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Old 12-21-2017, 04:13 PM   #1
Allaroundhunt
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Default Broad head shooting differently

Set up: draw weight 70lbs
dl:32''
Shooting 350 gr arrow with 100gr field point. All day 3''-4'' group out to 50yds.

Put a 100 gr. fixed blade Muzzy MX-3 and it is shooting down and to the left 6-8''

Any thoughts?

Last year was shooting same setup and it was plug and play, no issues....
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Old 12-21-2017, 04:49 PM   #2
LeanMachine
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Have you shot it through paper recently? I would either do that or bare shaft it to start. Try broadheads again after you are getting a bullet hole through paper. You may still need to make some small adjustments to rest to bring FPs and BHs together.

I was getting a perfect bullet hole before season with my reign 6. Had all kinds of issues with broadheads, including mechanicals, after season started. Went back to the paper and was getting a large left tear. I do not know what changed, but something did. Fixed the paper tune and that fixed the broadhead issues.
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Old 12-21-2017, 04:53 PM   #3
agwrestler
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The change from past to present could be a few things:
1. string/cable stretch changing the tune of the bow
2. bent/out of square broadhead (do a spin test)
3. face/beard pressure contact (if you grew a beard, gained some face or changed the D-loop, the amount of pressure put on the string changed. This pushes the back end of the arrow away from your face at the release.)

I'm not certain what the speed you're getting with a 32/70 setup at an IBO weight arrow, but I bet its way over 300 fps. The faster an arrow is moving through the air, the more effect from each of the 3 scenarios listed above.
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Old 12-21-2017, 05:21 PM   #4
Allaroundhunt
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LeanMachine View Post
Have you shot it through paper recently? I would either do that or bare shaft it to start. Try broadheads again after you are getting a bullet hole through paper. You may still need to make some small adjustments to rest to bring FPs and BHs together.

I was getting a perfect bullet hole before season with my reign 6. Had all kinds of issues with broadheads, including mechanicals, after season started. Went back to the paper and was getting a large left tear. I do not know what changed, but something did. Fixed the paper tune and that fixed the broadhead issues.
I have not paper tuned before, I'll check youtube for some resources.

Thank you
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Old 12-21-2017, 05:23 PM   #5
Allaroundhunt
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Quote:
Originally Posted by agwrestler View Post
The change from past to present could be a few things:
1. string/cable stretch changing the tune of the bow
2. bent/out of square broadhead (do a spin test)
3. face/beard pressure contact (if you grew a beard, gained some face or changed the D-loop, the amount of pressure put on the string changed. This pushes the back end of the arrow away from your face at the release.)

I'm not certain what the speed you're getting with a 32/70 setup at an IBO weight arrow, but I bet its way over 300 fps. The faster an arrow is moving through the air, the more effect from each of the 3 scenarios listed above.
Have not gotten it tested but it's possible.

Unfortunately 2,3 are no go, new broad heads and I can't grow a beard to save my life.
1: I did notice some difference shooting the other day, it was very cold and I had not shot in a while but today it was all spot on. So not sure if that could have been it.
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Old 12-21-2017, 05:42 PM   #6
muddyfuzzy
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350 grains total? Or 350 plus the 100 grain tip weight?


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Old 12-21-2017, 07:14 PM   #7
enewman
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Quote:
Originally Posted by muddyfuzzy View Post
350 grains total? Or 350 plus the 100 grain tip weight?


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At 70 lbs and 32 inch draw. Wonder what spine.
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Old 12-21-2017, 07:37 PM   #8
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Try adjusting you weight up or down a quarter of a turn on each limb. If it gets worse go the other way.
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Old 12-21-2017, 09:24 PM   #9
Allaroundhunt
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Quote:
Originally Posted by muddyfuzzy View Post
350 grains total? Or 350 plus the 100 grain tip weight?


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Sorry, cause some confusion:

Shooting a 350 spine, with 100 grain BH.
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Old 12-21-2017, 09:24 PM   #10
Allaroundhunt
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BO-N-ARO View Post
Try adjusting you weight up or down a quarter of a turn on each limb. If it gets worse go the other way.
Maybe with the added torque arrow is getting over powered?
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Old 12-21-2017, 11:16 PM   #11
agwrestler
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Allaroundhunt View Post
Sorry, cause some confusion:

Shooting a 350 spine, with 100 grain BH.
How long are your arrows? A 350 spine any longer than 28.5" carbon to carbon length will be way underspined and difficult to tune at 70 lbs. I would think the shortest you could shoot without pulling past your rest is around 30"
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Old 12-22-2017, 05:40 AM   #12
rocky
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Quote:
Originally Posted by muddyfuzzy View Post
350 grains total? Or 350 plus the 100 grain tip weight?


