Form 4 Wait

[35remington]

The issue comes on the second death. It becomes messier. I have seen this nightmare and it resulted in a family/Historic heirloom being confiscated by the ATF.

Why do you think it becomes messier upon the death of the heir?

[landman650]

Why do you think it becomes messier upon the death of the heir?

I assume it's the probate part along with the NFA item. Outside of a trust, a non-trust item cannot be handled by a person who does not own it.

[Outbreaker]

Because it has to go through the entire retransfer process. You have no idea what the situation will be with your heirs.

In the situation I am talking about the grandson was not eligible for NFA items, and the great grandsons were not 21 years of age yet. Since it was not in a trust and there was not a names heir that was eligible the ATF confiscated the NFA item.

The item in this case was a WW2 Sturmgewehr 44 with matching serial numbers.

If a trust had owned it.....the trust can't die and all this would have been avoided. A trustee could have been named that was eligible (aunt) and everything would have been fine.

Fix problems before they are problems.

[35remington]

Because it has to go through the entire retransfer process. You have no idea what the situation will be with your heirs.

In the situation I am talking about the grandson was not eligible for NFA items, and the great grandsons were not 21 years of age yet. Since it was not in a trust and there was not a names heir that was eligible the ATF confiscated the NFA item.

The item in this case was a WW2 Sturmgewehr 44 with matching serial numbers.

If a trust had owned it.....the trust can't die and all this would have been avoided. A trustee could have been named that was eligible (aunt) and everything would have been fine.

Fix problems before they are problems.

Wow that sucks. The executor could have Form 5'd it to himself in trust for the great-grandsons. When one of them turned 21, another Form 5 could've be done from the executor to the great-grandson.

Agree completely that a trust avoids these problems entirely.

[ultralite09]

Well....here we are at 366 days since ATF ran my card for $200. Form 4 Individual....still no phone call to come pick up my Omega 300. Maybe I'll be a new record for longest approval time

[Outbreaker]

Wow that sucks. The executor could have Form 5'd it to himself in trust for the great-grandsons. When one of them turned 21, another Form 5 could've be done from the executor to the great-grandson.

Agree completely that a trust avoids these problems entirely.

This was also during the Obama administration when the ATF was very harsh and looking for any reason to confiscate something. The strong armed them with something like "The listed owner is dead, the named beneficiary in the will is ineligible so it is an illegal NFA item at this point."

It was very sad. Monetary loss of probably over $250,000 but more than that in terms of whose it was and how they got it.

[Mike D]

Just got off the phone with ATF. Currently approving trust form 4s from August and Sept of last year.

Ooooffff. I have a submission from April of 2017.


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[Outbreaker]

Ooooffff. I have a submission from April of 2017.


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Mine was mailed off in late January. It was not entered into the ATF system until 3/13/17. I feel your pain. I was hoping it would come in by October. Guess that is not going to happen.

[Mike D]

I'm 35...honestly, not too big of a concern for me. In 20 years, maybe I'll spend another $200 to convey to my trust. My thing for the trust is the people in my family being able to defend themselves at home with a gun that is suppressed while I'm not around. A 10/22 isn't in the top 20 guns any of my family members would reach for in that instance so I really don't care in this one purchase.



*I already have a trust BTW with wife as trustee and 2.5 year old as beneficiary.

Then why would you do individual if you already have the trust in place?


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[35remington]

Then why would you do individual if you already have the trust in place?

Because he can't bear to wait the 3 extra months it might take for a trust approval :/

Landman, do what you want with your money and your toys. But I think going individual now that you have a trust is a mistake.

The wait is temporary. Another 1-3 months, so what? Trusts have the advantage of being a vehicle for asset protection in the event of a lawsuit or divorce, and have the ability to have people added or removed. If those advantages mean something to you, use a trust. If they don't, don't.

[Mike D]

Because he can't bear to wait the 3 extra months it might take for a trust approval :/

Landman, do what you want with your money and your toys. But I think going individual now that you have a trust is a mistake.

The wait is temporary. Another 1-3 months, so what? Trusts have the advantage of being a vehicle for asset protection in the event of a lawsuit or divorce, and have the ability to have people added or removed. If those advantages mean something to you, use a trust. If they don't, don't.

I haven't followed NFA tracker in a while. Are approvals trending shorter for individual vs trusts?


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[Outbreaker]

I haven't followed NFA tracker in a while. Are approvals trending shorter for individual vs trusts?


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Yes they are. But It would not surprise me if it was on purpose to drive people into individual ownership rather than trusts.

[ultralite09]

Bump, any one receive any updates?

[Ron]

I just got one of mine out about two weeks ago. I had it on a individual trust and it too 10.5 months. My second should be out any day now.

[AgBass01]

I just got an email from someone from the ATF. Said that he is processing my background check and needed to know the state I was born in. I hope it was legit because I answered. That is the only info I gave them though.