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    #46
    Originally posted by ACCURACYINC View Post
    Deca for 3 or 4 years straight???? Or just here and there? That stuff does not do me any favors below the waist!!!! Yikes! Deca is a muscle hardener. Winstrol is a leaner.


    Deca **** lol. Back in the day we would always run test with deca or youd be numb down there. Deca would add mass like massive amounts quickly. What use other than bodybuilding does deca serve for men?


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      #47
      Originally posted by Hunter Dan View Post
      This for sure!

      I have been on Test for 10 years and I work out 5 or 6 days a week. My test level were so low that I was always tired and my quality of life was suffering. You have to balance the test however because if I take too much I get on edge and a little crazy and if I don't take enough I get tired and depressed. I have gotten really good at balancing it on my own and if I know my levels are getting too high I skip a shot and up my shot if they get too low. I have also been doing Deca for the last 3 or 4 years and that helps me stay lean.

      You have to take a good estrogen blocker like anastrezol (spelled wrong) or something so that you do not get glynoclamastia or other side effects.
      Your not very smart. Deca is a weight gaining steroid.

      Winstrol will lean you out. No need for an adult to be on either of those steroids as they are not healthy.

      DECA for 3-4 years? Wow you wont make 60 lol.

      Know many athletes who took winny or deca. My brother took deca and gained 25 lbs on an under 5'11 frame. Face got fat as heck. They both have bad side effects, especially with 3-4 years of use
      Last edited by gingib; 08-11-2017, 11:00 AM.

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        #48
        Originally posted by quarterback View Post
        GARR you brought up an entirely different subject. How old is your wife? What kinds of hormones is she getting with the pellets? How long has she been doing this kind of treatment?

        What is the ongoing cost for weekly injections now that you're on a regular treatment schedule? You said your initial count was 170. What is it now that you receive these regular injections? Thanks in advance. I need to do something.

        My wife will be 50 this month, and she also gets testosterone pellet(s), depending on blood test results. She takes a higher dose than her weight calls for, but that is the value of this type treatment. Normally, it is a one size fits all treatment for women. This is specifically tailored to her and her body. Cost for her pellets is $300 a quarter, or $1200 annually, and i would pay a lot more than that for them! It has helped her tremendously over the past 5 years in all aspects of life. Biote pellets by the way.

        I stay around the high 700's to low 800's with injections. First round of pellets I was a tad over the 1000 mark. Pellets cost more, and most insurance providers won't cover them unless they have some type of pharmaceutical component included, but for men, it is a biannual treatment, which is much better than a weekly shot. Right now, I pay $15 a week for the shots, or $60 a month. I do them at home, so no dr visit or visit to a T clinic. They are easy to give yourself, unless you have a thing with needles.

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          #49
          Originally posted by gingib View Post
          Your not very smart. Deca is a weight gaining steroid.

          Winstrol will lean you out. No need for an adult to be on either of those steroids as they are not healthy.

          DECA for 3-4 years? Wow you wont make 60 lol.

          Know many athletes who took winny or deca. My brother took deca and gained 25 lbs on an under 5'11 frame. Face got fat as heck. They both have bad side effects, especially with 3-4 years of use
          Deca can cause bloating for those that are not strict on diet and exercise but for me it helped me increase muscle mass and eliminate a small amount of belly fat. I am on low maintenance levels of test and deca and do not have to cycle on and off like I would if I was on higher levels. I stay on top of all my levels and get blood work done every 3 months, and I donate blood every 2 months. It is not for everyone but works for me.

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            #50
            So I just turned 40. I have gained weight over the years but here lately I find myself tired and just not motivated to work out. Also the old sex drive has gone down a bit. It sounds like my testosterone has gone down. My girlfriend and I have discussed having kids in the next couple of years. How will this effect that? What is the best option for all of this? There is a Low T center here in San Antonio, should I go there or my primary physician? Thanks for any advice or help.


