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Old 02-26-2020, 08:34 PM   #1
LuckyCards2006
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Default Aging by jaw?

I have an argument going on. Whatís the GS say, HF, protein fed. Name:  IMG_1244.jpg
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Old 02-26-2020, 08:44 PM   #2
hoythunter02
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Dentine wider than enamel from 4 through 6....Older than 5.5.

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Old 02-26-2020, 08:47 PM   #3
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5 or 6
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Old 02-26-2020, 08:48 PM   #4
LuckyCards2006
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I say 6 other person says 4.


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Old 02-26-2020, 08:51 PM   #5
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Mature. Especially on protein. Beyond that its hard to say whether he is 5 or 8
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Old 02-26-2020, 08:52 PM   #6
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I believe 6.5 all day long. Possibly a tad older being HF deer
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Old 02-26-2020, 08:56 PM   #7
hoythunter02
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LuckyCards2006 View Post
I say 6 other person says 4.


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I believe you're closer if theres a correct answer. The concaves and dentine width back your number.

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Old 02-26-2020, 09:11 PM   #8
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5.5 to 6.5
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Old 02-26-2020, 09:11 PM   #9
LuckyCards2006
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I know aging teeth can be hit or miss, heck, aging deer in general is hard unless you have an ear tag or GPS tracker. Iíve been managing this place for 10 years, itís still hard to judge.

This was a doe that we were arguing about, or a friendly disagreement.


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Old 02-26-2020, 09:15 PM   #10
Chance Love
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Those teeth show 5+. Which simply means that deer could have been 5, or he could have been 12...or anywhere in between.

Fence height is irrelevant.
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Old 02-26-2020, 09:20 PM   #11
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6
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Old 02-26-2020, 09:26 PM   #12
LuckyCards2006
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chance Love View Post
Those teeth show 5+. Which simply means that deer could have been 5, or he could have been 12...or anywhere in between.



Fence height is irrelevant.


I agree, we had a known ear tagged doe that the teeth aged 4.5, we know she was 8.5. The head does not lie on aging.


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Old 02-26-2020, 09:44 PM   #13
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Mature! Have killed several high fence bucks that were protein fed and and known age. Their jaw said they were 4 1/2 years old and they were actually 9 1/2 years old. As it has been said many times before aging by teeth is (SWAG) and by no means that definite science. You can easily add several years to a deer that has consumed a diet other than their natural forage.
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Old 02-26-2020, 09:45 PM   #14
M16
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8.5 to 9.5 but could be older
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Old 02-26-2020, 10:21 PM   #15
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Lots of good agreement here. We are gradually learning how old deer teeth may look.
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Old 02-27-2020, 01:35 AM   #16
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6.5 would be my guess.

I also agree the fence height is irrelevant
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Old 02-27-2020, 05:52 AM   #17
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6.5 +
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Old 02-27-2020, 06:19 AM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by M16 View Post
8.5 to 9.5 but could be older
Under those conditions this is my "guess" also..
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Old 02-27-2020, 06:23 AM   #19
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6.5 would be my guess.

I also agree the fence height is irrelevant
There was suppose to be a plus sign after the 6.5. Heís at least that old, and it wouldnít surprise me if he was a year or two older. I donít have enough experience to distinguish between 6.5 and 8.5
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Old 02-27-2020, 06:26 AM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chance Love View Post
Those teeth show 5+. Which simply means that deer could have been 5, or he could have been 12...or anywhere in between.

