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    #31
    Originally posted by skinsfan View Post
    First hand experience feeding large amounts of people without GMO’s or Herbacde/Pesticide? We are not just discussing the US we are trying to feed the world!
    Not when we pay farmers to not farm.

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      #32
      You can beat this up all day long because it is in the media but you all still want fuel for your cars and boats, perscription Rx drugs, freon for air conditioning and all other products out there that are hazardous in the chemical process to make, waste after it is made or in using the product. For instance gas has benzene, known cancer causing agent still use it every day. I wish I could find a could bottle of Chloridane for termite control.

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        #33
        Originally posted by Dirtymike View Post
        Not when we pay farmers to not farm.
        Not going to go there. I respect your passion.

        Comment


          #34
          Everyone is entitled to their own belief system and will follow that path whether it's the food you eat, your medical treatment, or anything else in life. I'm no different, I'll try to utilize what the good lord first provided for us as far as I possibly can then resort to the man made alternatives as minimally as possible. Is roundup good or bad? It affects everyone just not the same, some people can walk through an acre of poison ivy in their tightly-whiteys with no affect, some folks can have minimal contact with roundup with devastating affects, imo!

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            #35
            Couple more points for consideration:
            In 2014 roughly 8/10 of a lb of glyphosate was sprayed on every ha of cultivated land in the U.S. The usage is increasing annually. Unarguably it is a highly toxic chemical that is being used in the highest concentrations in recorded history. Unarguably it is showing up on a large scale in waterways, grazing stock, the gulf of Mexico...even mothers milk. To me unarguably this should be cause for concern. I will confess that I am dubious of " scientific research" on either side of the controversy as it appears to me too many hidden agendas are involved by both sides. But intuitively I do not like the scale of poison used on our food.

            As I said earlier I believe we will see a landslide shift in ag practices sooner than later. Appears to me the current paradigm is hard to shift because 1) farmers have so much debt it is hard to take any risk of change 2) The large scale single commodity farming in place today requires such specific equipment it is difficult to shift. 3) Much easier to keep doing it the way we always have done it 4)The farm bill along with crop insurance essentially forces farmers to certain crops and practices { I don't get business insurance? Does anyone else?} I could go on

            Now , back to glyphosate....and synthetic fertilizer. Both can be dramatically reduced thru innovative ag practices proven and expanding today. No till ag , extensive multi specie cover cropping, strategic animal grazing, pollinator crops all work together to reduce the requirement for artificial inputs, enhance soil organic matter, increase the nutritional density of food, produce more and higher quality product per acre , thus require less acreage for greater production, thus more applicable on smaller scale thus can be used more efficiently on a world wide scale, thus closer to the user requiring less distribution, thus less fossil fuel usage...shall I go on?

            And glyphosate will become an asterisk to ag rather than a world wide concern over its health risks.

            I'm off to the ranch to go hunting. Best to all

            Comment


              #36
              What do y'all recommend using to clear about 3 acres of grass/hay/brush for making it into a food plot?

              Comment


                #37
                Breaking news- poison is poisonous!

                Comment


                  #38
                  Tons more head and neck cancers coming out of the Houston area... if u have fished the areas by Baytown and notice the smell in the air- it's no doubt that stuff inhaled causes its problems to everyone in the area
                  Not just round up

                  Comment


                    #39
                    Originally posted by elgato View Post
                    Couple more points for consideration:
                    In 2014 roughly 8/10 of a lb of glyphosate was sprayed on every ha of cultivated land in the U.S. The usage is increasing annually. Unarguably it is a highly toxic chemical that is being used in the highest concentrations in recorded history. Unarguably it is showing up on a large scale in waterways, grazing stock, the gulf of Mexico...even mothers milk. To me unarguably this should be cause for concern. I will confess that I am dubious of " scientific research" on either side of the controversy as it appears to me too many hidden agendas are involved by both sides. But intuitively I do not like the scale of poison used on our food.

                    As I said earlier I believe we will see a landslide shift in ag practices sooner than later. Appears to me the current paradigm is hard to shift because 1) farmers have so much debt it is hard to take any risk of change 2) The large scale single commodity farming in place today requires such specific equipment it is difficult to shift. 3) Much easier to keep doing it the way we always have done it 4)The farm bill along with crop insurance essentially forces farmers to certain crops and practices { I don't get business insurance? Does anyone else?} I could go on

                    Now , back to glyphosate....and synthetic fertilizer. Both can be dramatically reduced thru innovative ag practices proven and expanding today. No till ag , extensive multi specie cover cropping, strategic animal grazing, pollinator crops all work together to reduce the requirement for artificial inputs, enhance soil organic matter, increase the nutritional density of food, produce more and higher quality product per acre , thus require less acreage for greater production, thus more applicable on smaller scale thus can be used more efficiently on a world wide scale, thus closer to the user requiring less distribution, thus less fossil fuel usage...shall I go on?

                    And glyphosate will become an asterisk to ag rather than a world wide concern over its health risks.

                    I'm off to the ranch to go hunting. Best to all
                    I agree. Check out Polyface Farm. The man makes some really good points.

                    Comment


                      #40
                      Originally posted by AntlerCollector View Post
                      What do y'all recommend using to clear about 3 acres of grass/hay/brush for making it into a food plot?
                      Fire works well if you do not want to use round up.

                      Comment


                        #41
                        Oh Heck, I have one more point as I wait for my wife.