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              #51
              Originally posted by rattler7696 View Post
              So I just turned 40. I have gained weight over the years but here lately I find myself tired and just not motivated to work out. Also the old sex drive has gone down a bit. It sounds like my testosterone has gone down. My girlfriend and I have discussed having kids in the next couple of years. How will this effect that? What is the best option for all of this? There is a Low T center here in San Antonio, should I go there or my primary physician? Thanks for any advice or help.


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              PM Inbound buddy!

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                #52
                Originally posted by rattler7696 View Post
                So I just turned 40. I have gained weight over the years but here lately I find myself tired and just not motivated to work out. Also the old sex drive has gone down a bit. It sounds like my testosterone has gone down. My girlfriend and I have discussed having kids in the next couple of years. How will this effect that? What is the best option for all of this? There is a Low T center here in San Antonio, should I go there or my primary physician? Thanks for any advice or help.


                Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro
                I've done both( low T and the doctor) and for me I have to admit that the doctor was a better option. At the low T that I went to they kept increasing the dosage ( the highest it ever got was 1.5 cc a week). I felt great but my test went off the chart. ( also got back into working out at the time). The doctor had me starting at 1 cc and actually back it off to .5 cc on my second check. Now, the girls at low T were much cuter than my wife who gives me my shots ( sorry) so that was a plus. Also, through my doctor my insurance covers more of the cost. Winner!

                Comment


                  #53
                  Testosterone Therapy

                  Originally posted by rattler7696 View Post
                  So I just turned 40. I have gained weight over the years but here lately I find myself tired and just not motivated to work out. Also the old sex drive has gone down a bit. It sounds like my testosterone has gone down. My girlfriend and I have discussed having kids in the next couple of years. How will this effect that? What is the best option for all of this? There is a Low T center here in San Antonio, should I go there or my primary physician? Thanks for any advice or help.


                  Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro


                  Im in the same boat as you but a tad younger. My test just dropped off one day for no good reason. TRT would be best for me but we are trying for children. Dr put me on Clomid. Steroid users use it post cycle to recover from hormone shut down after a heavy cycle. It triggers your body to produce its own test. It can get your levels up but it doesnt fix things like TRT or naturally produced test would. But it doesnt affect sperm production.

                  Its better than nothing.


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                    #54
                    Originally posted by J Sweet View Post
                    Im in the same boat as you but a tad younger. My test just dropped off one day for no good reason. TRT would be best for me but we are trying for children. Dr put me on Clomid. Steroid users use it post cycle to recover from hormone shut down after a heavy cycle. It triggers your body to produce its own test. It can get your levels up but it doesnt fix things like TRT or naturally produced test would. But it doesnt affect sperm production.

                    Its better than nothing.


                    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
                    This is my current situation with Clomid, 1 daily doubled my initial Test and have now leveled off around 544, I jokingly asked my Dr (the best in San Antonio) if we could inch that up a bit with out sacrificing my swimmers. So I am on a 1 and 1/2 clomid daily for 8 weeks then going in for a recheck to make sure my levels haven't gone haywire.

                    Comment


                      #55
                      Testosterone Therapy

                      Originally posted by .270 View Post
                      This is my current situation with Clomid, 1 daily doubled my initial Test and have now leveled off around 544, I jokingly asked my Dr (the best in San Antonio) if we could inch that up a bit with out sacrificing my swimmers. So I am on a 1 and 1/2 clomid daily for 8 weeks then going in for a recheck to make sure my levels haven't gone haywire.


                      I am supposed to take 1 x50mg every other day but I do half of one every other day as it works better that way for me. It raises my est levels which is counterintuitive to test so symptoms of low T still persist. But my mood at least is alot better. My Dr says TRT would fix everything. My way I can sit around 650 but still have many symptoms.


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                        #56
                        A couple of things to note that I have not seen mentioned. I just finished doing a graduate level literature review on Intermittent Fasting. And in my search through scientific journals, 2 things stood out.

                        1. Males on an 16/8 Intermittent Fasting diet, and lifting weights 3 x day showed very favorable results in terms of body composition, HOWEVER their testosterone and IGF-1 anabolic hormones plummeted!!!!

