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Old 11-28-2022, 06:32 PM   #1
redfishted
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Default High Fence question

I am going to apologize if this dead horse has already be beat, but here is my question.

Say there was 15k acres that was high fenced, the 15k acres was really three 5k acre ranches with different owners, these properties were high fenced collectively but not separated individually by high fence, for the sake of clarity, if you owned the middle property and your fences were high on the two ends but not on the sides, would the deer you shot be considered high fence or low fence deer?
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Old 11-28-2022, 06:34 PM   #2
Snowflake Killa
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Good question, but I would think it would be considered high fence.

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Old 11-28-2022, 06:34 PM   #3
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High
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Old 11-28-2022, 06:59 PM   #4
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High
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Old 11-28-2022, 07:09 PM   #5
piercebronkite
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High as a kite.
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Old 11-28-2022, 07:09 PM   #6
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No low fence. High.


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Old 11-28-2022, 07:12 PM   #7
dgilbert
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High
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Old 11-28-2022, 07:22 PM   #8
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Sounds like what ole Swartz did with tecomante ranch years back. Think they shared a fence line that was low fence in the middle. Rest was high fenced.
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Old 11-28-2022, 07:26 PM   #9
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If you bought the place in the middle you may not even know the others had high fences, so I say low because you bought a place with two sides low fenced.
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Old 11-28-2022, 07:30 PM   #10
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If you have no say over what the neighbor shoots, and the deer you pass gets killed...seems like low fence to me. Alot of places in the hill country and south texas may not be high fenced, but once you drive around alittle you realize that you are because of a neighbors high fence
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Old 11-28-2022, 08:05 PM   #11
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If it was 20,000 acres completely surrounded by high fence, would it be high fence?

Now draw lines all over the same property. Does it become low fence? That is essentially what low fences are inside of outer perimeter high fence. They are just arbitrary lines that the deer don’t care about. They still are trapped.
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Old 11-28-2022, 08:21 PM   #12
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I would say high fenced
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Old 11-28-2022, 08:33 PM   #13
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This may be a new category never encountered before. May want to reach out to Cazadores about starting a new division for ďlow fence, inside high fence but still low fenceĒ category


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Old 11-28-2022, 08:41 PM   #14
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Wouldn’t you have to drive through a high fence to get to your property.?
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Old 11-28-2022, 08:51 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by W E H View Post
Wouldn’t you have to drive through a high fence to get to your property.?
You might have to do this on a low fenced category ranch, depending where your access point it.

I’ll” take this a little further. For those who high fence not all side of a property to keep the designation ‘low fence’, is the a minimum distance of low fence section to keep designation?
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Old 11-28-2022, 08:55 PM   #16
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I’d have another b&c in the books if that were the case. The west side of my ranch doesn’t have a fence between my neighbor and I. From what I gather the deer we shoot are still considered high fence and not eligible to be entered in b&c.
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Old 11-28-2022, 09:34 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by M16 View Post
Iíd have another b&c in the books if that were the case. The west side of my ranch doesnít have a fence between my neighbor and I. From what I gather the deer we shoot are still considered high fence and not eligible to be entered in b&c.
What's b&c? Just trying to keep up.
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Old 11-28-2022, 09:36 PM   #18
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Boone and Crockett
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Old 11-28-2022, 09:39 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BlackdirtCowboy View Post
Boone and Crockett
That with a quick Google search got me up to speed on the conversation. Thankyou
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Old 11-28-2022, 09:39 PM   #20
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it's "low fence", and one of the reasons you see some really really big "low fence" deer these days.


there's 1000 acres inside of my lease that's completely high fenced that has about 4-5 different tracts in it. the people that hunt on that 1100 acres don't even know they're high fenced in.
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Old 12-01-2022, 11:41 AM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kyle1974 View Post
it's "low fence", and one of the reasons you see some really really big "low fence" deer these days.


there's 1000 acres inside of my lease that's completely high fenced that has about 4-5 different tracts in it. the people that hunt on that 1100 acres don't even know they're high fenced in.
lol. I get to go play on my buddy's 1200 acre high fence ranch a few times a year. it doesn't take that much driving to run into one of those high fences.
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Old 12-01-2022, 11:53 AM   #22
kyle1974
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Default High Fence question

Quote:
Originally Posted by bullets13 View Post
lol. I get to go play on my buddy's 1200 acre high fence ranch a few times a year. it doesn't take that much driving to run into one of those high fences.

Other than trespassing on to someone elseís property maybe?

8 different tracts in that 1100 acres. So I guess if you want to trespass you could find out itís all high fence, but Iíve talked with some of the people hunting there and they have no idea because theyíve never seen it.

How many property lines does a deer have to be able to cross until itís fair chase?

Last edited by kyle1974; 12-01-2022 at 11:58 AM.
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Old 12-01-2022, 12:07 PM   #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kyle1974 View Post
Other than trespassing on to someone elseís property maybe?

8 different tracts in that 1100 acres. So I guess if you want to trespass you could find out itís all high fence, but Iíve talked with some of the people hunting there and they have no idea because theyíve never seen it.