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Quote:
Originally Posted by enewman View Post
At 70 lbs and 32 inch draw. Wonder what spine.
Quote:
Originally Posted by agwrestler View Post
How long are your arrows? A 350 spine any longer than 28.5" carbon to carbon length will be way underspined and difficult to tune at 70 lbs. I would think the shortest you could shoot without pulling past your rest is around 30"
These are the right questions before giving any tuning advice.
I don't see how we don't have a spine issue.
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Old 12-22-2017, 07:32 AM   #13
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All good responses, but if you are “only” 8” off at 50 yards paper tuning will not help much. If there is no spine issue try slight adjustments to your rest. Don’t try adjusting windage and elevation in one move. Adjust one, shoot, then adjust the other.


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Old 12-22-2017, 08:09 AM   #14
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How tall are you and what is your wing span? Along with the spine possibly being an issue, having a draw length set too long can cause this kind of flight issue. I don’t know if many folks that have a legit 32” DL.
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Old 12-22-2017, 08:14 AM   #15
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I had semi erratic flight on a Martin Cheetah with muzzys. I know a lot of people use them though. Switched to Slick tricks and that calmed things back down.
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Old 12-22-2017, 11:04 AM   #16
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Rocky and Enewman that have posted on this thread are ones that can help you, but without more info, no way to say what the problem is. Lots of good bow/arrow guys on this sight. Rat and Muddyfuzzy also come to mind.
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Old 12-22-2017, 12:19 PM   #17
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Have you tried to BH tune it yet? Are the arrows ( fp's & bh's ) grouping together at 10 & 20 yards?

We over analyze everything on the site first.
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Old 12-22-2017, 12:30 PM   #18
Adam G.
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You should have a stiffer spine. It's weak for your setup. Stop chasing speed.
Your draw length is above average and speed is already on your side
You should be at a 300 spine minimum and shooting a 450gr plus arrow.

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Old 12-22-2017, 07:44 PM   #19
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move knock point about 1/16" lower and move centerpoint on the rest in about the same. then see if the field points and BH come closer together
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Old 12-23-2017, 10:49 AM   #20
Allaroundhunt
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Quote:
Originally Posted by popup_menace View Post
How tall are you and what is your wing span? Along with the spine possibly being an issue, having a draw length set too long can cause this kind of flight issue. I don’t know if many folks that have a legit 32” DL.
6'2'', Wingspan of 78.5''.
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Old 12-23-2017, 11:04 AM   #21
Allaroundhunt
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Adam G. View Post
You should have a stiffer spine. It's weak for your setup. Stop chasing speed.
Your draw length is above average and speed is already on your side
You should be at a 300 spine minimum and shooting a 450gr plus arrow.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G935A using Tapatalk
From all the feedback, it is sounding like I am underspined, and my arrow might be on the light side.

Never thought consciously that I'm chasing speed but now that you say it I may be guilty as charged. .

Bow: Bear Attitude 32'' Draw, 70lbs.
Shooting Blackout X5 Envy, 32'' Arrow (not including nock or BH)
Spine is 340-matches manufacturers spec for my DL and DW.
Shooting a Spot Hogg Wiseguy release.

Arrow weight with everything running at 425-430 gr.
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Old 12-23-2017, 10:06 PM   #22
borstar1
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Not familiar with blackout envy but looks like they are made by gold tip. Just running your specs on the gold tip website show you should be shooting a .250 spine not . 350.


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Old 12-24-2017, 11:17 AM   #23
Rat
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Allaroundhunt View Post
Set up: draw weight 70lbs
dl:32''
Shooting 350 gr arrow with 100gr field point. All day 3''-4'' group out to 50yds.

Put a 100 gr. fixed blade Muzzy MX-3 and it is shooting down and to the left 6-8''

Any thoughts?

Last year was shooting same setup and it was plug and play, no issues....
Something has changed, either on the bow or on you (form).
If it worked last year it should work this year. So, even though I think the arrows are a little under spined, it should still work.

Bear Attitude is a single cam bow, a little stretch goes a long way in playing havoc with nock point travel on single cam bows.

Here's what I would do:
1) Make sure bow is in spec, A to A, brace height, draw length and draw weight.
2) Make sure bow is tuned correctly, yes, even a single cam needs to be tuned.
3) Make sure nock point and center shot are correct.

Then:
1) Paper tune or bareshaft tune.
2) Walk Back tune.
3) Broadhead/group tune.

The reason I say do this is because, even though it is might be just one thing that has changed, there are a thousand possibilities; instead of chasing wild geese, just start over.

But remember, something could have changed with your form as well; hand on the grip, stance, draw length, anchor, release position...
You will need to go over your sequence and see where the breakdown is, if any.

When someone brings me this problem to the house (for help) this is what I do.
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