                        Background Intermittent fasting (IF) is an increasingly popular dietary approach used for weight loss and overall health. While there is an increasing body of evidence demonstrating beneficial effects of IF on blood lipids and other health outcomes in the overweight and obese, limited data are available about the effect of IF in athletes. Thus, the present study sought to investigate the effects of a modified IF protocol (i.e. time-restricted feeding) during resistance training in healthy resistance-trained males. Methods Thirty-four resistance-trained males were randomly assigned to time-restricted feeding (TRF) or normal diet group (ND). TRF subjects consumed 100 % of their energy needs in an 8-h period of time each day, with their caloric intake divided into three meals consumed at 1 p.m., 4 p.m., and 8 p.m. The remaining 16 h per 24-h period made up the fasting period. Subjects in the ND group consumed 100 % of their energy needs divided into three meals consumed at 8 a.m., 1 p.m., and 8 p.m. Groups were matched for kilocalories consumed and macronutrient distribution (TRF 2826 ± 412.3 kcal/day, carbohydrates 53.2 ± 1.4 %, fat 24.7 ± 3.1 %, protein 22.1 ± 2.6 %, ND 3007 ± 444.7 kcal/day, carbohydrates 54.7 ± 2.2 %, fat 23.9 ± 3.5 %, protein 21.4 ± 1.8). Subjects were tested before and after 8 weeks of the assigned diet and standardized resistance training program. Fat mass and fat-free mass were assessed by dual-energy x-ray absorptiometry and muscle area of the thigh and arm were measured using an anthropometric system. Total and free testosterone, insulin-like growth factor 1, blood glucose, insulin, adiponectin, leptin, triiodothyronine, thyroid stimulating hormone, interleukin-6, interleukin-1β, tumor necrosis factor α, total cholesterol, high-density lipoprotein cholesterol, low-density lipoprotein cholesterol, and triglycerides were measured. Bench press and leg press maximal strength, resting energy expenditure, and respiratory ratio were also tested. Results After 8 weeks, the 2 Way ANOVA (Time * Diet interaction) showed a decrease in fat mass in TRF compared to ND (p = 0.0448), while fat-free mass, muscle area of the arm and thigh, and maximal strength were maintained in both groups. Testosterone and insulin-like growth factor 1 decreased significantly in TRF, with no changes in ND (p = 0.0476; p = 0.0397). Adiponectin increased (p = 0.0000) in TRF while total leptin decreased (p = 0.0001), although not when adjusted for fat mass. Triiodothyronine decreased in TRF, but no significant changes were detected in thyroid-stimulating hormone, total cholesterol, high-density lipoprotein, low-density lipoprotein, or triglycerides. Resting energy expenditure was unchanged, but a significant decrease in respiratory ratio was observed in the TRF group. Conclusions Our results suggest that an intermittent fasting program in which all calories are consumed in an 8-h window each day, in conjunction with resistance training, could improve some health-related biomarkers, decrease fat mass, and maintain muscle mass in resistance-trained males.


                        "Total testosterone and IGF-1 decreased significantly in TRF after 8 weeks while no significant differences were detected in ND (normal diet)"



                        2. High Intensity Exercise has been shown to INCREASE testosterone in previously sedentary males.

                        As the impact of high-intensity interval training (HIIT) on systemic hormones in aging men is unstudied to date, we investigated whether total testosterone (TT), sex hormone-binding globulin (SHBG), free testosterone (free-T) and cortisol (all in serum) were altered following HIIT in a cohort of 22 lifelong sedentary (62 ± 2 years) older men. As HIIT requires preconditioning exercise in sedentary cohorts, participants were tested at three phases, each separated by six-week training; baseline (phase A), following conditioning exercise (phase B) and post-HIIT (phase C). Each measurement phase used identical methods. TT was significantly increased following HIIT (~17%; P < 0.001) with most increase occurring during preconditioning (~10%; P = 0.007). Free-T was unaffected by conditioning exercise (P = 0.102) but was significantly higher following HIIT compared to baseline (~4.5%; P = 0.023). Cortisol remained unchanged from A to C (P = 0.138). The present data indicate a combination of preconditioning, and HIIT increases TT and SHBG in sedentary older males, with the HIIT stimulus accounting for a small but statistically significant increase in free-T. Further study is required to determine the biological importance of small improvements in free-T in aging men.


