Top 1%

[c3products20]

I started to post when I first saw your statement that the rich don't pay taxes, but I saw others challenged that. I WILL, however, ask you why you believe that.



I have also pondered why most of the top wealthiest vote Democrat. They obviously are capitalists, and the Demos usually support higher taxes. Please research that question and get back to us.

I'm not a economic master by any stretch but I do have a brain that I use from time to time.... In business, people don't do things to help anybody but themself. If they do, they don't stay in business very long! Ask anybody that's been in a corporate environment! Being nice is nice but it never gets you to the top. I started digging and it's interesting to see some trends. They make you wonder and you have to ask yourself some questions about what is really going on ... The biggest wealth transfer in human history is happening and we're just letting them do it!

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[Burnadell]

Sorry bud, but I think you are talking out of both sides of your mouth. Rich people's net worth increases at just about the same percentage as everyone else. If my net worth goes from $114,000 one year to $179,000 one year that is no different than Jeff Bezos going from $114B to $179B over the same time. It's just a percentage of what you started with.

The rich do pay taxes..a heck of a lot more than you or I do. My net worth and what I pay in income tax are totally different things though.

Now, the richest folks in the US do tend to lean liberal/democratic. If I had a billion dollars it probably wouldn't hurt as much to pay an extra $10M in taxes a year...if it gave me a warm and fuzzy to think I was helping the "poor man".

What you are missing is that it is about power. The rich should be able to spend their money any way they want....the same as you and I. It isn't their fault they have more to spend than we do. It's our fault for not having as much to spend as they do. Every one of those people listed above created or were part of creating a good/service that they were able to capitalize on.

You can't support the idea of free enterprise and capitalism and them complain about how the folks who were successful spend their money.....just like they don't have any say so on how you spend yours.

Yep!

These people got rich by taking risks and created their wealth while creating jobs.

[175gr7.62]

If US corporations receive a 5% tax increase, do you believe that Sam Walton's heirs pull 5% less profit from the business?

I'll tell you, they don't. They pass the tax increase onto the consumer in the form of increased cost of groceries/goods. That is the loop hole. Corporations pass tax increases on to consumers (you, me, and the rest of the middle class). Most of the ultra wealthy don't truly pay taxes (out of their pocket) and the ultra poor don't pay taxes. The middle class pays the majority of taxes either directly or indirectly.

I don't consider that a loop hole. If I am a home builder and OSB goes to $45/sheet (sound familiar) I'm not eating that cost increase. I'm passing thru that cost to my clients. We mark up materials and labor 20%. If my labor and material costs increase 5% I'm still marking it up 20%, at least until the market won't support the price I am charging. When that happens, we shut the doors. Why operate a business if you don't earn a profit?

[RR 314]

Yes it is. That increased tax $$$$ is not coming out of the landlord's pocket. The tenant is actually paying the $$$$. Do you really not see that the tenant is indirectly paying the tax? Landlord still making same profit. Tenant pays more.

Poor people are actually hurt by corporate tax increases. Not corporations.

That is NOT a loophole. . Of course the tenant is paying the tax. Still not a loophole.

[squirrel]

Some pretty big divorces in that group as well

[LWC]

For the record, Sam Walton's heirs don't pull any profit from WalMart. They are not employees. They own stock, just like other shareholders, so they only benefit from their stock values and the dividends that are paid to all stockholders.

I know they are shareholders. Same still applies. Walmart shareholders don't lose 5% if corp taxes go up 5%. Most if not all of that increase would be passed on to the consumer. Common folks voting for tax increases are ignorant. Billionaires voting for a party that increases taxes are doing it for ulterior motives. One of which was mentioned above....lining the pockets of sleazy politicians who can run their small business competitors out of the game.

[c3products20]

Sorry bud, but I think you are talking out of both sides of your mouth. Rich people's net worth increases at just about the same percentage as everyone else. If my net worth goes from $114,000 one year to $179,000 one year that is no different than Jeff Bezos going from $114B to $179B over the same time. It's just a percentage of what you started with.

The rich do pay taxes..a heck of a lot more than you or I do. My net worth and what I pay in income tax are totally different things though.

Now, the richest folks in the US do tend to lean liberal/democratic. If I had a billion dollars it probably wouldn't hurt as much to pay an extra $10M in taxes a year...if it gave me a warm and fuzzy to think I was helping the "poor man".

What you are missing is that it is about power. The rich should be able to spend their money any way they want....the same as you and I. It isn't their fault they have more to spend than we do. It's our fault for not having as much to spend as they do. Every one of those people listed above created or were part of creating a good/service that they were able to capitalize on.

You can't support the idea of free enterprise and capitalism and them complain about how the folks who were successful spend their money.....just like they don't have any say so on how you spend yours.

