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Old 03-08-2016, 03:58 PM   #51
Coup de Grace
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Originally Posted by muzzlebrake View Post
I will vote Republican. No matter what!
Yes sir.
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Old 03-08-2016, 04:23 PM   #52
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Originally Posted by Mike Javi Cooper View Post
I'm pretty sure that speech ended up with him getting shot.
Ha ha! Well, Trump did say he could shoot someone and his supporters wouldn't care.
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Old 03-08-2016, 04:49 PM   #53
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The only problem with not voting out of protest, voting a third party, writing Mickey Mouse on a write in, etc., is a flawed and foolish concept (heavy on the foolish). I know that many will do it anyway.

The problem is that we are going to be stuck with either the Democratic or Republican nominee in the White House for at least the next four years. It is unavoidable. It is not like joining an armed revolution to overthrow the government where you might risk death but you at least the possibility to win the fight or you might die but win freedom for the future generations. It is not like refusing to go into a store or restaurant because they post a 30.07 sign. If a person won't eat Ben and Jerry's ice cream because the owners are ultra liberal, great.

If Trump is the Republican nominee by the RNC then either he or Hillary will be the leader of this country and the only way to avoid the consequences is to move to another country.

The lesser of evils most definitely comes into play. Every single person elected to the presidency is the lesser of evils because not one person under our current system has a majority of votes to support an election when the primaries begin. Usually it is not even close.

So while a person can say that he will not vote for a less or evils, if he remains in the country then he will be stuck with other people's opinion on which side is lesser. Avoiding the polls in protest does not avoid the results.

Look at it like this. You are in your home with your entire family and no means to defend yourself. A gang is outside and giving your two options. You can turn over the keys to your car and they will leave. If not your other option is that they will burn down your house and kill you and your family and then take your car anyway. You say, "Both are evil criminal acts and I choose not to turn over my car keys in protest. I will not choose the lesser of evils".

Okay, that is your choice but you will suffer the consequences anyway because there is no way out.

In this upcoming election, either the RNC or the DNC nominee will be the president. You can lose a little or you can lose a lot.

Each person obviously has the right to make his own decision but I don't understand the rationale of allowing the house to burn down and my family brutally murdered in order to stand my ground.

It is often said that you have to pick your battles. Most of the time that is true however in a national election the battle has been joined without your consent. We will have a Democrat or Republican president and no protest will stop it. You have no option other than to try and sway it in your favor. Refusing to vote is allowing someone else to make your decisions for you. I am sometimes in wonder of the thought process of a person that stands his ground in pride by a refusal to vote (or vote for a third party which is the same)..... and then gives up that same ground by letting another person choose for him.
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Old 03-08-2016, 05:26 PM   #54
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Originally Posted by tvc184 View Post
The only problem with not voting out of protest, voting a third party, writing Mickey Mouse on a write in, etc., is a flawed and foolish concept (heavy on the foolish). I know that many will do it anyway.

The problem is that we are going to be stuck with either the Democratic or Republican nominee in the White House for at least the next four years. It is unavoidable. It is not like joining an armed revolution to overthrow the government where you might risk death but you at least the possibility to win the fight or you might die but win freedom for the future generations. It is not like refusing to go into a store or restaurant because they post a 30.07 sign. If a person won't eat Ben and Jerry's ice cream because the owners are ultra liberal, great.

If Trump is the Republican nominee by the RNC then either he or Hillary will be the leader of this country and the only way to avoid the consequences is to move to another country.

The lesser of evils most definitely comes into play. Every single person elected to the presidency is the lesser of evils because not one person under our current system has a majority of votes to support an election when the primaries begin. Usually it is not even close.

So while a person can say that he will not vote for a less or evils, if he remains in the country then he will be stuck with other people's opinion on which side is lesser. Avoiding the polls in protest does not avoid the results.

Look at it like this. You are in your home with your entire family and no means to defend yourself. A gang is outside and giving your two options. You can turn over the keys to your car and they will leave. If not your other option is that they will burn down your house and kill you and your family and then take your car anyway. You say, "Both are evil criminal acts and I choose not to turn over my car keys in protest. I will not choose the lesser of evils".

