This is going to make some people cringe! LOL!

[Horitexan]

I like him and he is a good Dude but his farewell was classless. At least he left on his terms.

I must have missed that thread. Wish I could pull it up somehow. Anyway, yeah that sux. I can understand getting infuriated at TBH and I can understand wanting to lash out but life will eventually teach you that it really doesn't pay off being ugly. You can make a classy and clever exit that is even more sharp and biting while keeping more folks on your side. Ah well, life goes on. Lol.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Doug Roberts]

http://creedmoorinfozone.com/index.p...6-5-creedmoor/

There is a comparison of the two calibers at the end of this article.

That was a really good article, Thank you!

[DRT]

OMG. Ragin is going to have a fit!

Ragin doesn't live here anymore.

[bboswell]

Ragin doesn't live here anymore.

Yes.....but I made sure that he knew about this gem [emoji6]

[Big pig]

Fully agree on both points - but will also add that I think Remington was a fool not to challenge the 6.5 Creedmoor with the .260 in the first place.

But they didn't... and now the 6.5 Creed is way out in front, gaining headway each and every day. So their only choice at this point was to get on the bandwagon.

Just my opinion. I still want a .260. But the Creedmoor offerings are becoming much easier to find.

All the best,
Glenn

The .260 is an awesome round. But I bought one of the first model 7's and It was the worst shooting rifles I ever owned. I spent s fortune on ammo and barrels.

[Jethro]

Does the 6.5c have a different twist over the .260 & where does it gain/win?? I honestly haven't kept up with all the hype.

That is really why the .243 won...The 6mm was meant to be a larger varmint caliber to shoot 70gr pills & everyone liked the .243 because it shot the 100gr due to a faster twist. I still think the 6mm was an overall better application & really don't like either of these on larger game vs a cartridge like the 257 Roberts.

Remington originally brought the .244 out in the 722, the precursor to the 700. At the time the pre-64 Winchester 70 was still being built and it was a way better rifle. The 721/722 had cheap wood and even cheaper bottom metal. Mainly the 722 just felt like a POS compared to the M-70. That was one strike against them.

Second strike was that the 244 was primarily marketed as a varmint round, and had the appropriate twist and bullet weights for that. As such it was great. But Remmy totally dropped the ball by not marketing it as a true dual purpose cartridge.

Third strike was the 243 was the brainchild of Warren Page (240 Page Super Pooper) which was commercialized. Winchester set it up as a true dual purpose deer/varmint cartridge from the beginning with the right twist rate to handle bullets for both, and factory ammo for both. Page and his buddies put the full marketing ploy of the gun rags of the time behind his baby, and it quickly outstripped the 244.

Remington tried to recover by putting better wood and bottom metal on their rifle and renaming it the 700. At the same time they renamed the .244 to 6mm, changed the twist, and brought out both deer and varmint loads in it. But it was too late. The 243 train had already started rolling down the tracks and nothing Remington did seemed to change it. Which is a shame because when pushed to the limits the 6mm is easily capable of outrunning the 243. Many a good cartridge has fallen to the woes of marketing though.

The story of the Roberts was similar. Lack of good factory ammo is what killed it. A fair number of the old rifles rechambered to it were Mausers brought back from the war. Most were plenty strong, but some were not. The 257 was mainly considered a gun cranks cartridge. In the hands of a good handloader in a strong action it was wonderful. But in factory form with limited and anemic loads, not so much.

At least that is my outlook on that whole situation. Others opinion may vary, and be as much or more valid than my own.

[T_Sebastian]

http://creedmoorinfozone.com/index.p...6-5-creedmoor/

There is a comparison of the two calibers at the end of this article.

Good read. Thanks!

[sendit]

Remington originally brought the .244 out in the 722, the precursor to the 700. At the time the pre-64 Winchester 70 was still being built and it was a way better rifle. The 721/722 had cheap wood and even cheaper bottom metal. Mainly the 722 just felt like a POS compared to the M-70. That was one strike against them.

