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Old 09-19-2020, 03:17 PM   #201
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Originally Posted by OldRiverRat View Post
Well thatís whatís great about our country you can have an opinion that differs from mine. Please explain what race is being held back in America today by another race?

And What does health care have to do with blm and why are we talking about COSTA rica? I assume thatís where you want to live because you have obviously researched it so just go and leave this racist country.




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Yes thatís a great thingó and maybe from dialogue we can learn and broaden perspective.
Weíre not going to agree on racism if you think it doesnít exist. Iíve experienced it personally. Iím half Mexican and my dad immigrated to this country.
Yeah I have researched healthcare because itís a confounding problem and Iíve also read recent comments about it. Admittedly it was just on my mind and doesnít have anything to do with BLM or the NFL.
I donít want to leave this countryó itís the greatest place in Earth and I live it and believe in what it stands for wholeheartedly. I want to take care of it and help make it an even better place.
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Old 09-19-2020, 03:22 PM   #202
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I don’t think anyone denies that racism still exist to some extent. And always will, I would imagine.
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Old 09-19-2020, 03:25 PM   #203
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Originally Posted by Rubi513 View Post
I am going to out on a limb and say that the consensus around here believe this of you.

Thatís fineó youíre entitled to your opinion. Iím not here to fit in, so the thought of not being on your team doesnít bother me in the least.
In general I keep my mouth shut on topics I donít know anything about. Like say for example the experience of other races or women or what itís like to grow up in Sweden. It seems obvious to me that a white conservative who likes hanging around with like minded people pretty exclusively and gets angry at even the suggestion that racism could be a current issue doesnít know much about what itís like to grow up on black America but thatís just me.
Iím here for dialogue and learn more about what people think who have different ideas from me (but who align on a lot of the fundamentals in general).

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Old 09-19-2020, 03:39 PM   #204
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To those who believe racism is out of control. Stop writing books and answer a few easy questions.

1. Provide an example or two of systematic racism. Show us how one race holds down another.

2. Which race (per capita) is given the most welfare? Which one gets the most help with college funds? Who qualifies the most for section 8 housing? Who gets to have lower test scores and be admitted into college over white kids with higher scores?

Fact is we can sit here all day long as list what they get. BLM only uses the fact that they are "poor" as their proof. But every single piece of real data shows they have a ton more opportunity than others. It's their choice to not use it.

3. Name one Country, State, town on planet Earth that's 80+% black and not a craphole. Please explain how that's the white mans fault. If it is then the white man must be super busy traveling the world to make sure they're all poor.
I will probably regret this, but in the spirit of sincere debate, I'll respond.

Systemic racism is neither malicious nor intentional, but it is real. Here is one of a series of videos that explain and provide examples of systemic racism.


Your 2nd and 3rd questions can't be realistically answered because they're framed within your own assumptions and political biases. The welfare problem rests in the hands of our own government because they value buying votes more than anything else. The majority of fraud in government assistance programs is actually perpetrated by business and middle age white people.

Some people seem to think that acknowledging racism means your conceding every issue related to black citizens and communities - especially when politics are involved. But that's a false choice. It doesn't mean there are many issues that need to be resolved within those communities by the people that live there.

Want an example there? Go watch some of the local news interviews from Chicago stations with black residents. Begging for more police support and a strong police presence and they don't care what color the police officers are. But you'll never see that on CNN, MSN, Fox or Brietbart. It isn't divisive or inflammatory.

If you really believe that black people have more opportunities, it can only be because you want to believe that and only look for news and info that supports it. I actually get that it is easy to do that when so much of the stuff crammed down our throats comes from a politically motivated media hellbent on portraying us as living in a racist society with a white supremacist in the WH.
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Old 09-19-2020, 03:40 PM   #205
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Sorry, I just meant to include the link.
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Old 09-19-2020, 04:19 PM   #206
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Originally Posted by JLivi1224 View Post
I donít think anyone denies that racism still exist to some extent. And always will, I would imagine.


Yep and it isnít an exclusively white thing either like the media would have you believe.