Okay, that is your choice but you will suffer the consequences anyway because there is no way out.

In this upcoming election, either the RNC or the DNC nominee will be the president. You can lose a little or you can lose a lot.

Each person obviously has the right to make his own decision but I don't understand the rationale of allowing the house to burn down and my family brutally murdered in order to stand my ground.

It is often said that you have to pick your battles. Most of the time that is true however in a national election the battle has been joined without your consent. We will have a Democrat or Republican president and no protest will stop it. You have no option other than to try and sway it in your favor. Refusing to vote is allowing someone else to make your decisions for you. I am sometimes in wonder of the thought process of a person that stands his ground in pride by a refusal to vote (or vote for a third party which is the same)..... and then gives up that same ground by letting another person choose for him.
What he said
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Old 03-08-2016, 05:29 PM   #55
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What if the choices are pretty much equal evils? It's much easier when there is an obvious lesser evil.
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Old 03-08-2016, 05:34 PM   #56
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Originally Posted by Mike Javi Cooper View Post
I will vote for Trump if he wins the nomination

and if the Republican party refuses to allow him to run... I will vote for him anyway..

If Cruz wins the nomination outright I'll vote for Cruz..

but if the Republican party takes the nomination from Trump and gives it to Cruz.. I will vote for Trump..
This
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Old 03-08-2016, 05:35 PM   #57
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Originally Posted by tvc184 View Post
The only problem with not voting out of protest, voting a third party, writing Mickey Mouse on a write in, etc., is a flawed and foolish concept (heavy on the foolish). I know that many will do it anyway.

The problem is that we are going to be stuck with either the Democratic or Republican nominee in the White House for at least the next four years. It is unavoidable. It is not like joining an armed revolution to overthrow the government where you might risk death but you at least the possibility to win the fight or you might die but win freedom for the future generations. It is not like refusing to go into a store or restaurant because they post a 30.07 sign. If a person won't eat Ben and Jerry's ice cream because the owners are ultra liberal, great.

If Trump is the Republican nominee by the RNC then either he or Hillary will be the leader of this country and the only way to avoid the consequences is to move to another country.

The lesser of evils most definitely comes into play. Every single person elected to the presidency is the lesser of evils because not one person under our current system has a majority of votes to support an election when the primaries begin. Usually it is not even close.

So while a person can say that he will not vote for a less or evils, if he remains in the country then he will be stuck with other people's opinion on which side is lesser. Avoiding the polls in protest does not avoid the results.

Look at it like this. You are in your home with your entire family and no means to defend yourself. A gang is outside and giving your two options. You can turn over the keys to your car and they will leave. If not your other option is that they will burn down your house and kill you and your family and then take your car anyway. You say, "Both are evil criminal acts and I choose not to turn over my car keys in protest. I will not choose the lesser of evils".

Okay, that is your choice but you will suffer the consequences anyway because there is no way out.

In this upcoming election, either the RNC or the DNC nominee will be the president. You can lose a little or you can lose a lot.

Each person obviously has the right to make his own decision but I don't understand the rationale of allowing the house to burn down and my family brutally murdered in order to stand my ground.

It is often said that you have to pick your battles. Most of the time that is true however in a national election the battle has been joined without your consent. We will have a Democrat or Republican president and no protest will stop it. You have no option other than to try and sway it in your favor. Refusing to vote is allowing someone else to make your decisions for you. I am sometimes in wonder of the thought process of a person that stands his ground in pride by a refusal to vote (or vote for a third party which is the same)..... and then gives up that same ground by letting another person choose for him.
Well said...I agree
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Old 03-08-2016, 05:42 PM   #58
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http://www.breitbart.com/big-governm...ote-for-trump/

He says it better than I can, and this plus other issues I have with Trump are how I came to my decision.

Last edited by Big H; 03-08-2016 at 05:44 PM. Reason: Add explanation
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Old 03-08-2016, 06:12 PM   #59
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I can't vote for a guy with a liberal record like his.
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Old 03-08-2016, 07:12 PM   #60
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Look... You can only vote for my side, or you're not invited to my birthday party!!

