How's it looking after Anthrax

[Hidden E]

I'm on 330 acres 20 miles north of Brackettville and lost 75-80%, I pulled 7 camera discs Oct 2 and had 14 whitetails, 13 Audad and a tagged Fallow that was the last of seven that I had just purchased. I came back two weeks ago and half of these deer have left, the fallow is on my neighbors camera over three miles away. We speculate predators may have moved to the area and caused them to leave. We have not seen a rabbit since June, they seem to be wiped out completely. The deer don't seem to like the CTC feed but the Audad put it away. We own it and will just have to hang in there and see how it plays out long term.

[dhmc03]

We had lots of buzzards on the carcasses in August... I think that was a rumor because I had heard the same thing at one time but saw for myself otherwise.

Not to say your experience isn’t different, on our place (family owned for a very long time) buzzards seem to leave upon outbreak.

[150class]

We got on a new lease in an anthrax prone area this year. Supposedly our pasture and others around us didn't get hit but we sure aren't seeing many deer. The guy who runs the ranch and our biologist both say there were no signs of anthrax in that immediate area. No dead deer, no buzzards, etc. They also say there has been a couple sightings of a mountain lion right by our pasture recently that may have pushed a bunch of deer out. But I can't see one cat running 75% of the deer off multiple pastures that are all say 1500-2500 acres each.

I put up a feeder in September and have had my camera out since then. Last I was out was 3 weeks ago and I had exactly 1 doe on my camera since Sept. Lots of hogs, some audad but only 1 doe. Several of us hunted 3 days and saw 6-8 deer total, all yearlings and maybe up to 2 year old does and bucks. All very young deer. Other guys who have been on the lease a long time went out the next weekend and saw very few as well. They said normally they would see 10-15 deer per sit and usually 3 or 4 decent bucks. And they saw just a very few as well.

I don't know about the big cat thing but maybe so. We are going to finish out the season and if there is no improvement I am calling BS and moving on. And I sure hate to, great amenities and a real good and very small group of guys. It's been nice except for the lack of deer. We'll be back out this weekend so I guess we'll see if there is any improvement.

Sounds like whoever got you on the place unfortunately gave you a load of BS to lease. Either it was hit by anthrax or it was shot out the prior years.

[taco1979]

I fed the G7 but it was to late. Feed the CTC prescribed from the vet. It needs to be fed early to get in their system before the outbreak hits. Out of 4 HF ranches all next to each other 1 fed CTC and 3 didn't, the 1 that fed it didn't loose any animals (out of the norm), the other 3 had close to a 90% loss.

I've searched for "CTC" for a few hours and I'm not seeing much of a relationship between this medication and actual Anthrax prevention. Can you possibly give us a little more info when you have time? Can it be diluted in a water source for easier delivery or must you have protein pellets specially made?

Any additional info would be greatly appreciated.

[Bowtech08]

I’m going on a hunt in Comstock this weekend. The ranch is 15miles out of town headed towards Juno. Any news on that area?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Capt Glenn]

I don't think it was shot out. I have several connections to the folks who run this ranch, are on this lease, etc. They are good folks. Trully, they are. The lease boss for our pasture and the man who runs the ranch both. I've seen 2 of the lease member's trail cam pics from last season and have seen what they were seeing last year and it was what you'd expect for the area. We also found a camera that one of the guys who got off the lease left on a feed pen and saw the pics from that spot from the end of the season before.

