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Old 04-04-2020, 03:14 PM   #151
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Richard I don’t see that as being lied to. That’s “this is a new virus and we won’t know what’s going to happen or how it’s going to spread in the US. We HOPED that people would listen and it could have been 2 weeks, or even 4 weeks but sadly they did not.”
Ok but that is what it feels like to a lot of us. Most everyone I know has been doing their best to limit their exposure since it was suggested then mandated. Yet the bar keeps sliding. In the meantime we are seeing friends and family lose their jobs in droves. That to those people is just as scary if not more so than getting the virus because they are seeing numbers that 99+% are surviving it. Im a social guy as are most of my friends and family.....we cant wait for this to be over. That is way more important to us than any money we have lost temporarily. Btw, what is today's date? Feels like March 93rd.

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Old 04-04-2020, 03:19 PM   #152
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Ok but that is what it feels like to a lot of us. Most everyone I know has been doing their best to limit their exposure since it was suggested then mandated. Yet the bar keeps sliding. In the meantime we are seeing friends and family lose their jobs in droves. That to those people is just as scary if not more so than getting the virus because they are seeing numbers that 99+% are surviving it. Im a social guy as are most of my friends and family.....we cant wait for this to be over. That is way more important to us than any money we have lost temporarily.


The issue is that 99% wonít survive it if everyone gets it at once and everyone canít get medical care thatís they need. I have 4 RN friends that are in NYC working crisis assignments at the moment and they are seeing people die in droves. I bet that ANY one of those who died or their family members would give more than just their job to have their family member still be alive.
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Old 04-04-2020, 03:20 PM   #153
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The issue is that 99% wonít survive it if everyone gets it at once and everyone canít get medical care thatís they need. I have 4 RN friends that are in NYC working crisis assignments at the moment and they are seeing people die in droves. I bet that ANY one of those who died or their family members would give more than just their job to have their family member still be alive.
Fair enough.
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Old 04-04-2020, 03:34 PM   #154
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Jenn, I'll add one thing that may help clarify what I'm trying to say....

If we kill the economy and lots of businesses and jobs, then there will be a lot less money available to go into the healthcare system. Without money, the healthcare system will have to be scaled back too. And then, even after the viral outbreak fades, just normal medical needs would be more than a scaled back healthcare system could handle effectively. Those of you in healthcare that still had jobs (not all of you would) would continue to have to make tough choices about how to allocate precious resources, and that would directly affect lives. That situation, if caused by economic collapse, would last a lot longer than it would in a viral outbreak. Neither situation is fun or ideal. But which one would be worse in the long run?
Some people just can't recognize this
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Old 04-04-2020, 03:42 PM   #155
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And for those who managed to save several thousand (even hundreds of thousands)- what good will all that money be when it will soon not even be worth the paper it was printed on? Imagine spending your life savings for a Coke- we laughed when it happened to Mexico. You will just have more TP than others I guess....

And we all know what happens next- government rations and more control followed by looting and rioting. When the looting starts- guess where they are going first? Not their crappy neighbor's house. They are headed for the good loot and all the money or guns in the world isn't going to save you. Call the police? Nope- they are gone. No one is going to put their heads on the line when their paycheck is worthless. Head for the hills? Not when all the roadways will be blocked. And enjoy those briskets and fancy meals while you can. Because when our grocery stores shut down and ranchers/farmers can no longer afford operations, there won't be a steak, chicken, or salad in sight. More gubberment cheese please!

We have seen this very thing happen all over the world and our narcissistic attitudes led us to believe that it can't happen to us. Well- it is happening to us now. We are literally watching it unfold. People are losing their jobs in massive numbers, companies are imploding, the stock market crashed, and a $1200 check isn't going to do jack chit. For those that have been living poor- it is their time to shine. They know how to get by on minimal subsistence and in poor living conditions. The rest of us better learn to catch up with them real quick...

And for those who say you're not going to just lay down and take it, you're going to fight! Well, who are you going to 'fight'? The government? The companies that shut down? The people on welfare? The banks? The stock market? China?? lol.

This IS a time of doom and gloom. How do we bounce back? Eliminate trade with other countries? War? (for what resource?) Build another dam? Give everyone a clean slate, wipe out all our domestic debts/student loans, restructure our credit system, develop a new currency, eliminate taxes, free health care, etc...etc...etc...?