                        "The present data indicate a combination of preconditioning, and HIIT increases TT and SHBG in sedentary older males, with the HIIT stimulus accounting for a small but statistically significant increase in free-T."


                        So, if you want to help your Test levels, get on a High Intensity Exercise program.
                        Last edited by .270; 08-11-2017, 01:26 PM.

                        Comment


                          #57
                          Side effects for me are a little acne and increase in body hair growth. Started off with T level in the low 200's. With 100 mg weekly it went up to 320's. Now on 200 mg week. Last check T was upper 600's. BP is remaining normal. Cholesterol has had no change. Benefits are it's like being a 16 yo again. Wake up and Joey is already up making flap Jacks. Lifts in the gym have improved as well. I also sleep better ,with CPAP which I started 1 year before T use.

                          Comment


                            #58
                            Originally posted by .270 View Post
                            A couple of things to note that I have not seen mentioned. I just finished doing a graduate level research paper investigating Intermittent Fasting. And in my search through scientific journals, 2 things stood out.

                            1. Males on an 16/8 Intermittent Fasting diet, and lifting weights 3 x day showed very favorable results in terms of body composition, HOWEVER their testosterone and IGF-1 anabolic hormones plummeted!!!!

                            Background Intermittent fasting (IF) is an increasingly popular dietary approach used for weight loss and overall health. While there is an increasing body of evidence demonstrating beneficial effects of IF on blood lipids and other health outcomes in the overweight and obese, limited data are available about the effect of IF in athletes. Thus, the present study sought to investigate the effects of a modified IF protocol (i.e. time-restricted feeding) during resistance training in healthy resistance-trained males. Methods Thirty-four resistance-trained males were randomly assigned to time-restricted feeding (TRF) or normal diet group (ND). TRF subjects consumed 100 % of their energy needs in an 8-h period of time each day, with their caloric intake divided into three meals consumed at 1 p.m., 4 p.m., and 8 p.m. The remaining 16 h per 24-h period made up the fasting period. Subjects in the ND group consumed 100 % of their energy needs divided into three meals consumed at 8 a.m., 1 p.m., and 8 p.m. Groups were matched for kilocalories consumed and macronutrient distribution (TRF 2826 ± 412.3 kcal/day, carbohydrates 53.2 ± 1.4 %, fat 24.7 ± 3.1 %, protein 22.1 ± 2.6 %, ND 3007 ± 444.7 kcal/day, carbohydrates 54.7 ± 2.2 %, fat 23.9 ± 3.5 %, protein 21.4 ± 1.8). Subjects were tested before and after 8 weeks of the assigned diet and standardized resistance training program. Fat mass and fat-free mass were assessed by dual-energy x-ray absorptiometry and muscle area of the thigh and arm were measured using an anthropometric system. Total and free testosterone, insulin-like growth factor 1, blood glucose, insulin, adiponectin, leptin, triiodothyronine, thyroid stimulating hormone, interleukin-6, interleukin-1β, tumor necrosis factor α, total cholesterol, high-density lipoprotein cholesterol, low-density lipoprotein cholesterol, and triglycerides were measured. Bench press and leg press maximal strength, resting energy expenditure, and respiratory ratio were also tested. Results After 8 weeks, the 2 Way ANOVA (Time * Diet interaction) showed a decrease in fat mass in TRF compared to ND (p = 0.0448), while fat-free mass, muscle area of the arm and thigh, and maximal strength were maintained in both groups. Testosterone and insulin-like growth factor 1 decreased significantly in TRF, with no changes in ND (p = 0.0476; p = 0.0397). Adiponectin increased (p = 0.0000) in TRF while total leptin decreased (p = 0.0001), although not when adjusted for fat mass. Triiodothyronine decreased in TRF, but no significant changes were detected in thyroid-stimulating hormone, total cholesterol, high-density lipoprotein, low-density lipoprotein, or triglycerides. Resting energy expenditure was unchanged, but a significant decrease in respiratory ratio was observed in the TRF group. Conclusions Our results suggest that an intermittent fasting program in which all calories are consumed in an 8-h window each day, in conjunction with resistance training, could improve some health-related biomarkers, decrease fat mass, and maintain muscle mass in resistance-trained males.


