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Old 01-22-2020, 11:53 AM   #151
Outdoor Legacy
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Hey guys I'm in Vegas all week at SHOT and don't have time to reply and answer questions right now but stay tuned and after I get back and settle in I'll be able to start answering questions with better info. We will also be starting a pre-order list for all the new optics, so stay tuned!

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Old 01-23-2020, 11:05 AM   #152
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Originally Posted by Russ81 View Post
Iím running a .308 right now, but seriously looking at 7.62x39 for hogs. Both are pretty cheap ammo and easy too find.

The KS-47 that palmetto state makes looks pretty dang good.


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Quote:
Originally Posted by LMiz View Post
I run my photon on a 6.8 and my thermal on 308

I get more one shot running kills with the 308 but the 6.8 is so much lighter when walking around and still does a great job dropping hogs
THis says it all. More .308 kills on the run. WHich is why I will stick with my Stainless .308 from Palmetto. Paid $580 out the door
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Old 01-23-2020, 11:07 AM   #153
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My vote would be 6.5 Grendel since it is a AR 15 platform. Lugging around an AR 10 gets old pretty fast IMO but I am not a strong guy.
Do you not scan from the truck and then stalk up once an animal is found?

My AR-10 is fairly light. No problem carrying it 300-400 yards on my SLIK tripod
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Old 01-23-2020, 11:09 AM   #154
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Default The 2020 Thermal & Night Vision Thread

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Do you not scan from the truck and then stalk up once an animal is found?



My AR-10 is fairly light. No problem carrying it 300-400 yards on my SLIK tripod

My old truck was a diesel so that was kinda out of the plan and the ranger is a diesel too. Usually Iíd drive close where Iím hunting then walk in to the pond I was working. Both my rifles have 2-point slings and it makes toting the AR10 bearable.

Just got a 1500 Chevy and as long as you donít punch it itís pretty quiet, might have to see how setting up from it will fare.


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Old 01-23-2020, 11:58 AM   #155
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My old truck was a diesel so that was kinda out of the plan and the ranger is a diesel too. Usually Iíd drive close where Iím hunting then walk in to the pond I was working. Both my rifles have 2-point slings and it makes toting the AR10 bearable.

Just got a 1500 Chevy and as long as you donít punch it itís pretty quiet, might have to see how setting up from it will fare.


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This is exactly why I won't get a diesel haha. A quiet gas 4wd truck is a huge plus when driving and scanning various places. My ranger is too loud also
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Old 01-23-2020, 12:01 PM   #156
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This is exactly why I won't get a diesel haha. A quiet gas 4wd truck is a huge plus when driving and scanning various places. My ranger is too loud also

Not gonna lie... A/C in the summer and heated seats this time of year appeal too me


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Old 01-23-2020, 02:09 PM   #157
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Originally Posted by Russ81 View Post
My old truck was a diesel so that was kinda out of the plan and the ranger is a diesel too. Usually Iíd drive close where Iím hunting then walk in to the pond I was working. Both my rifles have 2-point slings and it makes toting the AR10 bearable.

Just got a 1500 Chevy and as long as you donít punch it itís pretty quiet, might have to see how setting up from it will fare.


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I've been 100 yds from hogs in my gas pickup. Most of the time we'll spot them sooner, but its plenty stealth.
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Old 01-23-2020, 02:11 PM   #158
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I've been 100 yds from hogs in my gas pickup. Most of the time we'll spot them sooner, but its plenty stealth.



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Old 01-25-2020, 07:51 AM   #159
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Donít know if itís all cabelas but promos trigger sticks are on sale. $159 and I walked out paying $139


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Old 01-29-2020, 09:13 AM   #160
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Originally Posted by Outdoor Legacy View Post
Hey guys I'm in Vegas all week at SHOT and don't have time to reply and answer questions right now but stay tuned and after I get back and settle in I'll be able to start answering questions with better info. We will also be starting a pre-order list for all the new optics, so stay tuned!

- Jason
New 4k Wraith.... did I see that it now has a rechargeable battery & does audio? any other notable upgrades on it?
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Old 01-30-2020, 02:45 PM   #161
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Best battery pack and QD mount for Apex xq38?
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Old 01-31-2020, 10:32 AM   #162
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Jason, any chance Pulsar will upgrade existing Axion XM30 units to the new XM30S if you already own the older unit? Send it in and get upgraded???


