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Inserts vs Outserts

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    Inserts vs Outserts

    I need to finish setting up some fmj's and was thinking about going with outserts. I tried to put in some inserts and couldn't get them seated all the way in with the tool. It's like the glue dried to fast or something. Does it really matter which one I use?

    #2
    To me an outsert is more structurally sound but a properly installed insert should fair well too. I use plain old JB weld epoxy to help with working time during the installs. I have personally have had good luck with the HIT inserts but I really like the Ethics static half outs the best if you are thinking about outserts I would look at them pretty hard.

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      #3
      Most people generally gravitate towards the HIT system for the smaller diameter arrows as this is the OEM component. That being said there is some upside to running Outserts as they reinforce the load bearing areas of the arrow on impact. I’ve seen a few Eastons over the years where the bond breaks with the HIT insert driving the point back into the face of the shaft ruining the arrow in the process. The adhesives are not made to carry a sheer load across the bond, this is the cyclic loading the arrow sees every time it impacts a target or animal. Glues can become brittle with time and can lead to failure especially on heavy bone hits. Outserts can be a pain with certain types of targets as well but I’ve been using them exclusively for the last eight years with my Third Hand Rag Bag with no issues. Which ever you decide to go with be sure to use a 2-part epoxy when installing either. The slower cure will allow you to properly seat the HIT to the proper depth without the adhesive quick setting on you which sounds like the issue you encountered. If you decide to go the outsert route shoot me a pm and I can walk you through the process I use to get good figment while minimizing runout.


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        #4
        AAE 2-part epoxy is what I use on the Deep Impacts, stuff is awesome. As always the devil is in the details with the prep but when done right they are virtually impossible to get off.


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          #5
          Those outserts look like a good idea. Kinda like footing the arrow and should help prevent damage

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            #6
            Has anyone used the FOCOS system from Black Eagle? Looks interesting, though I don't like the length it adds to the arrow (or the length you have to cut to make total length the same, which affects spine).
            I'm probably going to go with the Day Six outsert system for my next micro build.

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              #7
              Originally posted by SharpEnd View Post
              Has anyone used the FOCOS system from Black Eagle? Looks interesting, though I don't like the length it adds to the arrow (or the length you have to cut to make total length the same, which affects spine).
              I'm probably going to go with the Day Six outsert system for my next micro build.

              I run the standard SS on my Deep Impacts. If you are going to add weight to build FOC the most efficient and effective way to do so is with broadhead weight. You can have two arrows say 500 grains TAW. One with 100 grains of tip weight loaded with 100 grains of insert weight and the other with 175 grains of tip weight loaded with a standard 25 grain insert. The FOC will always be higher with the second build all other things being equal. It’s just a function of the math, nothing more. If you are going to add weight forward you might as well add it where you are going to get the most bang for the buck in the penetration department. You’ve already settled on the TAW, and committed to the speed associated with the setup so you might as well take advantage of the physics.

              A lot of these “systems” are new to the market and in response to guys wanting to explore high/EFOC setups, it’s a good thing. However, those of use that have been doing this for a while generally tend to take a little more old school approach to building FOC for the reason listed above. You can keep it simple, save money and still build a high quality lethal arrow using a conventional approach.


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                #8
                Originally posted by muddyfuzzy View Post
                AAE 2-part epoxy is what I use on the Deep Impacts, stuff is awesome. As always the devil is in the details with the prep but when done right they are virtually impossible to get off.


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                I was trying to use the G5 Blu glu.

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                  #9
                  Originally posted by mikeyb_23 View Post
                  I was trying to use the G5 Blu glu.

                  That’s a great glue but it sets up pretty quick. I use Instabond IR-1500for standard inserts and can’t dilly dally around when setting them or they will stick in the process. All those glues are cyanoacrylate fast setting adhesives and that’s just how they are.


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                    #10
                    Originally posted by muddyfuzzy View Post
                    That’s a great glue but it sets up pretty quick. I use Instabond IR-1500for standard inserts and can’t dilly dally around when setting them or they will stick in the process. All those glues are cyanoacrylate fast setting adhesives and that’s just how they are.


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                    I'll pick me up some of that AAE epoxy, what brand of outserts do you recommend?

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                      #11
                      Black Eagle sells 56 grain SS Outserts for my Deep Impacts so that’s what I use, for customer stuff I use the Ethics components when required.


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                        #12
                        On something like that I use 2 part golf club epoxy, of course I use it on a regular basis. They make a 15 minute, but I use the one hour, if it’ll hold clubs, it’ll hold arrows.

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                          #13
                          Originally posted by muddyfuzzy View Post
                          Black Eagle sells 56 grain SS Outserts for my Deep Impacts so that’s what I use, for customer stuff I use the Ethics components when required.


                          Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
                          The only outserts I could find online that are in-stock are 75 grains. They are the easton half outs. My arrows now are 28 inches and 5mm fmj 340's. I'm shooting a Obsession fx6 at 66lbs I believe. Won't the half outs make me underspined? Using a 100gr broadhead.

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                            #14
                            Inserts vs Outserts

                            Originally posted by mikeyb_23 View Post
                            The only outserts I could find online that are in-stock are 75 grains. They are the easton half outs. My arrows now are 28 inches and 5mm fmj 340's. I'm shooting a Obsession fx6 at 66lbs I believe. Won't the half outs make me underspined? Using a 100gr broadhead.

                            What’s the draw length?


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                              #15
                              Originally posted by muddyfuzzy View Post
                              What’s the draw length?


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                              Well I thought it was 28, but not sure now. I now for sure the arrows are 28 inches. I will double check when I get back home.

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