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Old 10-20-2021, 08:12 AM   #1
rtjh
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Default Beaumont Exxon union strike

I have absolutely no dog in this hunt but it blows my mind that they haven't been working for 6 months and just this week rejected Exxons offer and will continue to strike. 6 months is a long time to willingly go without a paycheck, especially with other companies crying for workers nowadays.
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Old 10-20-2021, 08:18 AM   #2
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I have read bits and pieces on line regarding this strike, plus I have a real good friend that is an operation manager / shift manager or similar.

From what I have read and heard, Exxon/Mobil is playing hard ball in an attempt to "break the union" so to speak. If I understand right, salary/supervisor position people are running the plant, by working long hours.

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Old 10-20-2021, 08:35 AM   #3
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Originally Posted by Rwc View Post
I have read bits and pieces on line regarding this strike, plus I have a real good friend that is an operation manager / shift manager or similar.

From what I have read and heard, Exxon/Mobil is playing hard ball in an attempt to "break the union" so to speak. If I understand right, salary/supervisor position people are running the plant, by working long hours.

Rwc
I think they have also hired temporary operators who may have the chance to hire on full time depending on the outcome of this.
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Old 10-20-2021, 08:44 AM   #4
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National oil bargaining is nearing. If it is not settled by then you can expect heavy discussions to get these folks back to work during NOB.
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Old 10-20-2021, 08:45 AM   #5
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I would really like to see what the company is asking for vs what the union is asking for. I don't doubt that the company could be playing hard ball but I've heard and this is just hear say that the union is wanting back the console jobs they gave up many years ago.
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Old 10-20-2021, 08:48 AM   #6
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They are trying to get rid of the seniority clause. Fork lift drivers and box builders from the B&P plant have a lot of seniority and are bidding into highly skilled jobs at the refinery. I believe they're looking to make the B&P plant a contract job as well, to stop paying pension and benefits to low skilled labor. I work at a non union site in the area and their contract sets the tone for our raises. I'd love to see them get a good contract, but they're going to have to give up seniority.
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Old 10-20-2021, 10:42 AM   #7
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Exx/Mob is trying to dissolve the union.

Got family tied up in this crap. Execs for EM need to be hung from an I-Beam
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Old 10-20-2021, 11:04 AM   #8
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Originally Posted by lovemylegacy View Post
Exx/Mob is trying to dissolve the union.

Got family tied up in this crap. Execs for EM need to be hung from an I-Beam

If the union knows EM is not going to budge, why don’t they let the guys go back to work?
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Old 10-20-2021, 11:18 AM   #9
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If the union knows EM is not going to budge, why don’t they let the guys go back to work?
Because that will in effect, "break the union" or take away any bargaining power/leverage they have. EM wants them to do exactly that.
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Old 10-20-2021, 11:21 AM   #10
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How I understood it at the beginning, it was a lock out initiated by the company. Not a strike from the union
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Old 10-20-2021, 11:49 AM   #11
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I think they have also hired temporary operators who may have the chance to hire on full time depending on the outcome of this.
Back in the day, this would not have happened. If a temp would have crossed the line to work, the union folks would not have taken kindly to it!

Sure hope this works out for the workers, Exxon/Mobil dad gum sure aint hurting for money, just go look at their historical quarterly financials.......

Rwc
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Old 10-20-2021, 12:09 PM   #12
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Back in the day, this would not have happened. If a temp would have crossed the line to work, the union folks would not have taken kindly to it!

Sure hope this works out for the workers, Exxon/Mobil dad gum sure aint hurting for money, just go look at their historical quarterly financials.......

Rwc
I'm against both Big Corp and Unions. So they can both go down.
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Old 10-20-2021, 12:17 PM   #13
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Em locked the union out, it is not a union strike. Salaried employees and contractors are operating the plant. I have heard EM presented an offer and haven't budged, when contract ran out the company escorted hourly union employees out. Company I work for went through a 5 year lock out prior to me coming to work here.
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Old 10-20-2021, 12:20 PM   #14
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I'm against both Big Corp and Unions. So they can both go down.
And you sir can kiss my union arse
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Old 10-20-2021, 12:21 PM   #15
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First this is a lockout not a strike. EM wants to get rid of the a operators classification. The training program will have months added to it. So it will take a person longer to reach top pay. EM wants to break the union that is the bottom line.
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Old 10-20-2021, 12:29 PM   #16
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Nothing to add in here. Just tagging this one because these types of situations intrigue me.
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Old 10-20-2021, 12:46 PM   #17
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I hope they do I have some family involved in this and the union definitely should be broken
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Old 10-20-2021, 12:49 PM   #18
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Good for them break the union
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Old 10-20-2021, 12:55 PM   #19
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I kinda like watching these situations play out, since I don't have a stake in it, and really don't care which side "wins".
It's usually pretty easy to tell who's pro / anti union, though.
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Old 10-20-2021, 01:00 PM   #20
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And you sir can kiss my union arse
If you need a union to fight your fight so be it. I have never seen the benefit. To each his own.
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Old 10-20-2021, 01:06 PM   #21
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I have no skin in this at all, but find it fascinating. I personally think at one time there was a purpose and need for unions here in the U.S. I no longer believe they are necessary and in most cases cause more harm than good to an industry. That is my sole opinion. Bend over one more time Bayouboy.
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Old 10-20-2021, 01:39 PM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lovemylegacy View Post
Exx/Mob is trying to dissolve the union.

