Question for those who still watch NFL

[LWC]

How about this hit on Campbell from your boys. lol


https://youtu.be/2yAnTm3338E

Don't do that. I got stuck watching Earl highlights for 10 minutes

[LWC]

Gotta love how folks pivot to their political talking points and counterpoints to try to prove something that clearly does exist doesn't. Call it what you will - racism, systemic racism, implicit bias or whatever - it does exist and the impact is real, albeit difficult to measure.

One of my closest friends is a strong Christian, hardcore conservative Republican and we've had an ongoing debate on race since this NFL stuff started. No matter what, he could not take his politics out of the equation. He could acknowledge racism was an issue but always fell back into the politics. Angry at anything suggesting he or we (Republicans) were inherently racist and associating anyone speaking up to racism as part of the left wing crazies.

One day we're talking and he shares that his daughter is dating a young black kid and what great kid he is, his parents are, etc. He then shared how hard it was to get there - in terms of accepting and believing he was a great kid as opposed to had it been a white kid. He admitted he was having a hard time understanding as he was / is absolutely certain he is not racist. I had to laugh because I had been through something similar.

It is called implicit bias - it is real and it is widespread. It isn't malicious or intentional but it explains many examples of "call it something other than systemic" racism.

Resumes with identical qualifications of people with ethnic sounding names receiving 50% fewer call backs than resumes with more common names. Homes owned by black families appraising at consistently lower $/Sq foot compared to white homes in same neighborhoods. Behavior reported as suspicious of blacks totally ignored of whites. Police more likely to draw guns or use deadly force. There are countless examples and studies illustrating these and the impact is real.

Ask yourself and I wouldn't expect anyone to reply much less be honest, but what would your immediate reaction be if a black guy wanted to join your lease, knocked on your door after dark, etc. Or if you started a new job and met a couple of black people along with a bunch of white guys. Would everyone start on equal footing in terms of what you had to see before concluding they were definitely good guys?

If you can honestly say you would absolutely see and judge them equally and instantly without bias, then more power to you. Because I will admit I still fall into that trap sometime as I did initially when these NFL protests started.

I bet your buddy would have had similar feelings if the young man was Russian, Japanese, Iranian, etc... It is called being human and not understanding other races/cultures as well as your own. Doesn't mean he is the least bit racist. Everyone has perceived biases and stereotypes. It is human nature.

But his whole BLM and Kapernick movement started and is built on black folks being killed by police at a much higher rate than other races. That is a False Narrative and the statistics don't back it up. If they want to start a movement about a true narrative of some of the other issues you mentioned, I bet they would receive a lot more widespread support. Most critical thinking folks have a hard time supporting communists that are spreading false narratives.

[RiverRat1]

If 80% of crime came from guys driving F150's would you scream and yell when LEO pulled you over because you drove a F150?

Races put stereotypes on themselves. You dress like a thug with your underwear showing and expect people to think what exactly? Drive a gang banger car (doesn't matter what race your are) and what do you think people will be thinking? Or why in Hades would you expect them to think otherwise?

It's a mind bender for sure how people act, dress, etc so they can appear a certain way but then scream when people see them for exactly how they are... It's sort of like the slut dressed girl loving the attention from the hot guy but screams pervert when a guy she doesn't like gives her the same attention.

[OldRiverRat]

Ask yourself and I wouldn't expect anyone to reply much less be honest, but what would your immediate reaction be if a black guy wanted to join your lease, knocked on your door after dark, etc. Or if you started a new job and met a couple of black people along with a bunch of white guys. Would everyone start on equal footing in terms of what you had to see before concluding they were definitely good guys?



This is beyond I insulting, nothing like someone’s litmus test for racism. If you truly believe this is how most people think then you have some major issues.
I’ll answer your questions
Black guy on my lease? Uhhh wouldn’t even think twice, if I did I’m sure my BLACK brother in law might not appreciate it very much.
Black person knocks on my door at night - would handle it no different than any other time it has happened, I would equally use caution just as if it were a person of any other color.
Started a new job and there were black guys there, I wouldn’t think twice whether they were “good guys” whatever that means.

Are these The thoughts that go through your head when you see black people? Seems like you may have the problem




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[meltingfeather]

Systemic means built into the system, and I’m not arguing that racism doesn’t exist. People having prejudices does not equate to systemic racism. Unequal outcome does not equate to systemic racism. Outcomes you don’t like do NOT equate to systemic racism.

Show me the systems that are systemically racist, where it is in those systems, and how the legal system allows it... I’ll give you a hint, it is called Affirmative Action. Affirmative Action is the ONLY legal prejudice based on race or gender in the United States. They are the only truly “Systemicly” racist examples out there. i.e. they are intentionally, and legally, integrated into the ACTUAL system.