I don't have an answer for all this. I can only say when we have finally dealt with this **** bug, I will do whatever I can to help those in need.
This is my line of thinking, and what I see coming.
People who think metro areas aren't fixing to be run over with crime are delusional.
I would be looking for a way out now.
I've been spending money like mad, while I still can, in preparation.
Not sure what might come, but I don't see it as being good.
If nothing happens, oh well, I'll make it back.
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Old 04-04-2020, 03:43 PM   #156
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Because there is going to come a moment when the number of people who need medical care outnumber the amount of hospital beds available and decisions are going to have to be made about who gets treatment and who doesn't. This is NOT about the death rate at all. It's about not overwhelming our healthcare system like Wuhan, Italy, NYC.... It will get there a whole lot quick if everyone is allowed to do whatever they want all willy nilly.

I've seen it said that "we are being lied to." By who? About what?

I'm really curious about that because I am actually seeing this from the inside and this scares the **** out of me. I am expected to go to work and expose myself to this virus to take care of people who do have it. So it's okay that it's MY life that's being put at risk all because some of y'all can't stand to take a temporary hit to your 401K or small business?


Texas hospitals are so swamped right now that nurses are being let go, the number of positive tests are skyrocketing, and the number of deaths are barely changing. By the time this ďpeakĒ hits, the economy will be in shambles and we will all be more dependent on the govít for care.

If able bodied humans were allowed to do their thing with an abundance of caution, the worst of this would be behind us by now, and weíd be far better prepared to ďpick up the piecesĒ.

Weíre being lied to about the overall severity by officials, and media. Weíre being fed inflated #s, and BS information.



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Old 04-04-2020, 03:49 PM   #157
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Yep Dale I agree on all points.
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Old 04-04-2020, 03:49 PM   #158
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I’d rather die while I’m living, than live while I’m dead
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Old 04-04-2020, 03:52 PM   #159
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Jenn, this is a pic of me and my dad from a couple of years ago. He has myasthenia gravis. As you probably know, the disease causes antibodies that attack nerve receptors in muscles and makes it so muscles stop working. At that time, his disease and those symptoms had really flared up. He was incredibly weak. He couldn't swallow at all, so couldn't eat. He was having a lot of difficulty in just breathing (diaphram is a muscle that wasn't working much either). The medication he required causes lots of extra mucous. Since he couldn't swallow, all that extra mucous in his nose and mouth was choking him. Sitting up on the edge of the bed was the only thing that would allow him to breathe a little. So he couldn't eat, couldn't sleep, couldn't lay down to rest....for days....just trying not to drown and trying to stay alive long enough to get through the hours until the next dose of medicine that would ease symptoms for a few minutes.

IT. SUCKED. I stayed with him in the hospital around the clock for several days. Every now and then, I had to go outside to the back of the parking lot and just pray and cry. Watching Dad go through that was the worst thing I've ever been through. Thank God he recovered. A year later, he was back in the hospital and got even worse. The next year, he was in the hospital for weeks. For a long time, he couldn't even lift his head off the pillow, much less sit on the edge of the bed. God worked through the docs and nurses and life flight EMTs to get him through it again. Dad is a heck of a fighter to get through those times. He's told me several times since then that he doesn't think he has that kind of fight in him anymore, if that kind of thing happens again.

If he gets a bad case of the flu or COVID-19, I imagine it would be equally horrific. I pray that he doesn't get it. I pray that he never has to go through those sever MG symptoms again too. If he does have to face either one at some point, I hope and pray that he'll be able to get the care he needs and that he'll find the strength to overcome it. But one of these days, he won't be here anymore, whether it's because of illness or something else. That day will suck too. BAD.

None of that proves any kind of argument about anything. I just tell that story to make it clear that I clearly understand the implications of all of this. We're all just hoping to find the best plan of action to get through this mess. Whatever that is, we won't get through it without facing some things that REALLY suck. I don't know if my thinking on all of this is 100% correct or not. Time will tell, for all the theories and opinions. I just hope that God will lead us to the best answer. I don't care if the my thoughts are the best answer or not. I just hope we find the best answer.
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Old 04-04-2020, 03:56 PM   #160
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Well, it didn't take long to prove my point. My wife was just placing a grocery order online. Today is the 4th. The EARLIEST available date she can get an order filled at any store in town with an appointment for her to go and pick it up is April 13th at HEB. The earliest date to get an order delivered is past that. All because Wal-Mart and others are now only letting 5 people at a time into their stores, starting today. INSANE.

We're killing the economy and shutting down the supply chain for food - ON PURPOSE. The law enforcement system is about to get a lot more overwhelmed than the healthcare system ever thought about being.

