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Old 11-26-2018, 12:50 PM   #1
jer_james
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Default GM Layoffs - Frustrating

https://www.foxbusiness.com/markets/...vehicle-models

Makes you wonder where the auto industry is heading, and what we will be seeing in the next 5 years or so.
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Old 11-26-2018, 01:38 PM   #2
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I see my boycott is working. Gonna drive this old cheby another 200k or until it croaks. Ain't ever gonna buy another truck of any make. That'll show em!
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Old 11-26-2018, 01:56 PM   #3
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If they’d just bring the El Camino back they wouldn’t need to lay anyone off


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Old 11-26-2018, 02:41 PM   #4
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If they’d just bring the El Camino back they wouldn’t need to lay anyone off
Haha - I'm good without it.
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Old 11-26-2018, 02:49 PM   #5
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Innovate and keep up.....or go under.
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Old 11-26-2018, 04:05 PM   #6
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The US doesn't want American made sedans...we want big trucks, fast sports cars, SUV's & crossovers. GM didn't have much choice & better to make these moves now vs saving everybody's job, continue to loose $$$$ & get the tax payer to bail GM out again & the process starts all over.

My understanding is all the plants affected are tooled for sedans.
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Old 11-26-2018, 04:15 PM   #7
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There's not a lack of demand for new trucks, there's a lack of demand for $75K trucks. Bring back the base model work trucks with a towing pks and a little trim and trhey'd start selling some trucks.

Cuts like they're making today says GM and their unions will need another bail-out in two or three years.
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Old 11-26-2018, 04:17 PM   #8
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It cost about a third of what they’re charging to build a new one. Do the math.
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Old 11-26-2018, 04:46 PM   #9
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I know a delivery guy, he tells me they have all their lots near the Arlington plant full.
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Old 11-26-2018, 04:46 PM   #10
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Thanks Barak!
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Old 11-26-2018, 05:06 PM   #11
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There's not a lack of demand for new trucks, there's a lack of demand for $75K trucks. Bring back the base model work trucks with a towing pks and a little trim and trhey'd start selling some trucks.
I'm not going to act like I know the trucking business....but it sure does seem like there is a hole there that needs to be filled.
I am driving my 2007 Tacoma into the freaken ground..I just can't see myself paying the cost of these new trucks. Plus I am worried that the new trucks are made with so much computer tech in them that it would be **** near impossible to repair something if it breaks. Screw comfort and luxury...just make a dang truck that gets a person from A to B and back every day.
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Old 11-26-2018, 06:08 PM   #12
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You would prefer them to keep hemorrhaging money with a **** poor business plan? Seems like they are planning for the future, and the market responded to the moves well.

The company, which is shifting its focus to electric and autonomous vehicles, has been cutting jobs to deal with plunging car sales in North America and has been debating for months how to address shrinking car demand.
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Old 11-26-2018, 07:56 PM   #13
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Innovate and keep up.....or go under.
My thoughts exactly
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Old 11-26-2018, 09:32 PM   #14
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I'm not going to act like I know the trucking business....but it sure does seem like there is a hole there that needs to be filled.
I am driving my 2007 Tacoma into the freaken ground..I just can't see myself paying the cost of these new trucks. Plus I am worried that the new trucks are made with so much computer tech in them that it would be **** near impossible to repair something if it breaks. Screw comfort and luxury...just make a dang truck that gets a person from A to B and back every day.
Yep, I'll likely never own a new truck but if I do I guess I'll have to special order it with hand crank windows, rubber floors and no nav. Or any of the other tech. that comes in them.
I just want simple but that seems impossible
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Old 11-26-2018, 09:36 PM   #15
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I think GM is way behind in the modern world of small electric cars or hybrids. Holding their own on trucks. JMO.
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Old 11-26-2018, 10:04 PM   #16
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Unions busting them. Plus crappy product
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Old 11-26-2018, 10:58 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Man View Post
Innovate and keep up.....or go under.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Artos View Post
The US doesn't want American made sedans...we want big trucks, fast sports cars, SUV's & crossovers. GM didn't have much choice & better to make these moves now vs saving everybody's job, continue to loose $$$$ & get the tax payer to bail GM out again & the process starts all over.

