Let's be honest

[DRT]

This great nation was founded to free ourselves from the tyranny of the king of England. However the king considered the rebels/terrorists/ anarchists to be enemies of the throne. We burned out the homes of and hung loyalists to the crown. We waged war against his army. And when they finally decided the cost of the conflict was more than they were willing to pay as they simultaneously fought the French, they gave up the American colonies.
Then we went on to spread westward and as we did we decimated game herds, committed genocide of the native Americans using any means we could including intentionally infecting the with deadly diseases and poisoning. Then we used the same tactics we used in the revolutionary war to violently overthrow the Mexican government's control over much of what is now.the southwest US.
But the greed and cruelty didn't end there. We had rich men who enslaved men in order to have big production plantations, stole from and killed settlers to run railroads and used underpaid migrant workers to accomplish these things all the while the rich and powerful got more rich and powerful.

These are facts. While most of us just get up in the morning, go to work and want to live in peace the greed and violence continues both sanctioned and illegally.
Although I cannot for the life of me understand why who is to blame for what happened back then means diddly squat now I can see that those peoples whom were victimized might could be angry.
If your dad's new wife manipulated him out of your inheritance you'd be ******. If your ex wife took your kids away and they could never see you again they might be hurt and angry.

So since our nation was founded and built by all of these kind hearted, generous and people who were fair and equitable, gentle and giving in all that they did (yes sarcasm), why does it surprise anyone that the violence we see today and the lack of conscience by people in power is what it is?
That's what got us this far. Why would it change?

Gary

[flywise]

Your description of the events of our founding left out ONE major reality.
Every human society has done all those things. It is not uniquely American and extremely weak excuse to try and lay it all at the feet of our ancestors. Red men butchered red men and enslaved red men long before white men. Mexicans killed other men, Africans traded slaves and killed millions of other Africans. Fact is the WORLD is a better place because of those who tamed this land and created our industry. The actions of today are in no way an example Of Our history.

[LWC]

Your description of the events of our founding left out ONE major reality.
Every human society has done all those things. It is not uniquely American and extremely weak excuse to try and lay it all at the feet of our ancestors. Red men butchered red men and enslaved red men long before white men. Mexicans killed other men, Africans traded slaves and killed millions of other Africans. Fact is the WORLD is a better place because of those who tamed this land and created our industry. The actions of today are in no way an example Of Our history.

Well said. I wonder what the world would look like today if the US never existed?

[Let's go Brandon!]

Well said. I wonder what the world would look like today if the US never existed?

Pan Em comes to mind.

[RattlesnakeDan]

Life is certainly about how you see it. This nation was also founded by great men doing great things in the name of the Almighty God , but to focus on things that go bad is horrible way to perceive life. The bible says that you can choose death or you can choose life and then He gives the correct answer...choose life!
The tongue is a powerful tool and like a rudder on a ship it may be small but it steers the entire vessel in the direction it is going to go.

[DRT]

Oh world conquest is as human as it gets. But so is selfish manipulation and violence.
Exactly what I expect out of politicians and anarchists.
We will always have this because it is human nature.

Gary

[DRT]

And I disagree about the world being a better place. I think this continent was better wild and free and whites were across the pond.

Gary

[MadHatter]

And I disagree about the world being a better place. I think this continent was better wild and free and whites were across the pond.

Gary

You bet it was .
Wev'e done nothing beneficial to this continent for sure.
But, had we not, it would have been the Russians, Chinese, or whoever made it first.
So it's better to kill em in the name of God, than Allah .

[Throwin Darts]

And I disagree about the world being a better place. I think this continent was better wild and free and whites were across the pond.

Gary

You have a boat? C-ya!

[hpdrifter]

And I disagree about the world being a better place. I think this continent was better wild and free and whites were across the pond.

Gary

You that old?

[DRT]

Most white people refuse to acknowledge the genocide of the native American peoples is on par with Hitler's genocide of the Jewish people. Maybe different motives but it was systematic and driven by government and individuals.
That is is in the past and no one alive today is responsible for the actions of their ancestors.
Still it's enlightening to see the responses because they either are denials or excuses/rationalizations.
The reality is our politicians do what they do to gain and retain wealth and power. The rich take their manufacturing and production elsewhere to increase profits and maintain low costs because we want high wages and benefits and cheap comorbidities.
It's a viscous cycle. We will never abandon it and we will only be saved from it when Jesus comes again and brings judgement on the earth.


Gary

[DRT]

You that old?

56. But I love the few truly wild places that are left and they are disappearing fast.

Gary

[SaltwaterSlick]

Most white people refuse to acknowledge the genocide of the native American peoples is on par with Hitler's genocide of the Jewish people. Maybe different motives but it was systematic and driven by government and individuals.
That is is in the past and no one alive today is responsible for the actions of their ancestors.
Still it's enlightening to see the responses because they either are denials or excuses/rationalizations.
The reality is our politicians do what they do to gain and retain wealth and power. The rich take their manufacturing and production elsewhere to increase profits and maintain low costs because we want high wages and benefits and cheap comorbidities.
It's a viscous cycle. We will never abandon it and we will only be saved from it when Jesus comes again and brings judgement on the earth.
Gary

Well Gary, there is president for it... I mean God Himself promised Abraham a land flowing with milk and honey... He led Israel through Moses, Joshua, and others to obliterate the inhabitants from the lands of Canaan to give it to the Israelite's... Not saying it is right or not, but It sure ain't a new concept. As it is, we are here now and it is up to us to be good stewards of all the we have been provided... to me that does not mean lay down arms and surrender. Not sure how all this will turn out, but I do not plan to be among the "victims", nor be one of those "left behind".

[Gunnyart]

This country has a long history of attempting to right the wrongs of the past.
(not denying there were plenty of wrongs to be righted)
We we're the only country in the history of the planet to codify the principle of individual liberty and to limit the power of the government not the other way around.
(It took a civil war and the sacrifice of over 600k lives to begin to establish that principle as a reality.)

Just some examples:

1863 Emancipation Proclamation
1865 13th Amendment
Civil Rights Act of 1866 and 1871
The Enforcement Act of 1870
The Force Act of 1871
Grant sent soldiers to suppress the KKK in SC
The KKK Act and Civil Rights Act of 1875
1868 14th Amendment Ratified
1870 15th Amendment
1953 Eisenhower eliminated discrimination in Govt. contracting
1954 Brown v. Board of Education
1957 Civil Rights Act of 1957
1957 Eisenhower sent soldiers to protect students in AR
1957 & 1959 Eisenhower ordered desegregation of public schools
1962 Bailey v. Patterson
1962 Kennedy federalized the National Guard to allow black student to enroll at the University of Mississippi
1964 Civil Rights Act of 1964
1965 Voting Rights Act of 1965
1965 Johnson federalized the National Guard to protect civil rights marches from Selma, AL
1967 Loving v. Virginia (interracial marriage bans ruled unconstitutional)


I'm sure you're right that the only solution to the humanity and sin problem will be his imminent return, but God has blessed this country tremendously and I wouldn't want to live anywhere else.

[LWC]

56. But I love the few truly wild places that are left and they are disappearing fast.

Gary

I guess I don't get where you are coming from. I think everyone on TBH feels the same about wild places. But why the Obama apology tour? Did some bad things happen during the establishment of our country? Yes, but most of the same things happen with the establishment of every country in the history of world. People fight and die for land. It is a fact. If you are not strong enough, or have strong enough allies, someone stronger will take it from you. Our country has turned out to be one of, if not the greatest ever. Not perfect by a long shot but way better than most. Do you think North America would be a better place had we not settled this land and another country did?