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Old 01-31-2020, 03:32 PM   #1
TxAgHntr
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Default Tankless water heater or NO?

Water heater bit the dust today.

Considering the tankless option but want to get some expert advice from folks that wont make any money off my dilemma. I am located in Georgetown and have a water softener on the system. 2bath house with family of 5 normal use IMO.

Some info I am gathering is that they don't hold up to daily household use and that quality of water is a major factor as well. Thanks in advance.
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Old 01-31-2020, 03:43 PM   #2
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We replaced two 50 gallon gas water heaters with one gas Reni over 10 years ago and love it!!! I do flush it with vinegar ever couple of years.
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Old 01-31-2020, 03:45 PM   #3
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Only go tankless if you have gas or propane. If you do, I will never go back to a tank heater.

I have been running a Tikagi for 20 years now.
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Old 01-31-2020, 03:52 PM   #4
TxAgHntr
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I am electric only.
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Old 01-31-2020, 03:54 PM   #5
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In a similar situation, and if I can afford it I think we will go tankless on electric. I have heard nothing but good things about them
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Old 01-31-2020, 04:00 PM   #6
Rick
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check the power required....I installed a small tankless in a small house and had to run a 60 amp circuit for it....I could not believe it. most regular electric water heaters usually have a 30 amp circuit
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Old 01-31-2020, 04:01 PM   #7
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unless you use a massive amount of hot water and run out all the time or are going to reclaim the floor space I don't think it's worth it.
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Old 01-31-2020, 04:02 PM   #8
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certainly not from an efficiency (economic) perspective.
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Old 01-31-2020, 04:06 PM   #9
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I went with a rheem electric tankless a year ago. Its the higher volume model but I just love it. Never run out of water and electric bill dropped.

Only negative wax we had to run two super heavy wires and I stall two 60 amp 220 breakers.
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Old 01-31-2020, 04:09 PM   #10
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If you are installing a gas unit then go for it but if itís electric then avoid it like the plague.


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Old 01-31-2020, 04:12 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TxAgHntr View Post
I am electric only.
IMHO, I would stick with a tank version then.
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Old 01-31-2020, 04:21 PM   #12
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For a whole house you would need to go with a gas tankless unit. We have had great results on Rinnai and Nortiz brands in both residential and commercial applications.
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Old 01-31-2020, 04:22 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TxAgHntr View Post
I am electric only.
If you are electric only then going back with a tank is your best option.
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Old 01-31-2020, 04:23 PM   #14
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Newest models require flushing on a regular basis and not sure what all is involved. I do not own one but certainly our rock hard water in Central TX can be Very tough on water heating.I would expect it to be Super critical to maintain a good water softener. I retired but part time in plumbing parts for a while. Not an expert. I heard Renai is a good choice. It does require extra maintenance but it is a great system done right. I understand install costs can add at notable labor/parts cost over a basic tank replacement install. That may earn itself back if more efficient? And yes if no gas, the service is heavy on the electric demand and will need a powerful circuit. Many older electric heaters had one element and as small as 10 gauge which will Not run a modern dual element and not even close to a tankless demands. Serious electric work possible? Long comment but learned a "little" so sharing points to consider. Not a pro so error could easily exist in my info. Good Luck.
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Old 01-31-2020, 04:28 PM   #15
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Yep, just replace your tank heater and put a timer on it. Runs a couple hrs in the a.m. then maybe 3 or 4 in the evening.(adjust to your schedule) If it's in the garage or attic, put a blanket on it. For whatever reason we may need more hot water for something, just flip the switch...doesn't happen much tho. Not sure how long it'd take to recover the costs of your install mods, especially adding two new 60 amp circuits. That's if nothing happens to the heater.
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Old 01-31-2020, 04:29 PM   #16
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Buddy of mine just bought an electric tankless unit for a small cabin he's building for a hunting camp. I was shocked to see how much power that think pulled, if I remember correctly, it pulled 50 amps. I advised him to return it and get a small tank unit. Doubt he's going to do it. Good guy buy a dumb arse when it comes to anything mechanical / electrical / construction related.
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Old 01-31-2020, 04:35 PM   #17
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The electric ones once you get past the small point-of-use ones they get crazy with the power requirements. I have one sitting at my shop on the shelf that requires 3 60amp breakers.
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Old 01-31-2020, 04:38 PM   #18
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Have had miserable time with my new 2$k tankless. Will never do it again
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Old 01-31-2020, 04:40 PM   #19
warrington
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Mines gas

