Active shooter in Uvalde

[Mudslinger]

Terrible situation and my prayers are going out for anyone affected by this.

I know that most new schools are designed with controlled entry in mind. The problem is the older schools, which in Uvalde’s case is the elementary school, they have to try to retro fit older buildings to modern problems. That means a lot of possible entry points that can easily be left unmanaged. Sad to have to even consider that, but unfortunately it’s where we are.

I taught SE behavior kids for my last 3 years in an elementary school that was built an opened in 1967 and every door in that building could be and was locked 24/7 and locked very securely. Not sure how old this elementary is in Uvalde is but it should have been secure.

[Russ81]

Don’t know how true but my wife said the shooter threatened something similar a year ago & was in an institution for some time.

I was watching breaking news reporting earlier and an FBI representative said that from all their research on mass shootings 77% give warnings & share their intent whether via social media or close family or friends

And to add our school district where our kids go are armed

I still believe Pagourtzis set the bomb scare up the February before he shot those kids and teachers in May at Santa Fe just to see how the school would respond.

[diamond10x]

This whole this is heartbreaking and disgusting. I can promise you that everyone in uvalde is either family or very close friends with each family that was personally torn apart today. I would have never imagined something like this would ever happen there. Prayers for everyone involved from the victims and families to the first responders.

It’s ridiculous we even have to deal with events like this. This is a societal issue 100%. It wasn’t that long ago you were allowed to have guns in your vehicle at school and it was no big deal. More gun legislation isn’t going to solve anything but infringe on our god given rights, and arming more teachers isn’t going to solve it either. This isn’t mental illness either. If parents would discipline their kids and not coddle them or try to be their friend we wouldn’t be dealing with these things. If teachers and admin would punish the students the way they should be this wouldn’t be happening. Kids have no respect for anything these days because they have never had the fear of god put into them.

[Quackerbox]

Again Im former LE and trained local LE in active shooter. Im not discounting anyone but its not enough training when we are talking about hundreds to thousands of children. Different ballgame.


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I got that.

But, you said "most LE". I don't think that's the case. All of our guys have active shooter along with updates. Is it enough, absolutely not.

They/we all need more training. I take more gun training than anyone else in my unit and its not enough. Thankfully we're a reactive, contained scene group.

Unfortunately, Budgets and manpower dictate who does what more than what you need to learn and we both there ain't enough of either. I mean even the 3rd largest dept in the country got down to 2000 rounds of 9mm last year.

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[tvc184]

20 years at a very large agency and priority of life was never discussed or taught until I attended an ALERRT class in the late 2000's. That was around the same time they were still teaching wait for backup before entering an active shooter scene.

We now know that doesn't work and teach single man entries going straight to the shooting.

It look a very long time to get to single officer entry when it should have been common sense 30 years ago. But LE training was stuck on preserving the officer.

30 years ago you could wait for backup and were taught to do so because it wasn’t common for people to go into schools and start blasting without demands.

A couple of guys named Klebold and Harris changed the landscape.

I went to ALERRT 18 years ago and we were taught not to wait on swat but to wait for 4 officers from any agency. No that has been (rightfully) changed.

When I started almost 39 years ago for the first couple of years I had never drive by shootings, crack cocaine, active shooters, home invasions, carjackings and so on. Unfortunately crime changes and so do tactics.

[kurt68]

I will add this. If a crazy person did go off in a common area full of kids the only shot I am comfortable taking is a contact shot because I dont get weekly range time. Im not allowed to have a gun at school. Even then in the moment shooting around running children sounds horrible. Head shots in a hostage situation or with frantic friendlies providing cover/concealment to the target require SRT/SWAT training. I will be dead on the ground before anyone kills one of my students. Im not special. Any real man would but our schools are not filled with a lot of men. Especially at the elementary level. College grad females go to those schools.

We have a problem in our society and its going to take strong men to stop it.


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My neighborhood elementary school that all three of my kids attended here in Spring, only male employee was the old janitor. Very scary when you think about it.

[Mudslinger]

My neighborhood elementary school that all three of my kids attended here in Spring, only male employee was the old janitor. Very scary when you think about it.

Very common in elementary schools today. No males for the most part.

[andre3k]

I got that.

But, you said "most LE". I don't think that's the case. All of our guys have active shooter along with updates. Is it enough, absolutely not.

They/we all need more training. I take more gun training than anyone else in my unit and its not enough. Thankfully we're a reactive, contained scene group.

Unfortunately, Budgets and manpower dictate who does what more than what you need to learn and we both there ain't enough of either. I mean even the 3rd largest dept in the country got down to 2000 rounds of 9mm last year.