My understanding is all the plants affected are tooled for sedans.
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Old 11-26-2018, 11:03 PM   #18
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junk product, over priced, a lot!
cars that are to small to use for anything,,,, dang motorcycles are as big as some of the cars...

quit shafting people on warranty repairs,,
no body really wants an electric car,, there just trying to make you think you do ( city slicker, and sheeple) fall for that crap.....

many foreign car makers make a better car, sell it for less and back it up better,,, and chevy already has massive problems with electronic parts now,,, the last thing they need to do is make electric cars!!!!
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Old 11-26-2018, 11:06 PM   #19
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You can't pay people not to work forever.


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Old 11-26-2018, 11:07 PM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by xman59 View Post
junk product, over priced, a lot!

cars that are to small to use for anything,,,, dang motorcycles are as big as some of the cars...



quit shafting people on warranty repairs,,

no body really wants an electric car,, there just trying to make you think you do ( city slicker, and sheeple) fall for that crap.....



many foreign car makers make a better car, sell it for less and back it up better,,, and chevy already has massive problems with electronic parts now,,, the last thing they need to do is make electric cars!!!!


Unions, bro.


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Old 11-27-2018, 08:17 AM   #21
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Originally Posted by Thumper View Post
There's not a lack of demand for new trucks, there's a lack of demand for $75K trucks. Bring back the base model work trucks with a towing pks and a little trim and trhey'd start selling some trucks.

Cuts like they're making today says GM and their unions will need another bail-out in two or three years.
Yes sir. Miss my old 1970 C20 with 350/350 four bolt, large capacity radiator and 4:10 positrac, 4 spd granny. That thing would pull a mountain. Only lasted for 252K miles. I did have to replace a water pump and alternator and shocks one time It actually got decent gas mileage for a 4 barrel carb.
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Old 11-27-2018, 08:25 AM   #22
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Unions, bro.
My Dad worked a job at a Kroger warehouse for 10 years after his Service. The week he hit 10 years is when he quit. He will have a pretty decent little amount of money coming to him every month when the time comes because of it.
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Old 11-27-2018, 08:32 AM   #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Artos View Post
The US doesn't want American made sedans...we want big trucks, fast sports cars, SUV's & crossovers. GM didn't have much choice & better to make these moves now vs saving everybody's job, continue to loose $$$$ & get the tax payer to bail GM out again & the process starts all over.

My understanding is all the plants affected are tooled for sedans.
Looked at and drove a $115,000.00 Cadillac last week and was shocked at how behind the times it was. Impala level of bells and whistles.......
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Old 11-27-2018, 08:35 AM   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by xman59 View Post
junk product, over priced, a lot!
cars that are to small to use for anything,,,, dang motorcycles are as big as some of the cars...

quit shafting people on warranty repairs,,
no body really wants an electric car,, there just trying to make you think you do ( city slicker, and sheeple) fall for that crap.....

many foreign car makers make a better car, sell it for less and back it up better,,, and chevy already has massive problems with electronic parts now,,, the last thing they need to do is make electric cars!!!!
That statement would apply to all 3 US car companies. I drive a gmc and wife drives a Ford so I ain’t partial to one brand or another.
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Old 11-27-2018, 08:37 AM   #25
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Ford is doing fine
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Old 11-27-2018, 12:24 PM   #26
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You can't pay people not to work forever.


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That's kinda what a pension is.
Paying folks who aren't currently working for you and producing current income.
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Old 11-27-2018, 12:34 PM   #27
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Ford is doing fine
According to this article it looks like Ford already has planned to go all truck and suv but the Mustang. So I would assume they are feeling the pinch but not as bad as Chevy is right now.

https://www.automobilemag.com/news/2...ure-cars-ford/
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Old 11-27-2018, 12:36 PM   #28
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According to this article it looks like Ford already has planned to go all truck and suv but the Mustang. So I would assume they are feeling the pinch but not as bad as Chevy is right now.

https://www.automobilemag.com/news/2...ure-cars-ford/
Ya - this GM thing is shining an unfavorable light on Ford as well.

Says their issues/cutbacks are forthcoming.
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Old 11-27-2018, 12:39 PM   #29
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Ya - this GM thing is shining an unfavorable light on Ford as well.

Says their issues/cutbacks are forthcoming.
Ford's financial report in October showed an 11 percent decline in sales for 2018. Their trucks are keeping them afloat.
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Old 11-27-2018, 12:40 PM   #30
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They need to get more of the autonomous option out there in a gas powered sedan and SUV not. The features of the Tesla with the range and quick fillups you get from gas.