Political discussuons (arguments) are entertaining (in the train wreck sense) because people are so blinded by their beliefs that they can't use logic or even common sense. You have grown men and women arguing about things they haven't even thought through because "they seen it on Fox News", tha innur-net, etc.

I'm voting third party because I've been disgusted by this Republican race. I'm just about done with them. I think it's time to change it up and that's the way I'll vote.

The Donald is hilarious, I'll give him that. He's even grown on me a little as this progressed because he's different, but I can't vote for the guy. Those that do support him shouldn't be belittled for their decision, they should be proud of their candidate.

I'd just as soon vote for the Bern rather than some of these sleazy clowns on the R side. It has sickened me and pushed my vote away.
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Old 03-08-2016, 07:13 PM   #61
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No way Im gonna **** my vote off by note voting. I will support the Republican nominee period.
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Old 03-08-2016, 08:07 PM   #62
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike Javi Cooper View Post
I will vote for Trump if he wins the nomination

and if the Republican party refuses to allow him to run... I will vote for him anyway..

If Cruz wins the nomination outright I'll vote for Cruz..

but if the Republican party takes the nomination from Trump and gives it to Cruz.. I will vote for Trump..
Not likely! If they are going to go to the trouble of taking the nomination from Trump they are not going to do that to give it to Cruz.
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Old 03-08-2016, 08:08 PM   #63
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Originally Posted by Hogmauler View Post
No way Im gonna **** my vote off by note voting. I will support the Republican nominee period.

X2 but I did find this funny...

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Old 03-08-2016, 08:39 PM   #64
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Looks like a lot of tbhers are going to be sitting out the November election. Trump is going to get the delegates. I wish it was Cruz but I will vote for trump and hope he can turn this country around
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Old 03-08-2016, 08:40 PM   #65
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I will. I will also vote for Cruz should he get it. I'll do what I gotta if it prevents Billary from getting in. As should we all.
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Old 03-08-2016, 08:42 PM   #66
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Looks like some need to start giving this some serious thought.
Kicked butt tonight.
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Old 03-08-2016, 09:25 PM   #67
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If for some reason there is risk of texas going dem, then i might consider it. Otherwise i will find the next best option. there is always an alternative to the rep/dem on the ballot.
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Old 03-08-2016, 09:27 PM   #68
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Originally Posted by Be10dwn View Post
I will, under no circumstances, ever vote for Donald J Trump. I don't care you think it's handing a vote to the opposition, I can't in good conscience vote for someone who I think would be a disaster. Sorry. If that makes me whatever you think it makes me, so be it. My vote, my choice
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Old 03-08-2016, 09:32 PM   #69
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Hard to imagine there would be any danger of Texas going Democrat, even if some choose not to vote for Trump. Then again, if Trump cannot easily win Texas I doubt he will have any chance of winning the General.
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Old 03-08-2016, 09:37 PM   #70
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If Pee-Wee Herman was the republican nominee he would get my vote. Lol
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Old 03-08-2016, 09:38 PM   #71
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Originally Posted by LWC View Post
I won't. I'm not going to be held responsible for the disaster that I think he would be. I voted in the primary but can't bring myself to do something I feel would be bad for our country...which would be putting Trump in the white house. If someone is going to take us further into the toilet, might as well be a democrat.
This is the thinking that have us Obama for 8 years.
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Old 03-08-2016, 09:40 PM   #72
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Originally Posted by Kdog View Post
Hard to imagine there would be any danger of Texas going Democrat, even if some choose not to vote for Trump. Then again, if Trump cannot easily win Texas I doubt he will have any chance of winning the General.
Very true, and if the result is a foregone conclusion then i would vote for someone other than donald/hillary/bernie
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Old 03-08-2016, 09:44 PM   #73
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Originally Posted by tvc184 View Post
The only problem with not voting out of protest, voting a third party, writing Mickey Mouse on a write in, etc., is a flawed and foolish concept (heavy on the foolish). I know that many will do it anyway.



