Buck forage oats

[bentman]

If you have used buck oats before what did you think about them?

[buffalorider]

We've used them in East Texas with good results. Really easy/low maintenance and grow well here.



br

[mikemorvan]

Deer love 'em...

[Stan R]

I am putting some in the in the next two weeks... next to my dove plot

Got the seed at tractor supply $19 for 50lbs.

[qzilla]

They are awesome but, I will tell you one thing for sure. If you don't buy them now you ain't gonna get them this year.

Oats are in a bad shortage so if you are interested buy now.

[treed]

What is the difference between buck forage oats and regular "Seed oats" that you can get at any feed store?

[qzilla]

Without going into a length, basically they are a forage oat and not a seed oat. They stay tender longer, are more cold tolerant, produce more forage and for some reason the deer eat them better than regular oats. I have no idea why but, I planted food plots with both, side by side and the deer hammered the forage oat.

I will also say we had forage oats being grazed almost 2 months after they stopped touching the regular oats.

I have no stake in the company just the research I have done.

[Leftridge]

I've seen a lot of research, though done outside of Texas, that showed Buck Forage Oats were a huge waste of money compaired to regular ol' Bob Oats..

Here is some pretty compelling info..

http://www.qdma.com/forums/showthrea...ck+forage+oats

[Edwards]

what if you mix buck forage oats with regular oats 50/50?

[bentman]

i found some in spring texas

[jaspermac]

Buck Forage is a coker 227 oat variety. They are more cold tolerant like mentioned here, but with lime and fertilizer, they are not "significantly" better.

[qzilla]

Then you guys should buy regular oats.

Those of us that are suckers will just have to deal with being suckers I guess.

[Passthrough]

I thought I seen on a Buck Forage bag that they were "Bob" oats??

[Tejas Wildlife]

I have to agree with qzilla. BFO oats have performed better for me at the home place in Callahan Cty near Abilene, TX. I attended several of Dr. Kroll's seminars where he showed us BFO & other oats growing side by side in EAST TEXAS. For me the BFO oats are worth the $$. For the guys from Iowa, Illinois, Michigan, & elsewhere North on the QDMA Forum, I'm sure they are telling the truth about BFO's growing on their land. I just don't hunt on THEIR land.

Consider the same situation regarding people from North promoting the planting of Brassicas. I have planted purple top turnips for decades down here. We would watch the cattle & deer totally avoid them until after the first hard freeze. Then they would eat them to the ground & dig up the root. Turns out that turnips have a high alkaloid (bitter) content until the freeze. Then the plant develops a sugary taste. The disadvantage is that, where I hunt, that hard freeze is usually after Jan 1st. Thereby not providing me any benefit for using turnips in a hunting plot. They do however work well if you use them for a late winter food source.

[Leftridge]

Originally Posted by qzilla

Then you guys should buy regular oats.

Those of us that are suckers will just have to deal with being suckers I guess.

Best idea I've heard all day! Glad your tolerance for other experience is well developed!

[qzilla]

Best idea I've heard all day!

When you guys get ready to grow something with some real antlers give me a shout!

[Leftridge]

Originally Posted by qzilla

When you guys get ready to grow something with some real antlers give me a shout!

Your definately the only one doing it right!

[Grayson]

LOL. Ridiculous.

[Hafernick]

Originally Posted by qzilla

When you guys get ready to grow something with some real antlers give me a shout!

Q seems here lately you been having a chip on your shoulder when someone doesn't agree with you? Whats up with that? I used to enjoy your posts. I prefer nature to do my growing but you seem to have it going on! Good luck this season!

[Stan R]

I planted about 2 acres of oats last weekend. I used buck forage oats because that is all tractor supply had. I think I timed it just right .... Columbus got a lot of rain yesterday.

[huntmaster]

I'm with Quad on this. I have seen a difference on several places including my own between buckforage oats and reg oats. Y'all can do what you want but I have been usin them for several yrs and will continue to use them. And if your ever on a place that has both and watch deer walk across the reg oats to get to the buckforage oats what would you do.

[sooner00]

Originally Posted by Leftridge

I've seen a lot of research, though done outside of Texas, that showed Buck Forage Oats were a huge waste of money compaired to regular ol' Bob Oats..

Here is some pretty compelling info..

http://www.qdma.com/forums/showthrea...ck+forage+oats

I agree.. When I used Buck Forage it was just overpriced oats. I've used other brands that worked just as well.