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Old 01-31-2020, 11:01 AM   #163
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Jason, any chance Pulsar will upgrade existing Axion XM30 units to the new XM30S if you already own the older unit? Send it in and get upgraded???


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I would be shocked but it is always worth asking the question. I am interested to hear how much better the quality is. Obviously I am biased since I already own an XM30 but I am skeptical that it is going to be substantially better since you are still dealing with a 320 core and a small objective lens. I would guess that the screen isn't the weak link in the regular unit. Other side of that coin is that if it isn't substantially better why would they waste the time on changing it. I am sure Jason and Hans will do a review as soon as they can on the Late Night Vision Show.

Last edited by Fordnandez; 01-31-2020 at 11:08 AM.
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Old 02-01-2020, 12:19 AM   #164
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Default The 2020 Thermal & Night Vision Thread

Noticed my new truck was quieter then the ranger (but a lot of things are quieter then a diesel crew...) so she got a mud test tonight.

Heated seats are niiiiiice




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Old 02-01-2020, 12:47 AM   #165
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Noticed my new truck was quieter then the ranger (but a lot of things are quieter then a diesel crew...) so she got a mud test tonight.

Heated seats are niiiiiice




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Nice!

As Always My Heart is filled with Love for You and Your Families. Not because I am commanded to Love my Neighbor, but because I can, am able to and it brings me Joy.
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Old 02-02-2020, 11:31 PM   #166
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Originally Posted by duckmanep View Post
New 4k Wraith.... did I see that it now has a rechargeable battery & does audio? any other notable upgrades on it?
That's correct. Internal rechargeable battery, estimates are about 8 hours of run time. It will also take an external USB battery pack. And yes sir, it records video and audio. The biggest upgrade is going to be the resolution, it will be 4000x3000 pixels.

A really big improvement in my mind is that it will be a 3x base magnification, which is really going to be better for most hog hunters. The 4x of the Wraith HD is more than a lot of people need. We will be reviewing them as soon as possible and current ETA is around March from what I was told. Price is $799 and we've already got some pre-orders rolling in.

https://outdoorlegacygear.com/produc...31704981635146


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Originally Posted by SAC View Post
Best battery pack and QD mount for Apex xq38?
The only options are the Pulsar EPS3 and EPS5, both of which have been discontinued since summer 2019, however, you can find them on eBay and a few random places. If you see an online store advertising one as "in stock", you need to confirm that before you buy since they've been gone for several months. They are excellent battery packs though!


Quote:
Originally Posted by ATXArcher View Post
Jason, any chance Pulsar will upgrade existing Axion XM30 units to the new XM30S if you already own the older unit? Send it in and get upgraded???
No sir, they won't be able to do upgrades like that. These thermals are very intricate and they don't just swap parts around etc. I know it would be nice but they just aren't set up for that kind of thing anyway, especially here in the US. I wish the answer was different.

I know it sucks to buy something and then the price drops or the model gets an upgrade a few weeks or months later and I can totally feel the pain. Unfortunately, this is just the problem with consumer electronics. If you buy today, the price or model might change tomorrow but if you try to wait to purchase then you'll never find the right time to buy. It's tough. Heck it's not just electronics....anyone want to buy 2 Ruger LCP .380's? I paid $349/each for them and now they are $199 and were $149 at Christmas.
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Old 02-02-2020, 11:33 PM   #167
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Here are the SHOT Show updates that we released on The Late Night Vision Show.

https://youtu.be/jWdjjx9z0a0

http://youtu.be/HKlZ3J1SWQo

Last edited by Outdoor Legacy; 02-02-2020 at 11:41 PM.
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Old 02-03-2020, 05:48 AM   #168
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Thanks Jason. I pretty much new the answer already, but it didnít cost anything to ask.


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Old 02-03-2020, 08:27 AM   #169
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Noticed my new truck was quieter then the ranger (but a lot of things are quieter then a diesel crew...) so she got a mud test tonight.