How many property lines does a deer have to be able to cross until itís fair chase?

How do they get to their tract within the high fence without going through a high fence gate?


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Old 12-01-2022, 12:11 PM   #24
kyle1974
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Default High Fence question

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Originally Posted by cpatterson View Post
How do they get to their tract within the high fence without going through a high fence gate?


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LOL. Funny story about that. Until two years ago there was no gate.

6 miles of high fence and my landowner put up a cattle guard with a low fence gate next to it. It is a high fence gate now with some panels around the cattle guard.

So they all go through that section, but some of them donít realize how far the high fence extends because that cattleguard is in the NE corner. So the guys who go in there have 1-2-3 neighbors past them thatís all low fence between.


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Old 12-01-2022, 12:26 PM   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kyle1974 View Post

How many property lines does a deer have to be able to cross until itís fair chase?
If you apply a number to it, its high fenced. If you are really talking true free range, the number of property lines the deer can cross is infinity.
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Old 12-01-2022, 01:17 PM   #26
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Originally Posted by Gclyde28 View Post
If you apply a number to it, its high fenced. If you are really talking true free range, the number of property lines the deer can cross is infinity.
Then there is no longer any free range deer in America

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Old 12-01-2022, 12:56 PM   #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kyle1974 View Post
Other than trespassing on to someone else’s property maybe?

8 different tracts in that 1100 acres. So I guess if you want to trespass you could find out it’s all high fence, but I’ve talked with some of the people hunting there and they have no idea because they’ve never seen it.

How many property lines does a deer have to be able to cross until it’s fair chase?
somehow you know it's high fence but claim the people on the property are too dumb to figure it out? The fence would greatly increase the value of the lease, but the owner is being sneaky about it? makes no sense. either way, it's all irrelevant. 1100 acres is a small area of land that a deer can cross completely in a couple of hours. the deer are absolutely captive deer, no matter if there's 8 or 800 imaginary lines on the place.
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Old 12-01-2022, 02:07 PM   #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bullets13 View Post
somehow you know it's high fence but claim the people on the property are too dumb to figure it out? The fence would greatly increase the value of the lease, but the owner is being sneaky about it? makes no sense. either way, it's all irrelevant. 1100 acres is a small area of land that a deer can cross completely in a couple of hours. the deer are absolutely captive deer, no matter if there's 8 or 800 imaginary lines on the place.
it's not "somehow" I know, I know because the ranch I lease is 17,000 acres and surrounds it on all 4 sides, and I drive all 4 sides of it on a regular basis.

you're right, that entire place IS high fenced. that's not what I'm saying.

I'm saying if a guy shoots a deer on one of those tracts and enters it into a low fence competition, what happens?


I will draft a letter and leave it on their entrance with your concerns so they can be fully abreast of the situation here on TBH

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Old 11-28-2022, 09:45 PM   #29
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My thought is they would all be considered low fence. Each separate, individually owned ranch has at least one mile of LF. Thatís how TPWD defines LF

Just ask the Cactus Jack😂😂

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Old 11-28-2022, 10:25 PM   #30
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My thought is they would all be considered low fence. Each separate, individually owned ranch has at least one mile of LF. Thatís how TPWD defines LF

Just ask the Cactus Jack

Always figured they had a set up like that, otherwise they might be in some books


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Old 11-28-2022, 10:31 PM   #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HighwayHunter View Post
Always figured they had a set up like that, otherwise they might be in some books


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One mile of low fence fronting 83, with miles and miles of HF across the highway.
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Old 11-28-2022, 10:41 PM   #32
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Without a doubt HighFenced. Opinions or lack of knowledge have nothing to do with it when it comes to record books or contests. Now if it’s just talk then that’s different. People make up their opinions of what a free range deer is nowadays. To me if a deer cannot escape a place no matter how big it is then it’s a High Fenced enclosure. Also if I understand it correctly when some sides are Highfenced but the others are low/no fenced sides but impassable terrain like swamps or cliffs will not loophole a Highfenced classification for Boone&Crocket.

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Old 11-29-2022, 10:33 AM   #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KingsX View Post
To me if a deer cannot escape a place NO MATTER HOW BIG IT IS then itís a High Fenced enclosure. Also if I understand it correctly when some sides are Highfenced but the others are low/no fenced sides but impassable terrain like swamps or cliffs will not loophole a Highfenced classification for Boone&Crocket.
So what you're saying is, since the continent contains high fence, the North American continent would be excluded from records, as high fence (the oceans being the containment that would not qualify a loophole) according B&C?



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Old 11-29-2022, 10:14 AM   #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by webb09 View Post
One mile of low fence fronting 83, with miles and miles of HF across the highway.