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Old 09-19-2020, 06:22 PM   #207
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This statement right here is the very description of where we are in America today... APATHY... We've been in the Apathy stage of the decline of a Democracy for a while now. The next step is the end of freedom as we know it.... If it doesn't affect me in my daily life, it's OK. I just keep on keeping on... By the time it DOES affect you, it will be too late... What a pitiful state of affairs this once proud nation is in. God help us...
Absolutely agree. When or if one of these spoiled, self centered, arrogant, self righteous athletes stood on your loved ones grave with their ignorant actions that made it personal to you then you may change your mind.
I'm not all that surprised at some of the responses and support for their behaviour and actions.
The what's in it for me, I want it so to hell with everyone else type of mentality on here is sad to see.
One day people will wake up and say when did this or that happen or how can they do that. Then it may be to late.
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Old 09-19-2020, 08:48 PM   #208
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Do you watch any movies or tv shows? There is likely an actress/actor that speaks out on todayís current issues and has a different opinion than you. I watch for the game. I donít give a **** what they are trying to use there platform to promote. I donít support them monetarily, they arenít swaying my opinion. I watch for the football.


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Old 09-19-2020, 10:33 PM   #209
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Originally Posted by ttechdallas View Post
I will probably regret this, but in the spirit of sincere debate, I'll respond.

Systemic racism is neither malicious nor intentional, but it is real. Here is one of a series of videos that explain and provide examples of systemic racism.

Systemic Racism Explained - YouTube

Your 2nd and 3rd questions can't be realistically answered because they're framed within your own assumptions and political biases. The welfare problem rests in the hands of our own government because they value buying votes more than anything else. The majority of fraud in government assistance programs is actually perpetrated by business and middle age white people.

Some people seem to think that acknowledging racism means your conceding every issue related to black citizens and communities - especially when politics are involved. But that's a false choice. It doesn't mean there are many issues that need to be resolved within those communities by the people that live there.

Want an example there? Go watch some of the local news interviews from Chicago stations with black residents. Begging for more police support and a strong police presence and they don't care what color the police officers are. But you'll never see that on CNN, MSN, Fox or Brietbart. It isn't divisive or inflammatory.

If you really believe that black people have more opportunities, it can only be because you want to believe that and only look for news and info that supports it. I actually get that it is easy to do that when so much of the stuff crammed down our throats comes from a politically motivated media hellbent on portraying us as living in a racist society with a white supremacist in the WH.
That is the dumbest video I have watched in a long, long time. It is fundamentally biased and incorrect and based on a lot of assumptions to ďproveĒ their point they are trying to make. Garbage video.
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Old 09-20-2020, 09:01 AM   #210
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That is the dumbest video I have watched in a long, long time. It is fundamentally biased and incorrect and based on a lot of assumptions to ďproveĒ their point they are trying to make. Garbage video.
And many people believe that crap to be 100% valid.
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Old 09-20-2020, 03:44 PM   #211
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That is the dumbest video I have watched in a long, long time. It is fundamentally biased and incorrect and based on a lot of assumptions to ďproveĒ their point they are trying to make. Garbage video.
I'm sorry you lack the capacity to see outside your own biases.

On a positive note, how about them Cowboys! What an unfrigginbelievable game. Sorry you missed it.
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Old 09-20-2020, 03:56 PM   #212
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So your only evidence is you think blacks are denied home loans so that stops them from going to college.

Holy crap.... LOL I think you're the one having bias issues.
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Old 09-20-2020, 04:08 PM   #213
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Originally Posted by ttechdallas View Post
I'm sorry you lack the capacity to see outside your own biases.

On a positive note, how about them Cowboys! What an unfrigginbelievable game. Sorry you missed it.

To quote myself from a different thread debunking redlining.... you are arguing a straw man argument, because your understanding of economics and human nature is low enough that all you see is an unequal outcome and immediately associate it with a magical root cause. The real answer is the root cause is MUCH more complex than ďSystemic RacismĒ (which is bogus, by the way), and no one wants to talk about the REAL problems because it requires some very uncomfortable conversations centered around personal responsibility.