Got family tied up in this crap. Execs for EM need to be hung from an I-Beam
Why the EM bosses and not the union bosses?

Sent from my SM-G991U using Tapatalk
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Old 10-20-2021, 02:15 PM   #23
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Originally Posted by rtjh View Post
I have absolutely no dog in this hunt but it blows my mind that they haven't been working for 6 months and just this week rejected Exxons offer and will continue to strike. 6 months is a long time to willingly go without a paycheck, especially with other companies crying for workers nowadays.
EM locked us out. The union offered to continue working without a contract or a pay raise if negotiations could continue.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ElfEyes View Post
I would really like to see what the company is asking for vs what the union is asking for. I don't doubt that the company could be playing hard ball but I've heard and this is just hear say that the union is wanting back the console jobs they gave up many years ago.
This is false. It was an original demand but was dropped long ago.
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Old 10-20-2021, 02:18 PM   #24
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I have no skin in this at all, but find it fascinating. I personally think at one time there was a purpose and need for unions here in the U.S. I no longer believe they are necessary and in most cases cause more harm than good to an industry. That is my sole opinion. Bend over one more time Bayouboy.
Pucker up sweetie.
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Old 10-20-2021, 02:34 PM   #25
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I have no idea who is in the right on this issue, nor even most of the details. However, I do know that in refinery areas, those refineries drive the rest of the local economy. One plant won't stifle the economy, but it does have a negative effect. They need to settle their dispute and get working again.
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Old 10-20-2021, 04:11 PM   #26
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Nothing like some collective bargaining.
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Old 10-20-2021, 04:35 PM   #27
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I'm against both Big Corp and Unions. So they can both go down.
This.
Only thing they care about is $$$
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Old 10-20-2021, 09:09 PM   #28
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It sucks for both sides and I sure hope they can reach a resolution sooner rather than later. Also, don’t believe everything you read on the internet (or TBH), lots of partial facts scattered in with the opinions and assumptions on this subject.
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Old 10-20-2021, 09:19 PM   #29
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Originally Posted by SETX_Insanity View Post
How I understood it at the beginning, it was a lock out initiated by the company. Not a strike from the union
You are correct. EM is doing that to break the Union. To reduce benefits and to reduce the pay of the employees.
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Old 10-20-2021, 09:21 PM   #30
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Originally Posted by lovemylegacy View Post
You are correct. EM is doing that to break the Union. To reduce benefits and to reduce the pay of the employees.
Calvin…as I stated above, let’s not confuse fact with fiction.
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Old 10-20-2021, 09:26 PM   #31
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Originally Posted by jaime1982 View Post
Why the EM bosses and not the union bosses?

Sent from my SM-G991U using Tapatalk
Because they initiated the lockout, with no concern for the well being of the workers family or welfare. Its just, "there is the gate, so hit it!"

It would be the equivalent of your employer locking the doors until you agreed on lower pay, less benefits. Unless you are self employed.
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Old 10-20-2021, 09:32 PM   #32
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Originally Posted by lovemylegacy View Post
Because they initiated the lockout, with no concern for the well being of the workers family or welfare. Its just, "there is the gate, so hit it!"

It would be the equivalent of your employer locking the doors until you agreed on lower pay, less benefits. Unless you are self employed.

Last edited by slayr; 10-20-2021 at 09:37 PM.
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Old 10-20-2021, 09:35 PM   #33
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Calvin…as I stated above, let’s not confuse fact with fiction.
Fact, I have kin that work there. Just going by what they say. Essentially this is a revenge tactic from past bargaining tactics by the Union, initiated by EM.

Not sure what the fiction part would be. Might want to ask some of the families that are affected by this lockout.

In truth, it is almost a forgotten deal in the GT. Is EM paying the media to NOT cover it? I don't know, but seems plausible.

