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Old 09-27-2022, 04:10 PM   #101
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Would you knowingly eat a CWD positive deer?
Are you going to keep asking the same dumbass question? Ainít got **** to do with ****.
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Old 09-27-2022, 04:13 PM   #102
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True. Now tell us where the next 50 cases were detected otherwise whatís your point.
50. 50 cases. Out of how many millions of deer? Can you admit the percentage of free range deer tested versus breeder is significantly different?

Understand I support a solution to the problem. But not just focusing on breeders. Im not so naive as to think it just magically popped up in pens.

Why arenít yíall as concerned with anthrax? Itís killed WAY more deer in 2 weeks than CWD has in a decade.
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Old 09-27-2022, 04:16 PM   #103
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Are you going to keep asking the same dumbass question? Ainít got **** to do with ****.
Wonít answer. Thatís what I figured.
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Old 09-27-2022, 04:20 PM   #104
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How many times are you going to continue to ask this stupid question? What answer are you expecting?

People eat elk mule deer and Whitetail every year from places known to have cwd and that has been there for years. Would anyone knowingly eat a positive animal I highly doubt it but it doesn't stop people from eating animals that come from areas where cwd is prevalent.
Doing everything but answering the question. Interesting.
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Old 09-27-2022, 04:23 PM   #105
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Wonít answer. Thatís what I figured.
No you idiot. Nobody would. It doesnít have a thing to do with the conversation.
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Old 09-27-2022, 04:23 PM   #106
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Doing everything but answering the question. Interesting.
Your reading comprehension is severely lacking.

Guess you missed the part where I said I highly doubt anyone would eat a animal that they KNEW carried cwd. Pretty sure than answers your repeated joke of a question. No?
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Old 09-27-2022, 04:24 PM   #107
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No you idiot. Nobody would. It doesnít have a thing to do with the conversation.
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Old 09-27-2022, 04:25 PM   #108
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No you idiot. Nobody would. It doesnít have a thing to do with the conversation.
Calm down little buddy. Iím not sure why a simple question makes yíall so angry.
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Old 09-27-2022, 04:26 PM   #109
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Calm down little buddy. Iím not sure why a simple question makes yíall so angry.
Iím not angry. Iím just informing you of your nagging stupidity. Someone has to or you wonít stop lol.
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Old 09-27-2022, 04:29 PM   #110
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I’m sorry y’all can’t see the relevance of making y’all admit your fear of a contagion that y’all are downplaying the spread of.
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Old 09-27-2022, 04:33 PM   #111
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Lol. Lord.


Pretty **** sure you haven't seen me downplay anything. Yet you continue to repeatedly ask the same dumb *** question. Kinda like all the covid bs....not scared at all. Didn't wear a mask didn't go get the shot didn't stay inside all day every day. Spent the entire time out about working living life. Have ate elk from areas where cwd is prevalent. Wasn't scared about getting it worried about it anything. Never crossed my mind. Guess that means I fear it in your eyes? Lol only a fool would eat a animal that they knew was infected with any disease. Only a fool would continually ask the same question and think it's proving something.

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Old 09-27-2022, 04:40 PM   #112
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Lol. Lord.


Pretty **** sure you haven't seen me downplay anything. Yet you continue to repeatedly ask the same dumb *** question. Kinda like all the covid bs....not scared at all. Didn't wear a mask didn't go get the shot didn't stay inside all day every day. Spent the entire time out about working living life. Have ate elk from areas where cwd is prevalent. Wasn't scared about getting it worried about it anything. Never crossed my mind. Guess that means I fear it in your eyes? Lol only a fool would eat a animal that they knew was infected with any disease. Only a fool would continually ask the same question and think it's proving something.
Calm down little buddy
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Old 09-27-2022, 04:40 PM   #113
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I donít care for breeders and the only high fence stuff Iíve hunted is exotics aside from some management whitetail. But nice try. And yes Iíd say Iíve pretty successful with free range deer
I don't care about you, I was speaking to myself. I've done it all from high fence to Mexico to basic public poor-man's hunting. Watched deer grow up from birth to 7.5 years old and had group discussions on which to kill and which to let walk. I'd rather kill a doe on public and actually HUNT an animal than sit around anywhere shooting farm animals, like I said in the original comment that spawned your reply I consider half the animals hanging on people's wall to be livestock... including several of my own.