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Redlining has been debunked over and over in the modern era. Especially now that you can easily apply for loans without sitting down in person to do so.

Just because certain areas have lower acceptance rates on loans than others doesnít mean it is racially motivated. If the applicants have lower income, worse credit, or heavier debt loads they SHOULDNíT get approved at the same rates. If the equation to determine acceptance rates takes zero account of race, and relies solely on the mathematically statistical chance of default ... it ainít racist.

People who have worked to have the higher credit scores, money for down payments, and ensure they budget to meet their bills even when unexpected things happen almost always step up to higher priced properties once those goals are achieved. This is why neighborhoods within cities tend to stratify into different price points. If I can afford to live in a lower crime rate area, with better schools, and closer to amenities... I move there. Lower income neighborhoods export the people who decide to get their house in order, and that just happens to export the very people who generally qualify for loans.

This is a classic example of cherry picking a statistic that meets a narrative and ignoring the underlying drivers of that statistic.

That is like saying that people of Jewish descent being better off financially, on average, is systemic racism. People who hold that view just conveniently gloss over the MASSIVE focus within that culture of teaching their children wise money handling skills before they they leave the house and entrench bad habits.

It has been proven OVER and OVER that the vast majority of Americans, regardless of color, can plant themselves firmly into the middle class simply by waiting to have kids until after marriage, sticking to a good budget, and making sound financial decisions. Our public schooling doesnít teach these skills, so it is up to the parents to do so. It isnít systemically racist that some parents pass these skills down and others donít.


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Old 09-20-2020, 04:09 PM   #214
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So your only evidence is you think blacks are denied home loans so that stops them from going to college.

Holy crap.... LOL I think you're the one having bias issues.
Wise up. That is just one example from one of a series of videos. But why do you even ask the question when you've already decided what your answer is.

Sorry, gotta go. Second round of NFL games is underway. How about them Cowboys?
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Old 09-20-2020, 05:34 PM   #215
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Originally Posted by ttechdallas View Post
Wise up. That is just one example from one of a series of videos. But why do you even ask the question when you've already decided what your answer is.



Sorry, gotta go. Second round of NFL games is underway. How about them Cowboys?
We don't have to tune in to the NFL to get BLM rhetoric, we get it from your post.
Wise up and look at the numbers.
Numbers don't lie.
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Old 09-20-2020, 05:41 PM   #216
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Originally Posted by ttechdallas View Post
Wise up. That is just one example from one of a series of videos. But why do you even ask the question when you've already decided what your answer is.

Sorry, gotta go. Second round of NFL games is underway. How about them Cowboys?

No response to my arguments?


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Old 09-20-2020, 06:42 PM   #217
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You young ones keep arguing. I'm to old to protest anything. Enjoyed the Cowboys come behind victory and now watching the Chargers and Chiefs in overtime!
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Old 09-20-2020, 07:07 PM   #218
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Originally Posted by IkemanTX View Post
To quote myself from a different thread debunking redlining.... you are arguing a straw man argument, because your understanding of economics and human nature is low enough that all you see is an unequal outcome and immediately associate it with a magical root cause. The real answer is the root cause is MUCH more complex than ďSystemic RacismĒ (which is bogus, by the way), and no one wants to talk about the REAL problems because it requires some very uncomfortable conversations centered around personal responsibility.
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I wasn't about to spend the time or energy with him. If he can't see poor people for what they are then his mind is made up.

Still can't name one advantage today they don't have.
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Old 09-20-2020, 07:24 PM   #219
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Saw the Texans score....

BoB is a disaster....they deserve him
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Old 09-20-2020, 08:34 PM   #220
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Originally Posted by ttechdallas View Post
I will probably regret this, but in the spirit of sincere debate, I'll respond.

Systemic racism is neither malicious nor intentional, but it is real. Here is one of a series of videos that explain and provide examples of systemic racism.

Systemic Racism Explained - YouTube

Your 2nd and 3rd questions can't be realistically answered because they're framed within your own assumptions and political biases. The welfare problem rests in the hands of our own government because they value buying votes more than anything else. The majority of fraud in government assistance programs is actually perpetrated by business and middle age white people.