Takes some real audacity to call those low fence deer lol


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Old 11-28-2022, 11:11 PM   #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by webb09 View Post
My thought is they would all be considered low fence. Each separate, individually owned ranch has at least one mile of LF. Thatís how TPWD defines LF

Just ask the Cactus Jack😂😂
it's easy enough to know who hunts this marginal low fence, because they preface every single post about their LOW FENCE deer.
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Old 11-28-2022, 09:45 PM   #36
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The B&c defines fair chase as the ethical, sportsmanlike, and lawful pursuit and taking of any free ranging wild game animal in a manner that does not give the Hunter an improper or unfair advantage over the game animals. In 1983, the Club adopted a policy that made whitetail deer and other species taken in escape-proof enclosures ineligible for its record books. So I would say no to be able to enter in B&c.
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Old 11-29-2022, 10:22 AM   #37
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High
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Old 11-29-2022, 10:25 AM   #38
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It would be the same if you had three sections of land that borders were 1 mile each. This would meet the same rule but would still be a high finished ranch even though it had 1 mile of fence.

Total of 1920 acres
Broken up into three sections would give you 1 mile fence lines. So by the above description, you would have a low fence ranch even though the total pasture would be 1920 acres
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Old 11-29-2022, 10:25 AM   #39
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Y’all can argue all you want but I just talked to Bailey at los Cazadores and she didn’t even have a good answer for that because I have thought about that before myself so this gave me a good reason to call. They are actually going to take a poll with everyone at los Cazadores and call me back.
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Old 11-29-2022, 10:42 AM   #40
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Iím in the boat that says low fence, only in the event that you do not have permission to hunt the surrounding properties. If you can only hunt your property and it is low fenced around the entire perimeter then the deer are not forced to stay on your part and are free to come and go as they desire.


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Old 11-29-2022, 10:53 AM   #41
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Quote:
Originally Posted by canny View Post
Iím in the boat that says low fence, only in the event that you do not have permission to hunt the surrounding properties. If you can only hunt your property and it is low fenced around the entire perimeter then the deer are not forced to stay on your part and are free to come and go as they desire.


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This..
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Old 11-30-2022, 08:47 AM   #42
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Quote:
Originally Posted by justletmein View Post
If you bought the place in the middle you may not even know the others had high fences, so I say low because you bought a place with two sides low fenced.
this was my first thought.

Quote:
Originally Posted by canny View Post
Iím in the boat that says low fence, only in the event that you do not have permission to hunt the surrounding properties. If you can only hunt your property and it is low fenced around the entire perimeter then the deer are not forced to stay on your part and are free to come and go as they desire.


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good point here as well.

like someone said, if you go far enough down south you will hit a HF so in theory they are all fenced in.
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Old 11-29-2022, 10:49 AM   #43
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Here's another quirky thought...is the land inside the high fence, high fenced, or is the land outside the high fence, high fenced? If size/amount doesn't matter, then what's outside is also high fenced. The deer outside can't escape to the available land inside. So it goes both ways if your saying size doesn't matter.
(And no wise cracks about "both ways" or "size doesnt matter" from the 3rd graders!) Lol
Just to be clear I'm not an advocate for hunting high fence for myself, but to each his own. I do believe the amount of land fenced at some point becomes moot to being a determining factor in the "ability to escape" argument.

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Old 11-29-2022, 11:20 AM   #44
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I hunted a property that was 5k acres of low fence brush surrounded by nothing but open pastures. The deer would not leave. So it was low fence that hunted like high fence LOL.
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Old 11-29-2022, 08:18 PM   #45
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The OPs question was whether or not it’s considered HF or LF. Not about BC qualification.
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Old 11-29-2022, 08:34 PM   #46
kyle1974
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Itís 100% low fence status.

Otherwise itís all high fence if you keep going out far enough.
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Old 11-29-2022, 08:40 PM   #47
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I’d call that high fence all day long.

For those that think it’s considered low fence, if your neighbor bought and released a couple 250” breeder bucks, and they happened to wander to your portion of land and you wack one of them, you really gonna go around saying you killed some low fence monster?
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Old 11-29-2022, 08:45 PM   #48
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gclyde28 View Post
Iíd call that high fence all day long.

For those that think itís considered low fence, if your neighbor bought and released a couple 250Ē breeder bucks, and they happened to wander to your portion of land and you wack one of them, you really gonna go around saying you killed some low fence monster?
Look at it in reverse, the benefits of having the high fence is you can release 250" breeders and they don't get shot by your neighbors, well that didn't happen in your scenario.
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Old 11-29-2022, 09:01 PM   #49
webb09
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gclyde28 View Post
Iíd call that high fence all day long.

For those that think itís considered low fence, if your neighbor bought and released a couple 250Ē breeder bucks, and they happened to wander to your portion of land and you wack one of them, you really gonna go around saying you killed some low fence monster?
Said breeder bucks would have tags, tattoos or holes in their ear. Clearly anyone or any contest would know thatís not a legit LF deer. Would I shoot itÖ.absolutely! Would I claim LFÖ no. Would I send said neighbor a nice Christmas giftÖ.all day long.
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Old 11-30-2022, 09:01 AM   #50
RiverRat1
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So just buy or lease a 10 acre track right in the middle of a high fence breeding operation. Do not drive and see the HF part for plausible deniability. You could then own a lot of LF records.

How is this even a question?
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