Easton axis vs Easton full metal jacket

[DapperDan]

So, I'm shooting easton axis. Thinking of making the switch. I like the idea of a little heavier arrow however I've thought about increasing the foc of the axis and sticking with them. Not sure what to do.... I like shooting out to 80 yards on targets so I'd like to make sure what ever I do I have an extremely accurate arrow.

Side note, debating on getting the tools to cut and build my own arrows. The thought is that I may be able to be more precise and get a more accurate arrow and a batch of arrows that are more consistent in the batch.


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[220swift]

I used to be a big FMJ fan. I still really am, but they bend very easily and then you lose accuracy. They may look straight, but they can bend very slightly and you are done.

[Jeremy7306]

Originally Posted by 220swift

I used to be a big FMJ fan. I still really am, but they bend very easily and then you lose accuracy. They may look straight, but they can bend very slightly and you are done.

This. You won't think their bent but they can be! I shot FMJs for years. Good arrows but I'm glad I switched. Went to gold tips.


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[DapperDan]

Well, good info so far.


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[Daniel75]

They bend but they fly like darts and make your bow really quiet. It's not like they bend easily in my experience but YMMV. Blew right through the buck I shot last year and ended up 20+ yards beyond him. I spined another doe before that and it went about 18" past the spine . The other ones I've spined have stopped at the spine with most of the arrow showing. I say that to say they penetrate like crazy but the tradeofd is they are likely to bend in some situations.

[Buck Slayer]

Originally Posted by Daniel75

They bend but they fly like darts and make your bow really quiet. It's not like they bend easily in my experience but YMMV. Blew right through the buck I shot last year and ended up 20+ yards beyond him. I spined another doe before that and it went about 18" past the spine . The other ones I've spined have stopped at the spine with most of the arrow showing. I say that to say they penetrate like crazy but the tradeofd is they are likely to bend in some situations.

So if bending is the issue and a heavier arrow is wanted, is there not another quality arrow that one could get which is heavier?

[Daniel75]

Originally Posted by Buck Slayer

So if bending is the issue and a heavier arrow is wanted, is there not another quality arrow that one could get which is heavier?

Any arrow that has the same GPI will weigh the same and if it's carbon, it won't bend. I just prefer aluminum. Easier to pull from foam too.


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[DapperDan]

And the above mentioned comments is what adds to my confusion.


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[Buck Slayer]

Originally Posted by DapperDan

And the above mentioned comments is what adds to my confusion.


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Precisely, I don't really understand the purpose of going with the axis then? For ease of target removal? I think I'd rather just go with a heavier carbon and never look back.

[TexasTealHunter]

I went from FMJ to axis, like the axis better smoother and quicker but killed more with the FMJ... only because i had more opportunities haha

second that the FMJs will bend but not until bad o rmissed shot, mine stay in case so never had issue with until what i mentioned.

[Abcdj]

I use easton bowfire's and really like them. Shot plenty of critters with them. Sorry to add to the confusion.

[JWF]

I am in the exact same boat as OP. In for more info

[Laner7]

Love my fmj's. I have had a few bend after going through deer and javelinas and hitting rocks and caliche, but still wouldn't trade them. They have been very accurate for me and have had a pass through on all of the animals I have shot, except for one deer.

[muddyfuzzy]

The FMJ is great for increasing mass weight and building momentum all else being equal. The Axis will build more FOC due to the lighter GPI. If increasing mass weight is still desired then dropping down a spine rating and increasing tip weight is an option as well. The FMJ can take a bend, just something to think about.

Both are quality shafts and great building components. Personally I would prefer to build on the Axis platform unless building a really heavy arrow is the intention.


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[DapperDan]

Originally Posted by muddyfuzzy

The FMJ is great for increasing mass weight and building momentum all else being equal. The Axis will build more FOC due to the lighter GPI. If increasing mass weight is still desired then dropping down a spine rating and increasing tip weight is an option as well. The FMJ can take a bend, just something to think about.

