change those old homesteaders that grew up there and still to this day shoot illegal deer cause that's how it always was when they were growing up. Not mentioning hunting our property cause they've hog hunted on that property since the 50s lol. Hopefully since I met the gw he will start coming around our area more checking up

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                          #13
                          Great thread, I've seen a similar change in attitude over the past decade where I hunt in the Post Oak region.

                          You still have those who shoot the first legal deer they see but nothing like it was when I grew up hunting just hoping for a glance at an 8 pointer.

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                            #14
                            If you are hunting Conner property in Plain, i am sure i know the neighbors you are talking about. they are a dying breed though. And the property you now hunt was once the same mentality so that area is changing , just not as fast.

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                              #15
                              Originally posted by GarGuy View Post
                              Houston co still has cotton gins and the new state record was killed on the edge of a cotton field. Deer love cotton seed too.
                              Deer love it, the folks killing them out of the open fields 24/7/365 probably didn't like that the deer loved it and cutting into profit. On a good note, that extremely low deer density + transplants was a recipe for great genetics to be dominant in areas.

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