Heated seats are niiiiiice

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Not enough mud, not enough blood!
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Old 02-03-2020, 09:16 AM   #170
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Canít figure out how to post videos


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Same here trying to post photos. Wish I could get help ???
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Old 02-03-2020, 09:28 AM   #171
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Thanks Jason. I pretty much new the answer already, but it didnít cost anything to ask.
Absolutely correct, never hurts to ask and every once in a while you are pleasantly surprised at the answer!
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Old 02-03-2020, 09:30 AM   #172
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Staying tuned. I am using a Sig Echo now. Works good for the 100-125 yards from the porch to the creek.
Looking for suggestions on Sniper Hog Lights. I would like get one of these to mount on one of my rifles. I don't want to spend Thousands of $$$ right now on some of these scopes. Does any one here own one these are they fairly nice for the price. I have a decent amount Hogs on place I need to get rid of. Thanks for the help.
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Old 02-03-2020, 10:07 AM   #173
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Default The 2020 Thermal & Night Vision Thread

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Originally Posted by JFFB View Post
Looking for suggestions on Sniper Hog Lights. I would like get one of these to mount on one of my rifles. I don't want to spend Thousands of $$$ right now on some of these scopes. Does any one here own one these are they fairly nice for the price. I have a decent amount Hogs on place I need to get rid of. Thanks for the help.

Your in luck, Jason and Hans cover this very topic a few weeks ago:

http://youtu.be/Drsdj9p0pHA

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Originally Posted by SAC View Post
Not enough mud, not enough blood!

Your absolutely right, but I did get it on video this time


http://youtu.be/ZWzHgsHdM1o

Iíve got a big sounder out here roaming over 5-6 properties, they seem to know when Iím out and when Iím not. Got the .308 lubed up and another 800ac on the other side of their range Iím hoping to surprise them on soon


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Old 02-05-2020, 04:29 PM   #174
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Looking to get my first thermal. Would y’all recommend a readily available Trail XQ38 or get on a waiting list for a Thermion XM38? Thanks.
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Old 02-05-2020, 05:46 PM   #175
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Looking to get my first thermal. Would y’all recommend a readily available Trail XQ38 or get on a waiting list for a Thermion XM38? Thanks.
Trail xq38 is a great scope with 2.2x base magnification, the Therminion xm38 is 4x. Depends on what type country you are hunting. I would get the Therminion xq38 2.5x over the Trail xq38.

Last edited by RMW; 02-05-2020 at 05:50 PM.
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Old 02-05-2020, 06:23 PM   #176
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Trail xq38 is a great scope with 2.2x base magnification, the Therminion xm38 is 4x. Depends on what type country you are hunting. I would get the Therminion xq38 2.5x over the Trail xq38.
Thanks. Just hard to be patient Lol
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Old 02-05-2020, 06:53 PM   #177
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Thanks. Just hard to be patient Lol
I hear ya!

Just to be clear

Trail xq38- 2.2x
Therminion xq38- 2.5x
Therminion xm38- 4x
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Old 02-06-2020, 10:02 AM   #178
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Looking to get my first thermal. Would yíall recommend a readily available Trail XQ38 or get on a waiting list for a Thermion XM38? Thanks.
The Trail XQ38 (and all the non-LRF Trails) have been officially discontinued as of January 1, 2020. There are probably still a few around on shelves but we sold out at the beginning of the month. It's definitely a great scope but the new Thermion XQ38 is supposed to be released around June and it will have a new display screen and a new improved thermal core and both of those should provide sharper, crisper and more detailed image quality than the Trail XQ38. If you just can't wait the Trail is a great option and I'm sure you'd be happy with it but if this is a long term purchase and you can wait a few months, I'd consider waiting on the Thermion XQ38.

Jason
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Old 02-06-2020, 11:40 AM   #179
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Originally Posted by Outdoor Legacy View Post
The Trail XQ38 (and all the non-LRF Trails) have been officially discontinued as of January 1, 2020. There are probably still a few around on shelves but we sold out at the beginning of the month. It's definitely a great scope but the new Thermion XQ38 is supposed to be released around June and it will have a new display screen and a new improved thermal core and both of those should provide sharper, crisper and more detailed image quality than the Trail XQ38. If you just can't wait the Trail is a great option and I'm sure you'd be happy with it but if this is a long term purchase and you can wait a few months, I'd consider waiting on the Thermion XQ38.



Jason
Good to know on the Thermion XQ38. Been wondering the release date.