It's time for people to start saying NO to this ridiculousness.
Yep, I went to HEB today and basically had the entire store to myself. They had everything like normal, except for TP, paper towels and bleach stuff. I just needed a few things and a couple hundred beers so I can hang at home for several more weeks.
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Old 04-04-2020, 04:03 PM   #161
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Texas hospitals are so swamped right now that nurses are being let go, the number of positive tests are skyrocketing, and the number of deaths are barely changing. By the time this ďpeakĒ hits, the economy will be in shambles and we will all be more dependent on the govít for care.

Weíre being lied to about the overall severity by officials, and media. Weíre being fed inflated #s, and BS information.
I heard a comment today from my Dr buddy that was interesting. He said he has heard the term "presumed positive" used in the last few days from his Health Department contact. He says that in some places, the are stating that if a family member is positive, then the family is "presumed positive." That means instead of 1 positive case, a positive case in a family of 4 is now 4 positive cases.
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Old 04-04-2020, 04:12 PM   #162
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Originally Posted by Dale Moser View Post
Texas hospitals are so swamped right now that nurses are being let go, the number of positive tests are skyrocketing, and the number of deaths are barely changing. By the time this ďpeakĒ hits, the economy will be in shambles and we will all be more dependent on the govít for care.

If able bodied humans were allowed to do their thing with an abundance of caution, the worst of this would be behind us by now, and weíd be far better prepared to ďpick up the piecesĒ.

Weíre being lied to about the overall severity by officials, and media. Weíre being fed inflated #s, and BS information.



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I wish I could say it better but I canít.
Hospitals will not be overwhelmed
If we all go right back to normal activity 99% of the people will not die
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Old 04-04-2020, 04:28 PM   #163
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If able bodied humans were allowed to do their thing with an abundance of caution, the worst of this would be behind us by now, and we’d be far better prepared to “pick up the pieces”.

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You have a lot more faith in the general public than I do. I bet 60% don’t know what “abundance of caution” means.

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Old 04-04-2020, 04:42 PM   #164
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From reading this thread “The Tribe” is getting restless you can tell by the emotion in the comments. I totally understand the frustration, unknown for our future and Families. Unfortunately until the riots begin in the more populated areas or the average joes are fed up we are stuck until the true leaders draw the line in the sand.
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Old 04-04-2020, 04:45 PM   #165
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Interesting thread on multiple levels. I am not saying "health versus economics" or vice versa holds more weight. But i can tell you we need both to be a viable country, state, and community. If both implode it will be hail to pay. I am pretty agnostic on political parties after being burned by all the false promises so i wont say they are "lying" to the citizens. I will say they are trying to figure this crap out. I gotta trust the Fauci's of the world waaaaaay more than a bunch of talking heads.......and TBHers! This ain't good personally, economically or health-wise for our nation but it is a scourge we need to beat.
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The country was already done financially. This will just speed it up a bit. Look at the debt. We canít even pay the interest on the debt, let alone the principle. At some point, there was going to be a reckoning. The whole world economy will retract so it may all just be relative.
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Yep, hammer meets nail! It is happening with an assist from CV-19. It is a sound fact we have been in debt as a nation for decades. CV is calling in the bank note!
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the models have been spot on so far. Not sure what the future holds. If we just open back up like business as usual, that virus will burn through the country like a wildfire. Probably kill a quarter million folks. Many of whom will be our doctors and nurses who then wonít be around to take care of those left. You saved your small business but you lost a spouse, a child, a parent, or a friend?? America will recover at some point. Probably a lot faster than anyone expected.
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Could not have illustrated or said it better. Nobody wants the economic system to falter or fail...Ö..but if the infection rate spirals now we have bigger issues.
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This is my thinking as well. Our economy "seemed" strong, but like any business that grows too fast, wasn't very sturdy. Too much student debt, too much corporate debt and too much personal debt. What if.....our government saw an opportunity to retract the economy without it seeming as if it crashed on its own, which it would soon have done anyhow, and they used the COVID19 opportunity as a smokescreen. Our economy was due for a correction. What better opportunity to hide the fact that it was crashing.

....thoughts from a college dropout.
Not gonna jump on another conspiracy theory but what I underlined is a absolute fact...ÖÖ...we are at the end of a economic orgy...Ö..party had to end some time. Time for musical chairs and sadly China holds all the financial cards.
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Unless your one of the few then it might matter.
Bingeaux!!! I ain't giving up none of mine, we are ready to survive...Ö...even the very elderly and sickly portions of the family! My great aunt turns 99 in two weeks and I will defend her to the bitter end......as I suspect all of you will!
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Wait.....I read in a post above (a post you agreed with) that we arenít supposed to give a **** how many old people die?
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Lmaooooo! Been a few of those on multiple threads lately.
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When did cancer and heart disease become communicable diseases?
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Folks have been using some odd examples for weeks that have zero bearing on THIS current threat. I cant even respond to those posts.