The problem is that we are going to be stuck with either the Democratic or Republican nominee in the White House for at least the next four years. It is unavoidable. It is not like joining an armed revolution to overthrow the government where you might risk death but you at least the possibility to win the fight or you might die but win freedom for the future generations. It is not like refusing to go into a store or restaurant because they post a 30.07 sign. If a person won't eat Ben and Jerry's ice cream because the owners are ultra liberal, great.



If Trump is the Republican nominee by the RNC then either he or Hillary will be the leader of this country and the only way to avoid the consequences is to move to another country.



The lesser of evils most definitely comes into play. Every single person elected to the presidency is the lesser of evils because not one person under our current system has a majority of votes to support an election when the primaries begin. Usually it is not even close.



So while a person can say that he will not vote for a less or evils, if he remains in the country then he will be stuck with other people's opinion on which side is lesser. Avoiding the polls in protest does not avoid the results.



Look at it like this. You are in your home with your entire family and no means to defend yourself. A gang is outside and giving your two options. You can turn over the keys to your car and they will leave. If not your other option is that they will burn down your house and kill you and your family and then take your car anyway. You say, "Both are evil criminal acts and I choose not to turn over my car keys in protest. I will not choose the lesser of evils".



Okay, that is your choice but you will suffer the consequences anyway because there is no way out.



In this upcoming election, either the RNC or the DNC nominee will be the president. You can lose a little or you can lose a lot.



Each person obviously has the right to make his own decision but I don't understand the rationale of allowing the house to burn down and my family brutally murdered in order to stand my ground.



It is often said that you have to pick your battles. Most of the time that is true however in a national election the battle has been joined without your consent. We will have a Democrat or Republican president and no protest will stop it. You have no option other than to try and sway it in your favor. Refusing to vote is allowing someone else to make your decisions for you. I am sometimes in wonder of the thought process of a person that stands his ground in pride by a refusal to vote (or vote for a third party which is the same)..... and then gives up that same ground by letting another person choose for him.

Great post. Too many on here willing to give 4 more years to dems.
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Old 03-08-2016, 09:46 PM   #74
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Default Who will not vote for Trump in November

I see a bunch of guys on here contributing to the problem by not voting at all. So you're scared underneath all the bs that Donald is a liberal. Well guess what....Hillary IS a liberal. Not only that but an anti gun liberal. Besides that little nugget if there is one thing I think Donald CAN do its get some of this trade with other countries figured out. More jobs means better economy. No way Hillary is gonna get that done or anything positive for that matter. That in itself should make you wanna get your asses to the polls and vote Trump. A no vote is a vote for that lying *****.
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Old 03-08-2016, 09:47 PM   #75
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Originally Posted by armadillophil View Post
Looks like a lot of tbhers are going to be sitting out the November election. Trump is going to get the delegates. I wish it was Cruz but I will vote for trump and hope he can turn this country around

Would have never thought this but it seems to be true.
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Old 03-08-2016, 09:47 PM   #76
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I am not convinced Trump is any better than a democrat, so I probably wouldn't vote.
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Old 03-08-2016, 09:47 PM   #77
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Y'all are assuming Trump is the lesser of the evils. That is a huge assumption to make. Just because he wears your team colors doesn't mean he is even an acceptable choice for president. I refuse to be a part of his disaster.
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Old 03-08-2016, 09:55 PM   #78
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Originally Posted by Be10dwn View Post
Y'all are assuming Trump is the lesser of the evils. That is a huge assumption to make. Just because he wears your team colors doesn't mean he is even an acceptable choice for president. I refuse to be a part of his disaster.
Sounds like you don't have a problem with being a part of Hillary's disaster. Lol
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Old 03-08-2016, 09:57 PM   #79
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I won't vote for Trump. I won't vote for Hillary. It won't matter in Texas. Trump will cost the Republican more in the long run than Clinton. If trump wins, the Republican party is doomed. Hopefully I'll be wrong. I'm afraid I won't be.
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Old 03-08-2016, 09:58 PM   #80
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Originally Posted by Rubi513 View Post
I am not convinced Trump is any better than a democrat, so I probably wouldn't vote.
Dont just stay away from the polls, there are plenty if other important things on that ballot. There is always another option, or you can leave that line blank.
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Old 03-08-2016, 10:00 PM   #81
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Sounds like you don't have a problem with being a part of Hillary's disaster. Lol
I guess the same could be said about you and Trump's disaster...
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Old 03-08-2016, 10:01 PM   #82
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Dont just stay away from the polls, there are plenty if other important things on that ballot. There is always another option, or you can leave that line blank.
Absolutely.
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Old 03-08-2016, 10:13 PM   #83
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Originally Posted by Be10dwn View Post
I won't vote for Trump. I won't vote for Hillary. It won't matter in Texas. Trump will cost the Republican more in the long run than Clinton. If trump wins, the Republican party is doomed. Hopefully I'll be wrong. I'm afraid I won't be.