[qzilla]

Q seems here lately you been having a chip on your shoulder when someone doesn't agree with you? Whats up with that?

I rarely post an answer unless I have quite a bit of hands on experience and have done a fair amount of research on my own.

I take the time to post something of value (my time, my work done on my dollar) only for people to turn around and want to believe something they read on another forum from another state written by people they have no clue about?

Just pointless to post almost.

I do not have a stake in any any seed companies, archery products or deer breeding or deer breeders.

What I have done is spent a lot of time on these subjects, direct side by side comparisons AND I have results to prove what I am saying. I am not spewing an opinion or talking about something I tried once or something someone else says. I am only stating facts that are provable and have postive results.

I get tired of people giving advise that really have no clue and no basis for what they are spewing out.

If someone did something and wanted to say it didn't work for them or wanted to explain why it didn't work or why something else worked better that is great. I have yet to see this on most threads and certainly not on this thread.

Here is the brilliant advise we have on this thread for the nay-sayers:

I've seen a lot of research, though done outside of Texas, that showed Buck Forage Oats were a huge waste of money compaired to regular ol' Bob Oats..

Yup, looks like he has no factual info and has not used them as asked by the OP.

They are more cold tolerant like mentioned here, but with lime and fertilizer, they are not "significantly" better.

So they are better but, it leaves us all hanging and then based on what?

When I used Buck Forage it was just overpriced oats. I've used other brands that worked just as well.

Again, just as well based on the fact that they both turned green and sprouted? Or regular oats produced as much forage? Or deer would eat them just as well when side by side?

So yeah, it makes it not worth posting pretty much.


And I despise all things QDMA. One of the biggest QDMA promoters in this state just got fired from the largest ranch in the state if that tells you anything about how the QDMA programs work out?


All in all, if someone is going to give you some advise on something they should have something to back it up, not a link to another site written by people in another state. Or maybe that is just way too logical?

[wellingtontx]

BFO are definitely different than Bob Oats. The oat seed product at Tractor Supply that I have seen is not BFO, they are Plot Spike Oats and yes they may be Bob Oats but they are not BFO. BFO were originally a variety derived off of an 833 Oat that was at one time one of the most cold tolerant oats available. At this point, the Buck Forage Oat folks will NOT tell you the specific variety of oats they use. They did confirm to me in an email that it was a variation of the old 833.

[Leftridge]

Originally Posted by qzilla

I rarely post an answer unless I have quite a bit of hands on experience and have done a fair amount of research on my own.

I take the time to post something of value (my time, my work done on my dollar) only for people to turn around and want to believe something they read on another forum from another state written by people they have no clue about?

Just pointless to post almost.

I get tired of people giving advise that really have no clue and no basis for what they are spewing out.

If someone did something and wanted to say it didn't work for them or wanted to explain why it didn't work or why something else worked better that is great. I have yet to see this on most threads and certainly not on this thread.

Here is the brilliant advise we have on this thread for the nay-sayers:

Yup, looks like he has no factual info and has not used them as asked by the OP.

So they are better but, it leaves us all hanging and then based on what?

Again, just as well based on the fact that they both turned green and sprouted? Or regular oats produced as much forage? Or deer would eat them just as well when side by side?

So yeah, it makes it not worth posting pretty much.


And I despise all things QDMA. One of the biggest QDMA promoters in this state just got fired from the largest ranch in the state if that tells you anything about how the QDMA programs work out?

All in all, if someone is going to give you some advise on something they should have something to back it up, not a link to another site written by people in another state. Or maybe that is just way too logical?

I'd love to respond to this but its about the stupidest thing I've heard for some time..And in my line of work I hear some pretty stupid stuff...

Like I said I guess because people have researched, tested and have a different experence that YOU personally not only is it invalid but its a waste of time to post a link to..

Hope you can get that head through the blind door to shoot one of those monster bucks you've got over there!

Ok, I tried to ignore the snipes calling my post "pointless" but I just don't have it in me..

For the record my post wasn't talking out my butt..It was a link to someone elses experience that I find pretty compelling..And still do..

There is more than one way to skin a deer or grow big deer it would seem..Notice how I don't discount what your doing is working for you?

