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    #16
    I describe my shooting as 3 under tab with a gap to “set up” shot, then keep pulling that “look” for just a quick tic, then shift to an instinctive both eyes focus on my target and then pull through release. Never tried to write out my shot sequence before but I believe that is what I am doing. I guess that is maybe a combination of shooting styles, but this seems to work best for me, your mileage may vary.

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      #17
      The trouble with canting is getting the consistent angle. At least for me.
      I'm fairly lethal out to 16 to 18 yards. Although I really try to wait to under 15. I just want to see if it is worth while to invest the time and effort to change and what to change to if I should.
      Sent from my SM-G892A using Tapatalk
      Last edited by DRT; 09-26-2020, 07:53 PM.

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        #18
        I shoot 3 under with a tab and am instinctive until 25 yards (point on is 30, so 25-30 is an easy gap). I will reference the arrow to make sure my right eye is over the arrow. I will miss to the left consistently and get face scrapes if my head is too vertical. Anchor point is so that my index finger is pretty much on my top molars.

        At this point, I just do whatever Tom Clum says and look at what the better 3D and IBO are using for equipment. Originally started split with a tab, then 3 under with a glove. The tab seems much smoother and more consistent than a glove with a deep hook, and 3 under allows your brain to calculate trajectory much easier.

        I set up all of my hunting stands for 15-20 yard shots, but it's nice to know that I can stretch it out if there is an opportunity outside of the blind. Plus, it's just really fun to target shoot 30+ yards...

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          #19
          Originally posted by DRT View Post
          What do you shoot?
          1. Three under or split?
          2. Aiming system and which one? (Fixed crawl, gap etc)
          3. Has this changed for you over the years and if so why and how long to master the change?

          Sent from my SM-G892A using Tapatalk
          1. I've always shot split since I was seven years old. I fisted it before that. I have tried three-under a few times, but it just didn't take.

          2. I have mostly shot instinctive my whole life. It wasn't until a few years ago, though, that I found out I'm the wrong-eye dominant, which explains why I never got very good. I thought my sight picture was normal. Rather than trying to shoot left handed, I've been trying to train my other eye by closing my dominant eye when I shoot. Since then, I've been trying gap shooting with some success, but I'm honesty not working that hard at it at the moment.

          3. See 1 and 2.

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            #20
            I shot split finger instinctive for about 13 years. I played around with 3 under a few times but it never stuck. Played with fixed crawl but it causes target panic for me. A few months ago I decided to give 3 under a solid effort. Adjusted bow tune for it. Now i am 100% on the 3 under band wagon because I am shooting far better than I ever have. I was decent shooting split but I could never clean up the flyers. 3 under seems to have fixed that. I have shot hundreds of thousands of arrows most likely and my brain knows what a correct sight picture looks like. You know how you can draw on an animal you do not intend to shoot and just feel so solid about it without the pressure of actually making the shot? So I try to replicate that in my shot process. Solid bow arm, anchor hard, and wait for my brain to say yep that's what it's supposed to look like. Then a little back tension and the arrow is gone.

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              #21
              Originally posted by DRT View Post
              What do you shoot?
              1. Three under or split?
              2. Aiming system and which one? (Fixed crawl, gap etc)
              3. Has this changed for you over the years and if so why and how long to master the change?

              Sent from my SM-G892A using Tapatalk
              1.) 3 UNDER

              2.) 3D-GAP
              Hunting: newly transitioning to fixed crawl

              3.) Lots of changes in my shooting the last few years. I transitioned from shooting a glove, split fingered, and 100% instinctive to shooting a tab, 3 under and gapping a little over 2 years ago. Although I feel my consistency and accuracy increased with those changes, I still have yet to be able to say I've mastered the change. I shot so long instinctively that I still catch myself reverting back to that, many times coming to half or full draw on a target and fixing to pick a spot to shoot when I realize "crap, I didn't guess my yardage", so mid/full draw I throw a quick guess in, set my gap, and shoot. I think I became so comfortable shooting instinctive so long that once I feel comfortable on a range, I begin to revert back to my old shooting habits and forget about judging my yardages, especially if the targets are closer. Since implementing a gap method and going through Tom Clum's shooting course late last summer, my scores have on 3D courses have been higher on more consistent basis so all-in-all it is slowly coming together.