I talked to my kin and urged them to go some where else, lots of businesses hiring that are way better than EM, true on that one. Besides, he is young...ish, so he could do it with little pain involved.

Hey, how you know my name? Have we met?
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Old 10-20-2021, 09:39 PM   #34
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Originally Posted by lovemylegacy View Post
Fact, I have kin that work there. Just going by what they say. Essentially this is a revenge tactic from past bargaining tactics by the Union, initiated by EM.

Not sure what the fiction part would be. Might want to ask some of the families that are affected by this lockout.

In truth, it is almost a forgotten deal in the GT. Is EM paying the media to NOT cover it? I don't know, but seems plausible.

I talked to my kin and urged them to go some where else, lots of businesses hiring that are way better than EM, true on that one. Besides, he is young...ish, so he could do it with little pain involved.

Hey, how you know my name? Have we met?
Yeah, we’ve met….more than once, too.
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Old 10-20-2021, 09:42 PM   #35
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Yeah, we’ve met….more than once, too.
Spill the beans Shugah! I hope it was a nice visit.

I know a couple of guys from the Conroe area, but don't think you are either one.

Ya killin me dude.

Last edited by lovemylegacy; 10-20-2021 at 10:21 PM.
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Old 10-20-2021, 10:48 PM   #36
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Because they initiated the lockout, with no concern for the well being of the workers family or welfare. Its just, "there is the gate, so hit it!"

It would be the equivalent of your employer locking the doors until you agreed on lower pay, less benefits. Unless you are self employed.
You make a deal with the devil(union and Big Corp) and thats what you get. Sleep in the bed you make. Thats why I love capitalism. If your boss doesn't pay you enough you can go find another job. If you work hard and are worth more than another employee doing the same job you get paid more. Not the same as a union scale. I am a small business employer. I have only gone to my employees once in 20 plus years and said I need to take some money away from you. It was actually stated as the 8 of you can take a pay cut and all keep your jobs. Or I can let two of you go and the other 6 keep the same pay but pick up extra work from the two let go. They all agreed to take a pay cut and all 8 stay on board. We got back on our feet as a company and as soon as I could I got them back to what they were making plus some. Im glad I have a business in Texas so I can work with my employees. By the way all 8 are still employed 12 years later.
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Old 10-20-2021, 11:40 PM   #37
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I had my heart set on working for Exxon when I went back to school. I applied for a co op and was turned down. As luck would have it I missed an email to interview again and got a call from the guy over the co op program. He ask why I didn't come in for an interview and told me someone was supposed to have contacted me to tell me they wanted to hire me.. I was driving out of the parking lot from current employer having just signed to co op with them.. Turns out God does put you in the best situations even though you are disappointed at the time..

Last edited by jds247; 10-20-2021 at 11:56 PM.
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Old 10-21-2021, 12:50 AM   #38
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You make a deal with the devil(union and Big Corp) and thats what you get. Sleep in the bed you make. Thats why I love capitalism. If your boss doesn't pay you enough you can go find another job. If you work hard and are worth more than another employee doing the same job you get paid more. Not the same as a union scale. I am a small business employer. I have only gone to my employees once in 20 plus years and said I need to take some money away from you. It was actually stated as the 8 of you can take a pay cut and all keep your jobs. Or I can let two of you go and the other 6 keep the same pay but pick up extra work from the two let go. They all agreed to take a pay cut and all 8 stay on board. We got back on our feet as a company and as soon as I could I got them back to what they were making plus some. Im glad I have a business in Texas so I can work with my employees. By the way all 8 are still employed 12 years later.
You are a good man and business owner.
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Old 10-21-2021, 12:54 AM   #39
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I can’t see why anyone would be part of a union. I’ve worked around union welders offshore and non union welders. I’d take a non union member any day of the week.
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Old 10-21-2021, 01:13 AM   #40
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I can’t see why anyone would be part of a union. I’ve worked around union welders offshore and non union welders. I’d take a non union member any day of the week.
Union hands are not what they once where, that I promise.. I can say this from experience.. The pride of a job well done is gone in most Union hands these days.. It's a shame but it is the world we now live in.. Union maintenance hands are the worst.. Always have been.. The bad ones drag the few good ones down.. Like crabs in a bucket.
I was Union for 15 years. I have not been Union for the last 15... I have seen both sides..
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Old 10-21-2021, 07:27 AM   #41
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I work in a non union plant and my brother in law works for a union plant. The things he complains about i am very glad we dont have to deal with. I know most of our benefits and wages were originated by union plants and im thankful for that. But as of now im glad i dont work for a union plant.