Second strike was that the 244 was primarily marketed as a varmint round, and had the appropriate twist and bullet weights for that. As such it was great. But Remmy totally dropped the ball by not marketing it as a true dual purpose cartridge.

Third strike was the 243 was the brainchild of Warren Page (240 Page Super Pooper) which was commercialized. Winchester set it up as a true dual purpose deer/varmint cartridge from the beginning with the right twist rate to handle bullets for both, and factory ammo for both. Page and his buddies put the full marketing ploy of the gun rags of the time behind his baby, and it quickly outstripped the 244.

Remington tried to recover by putting better wood and bottom metal on their rifle and renaming it the 700. At the same time they renamed the .244 to 6mm, changed the twist, and brought out both deer and varmint loads in it. But it was too late. The 243 train had already started rolling down the tracks and nothing Remington did seemed to change it. Which is a shame because when pushed to the limits the 6mm is easily capable of outrunning the 243. Many a good cartridge has fallen to the woes of marketing though.

The story of the Roberts was similar. Lack of good factory ammo is what killed it. A fair number of the old rifles rechambered to it were Mausers brought back from the war. Most were plenty strong, but some were not. The 257 was mainly considered a gun cranks cartridge. In the hands of a good handloader in a strong action it was wonderful. But in factory form with limited and anemic loads, not so much.

At least that is my outlook on that whole situation. Others opinion may vary, and be as much or more valid than my own.

Remington has failed over and over with cartridges. You forgot about the 280 Rem being renamed to the 7mm-06 then to 7mm Express and then back to the 280 Rem. IT did and still does confuse people.Though a nice round, they sure don't market it as such.

[Jethro]

I remember the 280 going to 7mm Express and back, but the 7mm-06 naming must have slipped by me. The 280 should have put the 270 in the grave. Except for O Conner preachin' the gospel that is.

[KC Huntin]

Has anyone shot this rifle?

[BBReezen]

No thanks, I'll keep my great grandpas 1963 model 700 ADL in 264

[kmon]

Those rifles are not for me, 1 they are of the modern era Remington where QC is just 2 letters that mean nothing. I have seen new Remington rifles with no rifling in the barrel, burs so large on bolt faces no round would chamber and have experienced a M700 firing when the safety was disengaged. I still have a few Remington rifles (Mostly 788s) The 700s that I still have wear after market triggers.
Remington also has a history of missing the boat on cartridge introduction and support for cartridges after they were introduced, throw them out there with a couple gun rag articles and let them sink or swim or just dog paddle their way to where ever they make it.

I will just give my $ to other gun companies now after a few bad experiences that would have never happened if they had a true QC department.

[sir shovelhands]

Remington also has a history of missing the boat on cartridge introduction and support for cartridges after they were introduced, throw them out there with a couple gun rag articles and let them sink or swim or just dog paddle their way to where ever they make it.

Like the 280 rem...

[kmon]

Like the 280 rem...

280 they cut the operating pressure because it would be chambered in a semiauto but that came rifle was chambered in 270 and 30-06 so why not spec the 280 to the same pressure?

6.5 Rem Mag and 350 Rem Mag both good cartridges and what many have gone to now shorter fatter rounds but introduced in a gun that was hated by the gun scribes. Left to linger into obscurity.

244 Remington already discussed but missed the boat on twist.

5mm Remington Magnum is a rimfire with good ballistics but the owners of those rifles left hanging with a useless gun when they stopped making ammo.

7mm-08 they got right by most accounts but it took many years before it was found by many. I have been shooting the 708 for 32 years but for the first half of that it was rarely promoted by big green but was just too good not to make it. Though it could use a heavier factory loading like 162gr and beat the 6.5 Creedmoor at longer ranges though it does have a little more recoil.

260, they left that one pretty much to Jim Carmichael to promote his cartridge in Outdoor life where he was gun editor for years.

They did pretty good on the RUMs but on the short action SARUM they were behind Winchester on those and most are rarely seen now and ammo is getting harder to find. And with Remington track record expect them to die a slow death.

7mmSTW good cartridge from Layne Simpson but it is hard to find ammo these days, very limited runs .