We found out about this lease through a friend who we hunted with for several years on another ranch. He is very close friends with the guys who manage the ranch and I have another totally unrelated friend who is friends with them as well. I know they are good people. So they had a couple spots come open and we were looking so we got on in August. I asked them before we committed to it if they had been hit with anthrax and was told no, no issues except in one pasture that is a long way away from us and only in some of their breeder buck pens. It's miles away and across a highway. We went out to look at it and it was hot, hot and the brush is very thick and tall in this pasture. We saw some deer but it isn't really a property where you are just going to ride around and see alot of deer. It's too thick and too rugged, you can't drive all of it anyway. But we saw several deer crossing the roads, in camp, etc when we were there looking the lease over. So we go ahead and get on the lease and moved our stuff on in September. Same deal, the weekend we went out in Sept we saw some hogs, saw a few deer but it was 95+ degrees and I didn't expect to see much moving. We set up our stands, feeders and cameras. I am super busy all through the fall. One of the reasons we got on this lease is that it is MLD and has a few exotics so I could get alot of hunting in later on in the winter. I'm busy fishing up until usually mid-December and rarely have a weekend free until then. But Jan to mid-March I don't have anything going on and can hunt most weekends. So I don't get back out until the weekend before Thanksgiving. In the meantime the biologist did a survey and approved us for our # of MLD tags for the season. Supposedly (I know, I know). He OK'd us for the same number of doe tags as years past but recommended we cut the buck harvest in half for this season due to anthrax outbreaks around the area and just as a precaution to go easy on our deer or something to that effect. I wasn't thrilled about that but ok, whatever. We get out there the weekend before Thanksgiving and my camera shows hogs, hogs and more hogs everytime the feeder goes off. Day and night. Tons and tons of them. And one doe. So I am thinking the **** hogs have taken over my feeder. We shoot a few and run them off and I put up a big feed pen. My BIL had the same issue. There were 4 of us out there to hunt for 4 days. We saw 6-8 deer total and all very young, tons of hogs and a few audad. Cut our hunt short and came home a day early because of how few deer we were seeing. I literally had one doe at my feeder in those 3 days. My son saw a 3pt and a doe at another feeder. My brother in law and nephew saw a doe each at two other feeders and we saw 2 or 3 as we were driving thru going and coming from hunting. That was it.

Obviously something wasn't right. I was trying to stay positive and talk myself into it maybe being something other than a die off because I do like this lease, the camp and the people. So we report what we saw to the lease boss. He goes out the following weekend with a couple of guys and he says they don't see much of anything either. A couple deer at each feeder and nothing but very young bucks. Also pigs and audad. He is concerned as well so he contacts the biologist and ranch manager. They told him all the pastures around us are reporting very low deer sightings. They told him the pasture next to us has had multiple mountain lion sightings and maybe that is what's going on. That doesn't make sense to me. I mean, if a lion hunts and makes a kill at a feeder I'd expect the deer to be gone from that feeder for a few days but several pastures worth? Years ago I hunted in lion country out near Pandale and they didn't run the deer off whole pastures.

We have talked about it quite a bit and basically we are going to just finish out the season and see how it goes. I already told my BIL if it doesn't get better soon it'll be one and done for me. I have more stuff to haul out there and decided I'm not hauling anything else out this season unless things make a major turnaround. And I know that is unlikely but I'm going to stay positive and see how it goes.

Someone was asking where the lease is, it's in SW Edwards county. South of Carta Valley.

We'll see how it goes. I'm not angry about it, I really don't think we were purposely lied to or anything. Except that the state biologist maybe didn't actually do a survey. But I don't think the ranch manager or lease boss were trying to mislead us or anything. And I do feel like if it turns out there is an issue that we will work something out. They have been very good to us so far and more than fair. I don't have any reason to believe that would change. I've been very fortunate and every deer lease I have been on has been good. This time we might have struck out. It can happen. We all pays our moneys and takes our chances.

[150class]

I don't think it was shot out. I have several connections to the folks who run this ranch, are on this lease, etc. They are good folks. Trully, they are. The lease boss for our pasture and the man who runs the ranch both. I've seen 2 of the lease member's trail cam pics from last season and have seen what they were seeing last year and it was what you'd expect for the area. We also found a camera that one of the guys who got off the lease left on a feed pen and saw the pics from that spot from the end of the season before.

