Equipment Guidelines For Trad

[RickBarbee]

I don't think TBoT is going to change the rule from "must shoot off the shelf" .

Bisch

Is TBoT not majority rule?

I would think, that if a vote were held on such things, and done in a manner that insured the majority of the members of being able cast their vote, that the rules would change to whatever the majority wanted.

Maybe I'm wrong.

Rick

[RickBarbee]

The way it's worded now it is not excluded from any of the classes.. marks are only excluded from the string.

Another good point, although markings on the bow have always been considered sights, and sights are disallowed except in the "Unlimited Class".

Editing now.

Well, it won't let me edit, so I'll do it this way:

6 - Unlimited

(A) Any Recurve, or Longbow.

(B) Any and all accessories are allowed except electronic sights and mechanical releases.

(C) Markings on the bow which can be used as sights are only allowed in this class.

I'll revise, and post a complete list with the edits included as we go along.

[Mike Javi Cooper]

I saw the NFAA nearly destroyed in '62 because some folks wanted to allow the use of sights on bows.. Wonder if this rest issue will end up doing the same for TBoT...

Just my opinion, but I don’t think changing the rule to allow rests is going to be a working solution, I’d rather see the addition of a single unlimited class to allow rests, and anything else y’all can dream up except sights and cams..

But probably the simplest solution is to hold a mail in ballot in the next newsletter. A simple yes or no question… Do you favor allowing the use of an adhesive backed rest which has no moving parts and uses no pressure buttons in the recurve and longbow classes?

Those who care either way will mail them in and those who could care less will not..

[Bisch]

Is TBoT not majority rule?

I would think, that if a vote were held on such things, and done in a manner that insured the majority of the members of being able cast their vote, that the rules would change to whatever the majority wanted.

Maybe I'm wrong.

Rick

I meant this year. I don't think we can keep flip-flopping. With how this has blown up it may be that a member vote gets taken and acted upon. We will see.

Bisch

[RickBarbee]

I meant this year. With how this has blown up it may be that a member vote gets taken and acted upon. We will see.

Bisch

Got ya.

I would never recommend changing the rules or guidelines mid season, and honestly I would not have wanted to change the acceptance (even though not written in) of the stick on elevated rests until next year.

I asked about the rest before, because I could see where there was a potential of being DQed at a TBoT shoot if I used one. I was told multiple times, that it didn't matter, and to use one if I wanted as long as it was a stick on. I was still uneasy about it, so I switched to the shelf rather than risking it. It really was a non issue for me as far as my shooting is concerned, because I can swing with either way just fine.

I also, can't see the rest issue as ever being a destructive topic such as the sight issue for NFAA. Two completely different sets of equipment influence in my opinion.

The only reasons I have concerns about the rests are - elevated rests have been around for both longbow, and recurve for longer than a lot of the rules makers have been alive.
I know, and understand that certain types of rests can be a huge advantage, and that is where (in my opinion) we need to draw the lines for the guidelines, but not turn our backs on them. Just don't seem right to me.

Lots of long time trad shooters have grown up using them, and I hate to see them ostracized for it.

Sights and stuff have been around for a very long time also, and that is why I am in favor of adding an "Unlimited" class, because I hate seeing those folks ostracized either.

Rick

[RickBarbee]

Javi, a mail in ballot is a great idea, but there could also be an online voting booth available for those with internet, and with the use of both you would insure a larger number of members participation in the voting.

[huntinpool]

Wonder if this rest issue will end up doing the same for TBoT...

..

I wondered what prompted the vote 2 yrs ago. Was their someone consistantly winning with one? Machined risers for hunting have taken off over the past few years and figure it must have been someone using one and winning with it. That was my first year shooting trad and I thought the stick-ons were for shooting vanes. More density on my part.

Rick, the rules look pretty good , well thought out and clear. Looks like with the input here they could be Very hard to mis-understand .

[moah]

good rules Rick one questiom is ASA going to add 5 more trade classes so they can follow them to

[RickBarbee]

good rules Rick one questiom is ASA going to add 5 more trade classes so they can follow them to

I can't speak for the ASA, because I have no idea what their plans for the future of the Trad shooters are.

(purely speculation to follow) - I would however suspect, that little to no change will be made at the Texas Federation ASA as long as the shoots are drawing no more than 10 - 12 Trad shooters per event.

If classes are to be added, then there is going to have to be a lot more participation from the Trad shooters at those events.

You have to consider that even 30 - 50 shooters in one class really isn't a large number.

If the interest is generated, and Trad participation reaches truly recognizable numbers, then yep - I would love to see classes added, and a similar rule set put into action.

Rick

[Mike Javi Cooper]

good rules Rick one questiom is ASA going to add 5 more trade classes so they can follow them to

I doubt it.. Although Mike Smith is great at keeping the shooters interest in mind, there just isn't the participation level to warrant changing the rules to accommodate more trad classes.

[Van/TX]

I saw the NFAA nearly destroyed in '62 because some folks wanted to allow the use of sights on bows.. Wonder if this rest issue will end up doing the same for TBoT....

Javi, I competed in the NFAA National tournament in '61 & '62. More shooters shot in the Freestyle (sight) class than in the Instinctive (Barebow). Maybe the year you are speaking of was '52 instead of '62? In any case the sight class in the 60's was a boost to the NFAA and not detrimental. I shot the Instinctive class because it was fun beating a lot of the sight shooters...Van

[Mike Javi Cooper]

Javi, I competed in the NFAA National tournament in '61 & '62. More shooters shot in the Freestyle (sight) class than in the Instinctive (Barebow). Maybe the year you are speaking of was '52 instead of '62? In any case the sight class in the 60's was a boost to the NFAA and not detrimental. I shot the Instinctive class because it was fun beating a lot of the sight shooters...Van

The president resigned and threw the NFAA out of his building over the sight issue.... remember that.. That's when they bought the building they just sold to move into Bruce's backyard...

[Van/TX]

BTW, Rick's Rules Rock...Van

[Van/TX]

Javi, there were sight issues in the '40s and '50s when the instinctors were having to shoot against them but not in the 60's when the classes were split between Freestyle and Instinctive. As I recall the Freestyle classes were larger than the Instinctive classes at State and National level when I competed in the late 50's to mid 60's timeframe...Van

[Mike Javi Cooper]

Javi, there were sight issues in the '40s and '50s when the instinctors were having to shoot against them but not in the 60's when the classes were split between Freestyle and Instinctive. As I recall the Freestyle classes were larger than the Instinctive classes at State and National level when I competed in the late 50's to mid 60's timeframe...Van

I started competing in '60 but I was only 11 at the time... here is a good article on the subject..

http://www.nfaa-archery.org/depot/history/214-2005919-History%20of%20the%20National%20Field%20Archery%20Association.pdf

It appears I disremembered the correct day or maybe '62 was when I heard it being talked about.. the kicking out of the offices was in '58 because of sights.. We still shot instinctive or off the point and unmarked yardage in '62 here in Waco I don't remember seeing a sight until '62 which might be why I thought it was that year..