Hope the guys locked out by EM can come to an agreement that works for all and get back to work.
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Old 10-21-2021, 07:29 AM   #42
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I dont have a dog in the race but have a couple questions:#1 Folks are saying the lockout isnt fair but was the lockout just EM getting the jump on the union before the union walked out? This way EM could get staffing in place before all hands walked out. #2 News is saying the unions issues are about Seniority,job security and safety. I understand the seniority and job security but what is the unsafe part? Seems like whenever a strike or contract negotiation comes up then the union always says its about safety but noone ever says whats unsafe. Could someone clear this up for me? Thanks
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Old 10-21-2021, 08:26 AM   #43
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Union hands are not what they once where, that I promise.. I can say this from experience.. The pride of a job well done is gone in most Union hands these days.. It's a shame but it is the world we now live in.. Union maintenance hands are the worst.. Always have been.. The bad ones drag the few good ones down.. Like crabs in a bucket.
I was Union for 15 years. I have not been Union for the last 15... I have seen both sides..
At our union represented facility union craftsman have to pass multiple skill level tests to get hired. And, they are required to attend and pass multiple continuing education classes provided by the company and vendors throughout their career. How many of your non-crab contractors are required to do that?

VERY FEW.
You are lucky if half of them speak English.
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Old 10-21-2021, 08:38 AM   #44
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Is there a law that EM has to keep using Union labor?
It seems to me if they didn't want union labor they would just fire those hands and hire non-union. At the same time if the union hands don't like working there, why don't they quit and go somewhere else?

Pretty much what I have always done.
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Old 10-21-2021, 09:00 AM   #45
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At our union represented facility union craftsman have to pass multiple skill level tests to get hired. And, they are required to attend and pass multiple continuing education classes provided by the company and vendors throughout their career. How many of your non-crab contractors are required to do that?

VERY FEW.
You are lucky if half of them speak English.
For me it wasn’t the work qualifications, it was the work ethic and productivity levels. They were all knowledgeable just lacking drive and half hearted quality. The non union guys finished their jobs twice as fast, so I had them assist the the other guys. Turns out you can’t do that for violating their contract. I was in awe. So we had to let the good welders go and we’re stuck with the slackers for another two weeks. It was definitely noted with projects at the after action review. I know this is a general example in recent experiences but I remember the same issues when working at plants as contractor base load and the union guys in that plant. I’m sure their are still some hard working union guys out there that still take pride their work and still has that your not going to work harder than me attitude but I haven’t seen one.
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Old 10-21-2021, 09:09 AM   #46
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At our union represented facility union craftsman have to pass multiple skill level tests to get hired. And, they are required to attend and pass multiple continuing education classes provided by the company and vendors throughout their career. How many of your non-crab contractors are required to do that?

VERY FEW.
You are lucky if half of them speak English.
James....be honest with me for a minute.


Could you imagine having a 45 day TA using union labor in your plant?

How far would that schedule and budget slip? 25%, 50%, 75% ? If that ever happens, I hope I get to come run the schedule for y'all......loves me some 7/12's for months on end
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Old 10-21-2021, 09:13 AM   #47
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Originally Posted by Bayouboy View Post
At our union represented facility union craftsman have to pass multiple skill level tests to get hired. And, they are required to attend and pass multiple continuing education classes provided by the company and vendors throughout their career. How many of your non-crab contractors are required to do that?

VERY FEW.
You are lucky if half of them speak English.
Having the skill and continuing education doesn't mean much if you know you can piddle, work at a slow pace, do sub-par work and still won't be fired. Give me the non-English speaking hand that does quality work at an acceptable pace all day long.
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Old 10-21-2021, 09:24 AM   #48
Take Dead Aim
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Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: FBG
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Pucker up sweetie.
So was it hard for you to vote for Biden and the union love Dems? Or did you make peace with it?
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Old 10-21-2021, 10:50 AM   #49
Bayouboy
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Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: League City
Hunt In: East Texas
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So was it hard for you to vote for Biden and the union love Dems? Or did you make peace with it?
I have never voted for a democrat in my life. As usual… union haters with no real knowledge of what they are speaking about pull those remarks out their butt.
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Old 10-21-2021, 10:55 AM   #50
Bayouboy
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Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: League City
Hunt In: East Texas
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James....be honest with me for a minute.


Could you imagine having a 45 day TA using union labor in your plant?

How far would that schedule and budget slip? 25%, 50%, 75% ? If that ever happens, I hope I get to come run the schedule for y'all......loves me some 7/12's for months on end
Do you not realize many of the contractors are union? Especially the skilled positions. Some of our refineries are in areas where contractors are required to be union. They do just fine.
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