We found out about this lease through a friend who we hunted with for several years on another ranch. He is very close friends with the guys who manage the ranch and I have another totally unrelated friend who is friends with them as well. I know they are good people. So they had a couple spots come open and we were looking so we got on in August. I asked them before we committed to it if they had been hit with anthrax and was told no, no issues except in one pasture that is a long way away from us and only in some of their breeder buck pens. It's miles away and across a highway. We went out to look at it and it was hot, hot and the brush is very thick and tall in this pasture. We saw some deer but it isn't really a property where you are just going to ride around and see alot of deer. It's too thick and too rugged, you can't drive all of it anyway. But we saw several deer crossing the roads, in camp, etc when we were there looking the lease over. So we go ahead and get on the lease and moved our stuff on in September. Same deal, the weekend we went out in Sept we saw some hogs, saw a few deer but it was 95+ degrees and I didn't expect to see much moving. We set up our stands, feeders and cameras. I am super busy all through the fall. One of the reasons we got on this lease is that it is MLD and has a few exotics so I could get alot of hunting in later on in the winter. I'm busy fishing up until usually mid-December and rarely have a weekend free until then. But Jan to mid-March I don't have anything going on and can hunt most weekends. So I don't get back out until the weekend before Thanksgiving. In the meantime the biologist did a survey and approved us for our # of MLD tags for the season. Supposedly (I know, I know). He OK'd us for the same number of doe tags as years past but recommended we cut the buck harvest in half for this season due to anthrax outbreaks around the area and just as a precaution to go easy on our deer or something to that effect. I wasn't thrilled about that but ok, whatever. We get out there the weekend before Thanksgiving and my camera shows hogs, hogs and more hogs everytime the feeder goes off. Day and night. Tons and tons of them. And one doe. So I am thinking the **** hogs have taken over my feeder. We shoot a few and run them off and I put up a big feed pen. My BIL had the same issue. There were 4 of us out there to hunt for 4 days. We saw 6-8 deer total and all very young, tons of hogs and a few audad. Cut our hunt short and came home a day early because of how few deer we were seeing. I literally had one doe at my feeder in those 3 days. My son saw a 3pt and a doe at another feeder. My brother in law and nephew saw a doe each at two other feeders and we saw 2 or 3 as we were driving thru going and coming from hunting. That was it.

Obviously something wasn't right. I was trying to stay positive and talk myself into it maybe being something other than a die off because I do like this lease, the camp and the people. So we report what we saw to the lease boss. He goes out the following weekend with a couple of guys and he says they don't see much of anything either. A couple deer at each feeder and nothing but very young bucks. Also pigs and audad. He is concerned as well so he contacts the biologist and ranch manager. They told him all the pastures around us are reporting very low deer sightings. They told him the pasture next to us has had multiple mountain lion sightings and maybe that is what's going on. That doesn't make sense to me. I mean, if a lion hunts and makes a kill at a feeder I'd expect the deer to be gone from that feeder for a few days but several pastures worth? Years ago I hunted in lion country out near Pandale and they didn't run the deer off whole pastures.

We have talked about it quite a bit and basically we are going to just finish out the season and see how it goes. I already told my BIL if it doesn't get better soon it'll be one and done for me. I have more stuff to haul out there and decided I'm not hauling anything else out this season unless things make a major turnaround. And I know that is unlikely but I'm going to stay positive and see how it goes.

Someone was asking where the lease is, it's in SW Edwards county. South of Carta Valley.

We'll see how it goes. I'm not angry about it, I really don't think we were purposely lied to or anything. Except that the state biologist maybe didn't actually do a survey. But I don't think the ranch manager or lease boss were trying to mislead us or anything. And I do feel like if it turns out there is an issue that we will work something out. They have been very good to us so far and more than fair. I don't have any reason to believe that would change. I've been very fortunate and every deer lease I have been on has been good. This time we might have struck out. It can happen. We all pays our moneys and takes our chances.

Well good to hear about not potentially being shot out. However your lease location seems to be in the heart of where fellow TBH'ers were hit hard with anthrax.

Hope it all works out.

[Capt Glenn]

Well good to hear about not potentially being shot out. However your lease location seems to be in the heart of where fellow TBH'ers were hit hard with anthrax.

Hope it all works out.

Yes, for sure. And I knew about the die offs this summer and that we were looking at a place in that area. That is why I asked them if they had been effected.

[EastTexasMan]

I don't think it was shot out. I have several connections to the folks who run this ranch, are on this lease, etc. They are good folks. Trully, they are. The lease boss for our pasture and the man who runs the ranch both. I've seen 2 of the lease member's trail cam pics from last season and have seen what they were seeing last year and it was what you'd expect for the area. We also found a camera that one of the guys who got off the lease left on a feed pen and saw the pics from that spot from the end of the season before.