The “redlining laws” you point to were ill-conceived in the first place. Their supposed intention was to remove prejudice in the approval process, but they were instead used to force banks into approving loans for people who didn’t qualify for them mathematically. Banking institutions were held accountable for lower percentages of POC approval rates REGARDLESS of wether race was ever a factor in the approval decision or not. Once again... equal opportunity has never meant equal outcome.

You show me any institution that approves or rejects a loan (based on race) from any 2 people with equal credit rating/income/debt Load and I will help you tear them a new one. But don’t try to come at me with race based approval ratings, in the aggregate, and try to claim it as some kind of proof.

And the biggest irony in your response is that you claimed I was short on facts while providing NOT A SINGLE ONE to refute me.


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On affirmative action we agree 100%. I’ve never wanted to check boxes that might be used to qualify me for something I didn’t earn based on the fact that my father is an immigrant. Ideas like reparations and affirmative action are progressive constructs that I think do more damage than good.
I’ve been a Big Brother and I can tell you that kid had nothing like the opportunities I had. Sometimes I wondered how he could keep getting up in the morning and slugging it out— the odds are so stacked against him. It’s not his fault either. Maybe you could blame it on his father or mother or uncles or community or whatever, but you can’t blame it on him. I don’t think life is fair or that it necessarily needs to be but equality of opportunity is not a reality I see.
Redlining absolutely existed and is well documented. You can hand pick a couple of simplified examples in an attempt to substantiate your misplaced idea, but the fact is that there’s plenty of data that shows discriminatory practices based on race and geographic location, even when controlled for other risk factors. It still happens.
A study from 1995 in the American Economic Review showed that car dealerships charge women and blacks higher prices for the same cars even when given identically scripted bargaining strategies. That’s systemic disadvantage. It’s not anybody’s fault, but denying it exists is a disservice to reality as well as humanity.

[unclefish]

There are countless examples and studies illustrating these and the impact is real. Yet you still haven't given a legit one for systemic racism.

.

[IkemanTX]

Ask yourself and I wouldn't expect anyone to reply much less be honest, but what would your immediate reaction be if a black guy wanted to join your lease, knocked on your door after dark, etc. Or if you started a new job and met a couple of black people along with a bunch of white guys. Would everyone start on equal footing in terms of what you had to see before concluding they were definitely good guys?



This is beyond I insulting, nothing like someone’s litmus test for racism. If you truly believe this is how most people think then you have some major issues.
I’ll answer your questions
Black guy on my lease? Uhhh wouldn’t even think twice, if I did I’m sure my BLACK brother in law might not appreciate it very much.
Black person knocks on my door at night - would handle it no different than any other time it has happened, I would equally use caution just as if it were a person of any other color.
Started a new job and there were black guys there, I wouldn’t think twice whether they were “good guys” whatever that means.

Are these The thoughts that go through your head when you see black people? Seems like you may have the problem




Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

His arguments are a watered down version of “critical race theory” and are based on the assumption that white people (or any non person of color) are inherently racist, as are any systems or societies they have helped creat. As such, these evil white people must be taught to hate their inherently racist selves and feel guilty for the injustices they subconsciously (and their ancestors literally) forced upon persons of color.

The idea is a racists way of fighting racism... not saying he is, but that the people who originated the ideologies are. Big difference. This is how we are starting to see segregation in the name of “social justice”... how California is stripping away civil rights laws in the name of justice... how prejudicial policies are being touted as solutions to systemic racism... it is back asswords thinking


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[OldRiverRat]

On affirmative action we agree 100%. I’ve never wanted to check boxes that might be used to qualify me for something I didn’t earn based on the fact that my father is an immigrant. Ideas like reparations and affirmative action are progressive constructs that I think do more damage than good.
I’ve been a Big Brother and I can tell you that kid had nothing like the opportunities I had. Sometimes I wondered how he could keep getting up in the morning and slugging it out— the odds are so stacked against him. It’s not his fault either. Maybe you could blame it on his father or mother or uncles or community or whatever, but you can’t blame it on him. I don’t think life is fair or that it necessarily needs to be but equality of opportunity is not a reality I see.
Redlining absolutely existed and is well documented. You can hand pick a couple of simplified examples in an attempt to substantiate your misplaced idea, but the fact is that there’s plenty of data that shows discriminatory practices based on race and geographic location, even when controlled for other risk factors. It still happens.
A study from 1995 in the American Economic Review showed that car dealerships charge women and blacks higher prices for the same cars even when given identically scripted bargaining strategies. That’s systemic disadvantage. It’s not anybody’s fault, but denying it exists is a disservice to reality as well as humanity.