I'd go out and buy one if they would get it done. I don't give a crap about hybrids and all electric but the self driving features of the Tesla are very nice.
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Old 11-27-2018, 02:21 PM   #31
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Trump just tweeted that he is looking at cutting all of GM's subsidies including electric cars
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Old 11-27-2018, 02:47 PM   #32
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Ford is doing fine
Have you seen their stock?
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Old 11-27-2018, 03:30 PM   #33
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Trump just tweeted that he is looking at cutting all of GM's subsidies including electric cars
Something should be done
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Old 11-27-2018, 03:40 PM   #34
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Trump just tweeted that he is looking at cutting all of GM's subsidies including electric cars
Interesting term used when it comes to large corporations. When talking about our fellow Americans (or non Americans) it is welfare. The business in the middle gets nothing but an array of taxes and filing deadlines.
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Old 11-27-2018, 03:56 PM   #35
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I think Donnie used the right term. I dont think the Feds should be in the car business in the first place, but they atleast capped the number to help the smaller dealers.

Trump said he is “looking at cutting all GM subsidies” following the announcements. Currently, consumers can take advantage of a $7,500 federal tax credit if they purchase an all-electric vehicle, which includes GM vehicles including the Chevrolet Bolt and Chevrolet Volt. The federal tax credits begin to phase out after a manufacturer sells 200,000 electric cars, a limit which GM and other automakers have been lobbying Congress to lift.
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Old 11-27-2018, 05:13 PM   #36
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The Volt... Lol
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Old 11-27-2018, 05:30 PM   #37
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Trump just tweeted that he is looking at cutting all of GM's subsidies including electric cars
He can't
But Congress can
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Old 11-27-2018, 07:16 PM   #38
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Looked at and drove a $115,000.00 Cadillac last week and was shocked at how behind the times it was. Impala level of bells and whistles.......
Well you clearly looked at the wrong model amigo...there is only one caddy WORTH owning & that is the 640HP CTS-V, but then again I'm only concerned with whats under the hood & can handle impala bells & whistles.

Get this one and report back...I think you get a track day in vegas with this & the Z06 vette. Why GM doesn't offer this with the ZL1 Camaro is insulting. Heck, it's the same LT4 engine mine even has 10 more HP & yet no track day Vegas for us bottom feeders?? Yeah, GM sucks.

I seriously want to drive this sedan:

https://www.cadillac.com/v-series/ct.../photo-gallery

Last edited by Artos; 11-27-2018 at 07:19 PM.
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Old 11-27-2018, 09:52 PM   #39
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Well you clearly looked at the wrong model amigo...there is only one caddy WORTH owning & that is the 640HP CTS-V, but then again I'm only concerned with whats under the hood & can handle impala bells & whistles.

Get this one and report back...I think you get a track day in vegas with this & the Z06 vette. Why GM doesn't offer this with the ZL1 Camaro is insulting. Heck, it's the same LT4 engine mine even has 10 more HP & yet no track day Vegas for us bottom feeders?? Yeah, GM sucks.

I seriously want to drive this sedan:

https://www.cadillac.com/v-series/ct.../photo-gallery
What Cadillac is worth 115? I thought the V’s topped out at around 95?
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Old 11-27-2018, 10:12 PM   #40
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What Cadillac is worth 115? I thought the V’s topped out at around 95?


I don't know, unless they put that motor from the CTS-V in the suburban sized Caddy.

I have been in a Caddy in the last year, and it didn't look anything like a Malibu, but my pickup has ballsack coolers now, so...what do I know.


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Old 11-27-2018, 10:15 PM   #41
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US automakers have two problems...poor quality, and high prices. And the main contributor to those two problems over the last 30 years BY FAR....is the United Autoworkers UNION. That's a fact, folks!


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Old 11-27-2018, 10:41 PM   #42
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dale Moser View Post
US automakers have two problems...poor quality, and high prices. And the main contributor to those two problems over the last 30 years BY FAR....is the United Autoworkers UNION. That's a fact, folks!


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Let it be written...let it be done!
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Old 11-27-2018, 10:48 PM   #43
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What Cadillac is worth 115? I thought the V’s topped out at around 95?
I'm sure it was the CTS-V he was looking at but normally not seen by most GM dealers. That is usually an ADM (additional dealer mark-up) Ford tactic...they tried it on me with the GT350R before I found out about the ZL1 & also when Dad wanted to buy the new A10 17 Raptor.