Some people seem to think that acknowledging racism means your conceding every issue related to black citizens and communities - especially when politics are involved. But that's a false choice. It doesn't mean there are many issues that need to be resolved within those communities by the people that live there.

Want an example there? Go watch some of the local news interviews from Chicago stations with black residents. Begging for more police support and a strong police presence and they don't care what color the police officers are. But you'll never see that on CNN, MSN, Fox or Brietbart. It isn't divisive or inflammatory.

If you really believe that black people have more opportunities, it can only be because you want to believe that and only look for news and info that supports it. I actually get that it is easy to do that when so much of the stuff crammed down our throats comes from a politically motivated media hellbent on portraying us as living in a racist society with a white supremacist in the WH.
That has to be the dumbest **** I have ever seen...
Although not surprising coming from you...
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Old 09-20-2020, 09:00 PM   #221
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That has to be the dumbest **** I have ever seen...
Although not surprising coming from you...

And he turned tail and ran after I chewed up his argument and spat it out with facts... hasnít even tried to respond to me... though he responded to someone else on here.


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Old 09-20-2020, 09:41 PM   #222
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Just a side note. Have you guys noticed how
Many people of mixed races choose to identify as the minority? Wouldnít it make sense, if being white came with so much privilege they would associate with white/causation?? Maybe it isnít as easy as some say to be white?
Sorry I know itís a little off topic.


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Old 09-21-2020, 07:58 AM   #223
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Originally Posted by OldRiverRat View Post
Just a side note. Have you guys noticed how
Many people of mixed races choose to identify as the minority? Wouldnít it make sense, if being white came with so much privilege they would associate with white/causation?? Maybe it isnít as easy as some say to be white?
Sorry I know itís a little off topic.


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In the real average Joe world which is 90% of the population being black is a huge advantage. Try being white (and not a vet) and get a job for pretty much any government funded job (post office, TSA etc)

I've seen it with my own eyes at at least 4 different companies. Blacks get promoted easier due to policy. They can't be fired near as easy. Can't be denied a job (along with women) without a good excuse but whites can just be skipped over. It's so blatantly skewed it stupid. The people who can't see this either have mental problems or deny it on purpose (plain liars).

Then there's college...a whole different topic.
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Old 09-21-2020, 08:13 AM   #224
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In the real average Joe world which is 90% of the population being black is a huge advantage. Try being white (and not a vet) and get a job for pretty much any government funded job (post office, TSA etc)

I've seen it with my own eyes at at least 4 different companies. Blacks get promoted easier due to policy. They can't be fired near as easy. Can't be denied a job (along with women) without a good excuse but whites can just be skipped over. It's so blatantly skewed it stupid. The people who can't see this either have mental problems or deny it on purpose (plain liars).

Then there's college...a whole different topic.
Sometimes, even the Vet identifier won't help if you're a white male. (been there done that)
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Old 09-21-2020, 09:07 AM   #225
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Sometimes, even the Vet identifier won't help if you're a white male. (been there done that)
Point is "equal opportunity" is a crock of sh1t. If you're a white male and not a vet you have zero chance.
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Old 09-21-2020, 09:33 AM   #226
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Any Steelers fans up in here?


https://www.foxnews.com/sports/steel...officer-helmet




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Old 09-21-2020, 10:22 AM   #227
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Iím just waiting on [mention]ttechdallas [/mention] to have a response to my points above. Itís almost like he evaporated...


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Old 09-21-2020, 10:24 AM   #228
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Originally Posted by RiverRat1 View Post
Point is "equal opportunity" is a crock of sh1t. If you're a white male and not a vet you have zero chance.
Not only in the government sector, but just as well in the private sector too!!
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Old 09-21-2020, 11:35 AM   #229
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Black and Gold since about 7 years old. Steelers are different and always have been or most of the time. Pro Law Enforcement and US Military.
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Old 09-21-2020, 05:29 PM   #230
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Originally Posted by RiverRat1 View Post
Point is "equal opportunity" is a crock of sh1t. If you're a white male and not a vet you have zero chance.