Fence height is irrelevant.
This all day long
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Old 02-27-2020, 06:38 AM   #21
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What works for me is cementum annuli aging. Is it a perfect science, no, but it has not failed me yet. Over the years the results have always come back to what I thought I knew what a specific deer's age was. This past season I killed a buck I was pretty danged sure was a 7 year old. Upon removing the jaw I freaked out a little bit because the teeth were not worn as I expected. The visual made me think 5 and our lease member "age guru" (you know the type) was going on and on saying deer was 4. Even after showing him 5 years of pictures. Don't get me started. Anyways, sent the teeth off and boom, 7 year old. I could go on and on of stories like this. For me CA has not let me down. I am not saying it the be all end all, just saying it works for me and I have come to trust it over tooth wear.
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Old 02-27-2020, 07:03 AM   #22
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7.5
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Old 02-27-2020, 09:59 AM   #23
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By definition, using the Serveringhaus method, one side says 5.5 and the other hints at 6.5 (partially dished out 4th tooth (1st molar)). But, the technique tends to fall apart at older ages. For most management purposed, mature seems to work. Little value in aging deer past 6.5.
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Old 02-27-2020, 10:18 AM   #24
AntlerCollector
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sotx View Post
What works for me is cementum annuli aging. Is it a perfect science, no, but it has not failed me yet. Over the years the results have always come back to what I thought I knew what a specific deer's age was. This past season I killed a buck I was pretty danged sure was a 7 year old. Upon removing the jaw I freaked out a little bit because the teeth were not worn as I expected. The visual made me think 5 and our lease member "age guru" (you know the type) was going on and on saying deer was 4. Even after showing him 5 years of pictures. Don't get me started. Anyways, sent the teeth off and boom, 7 year old. I could go on and on of stories like this. For me CA has not let me down. I am not saying it the be all end all, just saying it works for me and I have come to trust it over tooth wear.


Please let me know where you sent it. I may want to use them also.
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Old 02-27-2020, 10:33 AM   #25
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Teeth show 6/7 so that means he's either 4 or 8
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Old 02-27-2020, 11:03 AM   #26
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6.5 plus
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Old 02-27-2020, 11:15 AM   #27
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I think aging teeth is a waste of time UNLESS you have a log book of several years of deer watched and harvested in same area due to type of soil, nutrients, vegetation,etc. Shooting a deer off a lease with no history of deer and deciding how old it is off teeth is not very accurate. I have a place where I have history with deer for 20+ years and couple years ago shot a 6.5yr old and only showed the jaws on here to get opinions. A VERY LARGE majority of people said 4.5yr old. When I finally showed pic of the bucks a few of those people came back and gave him 5.5+. It is cool to guess age based on jaws but need history of jaws and deer in that area to be more accurate IMO.
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Old 02-27-2020, 12:21 PM   #28
TXDUCKCUTTER
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Tooth aging is a waist of time.I killed 2 known 6.5 yr olds with pics to back it up and they showed 4.5.Full protein low fence ETX Jan-August.Alot of good hunters have been booted over this deal...
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Old 02-27-2020, 01:28 PM   #29
ttaxidermy
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Originally Posted by txduckcutter View Post
tooth aging is a waist of time.i killed 2 known 6.5 yr olds with pics to back it up and they showed 4.5.full protein low fence etx jan-august.alot of good hunters have been booted over this deal...
Fact!! In many cases it will not even get you close..
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Old 02-27-2020, 10:29 PM   #30
LuckyCards2006
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sotx View Post
What works for me is cementum annuli aging. Is it a perfect science, no, but it has not failed me yet. Over the years the results have always come back to what I thought I knew what a specific deer's age was. This past season I killed a buck I was pretty danged sure was a 7 year old. Upon removing the jaw I freaked out a little bit because the teeth were not worn as I expected. The visual made me think 5 and our lease member "age guru" (you know the type) was going on and on saying deer was 4. Even after showing him 5 years of pictures. Don't get me started. Anyways, sent the teeth off and boom, 7 year old. I could go on and on of stories like this. For me CA has not let me down. I am not saying it the be all end all, just saying it works for me and I have come to trust it over tooth wear.


We have been doing the cementum annuli aging for 6 years now, we are giving it up this year cause of some of the research we have found shows itís only 62% accurate. I can let you know first person experience, I sent a known tooth in, ear tagged doe, 5.5yr old, they aged her at 7.5, this has happened three times. The first two times were from deerage.com and another one I canít remember at the moment. I have a hard time trusting it.