So these people are willingly putting people in power so they can pay more taxes? And they justify it by saying they can afford it because they are rich? Then why are people fleeing new York and California by the thousands???? Why are they fleeing democratic run states to republican run states? Because they are the middle to upper class in their states and the fiscal burden has become too much for them to handle! Pretty soon there's only going to be the extremely rich and extremely poor left in those two states.....

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[c3products20]

Yep!

These people got rich by taking risks and created their wealth while creating jobs.

And they are just going to give more of their money away because they can afford it???

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[LWC]

I don't consider that a loop hole. If I am a home builder and OSB goes to $45/sheet (sound familiar) I'm not eating that cost increase. I'm passing thru that cost to my clients. We mark up materials and labor 20%. If my labor and material costs increase 5% I'm still marking it up 20%, at least until the market won't support the price I am charging. When that happens, we shut the doors. Why operate a business if you don't earn a profit?

Call it a loophole or whatever you want. When taxes increase, the rich don't take the hit or pay it out of their pocket. It ultimately gets passed onto the middle class or consumer.

[DEADEYE1]

Business

I'm not a economic master by any stretch but I do have a brain that I use from time to time.... In business, people don't do things to help anybody but themself. If they do, they don't stay in business very long! Ask anybody that's been in a corporate environment! Being nice is nice but it never gets you to the top. I started digging and it's interesting to see some trends. They make you wonder and you have to ask yourself some questions about what is really going on ... The biggest wealth transfer in human history is happening and we're just letting them do it!

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I disagree with you on people don't do anything to help other people. I pay 100% of health insurance for all my employees. I also give away 50% of the profits to the employees. My insurance cost has tripled in the last 10 years , if that means anything. I have never asked the employees for 1 dime of it either.
We have been in business since 1988 and I have never had 1 employee leave me
There is some good people in this world you just have to search for them sometimes

[LWC]

That is NOT a loophole. . Of course the tenant is paying the tax. Still not a loophole.

Call it what you will. You asked where the "indirect loopholes" are. If passing the tax burden on to the consumer is not an "indirect loophole", then call it something else. But it functions the same.

[DEADEYE1]

Taxes

Yep!

These people got rich by taking risks and created their wealth while creating jobs.

Exactly

[c3products20]

I disagree with you on people don't do anything to help other people. I pay 100% of health insurance for all my employees. I also give away 50% of the profits to the employees. My insurance cost has tripled in the last 10 years , if that means anything. I have never asked the employees for 1 dime of it either.

We have been in business since 1988 and I have never had 1 employee leave me

There is some good people in this world you just have to search for them sometimes

You are also doing that as an investment in your company not just a benefit for your employees.... I'm not knocking you, that's an awesome business model, but there's a ton of reasons why your business benefits from giving your employees the benefits. One of them being happy employees who do a better job because they are loyal. When it benefits start being more in favor of your employees than in favor of the company you would have to scale back on the benefits or ultimately go under. For example; why not give the employees 80% of the profits?

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[rvd]

Sorry bud, but I think you are talking out of both sides of your mouth. Rich people's net worth increases at just about the same percentage as everyone else. If my net worth goes from $114,000 one year to $179,000 one year that is no different than Jeff Bezos going from $114B to $179B over the same time. It's just a percentage of what you started with.

The rich do pay taxes..a heck of a lot more than you or I do. My net worth and what I pay in income tax are totally different things though.

Now, the richest folks in the US do tend to lean liberal/democratic. If I had a billion dollars it probably wouldn't hurt as much to pay an extra $10M in taxes a year...if it gave me a warm and fuzzy to think I was helping the "poor man".

What you are missing is that it is about power. The rich should be able to spend their money any way they want....the same as you and I. It isn't their fault they have more to spend than we do. It's our fault for not having as much to spend as they do. Every one of those people listed above created or were part of creating a good/service that they were able to capitalize on.

You can't support the idea of free enterprise and capitalism and them complain about how the folks who were successful spend their money.....just like they don't have any say so on how you spend yours.

Winner!

[175gr7.62]

So these people are willingly putting people in power so they can pay more taxes? And they justify it by saying they can afford it because they are rich? Then why are people fleeing new York and California by the thousands???? Why are they fleeing democratic run states to republican run states? Because they are the middle to upper class in their states and the fiscal burden has become too much for them to handle! Pretty soon there's only going to be the extremely rich and extremely poor left in those two states.....

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I think you have to define what "rich" is. I'll fight tooth and nail to keep my taxes from going up. An extra $2-3k a year in taxes hurts me a whole lot more on a $200k household income than an extra $10M a year on $1B. Bill Gates is not stupid and isn't throwing money away but he can afford to be a philanthropist. I don't begrudge them for having more than they could possibly spend in 100 lifetimes though. They just operate on different economies of scale.

If you take half of my $200k a year, I'll be up spit creek. If you take half of my $10B I'm still stupid rich and will still be buying my $100M yacht next year. Different strokes for different folks.