Both are quality shafts and great building components. Personally I would prefer to build on the Axis platform unless building a really heavy arrow is the intention.


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So school me on foc with the axis. I pull 70 lbs, 27 1/2 draw, Mathews no cam htx. I have blazers, nocturnals, standard insert, 100 grain tip, 5mm shaft diameter and 340 spine. Getting 280 fps. Shooting standard 1 inch slick tricks.



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[muddyfuzzy]

Originally Posted by DapperDan

So school me on foc with the axis. I pull 70 lbs, 27 1/2 draw, Mathews no cam htx. I have blazers, nocturnals, standard insert, 100 grain tip, 5mm shaft diameter and 340 spine. Getting 280 fps. Shooting standard 1 inch slick tricks.



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are you shooting a 5 or 6mm shaft?

[muddyfuzzy]

Originally Posted by DapperDan

So school me on foc with the axis. I pull 70 lbs, 27 1/2 draw, Mathews no cam htx. I have blazers, nocturnals, standard insert, 100 grain tip, 5mm shaft diameter and 340 spine. Getting 280 fps. Shooting standard 1 inch slick tricks.



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If you are shooting the old school Axis N-fused you are between 9-11% depending upon a few variables such as shaft length. You shoot a normal set-up and that is pretty average FOC on a hunting arrow. You give up a little more with the lighted nock and it's weight but this a good set-up for you. If you like the Axis and want a more aggressive set-up then think about dropping down a spine and adding some weight via the broadhead and/or insert combination (switching to brass). Finish the tuning with the shaft length and you will be good to go.

Like I said before, the FMJ is great for adding a ton of mass weight but the FOC will always suffer. However, with some work you could have a lighter arrow that is much more aggressive in the FOC department and could have the potential of penetrating like a heavier build..........with better recovery..........more forgiveness...........and a flatter trajectory.

Personally I don't have time to check jacketed arrows for bends and what not and I'm **** enough that if I did shoot them would feel compelled to do so. Carbon on the other hand, I can flex test it, chunk it, throw it back in the quiver and get on down the road.

[DapperDan]

Originally Posted by muddyfuzzy

If you are shooting the old school Axis N-fused you are between 9-11% depending upon a few variables such as shaft length. You shoot a normal set-up and that is pretty average FOC on a hunting arrow. You give up a little more with the lighted nock and it's weight but this a good set-up for you. If you like the Axis and want a more aggressive set-up then think about dropping down a spine and adding some weight via the broadhead and/or insert combination (switching to brass). Finish the tuning with the shaft length and you will be good to go.



Like I said before, the FMJ is great for adding a ton of mass weight but the FOC will always suffer. However, with some work you could have a lighter arrow that is much more aggressive in the FOC department and could have the potential of penetrating like a heavier build..........with better recovery..........more forgiveness...........and a flatter trajectory.



Personally I don't have time to check jacketed arrows for bends and what not and I'm **** enough that if I did shoot them would feel compelled to do so. Carbon on the other hand, I can flex test it, chunk it, throw it back in the quiver and get on down the road.

Sounds like what I'd really like to do. However I'm new to custom arrows so to speak so I'd hate to be going in the wrong direction. I'd need to pick some brains of someone that's done it. I understand most of how to but an example would be finishing tuning with shaft length. Ya lost me. Lol


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[kd350]

I'd stick with the axis or get muddyfuzzy to build you some black eagles

The fmjs bend too easy, when your like me and shoot random stuff like coons and squirrels you go through a lot of arrows quick

[DapperDan]

So here is a thought, what if I buy the things needed to build my own arrows??? I guess I could build them the way I want. But I'm a big dummy on foc. Lol


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[Fishndude]

Whatever you do, stick with Easton.

Look into the Injections with the Fire Nock outsert.(keeps you from having to shoot Deep Six) You'll get the weight you're looking for

[DapperDan]

Originally Posted by Fishndude

Whatever you do, stick with Easton.

Look into the Injections with the Fire Nock outsert.(keeps you from having to shoot Deep Six) You'll get the weight you're looking for

So what's wrong with the deep six?