              Then comes along this season and about a month ago I began to creep down the string and play with a fixed crawl. Knowing successes of folks such as Tim King among others using the method, I figured it had to be good or they wouldn't use it. So, after consulting with Tim and playing with the method, I completely understand why it would be used. My reason for giving it a try was simple, I wanted to decrease the amount of thinking involved in the moment of truth in hunting situations, just put the point where I want to hit and let it fly. I've got a nock set about 5/8" below my arrow nock and have it set so that when I have my tab at the bottom of the nock, I'm dead on at 17, top of same nock, dead on at 21, half way between that nock and my arrow nock I'm dead on at 26 and if I slide my tab all the way up the serving to my arrow nock, I'm dead on at 35. Almost feels like I'm shooting with sights at times and I've been amazed at how well it works. Really looking forward to this deer season to see how it plays out in the field.

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                #22
                Originally posted by MedicineMan7 View Post
                1.) 3 UNDER

                2.) 3D-GAP
                Hunting: newly transitioning to fixed crawl

                3.) Lots of changes in my shooting the last few years. I transitioned from shooting a glove, split fingered, and 100% instinctive to shooting a tab, 3 under and gapping a little over 2 years ago. Although I feel my consistency and accuracy increased with those changes, I still have yet to be able to say I've mastered the change. I shot so long instinctively that I still catch myself reverting back to that, many times coming to half or full draw on a target and fixing to pick a spot to shoot when I realize "crap, I didn't guess my yardage", so mid/full draw I throw a quick guess in, set my gap, and shoot. I think I became so comfortable shooting instinctive so long that once I feel comfortable on a range, I begin to revert back to my old shooting habits and forget about judging my yardages, especially if the targets are closer. Since implementing a gap method and going through Tom Clum's shooting course late last summer, my scores have on 3D courses have been higher on more consistent basis so all-in-all it is slowly coming together.

                Then comes along this season and about a month ago I began to creep down the string and play with a fixed crawl. Knowing successes of folks such as Tim King among others using the method, I figured it had to be good or they wouldn't use it. So, after consulting with Tim and playing with the method, I completely understand why it would be used. My reason for giving it a try was simple, I wanted to decrease the amount of thinking involved in the moment of truth in hunting situations, just put the point where I want to hit and let it fly. I've got a nock set about 5/8" below my arrow nock and have it set so that when I have my tab at the bottom of the nock, I'm dead on at 17, top of same nock, dead on at 21, half way between that nock and my arrow nock I'm dead on at 26 and if I slide my tab all the way up the serving to my arrow nock, I'm dead on at 35. Almost feels like I'm shooting with sights at times and I've been amazed at how well it works. Really looking forward to this deer season to see how it plays out in the field.
                So does that influence your arrow length you shoot? If so does the difference in field point vs broadhead length mess with that?

                Sent from my SM-G892A using Tapatalk

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                  #23
                  Originally posted by DRT View Post
                  So does that influence your arrow length you shoot? If so does the difference in field point vs broadhead length mess with that?

                  Sent from my SM-G892A using Tapatalk
                  No noticeable change/difference at this point. I aim/look off of the end of the arrow (actually insert) so the point length has no effect on where I hold. I actually have been shooting my broadheads as good, if not better then my field points and the only conclusion I can come up with to justify an answer to that is I can see the back of the broadhead better then my fieldpoints because the ferrule is slightly bigger then the shaft, and they are all brighter colored then my arrow, therefore I can see the intersection a bit better then if I have a field point on. I've shot 4 different broadheads and all hit where they were supposed to out to 30 yards.

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                    #24
                    Thank you. The devil is in the details.

                    Sent from my SM-G892A using Tapatalk

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                      #25
                      I recently swallowed my pride and started shooting gap.
                      Reason being is I have several stands set up with known distances to trails and I practice those shots all the time. I was struggling with consistency pretty bad so I figured I’d try to learn the gap for those known distances. If I do everything right and not revert back to trying to shoot instinctive I’m pretty dang deadly! Just hope in the moment of truth I remember to gap! Lol

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                        #26
                        I started as a kid shooting 3 under instictive because I read an article in Bow and Arrow magazine that it was called the "Apache Method". What kid doesn't want to shoot like the Apaches? I shot that way for probably 20+ years with great success and no problems. Then one day I pulled back and couldn't let go of the arrow. The sight picture never got right, nor did it ever again. I just totally lost the instinctive sight picture to tell me it was right to let go. I shot a compound in NFAA field archery and had a gap system worked out for all the different ranges involved and feel like that had some thing to do with it. I worked out my gaps for my Wing C2 recurve that I hunted with and life was good again and I've never changed any thing again.