                            "Total testosterone and IGF-1 decreased significantly in TRF after 8 weeks while no significant differences were detected in ND (normal diet)"



                            2. High Intensity Exercise has been shown to INCREASE testosterone in previously sedentary males.

                            As the impact of high-intensity interval training (HIIT) on systemic hormones in aging men is unstudied to date, we investigated whether total testosterone (TT), sex hormone-binding globulin (SHBG), free testosterone (free-T) and cortisol (all in serum) were altered following HIIT in a cohort of 22 lifelong sedentary (62 ± 2 years) older men. As HIIT requires preconditioning exercise in sedentary cohorts, participants were tested at three phases, each separated by six-week training; baseline (phase A), following conditioning exercise (phase B) and post-HIIT (phase C). Each measurement phase used identical methods. TT was significantly increased following HIIT (~17%; P < 0.001) with most increase occurring during preconditioning (~10%; P = 0.007). Free-T was unaffected by conditioning exercise (P = 0.102) but was significantly higher following HIIT compared to baseline (~4.5%; P = 0.023). Cortisol remained unchanged from A to C (P = 0.138). The present data indicate a combination of preconditioning, and HIIT increases TT and SHBG in sedentary older males, with the HIIT stimulus accounting for a small but statistically significant increase in free-T. Further study is required to determine the biological importance of small improvements in free-T in aging men.


                            "The present data indicate a combination of preconditioning, and HIIT increases TT and SHBG in sedentary older males, with the HIIT stimulus accounting for a small but statistically significant increase in free-T."


                            So, if you want to help your Test levels, get on a High Intensity Exercise program.

                            Very good points as well. IIRC, low fat diets also cause your T levels to drop.

                            Comment


                              #59
                              Originally posted by .270 View Post
                              A couple of things to note that I have not seen mentioned. I just finished doing a graduate level literature review on Intermittent Fasting. And in my search through scientific journals, 2 things stood out.

                              1. Males on an 16/8 Intermittent Fasting diet, and lifting weights 3 x day showed very favorable results in terms of body composition, HOWEVER their testosterone and IGF-1 anabolic hormones plummeted!!!!