What? You are quoting something from 25 years ago to support an argument for present day and it doesn’t even support your position of anything racially systematic. If two people walk into a dealership and haggle for the same car both have the opportunity to walk out and not buy the car. Could it be that the salesman knows his audience and that quite possibly blacks and women generally don’t hold the line when bargaining as often as other races or genders? One would have to assume that the salesperson was unknowingly a part of this study so if that salesman knows, on average, that a white male or asian male, for example, will walk away from a negotiation much quicker than a Black person or female then it would stand to reason that they would be less inclined to try and haggle beyond a certain point in order to not lose the deal.
It’s not a good or telling study because car prices are negotiable even if it was scripted. If you told me a black person or woman was being charged more for a fixed price item then I would take note but this is weak study.

I trade every day as a broker and I know my customers and market and I know when I can push for another $1 and when I can’t, this doesn’t make me racist it makes me good at my job.


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[stickerpatch59]

So Awards shows are not part of an Actor's work? How about press junkets?

NFL does support LEO ... They've also supported the Military in a HUGE way with the Salute to Service gear.

100 percent
The NFL donates 100 percent of proceeds from the sale of Salute to Service merchandise at retail and on NFL Auction to its military non-profit partners. The NFL does not profit from the sale or auction of Salute to Service merchandise.

a person or an organization shouldn't play both sides of the field.

make a stand. tell 'em to F.O or run with them.

[RiverRat1]

Ask yourself and I wouldn't expect anyone to reply much less be honest, but what would your immediate reaction be if a black guy wanted to join your lease, knocked on your door after dark, etc. Or if you started a new job and met a couple of black people along with a bunch of white guys. Would everyone start on equal footing in terms of what you had to see before concluding they were definitely good guys?



This is beyond I insulting, nothing like someone’s litmus test for racism. If you truly believe this is how most people think then you have some major issues.
I’ll answer your questions
Black guy on my lease? Uhhh wouldn’t even think twice, if I did I’m sure my BLACK brother in law might not appreciate it very much.
Black person knocks on my door at night - would handle it no different than any other time it has happened, I would equally use caution just as if it were a person of any other color.
Started a new job and there were black guys there, I wouldn’t think twice whether they were “good guys” whatever that means.

Are these The thoughts that go through your head when you see black people? Seems like you may have the problem

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

People judge everyone when it affects them. When looking for another lease member you try to figure out certain things, like will they have money to pay on time, do they love to listen to loud music 24/7, are they druggies.. It doesn't matter what race they are.

But if they are black you're being racist.

I went out to eat once for Mexican food. Waiter never came to my table so my friend and I eventually left. Guess they didn't like my friend. But he was white so ?? But if he was black and this happened to someone else they scream racism.

It's all in how people see things. Crap happens to all of us all the time.. Get over it.

[Raleigh]

I thought this was a football thread. Bummer just more **** politics.

[SaltwaterSlick]

...but yet, you had to post a smart *** remark instead of just hitting the back button...

[Raleigh]

Well I guess people cannot have an honest opinion anymore.

Beware the Internet police are in full force......

[meltingfeather]

What? You are quoting something from 25 years ago to support an argument for present day and it doesn’t even support your position of anything racially systematic. If two people walk into a dealership and haggle for the same car both have the opportunity to walk out and not buy the car. Could it be that the salesman knows his audience and that quite possibly blacks and women generally don’t hold the line when bargaining as often as other races or genders? One would have to assume that the salesperson was unknowingly a part of this study so if that salesman knows, on average, that a white male or asian male, for example, will walk away from a negotiation much quicker than a Black person or female then it would stand to reason that they would be less inclined to try and haggle beyond a certain point in order to not lose the deal.
It’s not a good or telling study because car prices are negotiable even if it was scripted. If you told me a black person or woman was being charged more for a fixed price item then I would take note but this is weak study.

I trade every day as a broker and I know my customers and market and I know when I can push for another $1 and when I can’t, this doesn’t make me racist it makes me good at my job.


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Oh you actually read the study? I’m pleasantly surprised.

[meltingfeather]

If you told me a black person or woman was being charged more for a fixed price item then I would take note but this is weak study.

lol riiiight. You mean if there was a "black" price or a "women's" price and a "white" price then you would believe it. Congress outlawed that a long time ago, so you likely won't find explicitly different "fixed" pricing example for different races.
Did you think through that idea or did it just fall out when you started typing?