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[Fishndude]

Originally Posted by DapperDan

So what's wrong with the deep six?


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Nothing is wrong with Deep Six except you'll need to stick up on Deep Six broadheads and field points. Just trying to save you the extra expense.

[ar3731guy]

An axis arrow with 75 go brass insert will weigh less than a FMJ arrow of the same length with an aluminum insert. And your FOC will go up with the axis. I made the switch from FMJ to axis for this very same reason.

[DapperDan]

Originally Posted by ar3731guy

An axis arrow with 75 go brass insert will weigh less than a FMJ arrow of the same length with an aluminum insert. And your FOC will go up with the axis. I made the switch from FMJ to axis for this very same reason.

How you like em?


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[ar3731guy]

[QUOTE=DapperDan;12541956]How you like em?
I think they are more duarable than the FMJs.

[muddyfuzzy]

As with any shaft of any spine a reduction in length decreases the dynamic spine just as lengthening the same shaft increases the dynamic reaction. The generic terms are stiffening and weakening the spine. With a ton of work and working against physic and basic Archery reason you can get almost any arrow to tune in any bow. With that being said we are all different and likewise our equipment so setting up what's best for you so be the goal.

Pick a target set of specs. FPS, FOC or EFOC, mass weight, momentum......what ever. This will get you in the right spine with the right build and broadhead. After that you can experiment with shaft length to find the optimal length/dynamic spine for that particular set up. It's a good way to learn, it will challenge your knowledge and make you a better archer for it. There are lots of very knowledgeable folks on this site that will be more than happy in assisting you in this process.


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[DapperDan]

Originally Posted by muddyfuzzy

As with any shaft of any spine a reduction in length decreases the dynamic spine just as lengthening the same shaft increases the dynamic reaction. The generic terms are stiffening and weakening the spine. With a ton of work and working against physic and basic Archery reason you can get almost any arrow to tune in any bow. With that being said we are all different and likewise our equipment so setting up what's best for you so be the goal.

Pick a target set of specs. FPS, FOC or EFOC, mass weight, momentum......what ever. This will get you in the right spine with the right build and broadhead. After that you can experiment with shaft length to find the optimal length/dynamic spine for that particular set up. It's a good way to learn, it will challenge your knowledge and make you a better archer for it. There are lots of very knowledgeable folks on this site that will be more than happy in assisting you in this process.


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Sounds like a great plan. Wouldn't know where to start...


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[Outlaw_6]

Originally Posted by DapperDan

Sounds like a great plan. Wouldn't know where to start...


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Maybe get a software program like Ontarget's Software for Archers and play around to get the specs you want. I believe they still offer a free trial version. It's not 100% accurate but it will give you a place to start before real world testing.

Here's what I'm running:
Chill X: 60lb / 27.5
26.5" Axis .340 w75gr insert and broadhead adapter.
125g Slick Trick Mags
Nockturnals
Flex Fletch FP-360's
Total arrow weight: 505 w205 up front
17% FOC
257 fps

No complaints.

[DapperDan]

Originally Posted by Outlaw_6

Maybe get a software program like Ontarget's Software for Archers and play around to get the specs you want. I believe they still offer a free trial version. It's not 100% accurate but it will give you a place to start before real world testing.

Here's what I'm running:
Chill X: 60lb / 27.5
26.5" Axis .340 w75gr insert and broadhead adapter.
125g Slick Trick Mags
Nockturnals
Flex Fletch FP-360's
Total arrow weight: 505 w205 up front
17% FOC
257 fps

No complaints.

Pretty close to what I have setup on my bow as far as specs. I'm not real crazy that my arrow sticks out 3.5 inches past my rest when at full draw... it literally is past my riser and under my sight.


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[Briar Friar]

MuddyFuzzy and others have done a great job giving direction where to start on an arrow build and pros and cons of Axis vs FMJ.