It will go out at times and you a have to reset it

They replaced it and the new one does it as well
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Old 01-31-2020, 04:49 PM   #20
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Agreed on gas models! We have a gas tankless and we cook on gas as well. Spend $200 on 100 gallons which lasts for about 10-11 months so how's that for cost effective! Best thing about the heaters is a non-limit of hot water, however some faucets take a little longer than you would think depending where the unit is mounted. Won't ever go back to the standard water heater!!
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Old 01-31-2020, 04:57 PM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TXhunter77 View Post
If you are electric only then going back with a tank is your best option.
Agreed. Only go tankless if you have gas. I have had homes with both and there is a huge difference.
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Old 01-31-2020, 04:59 PM   #22
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We have an electric tankless just for our master bath. It serves its purpose for us. Regular water heater for the rest of the house.
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Old 01-31-2020, 05:04 PM   #23
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Agreed. Only go tankless if you have gas. I have had homes with both and there is a huge difference.
Yep
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Old 01-31-2020, 05:14 PM   #24
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Originally Posted by kumathebear View Post
Agreed on gas models! We have a gas tankless and we cook on gas as well. Spend $200 on 100 gallons which lasts for about 10-11 months so how's that for cost effective! Best thing about the heaters is a non-limit of hot water, however some faucets take a little longer than you would think depending where the unit is mounted. Won't ever go back to the standard water heater!!
This and do regular maintenance!!!
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Old 01-31-2020, 05:26 PM   #25
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Originally Posted by Smokeater View Post
Yep, just replace your tank heater and put a timer on it. Runs a couple hrs in the a.m. then maybe 3 or 4 in the evening.(adjust to your schedule) If it's in the garage or attic, put a blanket on it. For whatever reason we may need more hot water for something, just flip the switch...doesn't happen much tho. Not sure how long it'd take to recover the costs of your install mods, especially adding two new 60 amp circuits. That's if nothing happens to the heater.

Need more details on this timer? My heater is hard wired to the breaker panel currently... Are you meaning put it on a timer like a normal lamp timer that shuts off and on to keep from basically heating water all day?
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Old 01-31-2020, 05:31 PM   #26
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https://www.lowes.com/pd/Intermatic-...-Timer/3125325

Installed adjacent to the water heater.
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Old 01-31-2020, 05:32 PM   #27
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I have a rinnea brand tankless. I’ll never have a tank one again
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Old 01-31-2020, 05:35 PM   #28
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Tank heater works just fine and a lot cheaper.
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Old 01-31-2020, 05:51 PM   #29
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I have a two gas tankless at home and an electric tankless at my farm house. No complaints with either. The electric only pulls power when in use so it won’t increase your electric bill versus a tank heater. Installation will be more upfront though.
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Old 01-31-2020, 09:33 PM   #30
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We have 3 gas tankless units for the house. I love it man. You can run the dishwasher the washing machine and 2 different showers at the same time and NEVER have to worry about cold water again.

A wise man (my dad) one told me that you can get just as clean in cold water as you can in hot. The only difference is the amount of time it takes!
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Old 01-31-2020, 10:31 PM   #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by warrington View Post
Mines gas

It will go out at times and you a have to reset it

They replaced it and the new one does it as well
I have one that was cutting off. I checked it and read the code that was blinking, come to find out the mud dobbers had flown in the vent and made nest on the radiator causing it to overheat. Once I cleaned it out, put screen over the opening, all has been great.

I have a Rinnai and it is Propane
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Old 01-31-2020, 10:55 PM   #32
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On all electric go back with a tank.

Donít fall for the timer gimmick. It takes more to heat the water than to maintain the temperature.


