Reply
Go Back   TexasBowhunter.com Community Discussion Forums > Topics > Around the Campfire
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 02-13-2019, 07:24 PM   #1
Johnny44
Eight Point
 
Johnny44's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2017
Location: Texas
Default Taxing the rain on your water bill, Texas falls

I was laughing when I was reading a proposal in New Jersey for charging a homeowner a fee or taxing rainfall.

I thought how crazy is this...But

San Antonio is already in the forefront. We will lose Texas!

https://www.saws.org/service/rates/stormwater_fee.cfm
Johnny44 is offline   Reply With Quote Back To The Top
Old 02-13-2019, 07:47 PM   #2
locolobo
Six Point
 
Join Date: Nov 2015
Location: Brazoria county
Hunt In: Somewhere in TX
Default

I've been paying for storm water management for 40 yrs.! Every year Angleton Drainage District gets a cut of my property taxes. And does little to deserve it if you ask me.

Last edited by locolobo; 02-13-2019 at 07:51 PM.
locolobo is offline   Reply With Quote Back To The Top
Old 02-13-2019, 07:49 PM   #3
Jerry H
Ten Point
 
Jerry H's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Parker County
Hunt In: Hall County
Default

My money grabbing city has been charging a storm water fee for a couple of years.
Jerry H is offline   Reply With Quote Back To The Top
Old 02-13-2019, 08:16 PM   #4
Johnny44
Eight Point
 
Johnny44's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2017
Location: Texas
Default

And you guys put up with it?

When it affects me I’ll either move or change my oil over the storm drain

I guess I truely am Johnny come lately
Johnny44 is offline   Reply With Quote Back To The Top
Old 02-13-2019, 09:42 PM   #5
DRT
Pope & Young
 
DRT's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Fort Worth, Tx
Hunt In: Jones and San Saba Counties and Missouri
Default

No you just seem clueless.
Run off from creating more hard surfaces cause the need to effectively channel away that runoff to prevent property damage and threatening lives. It costs money to engineer and develop those systems. Perfectly rational.

Gary
DRT is offline   Reply With Quote Back To The Top
Old 02-13-2019, 09:43 PM   #6
dustoffer
Pope & Young
 
dustoffer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Seguin, Tx
Hunt In: S/Central Tx
Default

Old not news.
dustoffer is offline   Reply With Quote Back To The Top
Old 02-13-2019, 09:47 PM   #7
Bullseye07
Ten Point
 
Bullseye07's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2015
Location: Celina
Hunt In: Leon/Freestone Cos
Default

DRT is right. The water has to go somewhere. Unless you collect every drop of water that falls on your property....
Bullseye07 is offline   Reply With Quote Back To The Top
Old 02-13-2019, 10:11 PM   #8
Johnny44
Eight Point
 
Johnny44's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2017
Location: Texas
Default

BULLCRAP and Jonestown Koolaid!

Even without man made “hard” surfaces, VERY LITTLE of the rainfall, especially a hard rainfall permeates the soil, MOST is runoff.

The darn street is the largest of these barriers anyway.

Why should people have to pay for God making it rain?
Johnny44 is offline   Reply With Quote Back To The Top
Old 02-13-2019, 10:16 PM   #9
Humper
Pope & Young
 
Humper's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Corinth
Hunt In: Tom Green Co.
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by DRT View Post
No you just seem clueless.
Run off from creating more hard surfaces cause the need to effectively channel away that runoff to prevent property damage and threatening lives. It costs money to engineer and develop those systems. Perfectly rational.

Gary
And to maintain them...

X2 on the OP seeming to be clueless.
Humper is offline   Reply With Quote Back To The Top
Old 02-13-2019, 10:40 PM   #10
Johnny44
Eight Point
 
Johnny44's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2017
Location: Texas
Default

Clueless and taxless I am. I’m exempt from such things
Johnny44 is offline   Reply With Quote Back To The Top
Old Yesterday, 08:02 AM   #11
Mike
Ten Point
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Orange, Texas
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by DRT View Post
No you just seem clueless.
Run off from creating more hard surfaces cause the need to effectively channel away that runoff to prevent property damage and threatening lives. It costs money to engineer and develop those systems. Perfectly rational.
It does make sense when the Drainage District is brought to the table initially to approve new additions/subdivisions and allowed to create a drainage plan. However, speaking from experience, some counties do not allow them a seat at the table, they adopt plans from developers, let them build and the Drainage District must accept what comes out in the end. Commissioners want more tax base and just allow development to occur unfettered in our area. We have a drainage district with a meager budget of $5M that can barely get by maintaining their own territory, their own ditches and the cities and counties feel they should maintain all the ditches, which is not feasible.

It wasn't until January 2018 that a zero runoff mandate was put into place for our entire county, covering all new development and commercial construction.
Mike is offline   Reply With Quote Back To The Top
Old Yesterday, 08:16 AM   #12
Bullseye07
Ten Point
 
Bullseye07's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2015
Location: Celina
Hunt In: Leon/Freestone Cos
Default

No one is exempt from taxes. Now you’ve erased all doubt of you being clueless.
Bullseye07 is offline   Reply With Quote Back To The Top
Old Yesterday, 08:27 AM   #13
sailor
Pope & Young
 
sailor's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Texas
Hunt In: Texas
Default

Brings to mind.... An old Beatles song.....
sailor is offline   Reply With Quote Back To The Top
Old Yesterday, 09:54 AM   #14
cehorn
Ten Point
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Pflugerville, TX
Hunt In: Uvalde, TX
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by DRT View Post
No you just seem clueless.
Run off from creating more hard surfaces cause the need to effectively channel away that runoff to prevent property damage and threatening lives. It costs money to engineer and develop those systems. Perfectly rational.

