HVAC Question

[PSE guy]

Is R22 a thing of the past ? Some say yes, others say Trump will kill the ban Obama put in place. Some Tech's I know say R22 is the best ever made even compared to the new stuff. Any of this true, I may be in the marked for a couple of 2.5 ton replacements. Any recommendations for honest installation in N. Houston cypress area ? Many thanks in advance for any information !!

[mavrick]

There is no shortage of r22. It’s just opposite there is an over abundance of it. Prices dropped early last year. You will not see your local A/C guy cut the cost but they are only paying $300 to $350 for a 30# jug. You can buy it in bulk for less than $10 a pound. It is by far the best refrigerate available at this time.

[chancito1]

Eventually we will run out of 22 at some point but it’s going to be a while. Personally I think supply houses are making a killing off it and so are a lot of companies. I’ve been at this for right at 30 years averaging between 600 to 700k worth of equipment purchases per year for the last 10 years. R22 was pretty bullet proof in my opinion but honestly have had no problems with 410A either. . I stopped selling R22 units somewhere around 2005. I would have no worry about the 410A refrigerant and focus more on who’s installing it.

[PSE guy]

Many thanks to you all for the feedback..

[Arturo V]

22 was way to simple in my opinion and had been around for to long. Was easy for people to figure out how to charge. as far as subcool super heat go, even the average guy didn’t have to know that and could charge/drop it in.
Beer can cold method I hear and you were good.
I sale a lot of 22. And 410a.
410a. Too will soon be the next (phase out) and it will be onto something else.

[Greenheadless]

I use Heights A/C, ask for Randy Fly. Might not be the cheapest, but the dude is honest as the day is long. I am also in the camp of not to worry about the product and focus more on the installation.

[double bogey]

I have been in hvac my whole life. R-22, and R-12 were good refrigerants. They both used mineral oil for compressor lubrication. R134a, and R404a took up the refrigeration for the most part, and they use POE oil, which is very hygroscopic. Next to impossible to get moisture out of the system and oil. R410a also uses POE oil, on the upside, R410a is more efficient than R22.
They banned R12, and R22 due to ozone depletion, you don't hear about that much anymore as man made climate change has become the hoax of the day. The refrigerant issues have cost trillions of dollars and they aren't through yet. Within the next couple of years they will be banning R410a, so they aren't done fleecing the people just yet. When your R410 system sprouts a leak in the next few years, you will have to replace it again. I have no doubt in the next 20 years they will find a reason to ban whatever they replace R410a with so they can do it again. Wont be an issue for me, I probably wont be around, and if I am I wont be working on them.


After that rant, I will say if you have a R22 system with problems, you should replace it, the higher efficiency alone is almost a good enough reason.

[Uncle Saggy]

I have been in hvac my whole life. R-22, and R-12 were good refrigerants. They both used mineral oil for compressor lubrication. R134a, and R404a took up the refrigeration for the most part, and they use POE oil, which is very hygroscopic. Next to impossible to get moisture out of the system and oil. R410a also uses POE oil, on the upside, R410a is more efficient than R22.
They banned R12, and R22 due to ozone depletion, you don't hear about that much anymore as man made climate change has become the hoax of the day. The refrigerant issues have cost trillions of dollars and they aren't through yet. Within the next couple of years they will be banning R410a, so they aren't done fleecing the people just yet. When your R410 system sprouts a leak in the next few years, you will have to replace it again. I have no doubt in the next 20 years they will find a reason to ban whatever they replace R410a with so they can do it again. Wont be an issue for me, I probably wont be around, and if I am I wont be working on them.


After that rant, I will say if you have a R22 system with problems, you should replace it, the higher efficiency alone is almost a good enough reason.

And yet we still get to play with R123.....I’m still trying to figure that one out


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[double bogey]

Trane too big and influential maybe. After 47 teardowns in 18 years on Trane chillers, (have done all of the big 4) for some dumb reason I miss moving pig iron around. No way I could even begin to do it today. If I am buying a heavy tonnage machine, it would be a low pressure machine.
Disclaimer, I don't or have ever worked for Trane.

[bowhntrmatt]

If you are replacing a system, R-22 is NOT the way to go. You would probably have a hard time even finding someone that would sell you one.

[Uncle Saggy]

Trane too big and influential maybe. After 47 teardowns in 18 years on Trane chillers, (have done all of the big 4) for some dumb reason I miss moving pig iron around. No way I could even begin to do it today. If I am buying a heavy tonnage machine, it would be a low pressure machine.
Disclaimer, I don't or have ever worked for Trane.

LOL
I sometimes miss moving and swinging it too.
We still have an old sidewinder under contract [emoji23]


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[TeamAmerica]

i wouldn't hesitate to repair and re-fill a R22 system. there is plenty to go around. you can find it on re-sale for good prices - just be sure you buy a sealed new bottle - not something someone reclaimed from who knows where!

[PSE guy]

Dang.. The green screen brain trust is the best. My thanks to all you folks !!! I have no clue on brands (good-vs-bad) and I know it's like chevy -vs-ford, so could I ask what I should steer clear of from the experts that work on this stuff every day ? My current installer sells American Standard yet current units are 27 year old Goodman. Most say Goodman stinks but they have done well for me. Maybe I'm lucky. I don't know..Is there such thing as a labor warranty with new units ? My neighbor had a trane coil replaced but he had to pay labor for the change out($900). Is that the normal model, manufacturer warrants the part but not the labor ?

[Uncle Saggy]

i wouldn't hesitate to repair and re-fill a R22 system. there is plenty to go around. you can find it on re-sale for good prices - just be sure you buy a sealed new bottle - not something someone reclaimed from who knows where!

Stupid advice right here



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[TeamAmerica]

Stupid advice right here



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Care to elaborate? How many 2.5 ton systems could you refill with 30 lbs?

https://www.refrigerantguys.com/R22-Refrigerant-30lb-p/111018.htm