Wait a second, if youíre poor or black and canít get a job itís your fault, but if youíre white itís not?
Just want to make sure I get that straight.
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Old 09-21-2020, 06:16 PM   #231
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Football was my sport in HS.
I like football.
When I was a kid I lived out of state and The Dallas Cowboys was my connection back to my birth state, Texas. I like The Dallas Cowboys.
My compromise is that I turn on the game right at kickoff, turn it off at halftime, and watch the second half. Very little stuff except football.
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Old 09-21-2020, 06:33 PM   #232
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Critical Race Theory is destroying this country...it is a Marxist ideology being used purposefully to do so. That video is case and point
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Old 09-21-2020, 06:38 PM   #233
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RR is disagree. Busy your tail, outwork everyone else, have manners and good communication skillls, keep your mouth shut and opportunities will happen and I don’t care what race, sex, or sexual preference the person has.
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Old 09-21-2020, 06:52 PM   #234
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Black and Gold since about 7 years old. Steelers are different and always have been or most of the time. Pro Law Enforcement and US Military.
I was a huge Oilers fans, never could get into the Texans after they left town. The Steelers always had my respect growing up when they played my Oilers. Man those were some awesome ballgames back in the 80's and 90's.

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Old 09-21-2020, 06:57 PM   #235
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Johnny I watched Earl torch them for a 80 plus yard run in the Dome. Those were physical games.
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Old 09-21-2020, 06:59 PM   #236
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Just watched the news, see job led the Texans to another loss. I miss reading posts from some of the die hard Obrienites and all the excuses they had.


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Old 09-21-2020, 07:35 PM   #237
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And he turned tail and ran after I chewed up his argument and spat it out with facts... hasnít even tried to respond to me... though he responded to someone else on here.


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What kind of fantasy world do you live in? First, I suspect you don't even understand what a straw man argument is, maybe facts either. What you believe is no more fact than what I believe.

You and a few others here like to ignore whatever you either can't or won't comprehend and seize upon your favorite talking points from your favorite political sources of news and information.

You are correct on one point though, it is a complex issue and if your interpretation is that I pointed to "systemic racism" as the cause or root cause of any of these problems, again I have to challenge your comprehension skills.

I'm guessing you agreed with that comment by RiverRat1, too - "If he can't see poor people for what they are then his mind is made up." Let's explore that for a moment since he likes to call out anyone who disagrees with his POV.

What are they? Would love to hear that definition.

If you want to pretend racism is not a burden on Black people or that they are all imagining this, that is your prerogative. I don't and I think there are a whole lot of us a little too silent on the issue - which contributes to it's lingering effects.

I can't control or influence what black people do, think or feel. But I can be anti-racism - which I try to be. That includes not being offended that they don't see the world as I do. And not assuming that because they are black and frustrated makes them part of the left wing craziness and the Marxist BLM group.

Also, In case you were wondering, New Orleans is up 3-0 over Las Vegas on MNF and its still scoreless in the Stars vs Lightning game 2 of the NHL Finals. Gotta go again and it has nothing do with your next round of "facts" or insults.
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Old 09-21-2020, 10:32 PM   #238
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There’s a lot going on here with workplace equality and poverty regarding African Americans so I’ll weigh in and even tie into some football. I played football in high school and dipped my foot in at the college level. I played sports with a lot of AA’s, some respected authority, did what was asked and they were successful on the field and still are today. Others did not, blamed everything on racism or other people and failed on the field as they have in life. Anybody with half a brain could see that it has nothing to do with race but rather had to do with someone not being able to follow simple instructions. The sad thing is you could see failure on them a mile away and nobody could help them because they couldn’t help themselves. Is that systematic racism? Because that seems to be what some would allude to. Now I’ll switch gears and weigh in on the work place. I have seen first hand on multiple occasions while interviewing candidates(team of people) for jobs where a more qualified white person was passed up for lesser qualified minority candidate. Have seen it with hires off the street and for internal promotions on numerous occasions. I have also witnessed white employees wrote up and disciplined for lesser infractions then that of minority’s, some of which get away with a lot more. I have also seen a minority employee terminated on what most would consider good grounds only to see that person file and win a successful arbitration and later a lawsuit (group of individuals for that matter and won) that a white person would never have a chance at. I’m not saying racism doesn’t exist but I know what I have seen first hand and minority’s have more opportunity then anyone in this county period. You can post all the cute videos you want. But right now if you’re a minority and you fail it’s no other fault then that individual or his/her parents for not doing their job. My grandparents were literally dirt floor poor and raised 4 kids in a one bedroom wooden shack. My grandad worked his arse off so my dad could graduate high school and my dad worked his off so I could have a chance to go to college. It’s not white privilege it’s hard work and sacrificing.