Gary
I somewhat agree and somewhat disagree lol. You are correct that the increase in impervious cover (hard surfaces) has effects and can be serious. However, I don't see developers eating this cost up front so an additional tax can be considering being "double dipped".

Let's take a subdivision for example. A developer buys the land and pays engineers to do "the plans" including drainage to get water away from the houses (ditches, street drainage, etc.), drainage to detain water so minimal to no increase in flow leaving development vs what is there now (has to pay fees and obtain permits) and drainage to clean water (depends on area, if over aquifer, etc. and again permits and fees). All of this is factored into the price of lot, house, etc. that the consumer buys. So in theory all of what you mentioned should already be paid for in the upfront cost of buying the house.

With that said, this doesn't consider maintenance when the developed streets are turned over to the city, etc. So from that standpoint the fee cold be justified. And doing a quick look at the SAWS fees the look to be less than $5 for residential so not worth worrying about.
cehorn is offline   Reply With Quote Back To The Top
Old Yesterday, 10:12 AM   #15
stinkbelly
Pope & Young
 
stinkbelly's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Weatherford
Default

We pay for rainwater run off even though there are no drains or anything in the area. I own 22 acres in the city limits. They should be paying me for the amount of rain water my land absorbs.
stinkbelly is offline   Reply With Quote Back To The Top
Old Yesterday, 10:14 AM   #16
brokeno
Ten Point
 
brokeno's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2016
Location: Smiley, Texas
Hunt In: Gonzales & Young Co and anywhere
Default

Everytime it rains the city should reimburse the tax payers for using the storm water drains the tax payers paid for
brokeno is offline   Reply With Quote Back To The Top
Old Yesterday, 10:24 AM   #17
Man
Pope & Young
 
Man's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Casper,Tx
Hunt In: Nacogdoches,Tx
Default

In Colorado I believe you are only legally allowed to collect 2 rain barrels of water on your property. 110 gallons. Hopefully we never get to a point we have water harvesting police here in Texas.
Man is offline   Reply With Quote Back To The Top
Old Yesterday, 10:32 AM   #18
35remington
Pope & Young
 
35remington's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2014
Location: Wilco
Hunt In: the dark
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Johnny44 View Post
And you guys put up with it?

When it affects me Iíll either move or change my oil over the storm drain

I guess I truely am Johnny come lately
No, you are a cancerous tumor spouting pus all over this website.

"The stormwater fee is billed by SAWS on behalf of the City of San Antonio's stormwater utility to support and manage the operation and maintenance of the stormwater infrastructure, as well as for engineering, design, and capital improvements."

Impervious cover fees are used to fix problems like this. These problems don't fix themselves for free.

35remington is offline   Reply With Quote Back To The Top
Old Yesterday, 10:40 AM   #19
MagicBlade
Eight Point
 
MagicBlade's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Keller, Texas
Hunt In: Archer County Texas
Default

Good point.
MagicBlade is offline   Reply With Quote Back To The Top
Old Yesterday, 10:55 AM   #20
Jspradley
Ten Point
 
Jspradley's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2015
Location: League City, TX
Hunt In: Wherever I can
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Johnny44 View Post
BULLCRAP and Jonestown Koolaid!

Even without man made “hard” surfaces, VERY LITTLE of the rainfall, especially a hard rainfall permeates the soil, MOST is runoff.

The darn street is the largest of these barriers anyway.

Why should people have to pay for God making it rain?
Because that rain has to be channeled somewhere and in the real world that costs money to engineer and maintain.

This sort of crap is what makes me almost ashamed to call myself a libertarian.

Children who want all the benefits but don't want to pay for it because they are "sovereign citizens".

Last edited by Jspradley; Yesterday at 10:59 AM.
Jspradley is online now   Reply With Quote Back To The Top
Old Yesterday, 11:36 AM   #21
2B4Him
Ten Point
 
2B4Him's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Aledo
Hunt In: My dreams this year
Default

Most folks don't complain much about the 'storm water' charges because it impacts them so little (maybe $5 month).
But I can tell you that being hit with a $313.20 'storm water utility' charge every freaking month on the water bill for my storage facility is no picnic. And the 'water charge' for that same month - $24.20.
And there are no 'storm water' facilities around us, no sewer lines (we are on the edge of Fort Worth and have septic).
2B4Him is offline   Reply With Quote Back To The Top
Old Yesterday, 11:53 AM   #22
sharpstick35
Six Point
 
sharpstick35's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2017
Location: odessa tx
Hunt In: rocksprings tx
Default

Texas actually is the opposite of some strict states when it comes to rainwater. they encourage rainwater harvesting and in certain areas the damming of dry creeks and drainages. in the hill country it gives the water a chance to soak in and recharge the aquifer rather than running off. and those that harvest rainwater for household or gardening use, use less well/city water.

then also look at the type of government in states and municipalities that are against it.
sharpstick35 is offline   Reply With Quote Back To The Top
Old Yesterday, 01:21 PM   #23
tex4k
Ten Point
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Big Lake TX.
Hunt In: Reagan, Upton, Crockett, and Uvalde counties
Default

I can't get my head wrapped around the fact that your benevolent city fathers extort money from us to build systems that allow them to extort more money for more systems!
tex4k is offline   Reply With Quote Back To The Top
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 05:21 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
Copyright 1999-2012, TexasBowhunter.com