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This is spot on...while Iím absolutely as concerned about the economic fallout of this virus, Iím ALOT more concerned about the potential loss of life...amazing how many are flippant about people dying...must not be in public safety or healthcare...
Agreed...ÖÖ.it is a fine line but some of this is amazingly odd to read.
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Excellent post Shane. Iím with you on probably 70% of your points. I disagree on the magnitude of the healthcare collapse/fallout, and the justification of the fear of lawlessness to just roll over for the weak in our society.

I too, donít agree at all that we should hole up forever, thatís not living. But this isnít the flu, and temporary isolation is a very strong approach to flattening the curve. But just accepting the negative impacts hits EXTREMELY close to home for some of us, and I think thatís lost on those who are not in those shoes. Whoís ready to give up the love of their life if it would guarantee that the economy would prevail. This question hits my where I live, and it doesnít for most people. Iím just being honest that Iím not willing to roll the dice with my wifeís life.
Well stated!
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Look at the National financial situation and tell me how this was in any way sustainable. It was going to all come down anyway. The math catches up at some point. We have spent and borrowed the country into bankruptcy already. What does it matter if it happens now or 5 years from now. I know...it sounds crazy, and itís just my opinion, but God blesses this country for His glory. And he will chastise it to refocus us.
https://www.usdebtclock.org/2000.html
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Cold hard undisputable facts!!! Yep, not a good time but it was coming sooner or later. I rather take this arse whipping now so my kid and grandkids don't have to deal with it. Reset button will be pressed!
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Because there is going to come a moment when the number of people who need medical care outnumber the amount of hospital beds available and decisions are going to have to be made about who gets treatment and who doesn't. This is NOT about the death rate at all. It's about not overwhelming our healthcare system like Wuhan, Italy, NYC.... It will get there a whole lot quick if everyone is allowed to do whatever they want all willy nilly.

I've seen it said that "we are being lied to." By who? About what?

I'm really curious about that because I am actually seeing this from the inside and this scares the **** out of me. I am expected to go to work and expose myself to this virus to take care of people who do have it. So it's okay that it's MY life that's being put at risk all because some of y'all can't stand to take a temporary hit to your 401K or small business?
Thank you for posting. Thank you for sharing real insight. I am hopeful that it is temporary (90 - 120 days) to let this scourge clear out. But I do know the economy will not exist if the health system collapse upon itself, that will start a domino effect.
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The issue is that 99% wonít survive it if everyone gets it at once and everyone canít get medical care thatís they need. I have 4 RN friends that are in NYC working crisis assignments at the moment and they are seeing people die in droves. I bet that ANY one of those who died or their family members would give more than just their job to have their family member still be alive.
Cold hard and to the point!
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Old 04-04-2020, 04:48 PM   #166
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And I am scared. Not for me. My kids are about to join the working world- if they have a chance to. That what scares me. I also have lots of family in “high risk”. Have told them they need to self quarantine. My Dad told me I better fill my hands if I’m gonna lock him inside.
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Old 04-04-2020, 05:05 PM   #167
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The issue is that 99% wonít survive it if everyone gets it at once and everyone canít get medical care thatís they need. I have 4 RN friends that are in NYC working crisis assignments at the moment and they are seeing people die in droves. I bet that ANY one of those who died or their family members would give more than just their job to have their family member still be alive.
Let me ask you this. Serious question....
Do you protect the 95% for the sake of 5% or protect the 5% for the sake of the 95%.
Those are just numbers I pulled out of the air for arguments sake but this is the argument being made by everyone here that is for forging ahead while being reasonable in their approach to getting back to work.
When it personally hits someone of course their perspective can be different due to tunnel vision but you MUST look at the bigger picture for the greater good of the country as a whole.
I applaud you and every one else battling the virus and I hope you and your family remain safe as I do for every American.
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Old 04-04-2020, 05:12 PM   #168
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Shane said it better but I think it is worth reiterating. It is not about valuing life over money. It is about saving some lives now vs many lives later. It is trying to save the economy now and possibly overwhelming a healthcare system for a few months. VS having a worldwide depression and crashing the entire economy and healthcare system at the same time. Have you considered how many lives will be lost in a worldwide depression? It would likely be in the many millions a year and could last decades.
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Old 04-04-2020, 05:17 PM   #169
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Randy. I have Garcaís delivery service headed your way. Make sure you tip him well.
I hope he gets the right kind of whiskey!
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Old 04-04-2020, 05:38 PM   #170
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The needs of the many out weigh the needs of the few. It's always been that way. You seal off a water tight bulkhead to keep the ship afloat even if some sailors are caught in that compartment.
But this virus isn't killing everyone. Y'all act like everyone who gets t is doomed. That is far from the truth. A bunch of people have to get it to build immunity to it.
The problem is the lies being spread by the government/ media that fuel the social disorder that will end up killing more than the virus. 90 to 120 days is not temporary and nobody I know has supplies for that long of a hold out.