                        No till farming along with the practices mentioned above actually sequester carbon into the soil from the air. This increases soil productivity and reduces the greenhouse effect simultaneously. Win/win and a bit more palatable than everyone selling their car and walking to work.

                        Whereas tillage releases carbon into the atmosphere and is one of the largest contributors of green house gases [ carbon ]. You can actually see the carbon plume thru specialized photography in the spring when farmers begin tillage.

                        Question? Have we really learned the lessons from the dust bowl days when dust from Kansas engulfed Washington DC? All caused fro excess tillage which destroys soil biota and all the perils that come from that.

                        Healthier soil, stronger more nutrient dense plants, less requirement for herbicides, less and pesticides less ag water runoff[ said differently better water absorption thus less irrigation and less pollution ] ....

                        Apologies...I'm prone to preaching

                        Comment


                          #42
                          Originally posted by Dirtymike View Post
                          I agree. Check out Polyface Farm. The man makes some really good points.

                          http://www.polyfacefarms.com/
                          I've been to Joels farm. He is one of my mentors

                          Comment


                            #43
                            Ag in general as practiced in the United States is disgusting. That certainly extends to how we produce animals for slaughter. Get rid of the government subsidies and it would largely sort itself out.

                            Comment


                              #44
                              This is something I've been following closely for years, so I have several comments in response to what's been posted.

                              Monsanto has (among its endless list of shady activities) been caught trying to (and sued for) producing intentionally falsified scientific data on glyphosate and other ingredients. Including secretly funding "independent" scientists and organizations to publish knowingly incorrect data and conclusions. They have also been caught secretly colluding with government agencies to hide data and affect regulatory outcomes.

                              Just a few of many articles on the subject:





                              ZeroHedge - On a long enough timeline, the survival rate for everyone drops to zero


                              Secondly, the evidence of adverse health effects of glyphosate (not just cancer) have been mounting for decades. That's why it has been banned in over 30 countries. But that news has been slow to spread here because Monsanto has been spending millions to actively affect and attempt to control public perception of their products here in this country. They have also been very successful in getting former employers into government regulatory positions within usda, fda, etc, which has no doubt helped them circumvent restrictions. A previous comment about there being only one study in existence which linked glyphosate to cancer is ridiculous. In March of 2015 the International Agency for Research on Cancer classified glyphosate as a probable carcinogen in humans based on numerous worldwide animal studies and circumstantial human studies. They have to legally use the word "probable" because direct testing on humans would be illegal and unethical. But the animal studies demonstrated direct causation and the case studies of human exposure provided statistically probable circumstantial evidence.

                              A couple of articles on the many deleterious health effects of glyphosate:





                              To the comments about how we're suppose to feed the world without gmo crops and we can't grow crops without weed killer and gmo's etc etc . . .

                              Grow crops where they are suited to grow. A lot of water waste, excessive use of pesticides, and herbicides has to do with trying to grow crops in environments where they are completely unsuited to grow. And yes, that means that places like Texas are not suited to grow a lot of things that can be grown elsewhere. We can't deplete our water by growing water needy crops here or poison everyone using tons of herbicides and pesticides for delicate crops. All regions have their own carrying capacity. Some places are lower than others. Most of Texas' is probably fairly low. People need to reproduce mindfully and not exceed that carrying capacity. Do not produce more people than resources can support.
                              Last edited by Longue Carabine; 12-27-2018, 01:26 PM.

                              Comment


                                #45
                                Originally posted by Longue Carabine View Post
                                This is something I've been following closely for years, so I have several comments in response to what's been posted.

                                Monsanto has (among its endless list of shady activities) been caught trying to (and sued for) producing intentionally falsified scientific data on glyphosate and other ingredients. Including secretly funding "independent" scientists and organizations to publish knowingly incorrect data and conclusions. They have also been caught secretly colluding with government agencies to hide data and affect regulatory outcomes.

                                Just a few of many articles on the subject:





                                ZeroHedge - On a long enough timeline, the survival rate for everyone drops to zero


                                Secondly, the evidence of adverse health effects of glyphosate (not just cancer) have been mounting for decades. That's why it has been banned in over 30 countries. But that news has been slow to spread here because Monsanto has been spending millions to actively affect and attempt to control public perception of their products here in this country. They have also been very successful in getting former employers into government regulatory positions within usda, fda, etc, which has no doubt helped them circumvent restrictions. A previous comment about there being only one study in existence which linked glyphosate to cancer is ridiculous. In March of 2015 the International Agency for Research on Cancer classified glyphosate as a probable carcinogen in humans based on numerous worldwide animal studies and circumstantial human studies. They have to legally use the word "probable" because direct testing on humans would be illegal and unethical. But the animal studies demonstrated direct causation and the case studies of human exposure provided statistically probable circumstantial evidence.

                                A couple of articles on the many deleterious health effects of glyphosate:





                                To the comments about how we're suppose to feed the world without gmo crops and we can't grow crops without weed killer and gmo's etc etc . . .

                                Grow crops where they are suited to grow. A lot of water waste, excessive use of pesticides, and herbicides has to do with trying to grow crops in environments where they are completely unsuited to grow. And yes, that means that places like Texas are not suited to grow a lot of things that can be grown elsewhere. We can't deplete our water by growing water needy crops here or poison everyone using tons of herbicides and pesticides for delicate crops. All regions have their own carrying capacity. Some places are lower than others. Most of Texas' is probably fairly low. People need to reproduce mindfully and not exceed that carrying capacity. Do not produce more people than resources can support.

                                Sounds pretty simple!

                                Comment

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