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Old 01-31-2020, 11:00 PM   #33
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unless you use a massive amount of hot water and run out all the time or are going to reclaim the floor space I don't think it's worth it.
We install a lot of them, and this is what I would say also. The tankless keeps up with the demand by diminishing the flow rate. They will not save you money, and initial cost is quit a bit higher. You will not get hot water any quicker then a standard water heater ( number one reason we hear, why people want one, and itís just not the case). In many cases you have to increase your gas line size also.
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Old 02-01-2020, 06:49 PM   #34
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In many cases you have to increase your gas line size also.

And your vent stack too
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Old 02-01-2020, 08:35 PM   #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by critter69 View Post
We install a lot of them, and this is what I would say also. The tankless keeps up with the demand by diminishing the flow rate. They will not save you money, and initial cost is quit a bit higher. You will not get hot water any quicker then a standard water heater ( number one reason we hear, why people want one, and itís just not the case). In many cases you have to increase your gas line size also.
Folks came in where I sold systems and installations wanting the instant Heat recirculating or the tankless systems for same reasons. Mis leading ads usually do not clarify circulation systems etc. in the real world. Sorry but true. A home must be properly plumbed for features. Period . Otherwise it is a choice of old school hot water or new school hot water modified in an existing old school system. I respect folks not understanding this and hopefully the complications can be grasped. There are cool things but limits apply. You are correct best I know and open to be corrected.
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Old 02-01-2020, 09:26 PM   #36
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Need more details on this timer? My heater is hard wired to the breaker panel currently... Are you meaning put it on a timer like a normal lamp timer that shuts off and on to keep from basically heating water all day?
The timer that Greenheadless posted. Got em on both our heaters. Been using them for a long time...25 yrs. in this house.
The wire coming from your breaker goes to it on the line side then add wire (in flex conduit) from the load side to the heater. Set the tabs for your morning and evening on/off times and good to go. If we're doing stuff where more hot water is needed, just flip the switch..it'll stay on till the next off cycle. Got em set to come on about an hour before and an hour after showers...am and pm. I figure there's 14 to 15 hrs a day mine ain't running. There's just 3 of us in the house now and the routine doesn't change much during the week. They're set to stay on for a good hour or so after we're usually done. That allows it to heat all the way up before shutting off. With 50 gallons, it'll stay plenty hot for a shower or two any time during the off cycle as well. May not work for everyone but they've been saving me $ for a long time!
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Old 02-01-2020, 09:35 PM   #37
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Consider adding a propane tank for a tankless heater. Ive been running an electric tankless for 3 years now. Family of 4 with no problems. I will be switching to a gas unit when this one dies because i hate that my lights flicker when i use hot water.
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Old 02-01-2020, 09:36 PM   #38
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well when all those who complain about the price of the electric tankless can get down to my $78 monthly electric bill they might have something to talk about,, 1500 sq feet, 2 showers, a dishwasher ( used at least ever other day) a minimum of 2 showers every day of the week and when the grand kids are over which is every week, there will be at least 6 showers plus bathing the dog once a week ... and yes it is running on 2 60 amp breakers,,, and we rarely do not have the ac or heat on everyday of the week, plus ceiling fans, and not counting light usage... laundry as often as 4 days a week not only our own but my wives mothers ( only once a week on those) and often some of the grand kids clothes.....

this is my second electric tankless water heater and i was told by everyone i would hate it and it would be expensive to run,,,, bullsnot...

we have been in our home since may 4th and only the first months bill was over 150$ and thats because the workers were leaving the doors open and all 6 ac units running,,,,, yes we only run about 125-150 on the monthly electric bill ,,, one tankless heater runs everything in the house, and it is not even a big one!

i am also home 3-4 days a week (all day frequently,) so it not like the house is going vacant most of the time

Last edited by xman59; 02-01-2020 at 09:39 PM.
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Old 02-01-2020, 09:53 PM   #39
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TxAgHntr View Post
I am electric only.
Stick with the tank-type.

If efficiency is what you are after, go with a heat pump water heater if yours is located in an open space like a garage or attic.
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Old 02-01-2020, 09:54 PM   #40
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Propane. Yes. Hot hot water. Cheap!
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Old 02-01-2020, 10:41 PM   #41
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Default Tankless water heater or NO?