DapperDan...a place to start is by breaking down your current setup into its components and doing the math yourself as to FOC, FPS (done), momentum, etc. and tinker. You might simply achieve what you desire by simply going from a 100gr to 125gr...but then your spine will change (weaken) and you might need to shorten your arrow shaft length...or not. I can shoot 100gr (307 fps) heads and 125gr (297 fps) heads on the Beman Hunter ICS 300 @ 31" to 40yds with only a 4" drop and maintaining a 4" group (not the best not the worst) however I dont try longer distances that you are trying to achieve.

Good luck

[DapperDan]

Originally Posted by Briar Friar

MuddyFuzzy and others have done a great job giving direction where to start on an arrow build and pros and cons of Axis vs FMJ.

DapperDan...a place to start is by breaking down your current setup into its components and doing the math yourself as to FOC, FPS (done), momentum, etc. and tinker. You might simply achieve what you desire by simply going from a 100gr to 125gr...but then your spine will change (weaken) and you might need to shorten your arrow shaft length...or not. I can shoot 100gr (307 fps) heads and 125gr (297 fps) heads on the Beman Hunter ICS 300 @ 31" to 40yds with only a 4" drop and maintaining a 4" group (not the best not the worst) however I dont try longer distances that you are trying to achieve.

Good luck

So I get confused on spine and knowing if it's too stiff or too weak as well how to check for that? Not to mention I have no idea how to do that math. I'm not a newby on archery. I can shoot. Have always been able to. But I've gotten **** about things as I've gotten older. An example would be buying new arrows and seeing some fletching has more glue than others. Or one fletching isn't quite perfectly set on a perfect helical compared to others. Be it a 16th or 32nd of an inch. It still drives me batty....


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[Stoof]

I like the FMJ's and have never had an issue with them bending that was not easily noticeable. I have had more of an issue with flaring the aluminium right above the insert. But this has always happened after a pass through then hitting rocks. I still have a bunch of axis and still shoot them occosianally. They are both great arrows.

[gonehuntin68]

I don't like how easy the FMJ's bend. I went through more FMJ's shooting pigs because they bend then any carbon arrow I've shot pigs with. For the last several years I've been buying cheap carbon arrows from Sportmans guide for $45.00 a dozen but I do have to cut them and put the insert in. To me cutting and putting the insert in is a advantage because it give me the chance to square the ends. I've bought arrows online and from archery shops that didn't square the end before putting the insert in and that can cause flight problems with fixed heads. I also normally can get them for around $35.00 a dozen with the coupon codes they offer. No they are not as straight as the more expensive arrows but in all honesty I can't tell the difference in my shooting and doubt many on here could. I do end up culling a arrow or two out of each dozen that I just can't get to spin right so my fixed blade broadheads don't fly good with those but I use those to shoot targets with field tips or will put a small game head on them and shoot coons and such with them. Some years I go through more then 100 arrows a year so spending $35-40 a dozen saves me a lot of money over the $100+ a dozen arrows and they kill pigs and deer just as good.

[MONSTERKEN]

Great thread! I too shot Easton FMJ's, then went to the Deep Six Easton Injexion FMJ's. Unfortunately I was not happy with there performances. Great penetration though. Problem was I could see them fishtailing in flight, hitting where I was aiming, but it didn't seem right. Was shooting 100gr fp's and bh's. I even had them cut real short to stiffen their spine. I am shooting 70lbs with a 29.5 dl. Then I talked to Muddyfuzzy. Do yourself a favor and get you some Muddyfuzzy built Black Eagle arrows. The best arrows I've shot. I've ordered 2 dozen, and about to order another 2 dozen for my wife and daughter's. I've learned a lot from Muddyfuzzy where I am starting to build and play around with different combos. He knows his stuff.

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[Loneaggie]

Axis. Not really a good reason for FMJ. Need a heavier arrow? More spine, brass insert, and heavier head. Hard to get decent FOC out of a FMJ. Axis are also incredibly durable.

[Lawhorn]

I've shot both arrows and made the switch to Gold Tip Kinetic Pierces. Durable and are micro diameter. FOC is easy to obtain as well.


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