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Old 09-21-2020, 10:49 PM   #239
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What kind of fantasy world do you live in? First, I suspect you don't even understand what a straw man argument is, maybe facts either. What you believe is no more fact than what I believe.

You and a few others here like to ignore whatever you either can't or won't comprehend and seize upon your favorite talking points from your favorite political sources of news and information.

You are correct on one point though, it is a complex issue and if your interpretation is that I pointed to "systemic racism" as the cause or root cause of any of these problems, again I have to challenge your comprehension skills.

I'm guessing you agreed with that comment by RiverRat1, too - "If he can't see poor people for what they are then his mind is made up." Let's explore that for a moment since he likes to call out anyone who disagrees with his POV.

What are they? Would love to hear that definition.

If you want to pretend racism is not a burden on Black people or that they are all imagining this, that is your prerogative. I don't and I think there are a whole lot of us a little too silent on the issue - which contributes to it's lingering effects.

I can't control or influence what black people do, think or feel. But I can be anti-racism - which I try to be. That includes not being offended that they don't see the world as I do. And not assuming that because they are black and frustrated makes them part of the left wing craziness and the Marxist BLM group.

Also, In case you were wondering, New Orleans is up 3-0 over Las Vegas on MNF and its still scoreless in the Stars vs Lightning game 2 of the NHL Finals. Gotta go again and it has nothing do with your next round of "facts" or insults.

You didnít address a single one of my arguments... just made claims that I donít understand, without any proof of me being wrong in the first place. Anti-racism.... really? You really have swallowed the whole critical race theory crap hook, line, and sinker.

You canít make an evidence based argument because your argument isnít based on them. It is based on emotion and white guilt. Thatís why you try to throw one liners in, make broad generalizations you think shield you from being proven wrong, and bail.


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Old 09-21-2020, 11:43 PM   #240
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I'm getting real tired of this systematic racist BS!!!
NFL supports it and that's a big problem for me.

Both sets of grandparents and their forefathers worked the dirt. One side landed off a typhoid ship in Galveston and lived in dugouts the first winter in the hill country. Freat Great grandma buried off santa domingo thrown overboard when she died at sea.
After established, some of relatives were captured by the confederates to fight and others drove supply trains for the union, but overall we supported the union.
According to the family ship charter we came to Texas for freedom of religion.
The other side of the family was panhandle farmers. My mom slept in a drawer during the dust bowl black Sunday in the Texas panhandle with a wet cloth over to keep the dirt off, wore shoes to school with the toes cut off. Uncle rode the bus with Waylon Jennings who was a thief and never returned a nickel he borrowed - some trivia.
I could ramble on and on about how our family worked hard through tough times but I'm sure there’s many others on this forum with similar histories

Where's the social injustice they're talking about? Did our families harm them? And the reparations , I don't want any of their f'in money, why do they want mine ?
Why do I owe them anything? Trust me I wasn't privileged. I am Blessed in the USA. I never owned a slave. I was never prejudice. I've worked elbow to elbow with blacks while working my way through college, some were good people.
The damage obama/holden did to this country breeding hate is still living on. Congratulations obama

And now they've sucked this crap into football and other sports, a non political event where all sides could sit down and enjoy the game at one time.
Why do you think they did it? Ever ask yourself this?
I don’t understand anyone who sits back and enjoy’ s the game with a beer while they slam and denigrate our countries roots.
What’s more important, your kids and grand kids future or this f'in game?
Guess you can tell I know longer watch the cowgirls.
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Old 09-22-2020, 05:15 AM   #241
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sigh...nothing but irrational pansies. keep digging.