                              Background Intermittent fasting (IF) is an increasingly popular dietary approach used for weight loss and overall health. While there is an increasing body of evidence demonstrating beneficial effects of IF on blood lipids and other health outcomes in the overweight and obese, limited data are available about the effect of IF in athletes. Thus, the present study sought to investigate the effects of a modified IF protocol (i.e. time-restricted feeding) during resistance training in healthy resistance-trained males. Methods Thirty-four resistance-trained males were randomly assigned to time-restricted feeding (TRF) or normal diet group (ND). TRF subjects consumed 100 % of their energy needs in an 8-h period of time each day, with their caloric intake divided into three meals consumed at 1 p.m., 4 p.m., and 8 p.m. The remaining 16 h per 24-h period made up the fasting period. Subjects in the ND group consumed 100 % of their energy needs divided into three meals consumed at 8 a.m., 1 p.m., and 8 p.m. Groups were matched for kilocalories consumed and macronutrient distribution (TRF 2826 ± 412.3 kcal/day, carbohydrates 53.2 ± 1.4 %, fat 24.7 ± 3.1 %, protein 22.1 ± 2.6 %, ND 3007 ± 444.7 kcal/day, carbohydrates 54.7 ± 2.2 %, fat 23.9 ± 3.5 %, protein 21.4 ± 1.8). Subjects were tested before and after 8 weeks of the assigned diet and standardized resistance training program. Fat mass and fat-free mass were assessed by dual-energy x-ray absorptiometry and muscle area of the thigh and arm were measured using an anthropometric system. Total and free testosterone, insulin-like growth factor 1, blood glucose, insulin, adiponectin, leptin, triiodothyronine, thyroid stimulating hormone, interleukin-6, interleukin-1β, tumor necrosis factor α, total cholesterol, high-density lipoprotein cholesterol, low-density lipoprotein cholesterol, and triglycerides were measured. Bench press and leg press maximal strength, resting energy expenditure, and respiratory ratio were also tested. Results After 8 weeks, the 2 Way ANOVA (Time * Diet interaction) showed a decrease in fat mass in TRF compared to ND (p = 0.0448), while fat-free mass, muscle area of the arm and thigh, and maximal strength were maintained in both groups. Testosterone and insulin-like growth factor 1 decreased significantly in TRF, with no changes in ND (p = 0.0476; p = 0.0397). Adiponectin increased (p = 0.0000) in TRF while total leptin decreased (p = 0.0001), although not when adjusted for fat mass. Triiodothyronine decreased in TRF, but no significant changes were detected in thyroid-stimulating hormone, total cholesterol, high-density lipoprotein, low-density lipoprotein, or triglycerides. Resting energy expenditure was unchanged, but a significant decrease in respiratory ratio was observed in the TRF group. Conclusions Our results suggest that an intermittent fasting program in which all calories are consumed in an 8-h window each day, in conjunction with resistance training, could improve some health-related biomarkers, decrease fat mass, and maintain muscle mass in resistance-trained males.


                              "Total testosterone and IGF-1 decreased significantly in TRF after 8 weeks while no significant differences were detected in ND (normal diet)"



                              2. High Intensity Exercise has been shown to INCREASE testosterone in previously sedentary males.

                              As the impact of high-intensity interval training (HIIT) on systemic hormones in aging men is unstudied to date, we investigated whether total testosterone (TT), sex hormone-binding globulin (SHBG), free testosterone (free-T) and cortisol (all in serum) were altered following HIIT in a cohort of 22 lifelong sedentary (62 ± 2 years) older men. As HIIT requires preconditioning exercise in sedentary cohorts, participants were tested at three phases, each separated by six-week training; baseline (phase A), following conditioning exercise (phase B) and post-HIIT (phase C). Each measurement phase used identical methods. TT was significantly increased following HIIT (~17%; P < 0.001) with most increase occurring during preconditioning (~10%; P = 0.007). Free-T was unaffected by conditioning exercise (P = 0.102) but was significantly higher following HIIT compared to baseline (~4.5%; P = 0.023). Cortisol remained unchanged from A to C (P = 0.138). The present data indicate a combination of preconditioning, and HIIT increases TT and SHBG in sedentary older males, with the HIIT stimulus accounting for a small but statistically significant increase in free-T. Further study is required to determine the biological importance of small improvements in free-T in aging men.


                              "The present data indicate a combination of preconditioning, and HIIT increases TT and SHBG in sedentary older males, with the HIIT stimulus accounting for a small but statistically significant increase in free-T."


                              So, if you want to help your Test levels, get on a High Intensity Exercise program.


                              HIT helps my symptoms greatly.


                              Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

                              Comment


                                #60
                                Having been on TRT for a number of years, I went from Androgel to Striant to injections with testosterone cypionate. The every two weeks injection is way more effective for me than the gel or the Striant (absorbs through the gums).

                                Regardless of method of TRT, it's critical to periodically have bloodwork done. Too high testosterone can thicken the blood (not good). Too high testosterone can cause excess testosterone to convert to estrogen. Too high estrogen is not good either.

                                Currently, I buy the testosterone and the nurse at the Dr office injects it.

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