Cannot tell you what a great pleasure it was in telling the Ford salesman who called me wanting to deal after the fact:

Ford: "Just wanted you to know you are the first buyer to EVER get a GT350R at only $1k over sticker."

Me: "Thanks, have you heard about the new 10 speed 650HP Camaro ZL1...there is going to be a very limited release of the 50yr anniversary due to the late launch."

Ford: "Yeah, a little."

Me: "Remember when I told you and the sales manager I would never pay more than sticker & you both sorta looked at each other and rolled your eyes."

Ford: crickets

Me: The Chevy dealer down the road only had two allocations & allowed me to place an order. They even accepted all GM discounts & got $3k off sticker for a very desirable 50th anniversary car that is faster & handles better than the 350 you want to bless me with an ADM of $1k."

Ford: Crickets

Me: "Hello, I took position of it last month, wanna see it."

Ford: "I understand sir."

Me: "Save my number & only call me when/if you get one of the new GT500's and willing to give me dibs on one at sticker."

Ford: Crickets
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Old 11-27-2018, 11:21 PM   #44
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US automakers have two problems...poor quality, and high prices. And the main contributor to those two problems over the last 30 years BY FAR....is the United Autoworkers UNION. That's a fact, folks!


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We agree here Dale
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Old 11-28-2018, 04:56 AM   #45
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What Cadillac is worth 115? I thought the V’s topped out at around 95?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Artos View Post
I'm sure it was the CTS-V he was looking at but normally not seen by most GM dealers.
Escalade platinum edition is about 95k base and can get to around $110k with options

For that type of coin he could be in a e63 wagon
Seats 7 and has 600 something ponies
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Old 11-28-2018, 04:59 AM   #46
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And the main contributor to those two problems over the last 30 years BY FAR....is the United Autoworkers UNION. That's a fact, folks!

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We agree here Dale
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Let it be written...let it be done!
Nobody likes workers negotiating for their rights as a group?
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Old 11-28-2018, 07:26 AM   #47
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We (taxpayers) lost 11.2B dollars on the GM bailout! GM used the money to invest in expansion in China’s economy, not America’s. The government took a 61% share in GM upon the bailout then pushed GM to make small electric cars nobody wants. Think Chevy Volt/Bolt
Just further proof that big government sucks at any form of management.
And somehow these plant closures will be Trumps fault.
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Old 11-28-2018, 08:26 AM   #48
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We (taxpayers) lost 11.2B dollars on the GM bailout! GM used the money to invest in expansion in China’s economy, not America’s. The government took a 61% share in GM upon the bailout then pushed GM to make small electric cars nobody wants. Think Chevy Volt/Bolt
Just further proof that big government sucks at any form of management.
And somehow these plant closures will be Trumps fault.
Expansion into China's economy doesn't mix well with China trade wars. Yes Trump will be blamed but it takes two to tango. Increased raw material prices and decreased Chinese demands for ag are putting the pinch to a lot of businesses right now and mark my words, we are headed for another slowdown...just in time for the next election cycle which gives both parties an opportunity to point fingers at each other. The auto bailouts & too big to fail was/is one of the biggest scams on the American taxpayer I've ever seen.
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Old 11-28-2018, 08:29 AM   #49
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Originally Posted by Dale Moser View Post
US automakers have two problems...poor quality, and high prices. And the main contributor to those two problems over the last 30 years BY FAR....is the United Autoworkers UNION. That's a fact, folks!


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One exception that I've seen when traveling abroad is that many Japanese prefer to buy Japanese brands that are assembled in the U.S. (Toyotas, etc.) They tend to be higher quality with less problems...or at least that's what a lot of Japanese folks told me when I was there.
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Old 11-28-2018, 09:17 AM   #50
texansfan
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Join Date: Nov 2014
Location: Littlefield
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JonBoy View Post
One exception that I've seen when traveling abroad is that many Japanese prefer to buy Japanese brands that are assembled in the U.S. (Toyotas, etc.) They tend to be higher quality with less problems...or at least that's what a lot of Japanese folks told me when I was there.
Do they still have planned obselesnce in japan where you cant drive a vehicle older than X number of years?

Does Japan have crazy strict emissions laws like we do?
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