[Jen-Man]

qzilla, don't stop posting. Very informative. I'm gonna try some BFO this year in south texas and see what happens. I have always just planted feed oats cuz they are cheaper. May have to plant some of both and see what happens. What ph shld I be shooting for in my soil?
Oh let the others have thier say. Not everyone will agree and some may have no idea what they are talking about but thats ok......chill.....and thanks for the report.

[raiderelkhunter]

I guess I am going to add a little fuel to the fire that is already raging.

Just as Leftridges data came from out of state and seems to be non applicable to TX, so could Quads. If Quad is on the other side of the state from you, his growing setup could be completely different from yours. TX is very diverse in climate, soil types, precipitation amounts. This is why I find it difficult for any "foodplot" seed to be a blanket type application for the state of TX. I think you should search for local and regional seed producers that know what works in your neck of the woods rather than asking for statewide advice on something....jmho

[Ron]

Thanks everybody! I like to read all the different views on the subject, because I am about to plant some oats and I find the information interesting.

[qzilla]

Just as Leftridges data came from out of state and seems to be non applicable to TX, so could Quads. If Quad is on the other side of the state from you, his growing setup could be completely different from yours. TX is very diverse in climate, soil types, precipitation amounts. This is why I find it difficult for any "foodplot" seed to be a blanket type application for the state of TX. I think you should search for local and regional seed producers that know what works in your neck of the woods rather than asking for statewide advice on something....jmho

You make a very good point and a very valid point.

The problem here is not whether or not BF oats will grow or if they are the best food plot. It is whether or not they are better than "regular oats" bob oats or whatever.

Now, I have done these tests in 3 different regions of the state, north TX, S TX and WAY South TX (Sand country). They do better in certain soild for sure but, at the end of the day if you stick "regular" oats in the ground next to BF oats, the BF will produce more forage and do it longer and do it in more severe weather than regular oats will. That is a FACT. They are a forage oat, not a seed oat and were developed to specifically to stay tender longer and provide more total forage.

So they may not grow good in some parts, I agree but, if you plant them side by side they are the better oat which was the original question.

I have always just planted feed oats cuz they are cheaper.

We did the same exact thing. An oat is an oat is an oat is what we screamed for years until we someone convinced us to try which is why I would prefer that some actual facts get stated and not hearsay.

Not only did we measure the oats, we used exclusion cages and we also used exclusion fences in some instances just to test the oats at various stages if they are not browsed. To go even further we compared prior years fecal sample results to last years fecal sample results to see if we could see any difference. I cannot assure you that it was all in the oats because we strive to make everything better every year but, our nutrition is better now than it used to be according to lab results of fecal samples.

I'd love to respond to this but its about the stupidest thing I've heard for some time

You will have a hard time responding until you can further improve your reading comprehension.

I am going to help you out.

Below is the simple request from the OP:

If you have used buck oats before what did you think about them?

You haven't. So quit spreading hearsay.

For the record my post wasn't talking out my butt

You are spreading hearsay, which is very similar. Ask your buddy grayson what the definition of hearsay is, he is an attorney I am sure he is well versed.

It was a link to someone elses experience that I find pretty compelling..And still do

If it is on the internet it must be true!

There is more than one way to skin a deer or grow big deer it would seem

This is where I can totally 100% agree with you. There are tons of ways to do this and there are ways to do it better than we are doing it now for sure.


My beef is this:

I've seen

Not I've done.

were a huge waste of money

If you are going to use statements like that you better have something to back it up, more than an internet link.

I think you should voice any opinion you want. When you starts spewing info out that you don't have ANY firsthand knowledge about and then want to proceed to tell everyone something is a huge waste of money you are going to get sharp responses back.

Same is true for braodheads, bows, arrows, feeders, protein etc.

[kfd82]

I can pee further than all of yall!!

[SAC]

Originally Posted by kfd82

I can pee further than all of yall!!

How can you know for sure? Have you actually seen them pee? Was wind a factor? Uphill, or downhill? Are you counting splatter? If you are taller do you have an advantage?

[Dale Moser]

Where do I get'em around here??? please don't say Cabela's please don't say Cabela's

[kfd82]

Originally Posted by SAC

How can you know for sure? Have you actually seen them pee? Was wind a factor? Uphill, or downhill? Are you counting splatter? If you are taller do you have an advantage?

More PSI secondary to less friction loss.....its a curse and a gift.

[Dale Moser]

I appreciate the opinion of anyone who HAS USED BFO, btw.

