Tbot arrow rest re-clarification

[huntinpool]

I'd love to have a discussion to see what you consider to be "traditional" equipment..

Heres my take on it:
FWIW
Limb design dictates Traditional equipment. Trad stuff has evolved for 1000's of years. It will likely keep evolving too. There are Purist who think all wood D- style is the only longbow while others shoot a R/D limb design. Recurves are the same way, machined risers are more popular than ever but considered non-trad by many because they are not wood. All selfbows don't shoot off the knuckle , some have shelfs. This does not make them any less of a selfbow but again ,frowned upon by some because that's not what they consider a selfbow.
We all have different taste and shoot different types of equipment. The one thing they will all have in common is the LIMB DESIGN.

[Mike Javi Cooper]

Heres my take on it:
FWIW
Limb design dictates Traditional equipment. Trad stuff has evolved for 1000's of years. It will likely keep evolving too. There are Purist who think all wood D- style is the only longbow while others shoot a R/D limb design. Recurves are the same way, machined risers are more popular than ever but considered non-trad by many because they are not wood. All selfbows don't shoot off the knuckle , some have shelfs. This does not make them any less of a selfbow but again ,frowned upon by some because that's not what they consider a selfbow.
We all have different taste and shoot different types of equipment. The one thing they will all have in common is the LIMB DESIGN.

I love innovation and make a living figuring out how to build a better mousetrap.. But at some point you have to say that isn't “traditional”. Look at black powder, these new guns while “better” in many ways are not traditional muzzle loaders even though you shove powder and bullet down the bore from the muzzle... They are not flint lock or cap lock and therefore not “traditional”... A Colt Python is a revolver but it isn't an 1836 Colt Navy...

The same can be said for bows... when do you say... that's modern and that's traditional... Or should we just cange the name to NO CAMS...

To me Traditional Archery is about wooden bows without sights, shot off the shelf... start adding things to that and you're not traditional anymore.. you may be “No Cams” but not traditional.. JMO

[Van/TX]

For me if it has no wheels then it's a Traditional bow. Anything from a selfbow to a fully loaded Olympic style recurve with all the bells and whistles (sights, stabs, clickers, etc)...Van

[Mike Javi Cooper]

For me if it has no wheels then it's a Traditional bow. Anything from a selfbow to a fully loaded Olympic style recurve with all the bells and whistles (sights, stabs, clickers, etc)...Van

So we should change TBot to NCBoT...

[LostHawg]

I figure if someone wants a reason to complain, they'll find a reason to complain.

Same ol, same ol...

[huntinpool]

So we should change TBot to NCBoT...

Thumb-rings date back to the early 1500's were they pre-trad or post -trad.. No trad archers are using releases now, are they untraditional?. What year do you think we switched from Traditional to Modern traditional?

[trad"Doc"53]

I love innovation and make a living figuring out how to build a better mousetrap.. But at some point you have to say that isn't “traditional”. Look at black powder, these new guns while “better” in many ways are not traditional muzzle loaders even though you shove powder and bullet down the bore from the muzzle... They are not flint lock or cap lock and therefore not “traditional”... A Colt Python is a revolver but it isn't an 1836 Colt Navy...

The same can be said for bows... when do you say... that's modern and that's traditional... Or should we just cange the name to NO CAMS...

To me Traditional Archery is about wooden bows without sights, shot off the shelf... start adding things to that and you're not traditional anymore.. you may be “No Cams” but not traditional.. JMO

I truly like the way you think and speak! The largest majority of us started with traditional then went wheelie then came back. WHY? For me it is the simplisity of things, and now there are those that want to start adding this tweeking that, interbreed with wheely bows. There is no way to add enough rules to make everyone happy and what once was a fun thing is now a conglomerated mess! All I got left is this, I have thought about and watched many different things in life. I have found that "progress" in making things better only winds up destroying the basic idea which if it had been left alone would still exist.

[Deb]

Thumb-rings date back to the early 1500's were they pre-trad or post -trad.. No trad archers are using releases now, are they untraditional?. What year do you think we switched from Traditional to Modern traditional?

Are you a lawyer?