If you find yourself running out of hot water with your current set up then go tankless. If you have no issues with the current set up stay with a like system.

You will never save enough energy to cover the cost of tankless.

I currently have 3 tankless heaters and 1 traditional, tankless serve deer camp where multiple showers back to back cause issues, home two person tub that a tank heater wouldnít fill and a shop that only uses hot water a couple times per month.

Utility room and kitchen run off tank heater

Last edited by bboswell; 02-01-2020 at 10:45 PM.
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Old 02-02-2020, 12:01 AM   #42
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Quote:
Originally Posted by xman59 View Post
well when all those who complain about the price of the electric tankless can get down to my $78 monthly electric bill they might have something to talk about,, 1500 sq feet, 2 showers, a dishwasher ( used at least ever other day) a minimum of 2 showers every day of the week and when the grand kids are over which is every week, there will be at least 6 showers plus bathing the dog once a week ... and yes it is running on 2 60 amp breakers,,, and we rarely do not have the ac or heat on everyday of the week, plus ceiling fans, and not counting light usage... laundry as often as 4 days a week not only our own but my wives mothers ( only once a week on those) and often some of the grand kids clothes.....

this is my second electric tankless water heater and i was told by everyone i would hate it and it would be expensive to run,,,, bullsnot...

we have been in our home since may 4th and only the first months bill was over 150$ and thats because the workers were leaving the doors open and all 6 ac units running,,,,, yes we only run about 125-150 on the monthly electric bill ,,, one tankless heater runs everything in the house, and it is not even a big one!

i am also home 3-4 days a week (all day frequently,) so it not like the house is going vacant most of the time
We've been using an electric tankless for over 20 years now and have had the same experience you have. All the talk about how much electricity they use is just not true. I will never use any thing else.
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Old 02-02-2020, 05:54 AM   #43
warrington
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Originally Posted by junkmanhunter View Post
I have one that was cutting off. I checked it and read the code that was blinking, come to find out the mud dobbers had flown in the vent and made nest on the radiator causing it to overheat. Once I cleaned it out, put screen over the opening, all has been great.

I have a Rinnai and it is Propane
They have check that, put a u coupling on it thinking maybe itís rain getting in there. Heck I donít know, frustrating
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Old 02-02-2020, 07:30 AM   #44
Mike D
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Default Tankless water heater or NO?

Quote:
Originally Posted by xman59 View Post
well when all those who complain about the price of the electric tankless can get down to my $78 monthly electric bill they might have something to talk about,, 1500 sq feet, 2 showers, a dishwasher ( used at least ever other day) a minimum of 2 showers every day of the week and when the grand kids are over which is every week, there will be at least 6 showers plus bathing the dog once a week ... and yes it is running on 2 60 amp breakers,,, and we rarely do not have the ac or heat on everyday of the week, plus ceiling fans, and not counting light usage... laundry as often as 4 days a week not only our own but my wives mothers ( only once a week on those) and often some of the grand kids clothes.....

this is my second electric tankless water heater and i was told by everyone i would hate it and it would be expensive to run,,,, bullsnot...

we have been in our home since may 4th and only the first months bill was over 150$ and thats because the workers were leaving the doors open and all 6 ac units running,,,,, yes we only run about 125-150 on the monthly electric bill ,,, one tankless heater runs everything in the house, and it is not even a big one!

i am also home 3-4 days a week (all day frequently,) so it not like the house is going vacant most of the time


Consider yourself lucky. You must have a defective electric meter. Resistive electric heat is the most power consuming, inefficient heat there is.

Iím not gonna say youíre wrong because you pay your bills but I do know about electricity and consumption.

Anything drawing 120 amps is going to make your electricity use skyrocket. There is nothing else in your house that will draw that much power unless both stages of an electric furnace were to come on which just doesnít happen in Texas.


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Old 02-02-2020, 07:49 AM   #45
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And your vent stack too
All the ones we install vent, with pvc. Canít go up a std. metal b-vent stack.
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Old 02-02-2020, 07:53 AM   #46
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I think the bigger issue is if you weren’t already set up for the load requirements.