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Old 04-04-2020, 06:09 PM   #171
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Iím more worried about the economic destruction than the virus, people are recovering from the virus but everyone is slowly getting killed by the down fall of the economy! Open chit up, we canít continue on this path or we will be a country of ruins.
I heart this And couldnít agree more
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Old 04-04-2020, 06:17 PM   #172
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It will be 8 weeks total if I had to guess. That’s what my sister had to do in Shanghai. I posted a link to her Facebook update a while back. Even if China has been untruthful through some of this I feel US will follow what they did. Either that or pass out ivamed to everyone! How funny will it be if that’s the cure.
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Old 04-04-2020, 06:22 PM   #173
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Seeing as about 1/2 of you guys and gals would sacrifice me (Im high risk) to save your wallet I think I'll just pray for all of us.
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Old 04-04-2020, 06:31 PM   #174
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Seeing as about 1/2 of you guys and gals would sacrifice me (Im high risk) to save your wallet I think I'll just pray for all of us.
Man, I'm truly sorry you see it this way. I'll pray for good health and prosperity for you and all else as well.

A ton of wisdom in this thread. What else can be said at this point? I've gotten more out of this community than all the govt and talking heads combined. Its comforting to know that the SIP and virus hasn't diminished critical thinking and so help me God, as long as we have that and are free to excercise that we will prevail...
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Old 04-04-2020, 06:48 PM   #175
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It will be 8 weeks total if I had to guess. Thatís what my sister had to do in Shanghai. I posted a link to her Facebook update a while back. Even if China has been untruthful through some of this I feel US will follow what they did. Either that or pass out ivamed to everyone! How funny will it be if thatís the cure.
When was the start date for us? Last week, 3 weeks ago, today?
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Old 04-04-2020, 06:51 PM   #176
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Originally Posted by Walker View Post
Seeing as about 1/2 of you guys and gals would sacrifice me (Im high risk) to save your wallet I think I'll just pray for all of us.
I don't think anyone wants to sacrifice you or anyone else that is high-risk. But we are in serious danger of pushing the fulcrum of our liberty towards a permanent point of imbalance- more government control in exchange for health care and bail outs.

But praying never hurts! I will join ya.
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Old 04-04-2020, 07:01 PM   #177
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Seeing as about 1/2 of you guys and gals would sacrifice me (Im high risk) to save your wallet I think I'll just pray for all of us.
Thank you for praying for all of us, I've been doing the same. Nobody is wanting to sacrifice you or anybody else.

Are you still in the work force or are you retired?
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Old 04-04-2020, 07:06 PM   #178
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Thank you for praying for all of us, I've been doing the same. Nobody is wanting to sacrifice you or anybody else.

Are you still in the work force or are you retired?
Im retired and have no financial worrries unless my pension fund collapses.
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Old 04-04-2020, 07:15 PM   #179
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I just typed a really long post and talked about what I think our best (least bad) course of action should be. Keep the most vulnerable sheltered. Everybody take common sense precautions. Everyone that's healthy - get back to work. Government get out of the way. Get helpful drugs into the hands of doctors and sick people. Get testing going. They keep saying it's coming, but it's not. Get everyone tested, and get the results fast. Get a vaccine done and distributed (this will take the longest of everything, even if government gets out of the way).

One thing to add to it would be something else government should do that would help. They should pass a law that no one can sue their employer or any business if they catch COVID-19. Lots of what we're seeing now with restricting access to grocery stores and the like are driven by corporate lawyers who are fearful of lawsuits over COVID-19. Companies need to be given immunity (legal) so that they can continue to operate freely. Disrupting our supply chain, especially for food and basic necessities, will have far-reaching negative consequences.
Everybody thatís healthy is only healthy until theyíre not. When this thing first started TBH was full of ďit ainít nuthiní but the fluĒ. This mindset is why itís like a wildfire right now in the big cities. People continue to congregate. Itís one thing for a person to choose his or her own fate, but when you are carrying Covid-19 and donít know it you can infect so many others that didnít choose that fate. Itís like a ripple in a pond, it just keeps going. I agree that if the current conditions continue it will play hell with our economy, but money isnít everything. Ask a dying man if he would rather have five more years or a million dollars. I think yíall know what that answer would be.