[TraditionalRJ]

Now THIS is how a discussion should be had. There should never be any bickering or name calling, etc. I like it! I wonder what will happen to all of it? I don't shoot tbot because I CAN'T shoot tbot. I'm a competitive traditional 3D archer and go to shoots to better my 3D shooting...however, if I'm excluded over a rest being an unfair advantage this is quickly getting nit picky. What if I'm just a better shooter than you are and we are in the same class? Is that an unfair advantage? I get to practice an hour or more a day so what would you consider that? I put my time in to be the best and if I'm not then it's to BEAT the best. I think all this over a rest is a little too much. Take a vote and see what happens? I know that women recently in ASA got their own class because a man has an unfair advantage even though my girl shot with us men for years...now we have a women's class and hardly any women show.

NO SIGHTS, NO WHEELS, NO CABLES, NO STABILIZER, NO PROBLEM!

[LostHawg]

What's wrong with stabilizers? Doesn't a mounted basically serve the same purpose? ...to some extent...

[Mike Javi Cooper]

Thumb-rings date back to the early 1500's were they pre-trad or post -trad.. No trad archers are using releases now, are they untraditional?. What year do you think we switched from Traditional to Modern traditional?

Todd, I’m sure that metal bows pre-date what I consider traditional bows as well and as for releases. I was using a spike & rope on my recurve in the mid 70’s and tried a sight in ’62 or ’63 but that doesn’t make them traditional does it..

It wouldn’t bother me to see the rules say selfbow off the knuckle with wooden arrows and stone tips. That might be a little preclusive for most people but it would be traditional…. Hey, I don't even like take-down bows but I understand why Bob Lee invented the darn things and at least they are still mostly wood...

I just don’t think that Olympic recurves, sights, releases and stabilizers or metal risers, rests and carbon fiber limbs meet the definition or the spirit of traditional. But if folks want to call them traditional I reckon they can, it ain’t gonna hurt my feelings none… ok… well maybe a little..
But don’t be surprised if I don’t give them folks a little nudge once in a while neither...

For “ME” I draw the line at metal risers, carbon fiber limbs, sights, rests, mechanical release aids and stabilizers.. and such things..

[Mike Javi Cooper]

Now THIS is how a discussion should be had. There should never be any bickering or name calling, etc. I like it! I wonder what will happen to all of it? I don't shoot tbot because I CAN'T shoot tbot. I'm a competitive traditional 3D archer and go to shoots to better my 3D shooting...however, if I'm excluded over a rest being an unfair advantage this is quickly getting nit picky. What if I'm just a better shooter than you are and we are in the same class? Is that an unfair advantage? I get to practice an hour or more a day so what would you consider that? I put my time in to be the best and if I'm not then it's to BEAT the best. I think all this over a rest is a little too much. Take a vote and see what happens? I know that women recently in ASA got their own class because a man has an unfair advantage even though my girl shot with us men for years...now we have a women's class and hardly any women show.

NO SIGHTS, NO WHEELS, NO CABLES, NO STABILIZER, NO PROBLEM!

Ryan, if the rest isn't of any use to you then take it off.. I remember when they started getting popular and they did so because you could shoot better off them... not because they didn't help..

[axisbuck24]

Deb,
Todd REST his case!

[Deb]

We have our differences and disagreements here on the trad side but we are friends and treat each other with respect. I am personaly against gadgetry and do-dads of any kind at all-until Todd shows up with intelligent, well researched, fair minded, reasonably stated different opinions that make me think that I may be a stubborn, narrow minded old fool. If, at sometime in the future TBoT has grown into shoots that acommodate all of these different classes (some with thier own ranges, maybe) it sure is gonna be fun to watch Bisch try to shoot them all.

[Deb]

Todd, I’m sure that metal bows pre-date what I consider traditional bows as well and as for releases. I was using a spike & rope on my recurve in the mid 70’s and tried a sight in ’62 or ’63 but that doesn’t make them traditional does it..

It wouldn’t bother me to see the rules say selfbow off the knuckle with wooden arrows and stone tips. That might be a little preclusive for most people but it would be traditional…. Hey, I don't even like take-down bows but I understand why Bob Lee invented the darn things and at least they are still mostly wood...

I just don’t think that Olympic recurves, sights, releases and stabilizers or metal risers, rests and carbon fiber limbs meet the definition or the spirit of traditional. But if folks want to call them traditional I reckon they can, it ain’t gonna hurt my feelings none… ok… well maybe a little..
But don’t be surprised if I don’t give them folks a little nudge once in a while neither...

For “ME” I draw the line at metal risers, carbon fiber limbs, sights, rests, mechanical release aids and stabilizers.. and such things..

Me, too.