You would need to evaluate running new circuits to handle the new load requirements.

Second, you would need to make sure your current service can even handle the increased load.

The, the above is valid. Electric heating elements are the most inefficient.
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Old 02-02-2020, 08:33 AM   #47
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Resistive electric heat is the most power consuming, inefficient heat there is.
Gotta disagree here, and I have a couple of simple pointsó look at efficiency factors of gas vs. electric heaters. Also think about the fact that every kw-h converted to heat in an electric heater ends up in the water. Then go up on your roof and put your hand over the vent while your gas water heater is running.
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Old 02-02-2020, 10:07 AM   #48
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Consider yourself lucky. You must have a defective electric meter. Resistive electric heat is the most power consuming, inefficient heat there is.

I’m not gonna say you’re wrong because you pay your bills but I do know about electricity and consumption.

Anything drawing 120 amps is going to make your electricity use skyrocket. There is nothing else in your house that will draw that much power unless both stages of an electric furnace were to come on which just doesn’t happen in Texas.


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Yea, something wrong for sure. Hope they don’t catch it and back charge him. But most likely what will happen. If they don’t catch it, he’s one lucky dude. Or the price of electricity down there is super cheap.

Last edited by critter69; 02-02-2020 at 10:18 AM.
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Old 02-02-2020, 10:13 AM   #49
critter69
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Originally Posted by meltingfeather View Post
Gotta disagree here, and I have a couple of simple points— look at efficiency factors of gas vs. electric heaters. Also think about the fact that every kw-h converted to heat in an electric heater ends up in the water. Then go up on your roof and put your hand over the vent while your gas water heater is running.
Not sure about costs down there, but my xcel bill ( utility company, gas and electric, is around 300.00 a month. Less then 20.00 a month ( normally 15.00-16.00) are gas, electric makes up the majority of it. I have natural gas, water heater, gas range, natural gas grill, and gas fireplace. Gas is far cheaper here then electric. You can get gas fired water heaters in the 95% efficacy range now ( which I don’t have) so very little goes out the flue.

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Old 02-02-2020, 01:52 PM   #50
xman59
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Originally Posted by Mike D View Post
Consider yourself lucky. You must have a defective electric meter. Resistive electric heat is the most power consuming, inefficient heat there is.

Iím not gonna say youíre wrong because you pay your bills but I do know about electricity and consumption.

Anything drawing 120 amps is going to make your electricity use skyrocket. There is nothing else in your house that will draw that much power unless both stages of an electric furnace were to come on which just doesnít happen in Texas.


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nothing wrong with the meter, it is the same one that was in my archery shop when i was running window unit acs,, and getting 175-200 a month bills,,

i really believe that most people who complain about the bill are running the water temp way higher than it needs to be,,, with an on demand we can change it at will with the turn of a dial,,, i lost my archery shop and home in the Harvey flood and the shop building was fine after gutting the interior,, so we turned the shop building into the house,,,, i did purposely set out to be as energy efficient as i could because of how high the old bill was when i was only heating and cooling 720 sqft,,, all the walls are double insulated the exterior metal wall and the inside house walls that are about 20" inside the sheet metal, went all led lights and mini split ac units,, 3 outside and 6 inside,, but i already knew the water heater was efficient having had it in the shop i just replaced it with a bigger one more appropriate for a house....

the on demand as most people know turns of instantly when you shut the hot water flow off,, no reason to keep heating water 30-45 min after the use is over, then periodically throughout the day ,,, go on vacation or just a 2 day trip for the weekend you tank is still keeping water hot all day and all night,, that is what is not efficient,,, your at work it comes on,, you take a shower or do dishes that tank heater element comes on right away when the water level drops in that tank just a little bit,,, i currently work in a hardware store and we sell heating elements for water tanks,, the elements are plenty cheap, but it seems like most of the elements we sell are 4500 watt,, that is a whole lot of juice !
the absolute worse thing i can say about electric tankless is that when the power goes out,,, i dont get any water not even cold since i am on a well
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