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Old 02-28-2020, 07:37 AM   #31
Chance Love
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sotx View Post
What works for me is cementum annuli aging. Is it a perfect science, no, but it has not failed me yet. Over the years the results have always come back to what I thought I knew what a specific deer's age was. This past season I killed a buck I was pretty danged sure was a 7 year old. Upon removing the jaw I freaked out a little bit because the teeth were not worn as I expected. The visual made me think 5 and our lease member "age guru" (you know the type) was going on and on saying deer was 4. Even after showing him 5 years of pictures. Don't get me started. Anyways, sent the teeth off and boom, 7 year old. I could go on and on of stories like this. For me CA has not let me down. I am not saying it the be all end all, just saying it works for me and I have come to trust it over tooth wear.
Iím glad it works for you. Your experience is the opposite of just about everyone else I know of.

Quote:
Originally Posted by LuckyCards2006 View Post
We have been doing the cementum annuli aging for 6 years now, we are giving it up this year cause of some of the research we have found shows itís only 62% accurate. I can let you know first person experience, I sent a known tooth in, ear tagged doe, 5.5yr old, they aged her at 7.5, this has happened three times. The first two times were from deerage.com and another one I canít remember at the moment. I have a hard time trusting it.


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Iíve often heard itís only about 60% accurate. Our guesses are at least that accurate. Whenever people ask me about it I always just tell them to save their money.
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Old 02-28-2020, 08:30 AM   #32
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I noticed this year that the deer on the north side of our lease age completely different from deer on the south side. North side is very sandy, south end has clay soils. 6+ year old deer jaws on the south side look like 4 year old jaws from the north side.
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Old 02-28-2020, 09:59 AM   #33
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Originally Posted by TXDUCKCUTTER View Post
Tooth aging is a waist of time.I killed 2 known 6.5 yr olds with pics to back it up and they showed 4.5.Full protein low fence ETX Jan-August.Alot of good hunters have been booted over this deal...
Dead on. Tooth aging sucks everywhere but in east tx you can guarantee it under ages deer. I'm stunned how bad it is after many years of actual history on deer.
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Old 02-28-2020, 10:08 AM   #34
Chance Love
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Dead on. Tooth aging sucks everywhere but in east tx you can guarantee it under ages deer. I'm stunned how bad it is after many years of actual history on deer.
This! Iím stunned at how many people still use it as gospel.

And itís not just east Texas. It under-ages in the hill country and down south as well. Although it seems down south itís not as bad but I still donít trust it. On our place in the hill country itís not uncommon AT ALL for the teeth to underage by 4 or 5 years.
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Old 02-28-2020, 03:34 PM   #35
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This! Iím stunned at how many people still use it as gospel.

And itís not just east Texas. It under-ages in the hill country and down south as well. Although it seems down south itís not as bad but I still donít trust it. On our place in the hill country itís not uncommon AT ALL for the teeth to underage by 4 or 5 years.
Absolutely. I hauled a known 8 year old to the taxi last year and a well know expert called him 4 years old. I showed him pics of a deer on my phone and he agreed that pic was a 5 plus year old deer. That's when I showed him it was a 2015 pic of the same deer he was now calling 4.
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Old 02-28-2020, 05:22 PM   #36
sotx
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chance Love View Post
Iím glad it works for you. Your experience is the opposite of just about everyone else I know of.







Iíve often heard itís only about 60% accurate. Our guesses are at least that accurate. Whenever people ask me about it I always just tell them to save their money.


Maybe Iíve just been lucky.


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Old 02-29-2020, 08:31 AM   #37
Top Of Texas
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Originally Posted by Deerguy View Post
By definition, using the Serveringhaus method, one side says 5.5 and the other hints at 6.5 (partially dished out 4th tooth (1st molar)). But, the technique tends to fall apart at older ages. For most management purposed, mature seems to work. Little value in aging deer past 6.5.
Spot on assessment!

I've observed that the majority of problems with tooth aging stems from people who don't have a clear understanding of the methodology, and then compound that problem by applying ages beyond their limited management use. Deerguy, Brokeno, and Deerwatcher clearly understand the methodology, because regardless of the deer's actual age, the teeth say 5 or 6.
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