Believe me, I understand where yíall are coming from, and I hope and pray that we can get a handle on this, and not for selfish reasons. Iím 73, my life is all but over, Iíve made all the money Iím gonna make and Iím pretty sure Iíll never get the virus because of my lifestyle. Hell, I donít even get a flu shot, because Iím never around people. Gotta make contact with somebody to get sick. Right now, Iím thinking about all the crap thatís gonna happen when people are at a loss as to how to cope, Iím betting theyíre gonna do some crazy **** in order to stay alive. Iím betting the things most folks are griping about now are gonna be the least of our worries. I hope Iím wrong.
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Old 04-04-2020, 07:21 PM   #180
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Would you believe pneumonia deaths are down by about 2000 this year? Strangest thing...


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Old 04-04-2020, 07:24 PM   #181
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Seeing as about 1/2 of you guys and gals would sacrifice me (Im high risk) to save your wallet I think I'll just pray for all of us.
How would anyone elses action affect you.

You just lock yourself in your home and your good right?
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Old 04-04-2020, 07:33 PM   #182
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We should find out pretty quick. Georgia governor just opened up the public beaches and is considering lifting other bans
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Old 04-04-2020, 07:41 PM   #183
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Im retired and have no financial worrries unless my pension fund collapses.
I'm one of the ones that want to get back to work. I've been self employed for 30 years and if we don't get back soon I'll need to close up shop. In that time frame I have never not met payroll or missed paying a bill on time. I have employees that rely I "me" for a paycheck to support their families. I don't want to be that guy that has to let any employee go . I've already eliminated "my" pay check the last two pay periods to buy more time to weather this storm. So it isn't about the almighty dollar for me.

My question is for the at high risk people. Is it wrong to ask all the high risk people to self quarantine to allow those of us that still need pay checks to support our family to get back to work?

If we go into a depression (that's the direction we are headed) causing millions of people to be unemployed, food rationing and desperation, a whole lot more people are going to dye from other methods than from this virus. The dollar will basically be worthless too.
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Old 04-04-2020, 07:46 PM   #184
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I'm one of the ones that want to get back to work. I've been self employed for 30 years and if we don't get back soon I'll need to close up shop. In that time frame I have never not met payroll or missed paying a bill on time. I have employees that rely I "me" for a paycheck to support their families. I don't want to be that guy that has to let any employee go . I've already eliminated "my" pay check the last two pay periods to buy more time to weather this storm. So it isn't about the almighty dollar for me.

My question is for the at high risk people. Is it wrong to ask all the high risk people to self quarantine to allow those of us that still need pay checks to support our family to get back to work?

If we go into a depression (that's the direction we are headed) causing millions of people to be unemployed, food rationing and desperation, a whole lot more people are going to dye from other methods than from this virus. The dollar will basically be worthless too.

I support this.


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Old 04-04-2020, 07:48 PM   #185
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Everybody that’s healthy is only healthy until they’re not. When this thing first started TBH was full of “it ain’t nuthin’ but the flu”. This mindset is why it’s like a wildfire right now in the big cities. People continue to congregate. It’s one thing for a person to choose his or her own fate, but when you are carrying Covid-19 and don’t know it you can infect so many others that didn’t choose that fate. It’s like a ripple in a pond, it just keeps going. I agree that if the current conditions continue it will play hell with our economy, but money isn’t everything. Ask a dying man if he would rather have five more years or a million dollars. I think y’all know what that answer would be.

Believe me, I understand where y’all are coming from, and I hope and pray that we can get a handle on this, and not for selfish reasons. I’m 73, my life is all but over, I’ve made all the money I’m gonna make and I’m pretty sure I’ll never get the virus because of my lifestyle. Hell, I don’t even get a flu shot, because I’m never around people. Gotta make contact with somebody to get sick. Right now, I’m thinking about all the crap that’s gonna happen when people are at a loss as to how to cope, I’m betting they’re gonna do some crazy **** in order to stay alive. I’m betting the things most folks are griping about now are gonna be the least of our worries. I hope I’m wrong.
If you think my motive is to preserve my money while somebody else dies, then you don't understand what I said at all. I'm worried about the virus as well as the long term damage to our collective safety resulting from intentionally killing our economy.

And, while some people are congregating in big numbers and ignoring the recommendations to not do that, I haven't heard of anyone anywhere being required to join them. The folks who are at high risk and the folks who aren't but are still just scared of the virus are free to just stay home still, right? You still have the right to choose your own response to this thing, even if other people are able to choose theirs and get back to work. We need people to get back to work so that people like you will have everything you need to be safe, well fed, and cared for.