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Old 09-22-2020, 07:38 AM   #242
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Wait a second, if youíre poor or black and canít get a job itís your fault, but if youíre white itís not?
Just want to make sure I get that straight.
You really are a liberal

If anyone doesn't have a job right now it's their own fault.

I'm not going down the liberal rabbit hole with you addressing every job in America so you can twist and nit-pick everything.


And why does it have to be poor AND black? Why not poor and white? or rich and black?
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Old 09-22-2020, 07:44 AM   #243
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Originally Posted by IkemanTX View Post
You didnít address a single one of my arguments... just made claims that I donít understand, without any proof of me being wrong in the first place. Anti-racism.... really? You really have swallowed the whole critical race theory crap hook, line, and sinker.

You canít make an evidence based argument because your argument isnít based on them. It is based on emotion and white guilt. Thatís why you try to throw one liners in, make broad generalizations you think shield you from being proven wrong, and bail.

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And he tries using the You prove it doesn't exist, tactic.

Who are they? You show me a black person without a job and I'll find him a job. It's that easy. But then the excuse will change to he didn't want the job because the boss was racist! or some other BS. Literally one excuse after another and it's never ending.
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Old 09-22-2020, 07:48 AM   #244
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Originally Posted by RiverRat1 View Post
You really are a liberal

If anyone doesn't have a job right now it's their own fault.

I'm not going down the liberal rabbit hole with you addressing every job in America so you can twist and nit-pick everything.


And why does it have to be poor AND black? Why not poor and white? or rich and black?
His username fits...
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Old 09-22-2020, 08:04 AM   #245
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To quote myself from a different thread debunking redlining.... you are arguing a straw man argument, because your understanding of economics and human nature is low enough that all you see is an unequal outcome and immediately associate it with a magical root cause. The real answer is the root cause is MUCH more complex than ďSystemic RacismĒ (which is bogus, by the way), and no one wants to talk about the REAL problems because it requires some very uncomfortable conversations centered around personal responsibility.




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Is this what you keep referring to as ďarguments?Ē
A claim that it is much more complex while discounting anything systemic and pointing to the very simple principle of personal responsibility?
Then a middle-school-level vignette of the lending process? Are you aware that the United States Congress passed a law specifically to target redlining? I canít tell from your so well-crafted ďargumentĒ if you think that redlining was debunked in the modern era or if redlining in the modern era has been debunkedó two totally different points.
Youíre short on facts and quick to chest thump about how you ran people off. Thatís a dead ringer for a position that is weak AF, if that wasnít apparent already.
Pretending like this has anything to do with evidence and rational analysis is a joke.
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Old 09-22-2020, 08:26 AM   #246
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When a countryís citizens lose tolerance and compassion for one another, that is a telling sign that the country is destabilizing. Consider whether it is worth the anger and ďbeing rightĒ to fuel the downward spiral. Whether itís originating in China, the Middle East, or Russia, our enemies have gained a foothold into our culture and they are effectively driving us to a cultural and political civil war. Think Putin is letting such a juicy opportunity pass by? Think whatever version of al-Queda/ISIS currently exists isnít quietly fanning the flames? Is it worth the country to keep your back turned in indignation? If oneís position is for a small government that does not intrude into private life, then we need to work together to solve problems so that the government does not have an excuse to intrude. Regardless of whoís right, civilian vs. civilian only benefits the governmentís expansion of power and control. Thatís all the incentive any of us should need to try and proactively resolve things without demanding that one political party or another ram itís agenda down the other sideís throat.


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Old 09-22-2020, 09:36 AM   #247
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Is this what you keep referring to as ďarguments?Ē
A claim that it is much more complex while discounting anything systemic and pointing to the very simple principle of personal responsibility?
Then a middle-school-level vignette of the lending process? Are you aware that the United States Congress passed a law specifically to target redlining? I canít tell from your so well-crafted ďargumentĒ if you think that redlining was debunked in the modern era or if redlining in the modern era has been debunkedó two totally different points.
Youíre short on facts and quick to chest thump about how you ran people off. Thatís a dead ringer for a position that is weak AF, if that wasnít apparent already.
Pretending like this has anything to do with evidence and rational analysis is a joke.
You need to prove this systemic racism exists. We can't prove a negative.