[wellingtontx]

Qzilla and Leftridge, what are your occupations ?

Dale - if you are asking about BFO, the cheapest place to get them that I have found is up in Denton at Dennis' Farm Store, which is in the same parking lot as MBS Seed. The fellow that runs Dennis' Farm Store worked on the development of the 833 Oat years ago and he can tell you the history of the BFO. He also has lots of experience with the BFO. He sells all kinds of oats but will tell you that there is most definitely a difference, not a hoax or a marketing gimmick.

[jaspermac]

I kind of wish I hadn't made a comment earlier, but my "significantly" was meant for testing the oats compared to other oats for statistical differences. All of the research that I have been a part of was in LA (undergraduate) and south Arkansas (graduate).

When I moved to east TX, I worked with the biologist at Scrappin' Vally and Boggy Slough. They have experimented with every seed on all types of ground. The biggest problem that EVERYONE has is lime and fertilize. If you do not prep the soil, you can't grow anything right. Most people do not put the time and money into the soil and the plant does not grow into its full potential. I have always been taught to spend more money on the soil and less on the seed. So whether it is seed oats, feed oats or trophy oats, make sure the soil is right before wasting any money.

[whitetailfanatic]

Dale, there's a dealer in Denton.
I have used them for 2yrs in a row now in Coleman and had good luck with them, and we have pretty poor soil.
They do grow a little slower but it seems to keep the does interested in the new growth longer.
They will be in the ground by the 15th again this year.
Good luck!

[Andy]

Like they said with size of Texas what works north won't won't work south. Some are planting oats now which I think is too early since still 94-95 temps here around San Antonio but to each his own I had mine burn up with that type temps....I will wait till high temp of 85 before planting any oats for my cattle...TO each his own believes great country we live in here.....Andy

[Tye]

I have done test plots for MBS seed and we have tested the bob oat to BF Oat comparison. We split a 5 acre field in half and planted both types of seed. I have watched deer walk through the Bob Oats and eat out of the BF Oats. I think the BF Oats are more palatable. However, we plant mixes and in the whole scheme of things, it really doesn't matter.IMHO. I don't think that one kind of Oat will make a huge difference on the deers body size. Just spoke with my contact with MBS and I will be planting Bob Oats, Wheat, Austrian Winter Peas, Turnips and Rape. If anything, the Turnips and Rape will help the deer more than anything. They have a higher protein content and they become palatable later in the season when the bucks will be trying to put their weight back on from the rut.

If you want to increase the size of your bucks, make sure they have plenty to eat after the rut and pray for rain during the Spring crop planting.

My 2 cents worth.

[Leftridge]

Originally Posted by qzilla

You make a very good point and a very valid point.

The problem here is not whether or not BF oats will grow or if they are the best food plot. It is whether or not they are better than "regular oats" bob oats or whatever.

Now, I have done these tests in 3 different regions of the state, north TX, S TX and WAY South TX (Sand country). They do better in certain soild for sure but, at the end of the day if you stick "regular" oats in the ground next to BF oats, the BF will produce more forage and do it longer and do it in more severe weather than regular oats will. That is a FACT. They are a forage oat, not a seed oat and were developed to specifically to stay tender longer and provide more total forage.

So they may not grow good in some parts, I agree but, if you plant them side by side they are the better oat which was the original question.




We did the same exact thing. An oat is an oat is an oat is what we screamed for years until we someone convinced us to try which is why I would prefer that some actual facts get stated and not hearsay.

Not only did we measure the oats, we used exclusion cages and we also used exclusion fences in some instances just to test the oats at various stages if they are not browsed. To go even further we compared prior years fecal sample results to last years fecal sample results to see if we could see any difference. I cannot assure you that it was all in the oats because we strive to make everything better every year but, our nutrition is better now than it used to be according to lab results of fecal samples.




You will have a hard time responding until you can further improve your reading comprehension.

I am going to help you out.

Below is the simple request from the OP:



You haven't. So quit spreading hearsay.



You are spreading hearsay, which is very similar. Ask your buddy grayson what the definition of hearsay is, he is an attorney I am sure he is well versed.



If it is on the internet it must be true!



This is where I can totally 100% agree with you. There are tons of ways to do this and there are ways to do it better than we are doing it now for sure.


My beef is this:



Not I've done.



If you are going to use statements like that you better have something to back it up, more than an internet link.