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Iím sorry yíall canít see the relevance of making yíall admit your fear of a contagion that yíall are downplaying the spread of.
Fact is a high CWD prevalence will hurt the hunting industry big time, financially and participation as well. We keep seeing comments in this thread about deer dying from CWD or with CWD, and that it won't hurt the population, etc. It's not about that, it's about hunters not wanting to hunt anymore if it gets out of control and your odds of eating an infected deer go up. They conveniently ignore that because it doesn't support their argument that everybody just hates breeders.
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Old 09-27-2022, 04:47 PM   #114
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I don't care about you, I was speaking to myself. I've done it all from high fence to Mexico to basic public poor-man's hunting. Watched deer grow up from birth to 7.5 years old and had group discussions on which to kill and which to let walk. I'd rather kill a doe on public and actually HUNT an animal than sit around anywhere shooting farm animals, like I said in the original comment that spawned your reply I consider half the animals hanging on people's wall to be livestock... including several of my own.



Fact is a high CWD prevalence will hurt the hunting industry big time, financially and participation as well. We keep seeing comments in this thread about deer dying from CWD or with CWD, and that it won't hurt the population, etc. It's not about that, it's about hunters not wanting to hunt anymore if it gets out of control and your odds of eating an infected deer go up. They conveniently ignore that because it doesn't support their argument that everybody just hates breeders.
Hmmm has hurt mule deer or elk hunting in Colorado Wyoming ect? Sure doesn't seem that way to me seems like record amounts of NR applications year after year.

Don't think anyone here wants CWD here in Texas or it spreading any farther than it has. Sure that's been said multiple times. Some just have different opinions than others.
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Old 09-27-2022, 04:49 PM   #115
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Calm down little buddy

About what I expected.
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Old 09-27-2022, 04:51 PM   #116
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Hmmm has hurt mule deer or elk hunting in Colorado Wyoming ect? Sure doesn't seem that way to me seems like record amounts of NR applications year after year.

Don't think anyone here wants CWD here in Texas or it spreading any farther than it has. Sure that's been said multiple times. Some just have different opinions than others.
Apples to oranges and not very well thought out argument. The winter kills the weak animals up there, down here they eat corn all winter and continue to spread the disease around the protein cooler.
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Old 09-27-2022, 04:56 PM   #117
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About what I expected.
Iím not sure how else to respond to an incoherent rambling
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Old 09-27-2022, 05:10 PM   #118
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50. 50 cases. Out of how many millions of deer? Can you admit the percentage of free range deer tested versus breeder is significantly different?

Understand I support a solution to the problem. But not just focusing on breeders. Im not so naive as to think it just magically popped up in pens.

Why arenít yíall as concerned with anthrax? Itís killed WAY more deer in 2 weeks than CWD has in a decade.
Calm down little buddy. Anthrax is naturally occurring in the soil in certain areas of Texas. Really nothing you can do about it other than not buying or leasing in those areas.

There's actually been more than 50 cases. Think of it as the China Flu. It starts with one case. Someone transports it to another area. Next thing you know thousands of cases get reported in the new contaminated area. Very simple logic. Had China stopped everyone from exiting or entering their country. The China Flu would have stayed in China. That's about a simple as I can make it for you.
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Old 09-27-2022, 05:18 PM   #119
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Apples to oranges and not very well thought out argument. The winter kills the weak animals up there, down here they eat corn all winter and continue to spread the disease around the protein cooler.
Lol. As with most if it doesn't fit your narrative then it's not well thought out or comparable.

How long does it take cwd to kill am infected animal? I'm not an expert by any means but from what I've read can take years. Most of the studies/research has been done up north where CWD has been prevalent for years. Hasn't slowed hunting down one bit up there as we all can see that.
So those weak animal your say die during the winter obviously don't die the first winter they contract it.. once again according to the researches. So can still be spread among other animal can still be eaten by hunters who have no idea the animal may be infected.