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Old 02-06-2020, 11:48 AM   #180
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Originally Posted by Outdoor Legacy View Post
The Trail XQ38 (and all the non-LRF Trails) have been officially discontinued as of January 1, 2020. There are probably still a few around on shelves but we sold out at the beginning of the month. It's definitely a great scope but the new Thermion XQ38 is supposed to be released around June and it will have a new display screen and a new improved thermal core and both of those should provide sharper, crisper and more detailed image quality than the Trail XQ38. If you just can't wait the Trail is a great option and I'm sure you'd be happy with it but if this is a long term purchase and you can wait a few months, I'd consider waiting on the Thermion XQ38.

Jason
Thanks. Iíve been listening to your podcast every chance I get. Including today Lol. Compared to regular scopes, 3x9 is super common and probably on almost all of my rifles in the safe. Is the base 4x of the Thermion really that big of a difference? Right now we hunt 350 acres 65% fields but I do have access to a lot of more dense growth pine leases also. Definitely a toss up to wait it out.
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Old 02-06-2020, 10:54 PM   #181
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Thanks. Iíve been listening to your podcast every chance I get. Including today Lol. Compared to regular scopes, 3x9 is super common and probably on almost all of my rifles in the safe. Is the base 4x of the Thermion really that big of a difference? Right now we hunt 350 acres 65% fields but I do have access to a lot of more dense growth pine leases also. Definitely a toss up to wait it out.
This is a very common question for guys new to NV/thermal hunting, so don't feel bad for asking. One reason that the digital night vision optics are pretty high magnification like 4x is because that's the scopes that a lot of new night hunters buy and coming from daytime optics, they really think they need high magnification at night. In truth, you want to buy the absolute lowest magnification you can reasonably get by with. I'll explain.

During the day you locate the animal with your naked eyes and then you point your rifle at it, look through the scope and normally, you can see the animal. If you don't see it, you pull you head back, lean to the left, spot it again and move your rifle/scope to point at it and now you see it in your scope. At night....there is none of that. You have no forward vision with your eyes and no peripheral vision, which we also take for granted. If you don't see him in your scope, you don't see him at all.

Generally speaking, as the magnification goes up, the field of view goes down. To counter this, thermal manufacturers enlarge the objective lens size. The problem is, to completely counter that FOV issue, objective lenses would have to be huge and another side note but the lenses are not glass on thermals. They are germanium and it's one of the most expensive parts of the scope. Let's take a couple scopes as examples, the (discontinued) Trail XQ38 is 2.1x base mag and it has a 56ft FOV at 110 yards with a 32mm objective. The XQ50 is 2.7x base mag and it has a 42ft FOV at 110 yards with a 42mm objective. The objective lens size went up 10mm or 24% and there was still a net loss of 25% of the FOV by going up a little over 1/2 power of magnification.

The point is, generally speaking, the more magnification, the narrower the FOV and a narrow FOV and a high magnification are the 2 enemies of a night hunter. There are some exceptions to this rule depending on how you hunt, for instance, someone hunting hogs at feeders from a deer stand can get by with less FOV and higher base mag than a guy hunting the exact same distances doing spot and stalk hunting. Now to be clear, this does not mean that 4x or even 5.5x base mag is a bad thing. It just depends on your hunting conditions, shooting ranges, personal comfort levels etc.

Did I mention there is also a huge danger is getting too low of a base magnification? That's another topic for another day.

My advice to people is, call a good honest dealer who uses every scope IN the field and get his advice on what you need. Shameless TBH sponsor plug, we are one of those dealers. But I have a couple friends who are big dealers as well and they fit this bill too. Getting advice on what to buy from a FB group full of random people who've only looked through a few thermals is not a wise decision when it comes to spending this kind of money.

Also, I'm not sure if I mentioned it or not previously but since 4x magnification was mentioned, the Thermion XM38 4x has been discontinued and the FLIR PTS536 4x is gone too, so there aren't any less expensive/quality 4x scopes on the market right now.

I hope this helps a little.

- Jason
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Old 02-06-2020, 11:08 PM   #182
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Also how you hunt hogs at night is different then your daytime hunting. First hog I ever shot with my Trail XQ50 was at 181yds because I saw him and shot because I was still in day hunting mode... shoot on sight.

I had an issue (didnít read the manual...) and had called Jason and he called me back the next morning. Told what happened and his response was classic...