I think you should voice any opinion you want. When you starts spewing info out that you don't have ANY firsthand knowledge about and then want to proceed to tell everyone something is a huge waste of money you are going to get sharp responses back.

Same is true for braodheads, bows, arrows, feeders, protein etc.

Do you have a belief that deer have a preference for Buck Foarage Oats over Bob Oats?

That seems to be the real issue..The fact that BFO are more hardy, produce more tonnage, etc is not really at debate. Those qualities of BFO are super if the deer eat it or have a preference for it over regualar "bob oats".

So could you please provide us with something of a side by side compairision, much like was done with the hearsey link I provided, to shows us that in fact BFO are "better" than Bob Oats in regards to deer actually eating it?

I've seen you provide ZIPPO of evidence other than your saying it is so.. Please, do SHOW us your research data. Pictures are great.. I'd specifically like to see the side by side picture of the utilization cages of BFO and "Bob Oats". While we are evaluating the merits of your experience could you quantify the consumption of each so that we might see the value we get by going with BFO over Bob Oats?

My beef is the fact that your busting my nuts over an opinion I have made based on the internet "research" I'd done on the subject. Lickcreeks research regarding the issue is pretty well laid out and documented in pictures.. It's compelling visual evidence---NONE of which you have provided..

I've never said that your experience is not valid and what works for you is great..But, at your age you'd think you'd learn that disagreeing doesn't mean you have to be disagreeable...

While we are one reading comprehension..I stated "I've seen a lot of research that showed Buck Forage Oats were a huge waste of money compaired to regular ol' Bob Oats.."... I did not say they were--I said I'd seen some reasearch that suggested that... And I provided a link to that..

People make "educated" observations all the time based on others data, not personal experience. But I guess that is Hearsey! Blasphemy!

There goes any belief in the bible I guess.. Too dang much hearsey!

Originally Posted by wellingtontx

Qzilla and Leftridge, what are your occupations ?

Emergency Manager/Cop

[Leftridge]

Originally Posted by Dale Moser

Where do I get'em around here??? please don't say Cabela's please don't say Cabela's

They do have them at Dennis.. I was in there Friday picking up my sorry ol' Bob oats..

I'll be driving through Decatur on Sat. if you want me to pick you some up on my way through..

[leoparddog]

how many acres with Buck oats cover and what is the cost

[Triple 7]

I just called the feed store here in Nac and they have a 50# bag for BFO for $30

[raiderelkhunter]

Originally Posted by Triple 7

I just called the feed store here in Nac and they have a 50# bag for BFO for $30

I just bought a 50lb bag of "Bob" oats for 11.50....

[buckwild17]

Plot Spike Oats from Tractor Supply, can't go wrong there !!!! Cover 1/2 acre for $20.00.

[Hafernick]

Originally Posted by qzilla

I rarely post an answer unless I have quite a bit of hands on experience and have done a fair amount of research on my own.

I take the time to post something of value (my time, my work done on my dollar) only for people to turn around and want to believe something they read on another forum from another state written by people they have no clue about?

Just pointless to post almost.

I do not have a stake in any any seed companies, archery products or deer breeding or deer breeders.

What I have done is spent a lot of time on these subjects, direct side by side comparisons AND I have results to prove what I am saying. I am not spewing an opinion or talking about something I tried once or something someone else says. I am only stating facts that are provable and have postive results.

I get tired of people giving advise that really have no clue and no basis for what they are spewing out.

If someone did something and wanted to say it didn't work for them or wanted to explain why it didn't work or why something else worked better that is great. I have yet to see this on most threads and certainly not on this thread.



All in all, if someone is going to give you some advise on something they should have something to back it up, not a link to another site written by people in another state. Or maybe that is just way too logical?

I kind of figured as much I understand where your coming from. I just wanted to ask....

[gtsticker]

Just another sugestion plant a plot with regular oats one with BFO and one with plot spike oats. I bet they like the plot spike oats best. Easy test.

[ecfire1967]

When should I plant the buck forage oats in Johnson County?

[huntmaster]

Originally Posted by ecfire1967

When should I plant the buck forage oats in Johnson County?

now

[Dale Moser]

I mowed to the ground, and drug the dirt bare 3 weeks ago and planted a bunch of stuff. After this rain I'm gonna rake, overseed, and fertilize the same dirt frida...planting back to moisture. Surely SOMETHING will grow.