Just because it doesn't fit your narrative doesn't mean it's not the truth of the matter. Cwd has been in those states for years and years. There's still a ton of animal there and hunting numbers have only gone up.
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Old 09-27-2022, 05:23 PM   #120
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Lol. As with most if it doesn't fit your narrative then it's not well thought out or comparable.
Youíre projecting so hard rat nao
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Old 09-27-2022, 05:25 PM   #121
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Youíre projecting so hard rat nao
Speaking of incoherent....why don't you go back to your question you keep repeating. At least you can get that one right.
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Old 09-27-2022, 05:27 PM   #122
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Apples to oranges and not very well thought out argument. The winter kills the weak animals up there, down here they eat corn all winter and continue to spread the disease around the protein cooler.
Sure seems they feed them well in the basin outside of Jackson hole. Least they did last winter.
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Old 09-27-2022, 05:30 PM   #123
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Sure seems they feed them well in the basin outside of Jackson hole. Least they did last winter.
Not to mention piling into every alfalfa field around and elk using the same water holes ect.
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Old 09-27-2022, 05:31 PM   #124
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Lol. As with most if it doesn't fit your narrative then it's not well thought out or comparable.

How long does it take cwd to kill am infected animal? I'm not an expert by any means but from what I've read can take years. Most of the studies/research has been done up north where CWD has been prevalent for years. Hasn't slowed hunting down one bit up there as we all can see that.
So those weak animal your say die during the winter obviously don't die the first winter they contract it.. once again according to the researches. So can still be spread among other animal can still be eaten by hunters who have no idea the animal may be infected.

Just because it doesn't fit your narrative doesn't mean it's not the truth of the matter. Cwd has been in those states for years and years. There's still a ton of animal there and hunting numbers have only gone up.
lol you use these words like narrative trying to gain some credibility, Psaki used to do that all the time. The winter is brutal and plenty of perfectly healthy animals succumb, CWD infected animals die at a high rate up there so they naturally don't spread it nearly as much as down here so your odds of eating an infected animal stay constant and stay lower, it's basic common sense.

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Old 09-27-2022, 05:34 PM   #125
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Lol. As with most if it doesn't fit your narrative then it's not well thought out or comparable.

How long does it take cwd to kill am infected animal? I'm not an expert by any means but from what I've read can take years. Most of the studies/research has been done up north where CWD has been prevalent for years. Hasn't slowed hunting down one bit up there as we all can see that.
So those weak animal your say die during the winter obviously don't die the first winter they contract it.. once again according to the researches. So can still be spread among other animal can still be eaten by hunters who have no idea the animal may be infected.

Just because it doesn't fit your narrative doesn't mean it's not the truth of the matter. Cwd has been in those states for years and years. There's still a ton of animal there and hunting numbers have only gone up.
Hey guys, heís not downplaying CWD lol
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Old 09-27-2022, 05:39 PM   #126
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lol you use these words like narrative as if you know what they mean. The winter is brutal and plenty of perfectly healthy animals succumb, CWD infected animals die at a high rate up there so they naturally don't spread it nearly as much as down here so your odds of eating an infected animal stay constant and stay lower, it's basic common sense.
Hey I got a HS diploma!

Go read some studies nearly every one I've seen has said it usually takes years for an animal to die from cwd. Again not my words that's coming from the researches I've seen. Once again most of the studies on cwd come from northern states... you know where those brutal winters are. So just going by what the researchers have said. I would imagine they may have a little insight on cwd.
I'd say right now you'd have a much higher chance of eating a cwd positive animal up north where it's been for years and years. Where they find find multiple free range animals that are positive every year than you do here in Texas. The future could prove to be different but nobody knows that.

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Old 09-27-2022, 06:11 PM   #127
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Hey I got a HS diploma!

Go read some studies nearly every one I've seen has said it usually takes years for an animal to die from cwd. Again not my words that's coming from the researches I've seen. Once again most of the studies on cwd come from northern states... you know where those brutal winters are. So just going by what the researchers have said. I would imagine they may have a little insight on cwd.
I'd say right now you'd have a much higher chance of eating a cwd positive animal up north where it's been for years and years. Where they find find multiple free range animals that are positive every year than you do here in Texas. The future could prove to be different but nobody knows that.
lol right on

I think the confusion here is that weak animals dying of winter kill aren't dying from CWD, so they don't show in the studies as CWD deaths they're just winter kill. What I'm suggesting is that animals never get the chance to die from the disease due to the brutal winters for exactly the reason you say, it takes years to even start displaying symptoms. Even if I eat an infected animal from there it's likely to be in super early stages and considerably more palatable than down here where I can kill one in advanced stages due to an easy environment and lots of available feed handed to them. In addition the disease is much more likely to take off to an uncontrollable level because of this as well as our addiction to concentrating the animals at feed sources and end up financially hurting the hunting industry and everyone who profits from it.
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Old 09-27-2022, 06:21 PM   #128
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lol right on