Is there a scenario where it isn't doomed?
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Old 03-08-2016, 10:26 PM   #84
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I won't vote for Trump. I won't vote for Hillary. It won't matter in Texas. Trump will cost the Republican more in the long run than Clinton. If trump wins, the Republican party is doomed. Hopefully I'll be wrong. I'm afraid I won't be.

This shouldn't be a surprise but the world is laughing at the Republican Party right now and not because of only Trump.
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Old 03-08-2016, 10:35 PM   #85
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Originally Posted by Texas Stalker View Post
I see a bunch of guys on here contributing to the problem by not voting at all. So you're scared underneath all the bs that Donald is a liberal. Well guess what....Hillary IS a liberal. Not only that but an anti gun liberal. Besides that little nugget if there is one thing I think Donald CAN do its get some of this trade with other countries figured out. More jobs means better economy. No way Hillary is gonna get that done or anything positive for that matter. That in itself should make you wanna get your asses to the polls and vote Trump. A no vote is a vote for that lying *****.
All I see is someone telling others who they should vote for. What is American about that???
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Old 03-09-2016, 02:15 AM   #86
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Trump will have us in a war fast. He's a big mouth with too much money. Not voting this time.
You mean, have us in another war, right?
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Old 03-09-2016, 05:20 AM   #87
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This shouldn't be a surprise but the world is laughing at the Republican Party right now and not because of only Trump.
this ^^^^^^^
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Old 03-09-2016, 06:26 AM   #88
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Originally Posted by JGreen31 View Post
This shouldn't be a surprise but the world is laughing at the Republican Party right now and not because of only Trump.

And that's a fact.
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Old 03-09-2016, 06:48 AM   #89
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Some of y'all act like the Republican Party is somehow sacrosanct, when in fact it has flipped and flopped throughout its history. The loss of a political party is nothing more than the birth of another..
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Old 03-09-2016, 06:55 AM   #90
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Originally Posted by Mike Javi Cooper View Post
Some of y'all act like the Republican Party is somehow sacrosanct, when in fact it has flipped and flopped throughout its history. The loss of a political party is nothing more than the birth of another..
correct...

it's gone from the party of lincoln and the emancipation, to 80-90% of african americans voting for the dems.
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Old 03-09-2016, 07:43 AM   #91
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I will be voting for him if he is the Republican nominee.
+1
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Old 03-09-2016, 07:44 AM   #92
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correct...

it's gone from the party of lincoln and the emancipation, to 80-90% of african americans voting for the dems.
more correctly, it has been the party of the corporations since its onset. that has never changed.
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Old 03-09-2016, 08:00 AM   #93
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more correctly, it has been the party of the corporations since its onset. that has never changed.
my response was to javi's comment regarding the party changing...

but yes, the pro-corporation stance has become very old to the american people
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Old 03-09-2016, 08:25 AM   #94
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. The loss of a political party is nothing more than the birth of another..
Maybe the time has come?
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Old 03-09-2016, 08:30 AM   #95
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my response was to javi's comment regarding the party changing...

but yes, the pro-corporation stance has become very old to the american people
I bet being anti-corporation would get old to the American people a lot quicker.
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Old 03-09-2016, 10:34 AM   #96
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Assuming the Congress remains Republican, they are not going to allow any president, R or D, to get too far out of line. For example, there is no frickin way that the carrier corporation will be paying 35% import duty on air conditioners made in Mexico. It would require the repeal of the NAFTA treaty and a complete abandonment of long standing republican support for free trade. There are three ways a president can go against the will of the majority in congress: (1) as commander in chief, (2) in nomination of court justices and (3) with executive orders. All three can still be thwarted by congress if the actions are unpopular enough.