If you're to build a case you could start with showing us areas where blacks do good in society with any other race or even just amongst themselves. You have the entire world to look over.

If you pay attention schools are always rezoning to get poor kids in with better off kids. How's that NOT racism towards whoever happens to have money?

Bottom line is the chips fly up in the air but they always land the exact same way. Nothing to do with racism at all. You just want to blame other races for blacks failures and that's racist.
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Old 09-22-2020, 12:00 PM   #248
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Is this what you keep referring to as ďarguments?Ē
A claim that it is much more complex while discounting anything systemic and pointing to the very simple principle of personal responsibility?
Then a middle-school-level vignette of the lending process? Are you aware that the United States Congress passed a law specifically to target redlining? I canít tell from your so well-crafted ďargumentĒ if you think that redlining was debunked in the modern era or if redlining in the modern era has been debunkedó two totally different points.
Youíre short on facts and quick to chest thump about how you ran people off. Thatís a dead ringer for a position that is weak AF, if that wasnít apparent already.
Pretending like this has anything to do with evidence and rational analysis is a joke.

Systemic means built into the system, and Iím not arguing that racism doesnít exist. People having prejudices does not equate to systemic racism. Unequal outcome does not equate to systemic racism. Outcomes you donít like do NOT equate to systemic racism.

Show me the systems that are systemically racist, where it is in those systems, and how the legal system allows it... Iíll give you a hint, it is called Affirmative Action. Affirmative Action is the ONLY legal prejudice based on race or gender in the United States. They are the only truly ďSystemiclyĒ racist examples out there. i.e. they are intentionally, and legally, integrated into the ACTUAL system.

The ďredlining lawsĒ you point to were ill-conceived in the first place. Their supposed intention was to remove prejudice in the approval process, but they were instead used to force banks into approving loans for people who didnít qualify for them mathematically. Banking institutions were held accountable for lower percentages of POC approval rates REGARDLESS of wether race was ever a factor in the approval decision or not. Once again... equal opportunity has never meant equal outcome.

You show me any institution that approves or rejects a loan (based on race) from any 2 people with equal credit rating/income/debt Load and I will help you tear them a new one. But donít try to come at me with race based approval ratings, in the aggregate, and try to claim it as some kind of proof.

And the biggest irony in your response is that you claimed I was short on facts while providing NOT A SINGLE ONE to refute me.


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Old 09-22-2020, 12:11 PM   #249
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Ike, you've done your homework...
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Old 09-22-2020, 02:23 PM   #250
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Systemic means built into the system, and Iím not arguing that racism doesnít exist. People having prejudices does not equate to systemic racism. Unequal outcome does not equate to systemic racism. Outcomes you donít like do NOT equate to systemic racism.

Show me the systems that are systemically racist, where it is in those systems, and how the legal system allows it... Iíll give you a hint, it is called Affirmative Action. Affirmative Action is the ONLY legal prejudice based on race or gender in the United States. They are the only truly ďSystemiclyĒ racist examples out there. i.e. they are intentionally, and legally, integrated into the ACTUAL system.

The ďredlining lawsĒ you point to were ill-conceived in the first place. Their supposed intention was to remove prejudice in the approval process, but they were instead used to force banks into approving loans for people who didnít qualify for them mathematically. Banking institutions were held accountable for lower percentages of POC approval rates REGARDLESS of wether race was ever a factor in the approval decision or not. Once again... equal opportunity has never meant equal outcome.

You show me any institution that approves or rejects a loan (based on race) from any 2 people with equal credit rating/income/debt Load and I will help you tear them a new one. But donít try to come at me with race based approval ratings, in the aggregate, and try to claim it as some kind of proof.

And the biggest irony in your response is that you claimed I was short on facts while providing NOT A SINGLE ONE to refute me.


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Keep posting Ike so I don't have to waste my time here.
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