I think the confusion here is that weak animals dying of winter kill aren't dying from CWD, so they don't show in the studies as CWD deaths they're just winter kill. What I'm suggesting is that animals never get the chance to die from the disease due to the brutal winters for exactly the reason you say, it takes years to even start displaying symptoms. Even if I eat an infected animal from there it's likely to be in super early stages and considerably more palatable than down here where I can kill one in advanced stages due to an easy environment and lots of available feed handed to them. In addition the disease is much more likely to take off to an uncontrollable level because of this as well as our addiction to concentrating the animals at feed sources and end up financially hurting the hunting industry and everyone who profits from it.
It's very well could but none of us know what it will do here or the impact it could have. Hopefully we don't have to find out I'm just saying it hasn't had that impact on states where it's been for a long time. Doesn't scare people away doesn't keep people from eating them. They hunt just the same as they always have and have more numbers than ever.
Your theory could be a sound one and right on the money. I'm just going by what I've read on the disease. I know we have a member here who hunts a property that is next door to a place that has cwd and has had it for years. May even be a testing/research facility. They still hunt eat the elk they kill.

I'm not a breeder don't have friends or family that are. I'm just not going condemn one group because of what others say or place blame on. They are following the laws it seems and highly doubt anyone of them want cwd or want to spread it.

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Old 09-27-2022, 07:17 PM   #129
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It's very well could but none of us know what it will do here or the impact it could have. Hopefully we don't have to find out I'm just saying it hasn't had that impact on states where it's been for a long time. Doesn't scare people away doesn't keep people from eating them. They hunt just the same as they always have and have more numbers than ever.
Your theory could be a sound one and right on the money. I'm just going by what I've read on the disease. I know we have a member here who hunts a property that is next door to a place that has cwd and has had it for years. May even be a testing/research facility. They still hunt eat the elk they kill.

I'm not a breeder don't have friends or family that are. I'm just not going condemn one group because of what others say or place blame on. They are following the laws it seems and highly doubt anyone of them want cwd or want to spread it.
Yeah that's WyTex, they're pretty heavily versed on the whole thing as well and have quite a bit of contact with those in the know up there.

I can tell you this, last year Lake Amistad had the lowest hunter participation in a long time, 50% or so of the permits of the previous year. There's two things that changed, one being the border issues, and one being that it's now a mandatory CWD zone and every deer in that county is required to be tested and there's carcass handling rules. Every year we have a pretty big camp in which we invite people out, last year I invited all the same characters and had a pretty low turnout, one citing specifically that he doesn't want to clean any infected deer... he's worried about cutting through the spine with his knife and getting exposed to prions that way. I don't know if that's a thing or not, I know that's the last thing I do after quartering an animal up just in case and then I'm sure to wash the knife before doing anything else with it. When I check in at the CWD station those people are telling me that hunters are turning in fewer and fewer deer in that county. I ain't gonna stop hunting and eating animals, but between the border issues and the CWD zone something has already absolutely effected hunting out there.
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Old 09-27-2022, 07:36 PM   #130
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Old 09-27-2022, 07:43 PM   #131
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Calm down little buddy. Anthrax is naturally occurring in the soil in certain areas of Texas. Really nothing you can do about it other than not buying or leasing in those areas.

There's actually been more than 50 cases. Think of it as the China Flu. It starts with one case. Someone transports it to another area. Next thing you know thousands of cases get reported in the new contaminated area. Very simple logic. Had China stopped everyone from exiting or entering their country. The China Flu would have stayed in China. That's about a simple as I can make it for you.
I was expecting you to reply that way. Anthrax was suspected to have been spread by feed.

CWD just miraculously showed up all on its own? Lol
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Old 09-27-2022, 07:53 PM   #132
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lol right on

I think the confusion here is that weak animals dying of winter kill aren't dying from CWD, so they don't show in the studies as CWD deaths they're just winter kill. What I'm suggesting is that animals never get the chance to die from the disease due to the brutal winters for exactly the reason you say, it takes years to even start displaying symptoms. Even if I eat an infected animal from there it's likely to be in super early stages and considerably more palatable than down here where I can kill one in advanced stages due to an easy environment and lots of available feed handed to them. In addition the disease is much more likely to take off to an uncontrollable level because of this as well as our addiction to concentrating the animals at feed sources and end up financially hurting the hunting industry and everyone who profits from it.
Thereís plenty of high fence places in the western states feeding protein as well. Not near as prevalent as in Texas but they are certainly out there. As well as elk and mule deer breeding operations.