ďWhy didnít you get closer???Ē

Long as you donít sound like a bull elephant stomping thru the woods get up on them and make a clean shot. The last hog video I posted was a good example. With the 2.7 base off the trail it looked further then what he was but my Axion XM30 made him seem right in front of me with 4x base magnification.

Hereís the 181yd hog
First Shot with the Pulsar Trail XQ50 http://youtu.be/4YpUAdOZIW8


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Old 02-07-2020, 05:54 PM   #183
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Originally Posted by Outdoor Legacy View Post
This is a very common question for guys new to NV/thermal hunting, so don't feel bad for asking. One reason that the digital night vision optics are pretty high magnification like 4x is because that's the scopes that a lot of new night hunters buy and coming from daytime optics, they really think they need high magnification at night. In truth, you want to buy the absolute lowest magnification you can reasonably get by with. I'll explain.



During the day you locate the animal with your naked eyes and then you point your rifle at it, look through the scope and normally, you can see the animal. If you don't see it, you pull you head back, lean to the left, spot it again and move your rifle/scope to point at it and now you see it in your scope. At night....there is none of that. You have no forward vision with your eyes and no peripheral vision, which we also take for granted. If you don't see him in your scope, you don't see him at all.



Generally speaking, as the magnification goes up, the field of view goes down. To counter this, thermal manufacturers enlarge the objective lens size. The problem is, to completely counter that FOV issue, objective lenses would have to be huge and another side note but the lenses are not glass on thermals. They are germanium and it's one of the most expensive parts of the scope. Let's take a couple scopes as examples, the (discontinued) Trail XQ38 is 2.1x base mag and it has a 56ft FOV at 110 yards with a 32mm objective. The XQ50 is 2.7x base mag and it has a 42ft FOV at 110 yards with a 42mm objective. The objective lens size went up 10mm or 24% and there was still a net loss of 25% of the FOV by going up a little over 1/2 power of magnification.



The point is, generally speaking, the more magnification, the narrower the FOV and a narrow FOV and a high magnification are the 2 enemies of a night hunter. There are some exceptions to this rule depending on how you hunt, for instance, someone hunting hogs at feeders from a deer stand can get by with less FOV and higher base mag than a guy hunting the exact same distances doing spot and stalk hunting. Now to be clear, this does not mean that 4x or even 5.5x base mag is a bad thing. It just depends on your hunting conditions, shooting ranges, personal comfort levels etc.



Did I mention there is also a huge danger is getting too low of a base magnification? That's another topic for another day.



My advice to people is, call a good honest dealer who uses every scope IN the field and get his advice on what you need. Shameless TBH sponsor plug, we are one of those dealers. But I have a couple friends who are big dealers as well and they fit this bill too. Getting advice on what to buy from a FB group full of random people who've only looked through a few thermals is not a wise decision when it comes to spending this kind of money.



Also, I'm not sure if I mentioned it or not previously but since 4x magnification was mentioned, the Thermion XM38 4x has been discontinued and the FLIR PTS536 4x is gone too, so there aren't any less expensive/quality 4x scopes on the market right now.



I hope this helps a little.



- Jason
I hope you copied and pasted that! That's an epic novel lol

Seriously though, great info! Glad to have someone on here that can explain it and answer questions

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Old 02-08-2020, 02:04 AM   #184
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Me and my buddy killed 31 hogs tonight here at the deer lease, corned the roads and made round after round. Probably saw at least 100 hogs. He used a pulsar apex xq50 and I used a pulsar trail xq38.
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Old 02-08-2020, 06:55 AM   #185
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Me and my buddy killed 31 hogs tonight here at the deer lease, corned the roads and made round after round. Probably saw at least 100 hogs. He used a pulsar apex xq50 and I used a pulsar trail xq38.

Nice!


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Old 02-10-2020, 09:20 AM   #186
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My BIL shot a pretty nice hog this past weekend with his Wraith. We spotted it with a Flir 536 that was not weapon mounted yet. We would have never seen this hog without the use of a thermal. Super pleased with the Flir and my Axion XM30.
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Old 02-29-2020, 04:57 PM   #187
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Been using my Halo Lr the last few weeks and I’ve got to say I’m not really impressed. For 8100.00 I thought it would blow away my Pulsar trail xq38, boy was I wrong. It’s got a better image but not by much.
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Old 02-29-2020, 07:59 PM   #188
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My BIL shot a pretty nice hog this past weekend with his Wraith. We spotted it with a Flir 536 that was not weapon mounted yet. We would have never seen this hog without the use of a thermal. Super pleased with the Flir and my Axion XM30.