Last edited by Shane; 04-04-2020 at 07:51 PM.
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Old 04-04-2020, 08:12 PM   #186
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Great thread BTW - I truly like to read different perspectives based on current situations.

I have not once advocated the personal wealth over the health of the US! I have not read anyone else advocating that either. As the people who strongly believe that we should SIP for the good of all, we who believe the economic implications for the entire US economy.

I am also a business owner with 15 plus full time employees. I have left the majority of profits in the company for growth. Thank God i have done that so I can afford to pay my people who cant work due to all of the closures such as child care. I have been working since this thing started due to being essential. I have had to enter multiple facilities for material and goods and so far I have not been infected. I have taken all precautions that I can and I assure you my wife is very worried for me and the family.

I will continue to pray!
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Old 04-04-2020, 08:21 PM   #187
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For those that missed it. Real life experience from my sister in China that has been through https://m.facebook.com/story.php?sto...&id=1460943304
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Old 04-04-2020, 08:26 PM   #188
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You young ones keep working and pay taxes. I'm receiving Social security and have my Medicare card. No money in the stock market. LOL!!
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Old 04-04-2020, 09:23 PM   #189
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Originally Posted by Shane View Post
If you think my motive is to preserve my money while somebody else dies, then you don't understand what I said at all. I'm worried about the virus as well as the long term damage to our collective safety resulting from intentionally killing our economy.

And, while some people are congregating in big numbers and ignoring the recommendations to not do that, I haven't heard of anyone anywhere being required to join them. The folks who are at high risk and the folks who aren't but are still just scared of the virus are free to just stay home still, right? You still have the right to choose your own response to this thing, even if other people are able to choose theirs and get back to work. We need people to get back to work so that people like you will have everything you need to be safe, well fed, and cared for.


I cannot figure out why this is so hard to grasp...

I do not have near the grasp on the economy that you do, but it doesnít take Warren Buffett to see what weíre gonna have left after this virus, if something doesnít change VERY quickly.


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Old 04-04-2020, 10:03 PM   #190
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The needs of the many out weigh the needs of the few. It's always been that way. You seal off a water tight bulkhead to keep the ship afloat even if some sailors are caught in that compartment.
But this virus isn't killing everyone. Y'all act like everyone who gets t is doomed. That is far from the truth. A bunch of people have to get it to build immunity to it.
The problem is the lies being spread by the government/ media that fuel the social disorder that will end up killing more than the virus. 90 to 120 days is not temporary and nobody I know has supplies for that long of a hold out.


Gary
A oncologist posted this today concerned about his cancer and hemotolgy patients
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Old 04-04-2020, 10:37 PM   #191
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A oncologist posted this today concerned about his cancer and hemotolgy patients
Is that all you got? Calling me a jackass? Weak.

Gary
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Old 04-04-2020, 10:47 PM   #192
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I cannot figure out why this is so hard to grasp...

I do not have near the grasp on the economy that you do, but it doesnít take Warren Buffett to see what weíre gonna have left after this virus, if something doesnít change VERY quickly.


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Dale, this is what will happen if we go back to business as usual:
1) the virus will spread rapidly, itís incredibly contagious. Think Wuhan in the early stages.
2) 20% will have severe symptoms and a bunch of them will be hospitalized. Based on what weíve seen so far in hard hit areas.
3) Nurses and doctors taking care of those people will become infected and taken out. Thereís not enough PPE, look at New York for an example of this. Some data suggest its more severe in medical staff because they are getting multiple exposures.
4) Now thereís no one available to take care of the folks left. Or prepare for the second wave. You basically decimate the healthcare infrastructure


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Old 04-04-2020, 10:55 PM   #193
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Yes tightly populated areas using public transportation are more at risk.
Doesn't change the fact the rest of us are in a bad situation not because of the virus, but because of government over reach.

Gary
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Old 04-04-2020, 11:00 PM   #194
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My daughter had the virus a couple weeks ago. My parents are in their 70s. My dad has an autoimmune disease and is pretty weak. He's also at HIGH risk of catching every virus that comes along. My mom just had breast cancer and radiation a few months ago. She's pretty high risk for things like this too. They're also at high risk of being the victims of all of the negative effects of an economic depression. I love my family more than life itself. I'm not willing to sacrifice their lives to preserve my money or anyone else's money. And, frankly, it's it's an insult to continue to hear that is what is being advocated by those of us who recognize the real risks of financial collapse. I know you're not trying to be insulting - at ALL. And I'm not mad at you. It's just frustrating to keep seeing that response in these conversations everywhere.