CWD IS an issue. I never and wonít dispute that at all.

My gripe has always been about who the blame and shots are all aimed at. As has been mentioned here many times, why are we looking into it being transported by feed? I may be wrong but it seems lots of info needs to be gathered before finding a solution. I agree with shutting down breeder stock transportation until they can accurately live test. The SAME standards need to be implemented on TTT deer and all other sectors of the industry. THAT is my gripe. I donít like canned hunts and kick and shoot operations at all. I think itís a sad way to hunt. But I 100% respect an individuals right to do it as it is legal.

Very similar reaction to Covid. Freak out. Itís gonna ruin everything. Shut it all down before we know anything about it. Put folks out of business. Do irreparable damage to folks affected by these knee jerk reactions.
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Old 09-27-2022, 08:00 PM   #133
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Thereís plenty of high fence places in the western states feeding protein as well. Not near as prevalent as in Texas but they are certainly out there. As well as elk and mule deer breeding operations.

CWD IS an issue. I never and wonít dispute that at all.

My gripe has always been about who the blame and shots are all aimed at. As has been mentioned here many times, why are we looking into it being transported by feed? I may be wrong but it seems lots of info needs to be gathered before finding a solution. I agree with shutting down breeder stock transportation until they can accurately live test. The SAME standards need to be implemented on TTT deer and all other sectors of the industry. THAT is my gripe. I donít like canned hunts and kick and shoot operations at all. I think itís a sad way to hunt. But I 100% respect an individuals right to do it as it is legal.

Very similar reaction to Covid. Freak out. Itís gonna ruin everything. Shut it all down before we know anything about it. Put folks out of business. Do irreparable damage to folks affected by these knee jerk reactions.
Fair enough brotha, respect that POV. Only thing I'd balk at is comparing it to Covid, but that's going off on another rabbit hole.
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Old 09-27-2022, 08:11 PM   #134
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Fair enough brotha, respect that POV. Only thing I'd balk at is comparing it to Covid, but that's going off on another rabbit hole.
Kinda like comparing apples to apple flavored oranges

The knee jerk reaction is what Iím referring to. And strongly dislike. I do have a very good friend who was impacted significantly. I see both sides.
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Old 09-27-2022, 08:19 PM   #135
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I agree with shutting down breeder stock transportation until they can accurately live test. The SAME standards need to be implemented on TTT deer and all other sectors of the industry.
Agreed
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Old 09-27-2022, 08:59 PM   #136
cantexduck
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I have yet to hear of a deer dying from CWD.
And to prove a point I would eat a deer that had cwd. Maybe then TPWD would back off some.
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Old 09-27-2022, 09:01 PM   #137
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Agreed
We already have to live test for movement. You canít live test for trace out but can for movement , what sense does that make ? DMP and TTT are exempt from testing , go figure.
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Old 09-27-2022, 09:05 PM   #138
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Originally Posted by cantexduck View Post
We already have to live test for movement. You canít live test for trace out but can for movement , what sense does that make ? DMP and TTT are exempt from testing , go figure.
Oh they are? Lol. If thatís not blatantly obvious whoís controlling the narrative lol
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Old 09-27-2022, 09:11 PM   #139
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Kinda like comparing apples to apple flavored oranges

The knee jerk reaction is what Iím referring to. And strongly dislike. I do have a very good friend who was impacted significantly. I see both sides.
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Old 09-27-2022, 09:28 PM   #140
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Originally Posted by cantexduck View Post
We already have to live test for movement. You canít live test for trace out but can for movement , what sense does that make ? DMP and TTT are exempt from testing , go figure.
TTT has been suspended since 2021.
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Old 09-27-2022, 09:33 PM   #141
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TTT has been suspended since 2021.
You are right , I forgot about them doing that last year. But I am pretty sure the DMP can still trap and release without testing.
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Old 09-27-2022, 09:34 PM   #142
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Originally Posted by cantexduck View Post
I have yet to hear of a deer dying from CWD.
And to prove a point I would eat a deer that had cwd. Maybe then TPWD would back off some.
I respect that.