If Trump is the nominee, I probably won't vote for president. There are a lot of folks out there with this position. He probably wouldn't get elected. In any case, there would still be a lot of gridlock in Washington (unless Cruz or Rubio or Kasich got elected). Then we start talking about the 2020 elections.
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Old 03-09-2016, 11:06 AM   #97
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Evidently someone will vote for him. Plenty have and numbers are up. Democrats may throw quiet a few his way also.
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Old 03-09-2016, 11:14 AM   #98
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Assuming the Congress remains Republican, they are not going to allow any president, R or D, to get too far out of line. For example, there is no frickin way that the carrier corporation will be paying 35% import duty on air conditioners made in Mexico. It would require the repeal of the NAFTA treaty and a complete abandonment of long standing republican support for free trade. There are three ways a president can go against the will of the majority in congress: (1) as commander in chief, (2) in nomination of court justices and (3) with executive orders. All three can still be thwarted by congress if the actions are unpopular enough.

If Trump is the nominee, I probably won't vote for president. There are a lot of folks out there with this position. He probably wouldn't get elected. In any case, there would still be a lot of gridlock in Washington (unless Cruz or Rubio or Kasich got elected). Then we start talking about the 2020 elections.
1. NAFTA is a bad joke, it isn't free trade when they put a tariff on our product and we don't reciprocate in kind.

2. Cruz will also result in grid lock..

3. Congress has done almost nothing to stop the current president... why would that change with Hillary as POTUS
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Old 03-09-2016, 11:29 AM   #99
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1. NAFTA is a bad joke, it isn't free trade when they put a tariff on our product and we don't reciprocate in kind.

2. Cruz will also result in grid lock..

3. Congress has done almost nothing to stop the current president... why would that change with Hillary as POTUS
I'm sorry but your wrong on at least two of these. There are no tariffs either way on trade between Mexico, Canada and the U.S. There are some minor costs associated with import / export to cover paperwork and such but no tariffs.

Congress has blocked Obama on almost everything he has wanted since the Republicans took the majority. Just ask any democrat. They have weakened Obamacare, blocked increases in spending and held the line on most regulations. If Obama had his way, we would have a carbon tax on all consumption of fossil fuel plus additional taxes on all kinds of things. Congress doesn't get much credit for stopping things from getting worse because people expect things to get better but I for one am sure glad they have stopped the train wreck Obama endorses.
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Old 03-09-2016, 12:14 PM   #100
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I'm sorry but your wrong on at least two of these. There are no tariffs either way on trade between Mexico, Canada and the U.S. There are some minor costs associated with import / export to cover paperwork and such but no tariffs.

Congress has blocked Obama on almost everything he has wanted since the Republicans took the majority. Just ask any democrat. They have weakened Obamacare, blocked increases in spending and held the line on most regulations. If Obama had his way, we would have a carbon tax on all consumption of fossil fuel plus additional taxes on all kinds of things. Congress doesn't get much credit for stopping things from getting worse because people expect things to get better but I for one am sure glad they have stopped the train wreck Obama endorses.
The no tariff thingy is only if the goods meet a strict criteria and if you have "origin designation" We (the company I work for) ship almost daily to Mexico so I have a pretty good grasp on what is required. We actually manufacture and "value add" to several items which we ship to Mexico..

But I also have friends who live there and they pay heavy taxes to import US goods there for consumption.. The only thing NAFTA did was smooth the way for US companies to move facilities to Mexico..

As for congress impeding Obama's agenda... well on that one we'll just have to disagree... they caved on many things or at best got nothing done at all..

Last edited by Mike Javi Cooper; 03-09-2016 at 12:19 PM.
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