"Temporary isolation" was acceptable when it meant "2 weeks and we can flatten the curve". But every day, "temporary isolation" is morphing into "indefinite isolation". It's now meaning something closer to 2 months. What will it mean tomorrow? Every week we keep things shut down, the other risks to our loved ones lives go up. That curve will grow exponentially too, if we allow it to.
This is much more eloquently stated than I could have come up with, that being said, I agree 100%.

We are on the verge of a monumental and life changing economic collapse of which the world has never seen. We can not afford to be shut down for another 30-45 days. If yíall though the collapse of 2008 was bad, just sit back and watch this epic train wreck unfold if we keep the economy shut down for another 45 days
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Old 04-04-2020, 11:05 PM   #195
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A oncologist posted this today concerned about his cancer and hemotolgy patients
Na. Those GIs would have just capped that donkey. Something else going on there. Irrelevant to this situation
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Old 04-04-2020, 11:08 PM   #196
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Is that all you got? Calling me a jackass? Weak.

Gary
If your foot hurts itís from you sticking your own foot in your mouth, as I didnít step on your toes
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Old 04-04-2020, 11:20 PM   #197
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Dale, this is what will happen if we go back to business as usual:
1) the virus will spread rapidly, itís incredibly contagious. Think Wuhan in the early stages.
2) 20% will have severe symptoms and a bunch of them will be hospitalized. Based on what weíve seen so far in hard hit areas.
3) Nurses and doctors taking care of those people will become infected and taken out. Thereís not enough PPE, look at New York for an example of this. Some data suggest its more severe in medical staff because they are getting multiple exposures.
4) Now thereís no one available to take care of the folks left. Or prepare for the second wave. You basically decimate the healthcare infrastructure


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Projected, and likely to happen, unfortunately now or whenever we poke our heads outside. However, waiting much longer WILL sink our economy. The point is, your post is probably correct, but not avoidable either way. We cant throw a depression on top of it. It's just not an option. We weren't ready, we have some tuff times ahead.
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Old 04-04-2020, 11:24 PM   #198
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I loss count of how many times folks have said "HEALTHY people with no underlining issues" are good to roam freely and get back to work. Oh well, I guess that is out the door. The last two days there have been multiple widows in there 30's saying there husbands are DEAD, and just 10 days ago were running at 100 mph changing the world! Is nobody seeing the interviews? Or, they could be faked interviews, kinda like the Sandy Hook shooting. The theory of young and healthy are not susceptible is out the door as little children are without a parent. Covid 19 is finding its way from children to geriatrics...ÖÖ.and anybody in the middle.
My second boredom induced thought: Politically what's up with this lack of trust of the decisions being made? I thought we had the right folks in the right seats on the bus? Lets all trust the direction we are going as a nation. We have $2.2 trillion allocated (not enough of that is allocated to medical, but I digress), another $2 trillion being floated for infrastructure repairs and also plans for filling up all the oil reserves in Texas & Louisiana. Heck, sounds like a decent plan to hold it all together until the crisis/social experiment is complete or we crash & burn on the trash heap of history like ancient Rome. Can't have it both ways my fellow Americans, but it wont be long until we know. I absolutely agree, it is truly a fine line between pandemic & economics but none of us are being asked to participate in the sausage making. The cows are out the barn on this one. I wish everybody comes out smelling like roses, and all is good in the world at the end of the day......but I ain't willing to bet on it with what we are dealing with globally and the divide we have as a nation.
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Old 04-04-2020, 11:25 PM   #199
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People in the high risk category need to shelter in place along with their caregivers. Those of us that are healthy need to be living our lives. Im 56 in good health with a neice that has CF and obviously many elderly family members. Im checking in on them and making sure they have what they need. I still think this is a bunch of bull****. The cure is going to be way worse than the illness.

Doc comes in and says, you know that infection in your pinky toe is pretty bad, I think we better amputate your leg.....in fact we might as well amputate both of your legs. We dont want you to have any problems with your pinky fingers.

That is what this feels like to me.

Also Im guessing I had this starting on Feb 1. I understand there is now an easy test to see if indeed a person has had it. I plan on getting that test once this stuff settles down. I want to know if it was here for sure that early.
Agreed
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Old 04-04-2020, 11:27 PM   #200
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Projected, and likely to happen, unfortunately now or whenever we poke our heads outside. However, waiting much longer WILL sink our economy. The point is, your post is probably correct, but not avoidable either way. We cant throw a depression on top of it. It's just not an option. We weren't ready, we have some tuff times ahead.


My company just released tonight that they have 150,000 doses of medicine ready to give away for free if the studies come back good in two weeks. If we can keep shut down even until then, it bridges us to a treatment/cure. If the data shows it doesnít work, whole different situation.


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