Quote:
Originally Posted by cantexduck View Post
We already have to live test for movement. You canít live test for trace out but can for movement , what sense does that make ? DMP and TTT are exempt from testing , go figure.
Didnít know about the exemptions. That is some bull****
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Old 09-27-2022, 10:45 PM   #143
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Apples to oranges and not very well thought out argument. The winter kills the weak animals up there, down here they eat corn all winter and continue to spread the disease around the protein cooler.
This argument while is valid it only applies to roughly a 1/3 of the western habitat. Well Over 1/2 of Colorado is under 6kí and plains, more then that in WY, Montana, Idaho etc. This this why WY and CO have increased tags or extended season in special areas to target higher age classes.

Major traditional winter kill areas like Gunnison etc arenít numerous enough to support this theory in whole.
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Old 09-27-2022, 10:47 PM   #144
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Originally Posted by cantexduck View Post
I have yet to hear of a deer dying from CWD.
And to prove a point I would eat a deer that had cwd. Maybe then TPWD would back off some.
Same here and I’ve been hunting in CWD areas for past 25 years, with out a second thought.
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Old 09-27-2022, 10:52 PM   #145
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This argument while is valid it only applies to roughly a 1/3 of the western habitat. Well Over 1/2 of Colorado is under 6kí and plains, more then that in WY, Montana, Idaho etc. This this why WY and CO have increased tags or extended season in special areas to target higher age classes.

Major traditional winter kill areas like Gunnison etc arenít numerous enough to support this theory in whole.
That's fair, but the winters are still tougher than Texas no matter what and especially for sick animals. Look at how many antelope died off recently, they don't live in the mountains.
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Old 09-27-2022, 10:56 PM   #146
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You are right , I forgot about them doing that last year. But I am pretty sure the DMP can still trap and release without testing.
No CWD test for DMP but you can no longer transfer to deer to a DMP from any breeding facility. Only deer within the designated ranch may be captured and detained in the DMP and released back to the ranch. No outside deer brought in to the ranch, no resident deer going off the ranch.

We TTTed does to other ranches almost every year until the program was suspended and we were always required to submit samples from 15 deer for CWD testing.
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Old 09-27-2022, 11:14 PM   #147
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That's fair, but the winters are still tougher than Texas no matter what and especially for sick animals. Look at how many antelope died off recently, they don't live in the mountains.
Pronghorns? I have had zero die off on my ranch in last 40 years? My ranch essentially borders CO for all essential purposes. I’ve lost cattle but never deer, elk or pronghorns in any measurable amount
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Old 09-27-2022, 11:24 PM   #148
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Same here and Iíve been hunting in CWD areas for past 25 years, with out a second thought.
Same here. I've always figured if anyone was going to catch CWD it would be myself or someone in my immediate family. I can probably all but guarantee there has been at least one cervid having cwd positive proteins consumed in the family and we still continue to hunt and eat those animals in those areas without a second thought. Only thing that's changed is processing in the field to be compliant with the law.
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Old 09-27-2022, 11:56 PM   #149
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Originally Posted by crc View Post
Iím sorry yíall canít see the relevance of making yíall admit your fear of a contagion that yíall are downplaying the spread of.
would you knowingly eat a deer with EHD?
would you knowingly eat a deer with botulism?
would you knowingly eat a deer with anthrax?
would you knowingly eat a deer with lime disease?
would you knowingly eat road kill?

all of those are more common than CWD, and no one lifts an eyebrow at them because the covid response team has told them CWD is what we worry about. I'm all for getting down to a root cause for CWD, but this has turned entirely into a political debacle.

Last edited by kyle1974; 09-28-2022 at 12:18 AM.
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Old 09-28-2022, 10:34 AM   #150
cantexduck
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No CWD test for DMP but you can no longer transfer to deer to a DMP from any breeding facility. Only deer within the designated ranch may be captured and detained in the DMP and released back to the ranch. No outside deer brought in to the ranch, no resident deer going off the ranch.

We TTTed does to other ranches almost every year until the program was suspended and we were always required to submit samples from 15 deer for CWD testing.
That was live testing correct ? Live testing was just made available to breeders last year. And if we want to release deer from our pens to our pasture we have to live test. Whatís the difference between DMP being able to release bred doe from a pen (with a breeder deer they bought three years ago) into the pasture then me releasing buck fawns into our own pasture ?
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