Just sold my Wraith.
Not sure what's next. Thermal is, haven't decided if it's going to be a scope or monocular....

As Always My Heart is filled with Love for You and Your Families. Not because I am commanded to Love my Neighbor, but because I can, am able to and it brings me Joy.
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Old 03-01-2020, 10:38 AM   #189
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Originally Posted by RMW View Post
Been using my Halo Lr the last few weeks and I’ve got to say I’m not really impressed. For 8100.00 I thought it would blow away my Pulsar trail xq38, boy was I wrong. It’s got a better image but not by much.
I also had an xq38 first and then got a halo Lr. The trail xq38 is just a phenomenal scope for the money with all the built in features. The image on the halo is great.....but I honestly think I’d rather have 2 xq38’s. I still use the xq38 to scan with but at times Halo Lr comes in handy when trying to ID animals wayyyy out there. I’m also not a fan of any of the Halo reticles
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Old 03-01-2020, 11:20 PM   #190
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If you want THE best on the market and know that there is literally nothing you can own any better, you have no choice to pick up something like a Halo LR or a Trijicon. I think what it boils down to is the value for the dollar. The rule of "diminishing returns" is at play with these really high end thermal scopes.

Here is what I mean by that. The Thermion XP50 is Pulsar's best scope and it's $5,000. The Halor LR is $7,500 or 50% more than the XP50. Is the image quality 50% better than the Thermion XP50? No way. But it's definitely better Is it really worth $2,500 more than the XP50? I say it depends on the person. Personality is really a big player in people forming that opinion. I know a ton of people who can't imagine using anything less than Trijicon or N-Vision and cost doesn't factor into that equation. Other people are looking for the best bang for the buck or the best image quality within a "reasonable" price. The problem is, everyone's definition of what is "reasonable", is different.

That's what's great, there are choices for everyone! From a $500 Sightmark Wraith to a $9,000 Trijicon MK3 60mm.

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Old 03-02-2020, 11:45 AM   #191
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If you want THE best on the market and know that there is literally nothing you can own any better, you have no choice to pick up something like a Halo LR or a Trijicon.
I'm happy to play devil's advocate to this. If all you care about is image quality, and you don't care about reticles, battery life, price, PIP, laser range-finding, recording, or streamability, then sure, pick up a Halo or a MK III. Image quality is literally the *only* thing they do better.

I have Halo LR money. I wouldn't buy one at HALF their asking price. The rest of the features I listed are all on my Trail XP50 LRF, and I love them way, way too much to walk away.
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Old 03-02-2020, 11:46 AM   #192
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Pulsars got a workout this weekend

New homemade battery packs worked flawlessly in all
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Old 03-02-2020, 01:17 PM   #193
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Pulsars got a workout this weekend

New homemade battery packs worked flawlessly in all
Please explain why you made a homemade battery pack for a pulsar?

Now thats a pile
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Old 03-02-2020, 02:43 PM   #194
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.... cause pulsar wants $130 for theirs and I made one for $19 that so far has gone 20 hours on a single charge and still going.... 1/4 the size and weight

But other than that no reason
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Old 03-02-2020, 04:15 PM   #195
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Yíall talking batteries and Iím waiting on sundown to see the new firmware update on how the XQ trails look


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Old 03-02-2020, 07:38 PM   #196
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Yíall talking batteries and Iím waiting on sundown to see the new firmware update on how the XQ trails look


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The XQís have an update? Guess I need to download it.
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Old 03-02-2020, 09:50 PM   #197
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Default The 2020 Thermal & Night Vision Thread

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The XQís have an update? Guess I need to download it.






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Old 03-02-2020, 10:11 PM   #198
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Sweet!
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Old 03-03-2020, 10:51 PM   #199
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How is the new firmware update?
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Old 03-04-2020, 05:53 AM   #200
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Does anyone know when Pulsar coming out with the Trail 2 series?

Last edited by TaDow; 03-04-2020 at 06:03 AM.
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