We found out about this lease through a friend who we hunted with for several years on another ranch. He is very close friends with the guys who manage the ranch and I have another totally unrelated friend who is friends with them as well. I know they are good people. So they had a couple spots come open and we were looking so we got on in August. I asked them before we committed to it if they had been hit with anthrax and was told no, no issues except in one pasture that is a long way away from us and only in some of their breeder buck pens. It's miles away and across a highway. We went out to look at it and it was hot, hot and the brush is very thick and tall in this pasture. We saw some deer but it isn't really a property where you are just going to ride around and see alot of deer. It's too thick and too rugged, you can't drive all of it anyway. But we saw several deer crossing the roads, in camp, etc when we were there looking the lease over. So we go ahead and get on the lease and moved our stuff on in September. Same deal, the weekend we went out in Sept we saw some hogs, saw a few deer but it was 95+ degrees and I didn't expect to see much moving. We set up our stands, feeders and cameras. I am super busy all through the fall. One of the reasons we got on this lease is that it is MLD and has a few exotics so I could get alot of hunting in later on in the winter. I'm busy fishing up until usually mid-December and rarely have a weekend free until then. But Jan to mid-March I don't have anything going on and can hunt most weekends. So I don't get back out until the weekend before Thanksgiving. In the meantime the biologist did a survey and approved us for our # of MLD tags for the season. Supposedly (I know, I know). He OK'd us for the same number of doe tags as years past but recommended we cut the buck harvest in half for this season due to anthrax outbreaks around the area and just as a precaution to go easy on our deer or something to that effect. I wasn't thrilled about that but ok, whatever. We get out there the weekend before Thanksgiving and my camera shows hogs, hogs and more hogs everytime the feeder goes off. Day and night. Tons and tons of them. And one doe. So I am thinking the **** hogs have taken over my feeder. We shoot a few and run them off and I put up a big feed pen. My BIL had the same issue. There were 4 of us out there to hunt for 4 days. We saw 6-8 deer total and all very young, tons of hogs and a few audad. Cut our hunt short and came home a day early because of how few deer we were seeing. I literally had one doe at my feeder in those 3 days. My son saw a 3pt and a doe at another feeder. My brother in law and nephew saw a doe each at two other feeders and we saw 2 or 3 as we were driving thru going and coming from hunting. That was it.

Obviously something wasn't right. I was trying to stay positive and talk myself into it maybe being something other than a die off because I do like this lease, the camp and the people. So we report what we saw to the lease boss. He goes out the following weekend with a couple of guys and he says they don't see much of anything either. A couple deer at each feeder and nothing but very young bucks. Also pigs and audad. He is concerned as well so he contacts the biologist and ranch manager. They told him all the pastures around us are reporting very low deer sightings. They told him the pasture next to us has had multiple mountain lion sightings and maybe that is what's going on. That doesn't make sense to me. I mean, if a lion hunts and makes a kill at a feeder I'd expect the deer to be gone from that feeder for a few days but several pastures worth? Years ago I hunted in lion country out near Pandale and they didn't run the deer off whole pastures.

We have talked about it quite a bit and basically we are going to just finish out the season and see how it goes. I already told my BIL if it doesn't get better soon it'll be one and done for me. I have more stuff to haul out there and decided I'm not hauling anything else out this season unless things make a major turnaround. And I know that is unlikely but I'm going to stay positive and see how it goes.

Someone was asking where the lease is, it's in SW Edwards county. South of Carta Valley.

We'll see how it goes. I'm not angry about it, I really don't think we were purposely lied to or anything. Except that the state biologist maybe didn't actually do a survey. But I don't think the ranch manager or lease boss were trying to mislead us or anything. And I do feel like if it turns out there is an issue that we will work something out. They have been very good to us so far and more than fair. I don't have any reason to believe that would change. I've been very fortunate and every deer lease I have been on has been good. This time we might have struck out. It can happen. We all pays our moneys and takes our chances.

From your story it seems pretty apparent to me your place was hit with Anthrax. Maybe the lease boss and owner didn't see the carcasses, maybe they did, who knows.... but regardless, sounds like Anthrax got your lease pretty hard. Sorry to hear it, just way it comes across reading your post.