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Things are definitely changing for the better. My agency has received more and better training in the last five years than the previous twenty five.

This is one aspect in which body cams are a good thing. We are able to learn from our shootings and adjust training accordingly. With the frequency of our shootings it's a good resource to gather data to improve tactics and training.

I feel bad for the officers that are working that scene. Seeing that many dead children will effect them for the rest of their lives. I hope those depts have resources for counseling for those that seek it after working traumatic scenes.

I read an article about the Pulse nightclub shooting. One officer suffered PTSD and cell phones would trigger it. He remembered all the cell phones ringing from the dead patrons of the club from worried family members calling.

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[Aggiehunter08]

[QUOTE=diamond10x;16233218

It’s ridiculous we even have to deal with events like this. This is a societal issue 100%. It wasn’t that long ago you were allowed to have guns in your vehicle at school and it was no big deal. More gun legislation isn’t going to solve anything but infringe on our god given rights, and arming more teachers isn’t going to solve it either. This isn’t mental illness either. If parents would discipline their kids and not coddle them or try to be their friend we wouldn’t be dealing with these things. If teachers and admin would punish the students the way they should be this wouldn’t be happening. Kids have no respect for anything these days because they have never had the fear of god put into them.[/QUOTE]

This is spot on. Too many people bringing kids into the world that have no business doing so.

[Quackerbox]

Things are definitely changing for the better. My agency has received more and better training in the last five years than the previous twenty five.

This is one aspect in which body cams are a good thing. We are able to learn from our shootings and adjust training accordingly. With the frequency of our shootings it's a good resource to gather data to improve tactics and training.

I feel bad for the officers that are working that scene. Seeing that many dead children will effect them for the rest of their lives. I hope those depts have resources for counseling for those that seek it after working traumatic scenes.

I read an article about the Pulse nightclub shooting. One officer suffered PTSD and cell phones would trigger it. He remembered all the cell phones ringing from the dead patrons of the club from worried family members calling.

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I'd be surprised if more than 10 on scene uses any form of debrief or counseling. The type A personality just plain won't go.

Sheriff's, chiefs and brass will come check on their guys. Make some sound bites, shake a hand and leave. They won't check on thier guys later and those initial units will run calls tomorrow. Seen it too many times while watching loved ones outside the tape and hearing phones ring

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[JeffJ]

My wife was asked to move this school year to DAEP (District Alternative Education Program), which is the next step after ISS, as an alternative to long term suspension. The DAEP rooms (for HS and MS) are located in portable buildings across the street from the main HS building.

THREE of the kids that are currently in the DAEP classroom are there BECAUSE they made death threats at school.

I asked my wife to text the principal to find out what additional precautions and security is being provided for the last two days of school to avoid a copycat. He replied that they are providing additional security for the campus, but I'm concerned how much will be focused on the main campus building as opposed to the DAEP portables on the outskirts. There are times she's in the portables alone with the kids. I'm not sure I'm comfortable with that these days.

I’d have her calling in sick the rest of the year.

[PondPopper]

Parents need to start being held accountable when their obviously VERY strange acting, mentally deranged child commits these heinous crimes... It is 100% the responsibility of the parents to either raise their children to be normal, respectful, sane, non violent individuals or get them whatever help they may need to live a normal life..
All of this evil, demented crap that parents are allowing their children to be exposed to, and participate in, is what is creating these highly confused, depressed, evil killing monsters!!
Then they just turn them loose on society.. That just happened again today!!
And now we have dead babies!!!

[Capt Glenn]

My wife was asked to move this school year to DAEP (District Alternative Education Program), which is the next step after ISS, as an alternative to long term suspension. The DAEP rooms (for HS and MS) are located in portable buildings across the street from the main HS building.

THREE of the kids that are currently in the DAEP classroom are there BECAUSE they made death threats at school.

I asked my wife to text the principal to find out what additional precautions and security is being provided for the last two days of school to avoid a copycat. He replied that they are providing additional security for the campus, but I'm concerned how much will be focused on the main campus building as opposed to the DAEP portables on the outskirts. There are times she's in the portables alone with the kids. I'm not sure I'm comfortable with that these days.

Disciplinary Alternative Education Program. I have many years of experience with DAEP.

[BrandonA]

Prayers to the victims and the Border Patrol Agent Shot. The BP agents are probably the most experienced that get ignored. My brother is a BP agent in that sector but wasn’t dispatched but what he is telling me it was horrific

[whopper1800]

Probably gonna get flamed for this but none of this happened before the induction of violent video games turned into the new baby sitter.


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