                        As in the sticky on gap shooting, I'm not point on except at 32 yards. I'm a foot under up close and a foot high at 40. I'm only dealing with 24" to be on. Under 32 and the point is under the target, over 32, the point is above. I don't think about measurements in where the point is, it just goes there, dare I say it, instinctively. I still never take my concentration off of what I'm shooting at.

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                          #27
                          My release changes with different bows. I flemish loose on my string follow longbow and have to shoot instinctive to see around the riser with both eyes at shorter distances. With my Blueridge S/R I shoot 3 under gapish.

                          I just recently started to actually be able to gap shoot (3 under) since I changed my anchor finger to my middle finger at canine teeth (versus pointer finger anchored at canine) and moved up my face to bring the arrow closer to my sight line. I find that I have to close/wink my left eye to focus focusing with my right eye and alignment. I have yardage tape marks on my Blueridge Longbow riser for quicker target and proper elevation acquisition.

                          I have also found that with my short 27 3/4” hunting arrows Im using I cant use the arrow point for gapping accurately and consistently like I can with longer arrows...except at 30 yds...which with my short arrows the tip is just below point on.

                          I have found my accuracy is more consistent when I focus on the tip and the target is blurry...very similar if not the same as using iron sights on a rifle. My current short hunting arrows dont allow for the extra inches of aiming point to extend my sight radius...so I use the shaft for windage and riser marks for elevation.

                          Reading aiming, anchors and form posts on TBH (like this thread) and reading various archery books has helped to give me options that I wouldve not considered.

                          Have a great day and good luck tomorrow Gary.

                          God bless!
                          Byron

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                            #28
                            Originally posted by Briar Friar View Post
                            My release changes with different bows. I flemish loose on my string follow longbow and have to shoot instinctive to see around the riser with both eyes at shorter distances. With my Blueridge S/R I shoot 3 under gapish.

                            I just recently started to actually be able to gap shoot (3 under) since I changed my anchor finger to my middle finger at canine teeth (versus pointer finger anchored at canine) and moved up my face to bring the arrow closer to my sight line. I find that I have to close/wink my left eye to focus focusing with my right eye and alignment. I have yardage tape marks on my Blueridge Longbow riser for quicker target and proper elevation acquisition.

                            I have also found that with my short 27 3/4” hunting arrows Im using I cant use the arrow point for gapping accurately and consistently like I can with longer arrows...except at 30 yds...which with my short arrows the tip is just below point on.

                            I have found my accuracy is more consistent when I focus on the tip and the target is blurry...very similar if not the same as using iron sights on a rifle. My current short hunting arrows dont allow for the extra inches of aiming point to extend my sight radius...so I use the shaft for windage and riser marks for elevation.

                            Reading aiming, anchors and form posts on TBH (like this thread) and reading various archery books has helped to give me options that I wouldve not considered.

                            Have a great day and good luck tomorrow Gary.

                            God bless!
                            Byron
                            Interesting that you don't set elevation with your tip, but you focus on it at full draw... I shoot best when I get soft vision overall. Not that anything is out of focus, but I am not particularly keyed in on any one aspect of the sight picture. This only happens when I'm really focused on pulling through whatever psycho trigger or clicker I'm currently shooting with.

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                              #29
                              Originally posted by DRT View Post
                              What do you shoot?
                              1. Three under or split?
                              2. Aiming system and which one? (Fixed crawl, gap etc)
                              3. Has this changed for you over the years and if so why and how long to master the change?

                              Sent from my SM-G892A using Tapatalk
                              1. Split with an American Leathers Glove

                              2. Instinctive/Howard Hill

                              3. I have shot split and 3 under with tabs and gloves in the past but am now fully committing to Howard Hill style. I definitely have not mastered the change.

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                                #30
                                I appreciate the replies. If I survive hunting season I think I'll pick up a low poundage recurve in the spring and seriously work on some things.
                                I'm having some work done on my neck this month to hopefully give me little better range of movement as well as reduce the discomfort. If it does I will try a different anchor point or two and maybe gapping.
                                I'm not dissatisfied with what I'm doing but just wondering if maybe I could be better at something different or at least have another arrow in my quiver so to speak to use as a situation may dictate.
                                Y'all have a rewarding hunting season and don't forget to post pics.

                                Sent from my SM-G892A using Tapatalk

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