[Capt Glenn]

From your story it seems pretty apparent to me your place was hit with Anthrax. Maybe the lease boss and owner didn't see the carcasses, maybe they did, who knows.... but regardless, sounds like Anthrax got your lease pretty hard. Sorry to hear it, just way it comes across reading your post.

I don't disagree.

[kjheiter]

I've searched for "CTC" for a few hours and I'm not seeing much of a relationship between this medication and actual Anthrax prevention. Can you possibly give us a little more info when you have time? Can it be diluted in a water source for easier delivery or must you have protein pellets specially made?

Any additional info would be greatly appreciated.

From what I understand CTC is a antibiotic that strengthens the immune system to help keep the deer alive when the spores are inhaled / ingested, apparently "healthy" deer can fight off the effects from anthrax. I too have researched a fair amount and not seen much on it. The only way I have found to get it to the deer is in the pellets mixed from the mill. I would prefer to mix myself for better control, the issue I run into is buying bulk pellets and having to get 10 tons at a time and then run into issue with the 60 day withdraw period for human consumption. That and I don't like feeding wild deer antibiotics because it can create bacteria / virus that are resistant to antibiotics and it just seems weird / unnatural.

I went to the seminar in Sonora and there were several biologist from A&M there saying that there has been no research done in relationship to CTC preventing loss from anthrax but I have spoken to several folks in the Brackettville area that say it works wonders and what i saw this year with neighboring ranches all HF in the same geological area tells me it must work. The same A&M guys also said it is illegal (by the Center for Disease Control, I think) to feed CTC to wild deer until there is a confirmed case on your property but by that time it's too late and I am told vets who know the area will prescribe it before hand anyways. A&M is working on a vaccine similar to the livestock vaccine that is given by a shot but i think the snag is the delivery method for wildlife. Sounds like it is years off from being available to the public.

I am curious as to why TPWD has not done more / any research on this when it appears to be a ton of money spent on CWD and anthrax seems to be the bigger issue, IMO.

We are working on re-stocking with some TTT doe, going against me being determined to grow big deer with out bringing in pen deer, TTT, DMP or any of that stuff. I wanted to do it with native genetics. But i am not going to sit around not have a hunt-able herd for the next 5 to 8 years, over to the dark side I go.

Not an expert by any means, just what i have learned over the past couple of years and hope I can prevent this in the future as it is heartbreaking to say the least.

[big_smith]

I have family that hunts in Carta Valley (past Del Rio) and they are almost wiped out. I don't see a future there on that place without restocking from outside sources. No way I would spend what they are spending to drive that far to sit around a camp fire. Cheaper camping a lot closer.

[chongo]

How's it looking after Anthrax

I took my three oldest last weekend to my buddies place south of Sonora. His place got wiped out for the most part, I'd wager 95% loss on the WT.

Audad are gone, WT are all but gone, BB, Axis and Fallow seemed to have survived. This season 7 WT have been killed, my kids killed two last weekend. Not 100% but, I think that might be all of them. There might be a few left but not many.

Buddy is stocking with bred doe in Jan and bucks I believe in Sept.

Property is just under 1,100 acres and is HF.

[CoolHandLuke]

I have family that hunts in Carta Valley (past Del Rio) and they are almost wiped out. I don't see a future there on that place without restocking from outside sources. No way I would spend what they are spending to drive that far to sit around a camp fire. Cheaper camping a lot closer.

We lost 90% of our herd in 2001 and stayed on the lease. We were 50% after the first year and almost back to normal after 2. The deer don’t take long to move back in the area.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[JhuntsAlot]

Curious question for you. What exactly could anyone do about an anthrax outbreak, that occurs naturally when a lot of conditions are just right, and is fairly unpredictable as far as location?

As I understand it, the anthrax gas is created when certain geographical features coincide with just the right amounts of moisture to create a mold or fungus that releases anthrax gas as it grows or dies.

Planning for something like that to happen, or guarding against it seem nearly impossible to me.

My buddy had stated, not that this is right or not, that the anthrax was introduced through some farming based products like feed and salt blocks or something that came from overseas. Said the bacteria took off from there.

I surely don't have the answer. I would probably be a rich man if I did. Was just hoping that a group like TPWD with possible access to resources could find a way. Maybe come up with a digestible vaccine or some way to eradicate the problem.


J