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Old 11-09-2017, 12:58 PM   #1
LennyWayne
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Default AR Deer Hunting w/Walker Beagles? Whatcha' think?

Deeeer Greenscreen.....

I am leaving this evening to meet a group at my deer lease (2nd year member) to hunt deer with Walker Beagle hunting dogs on Saturday morning, the opening day of gun season in Arkansas (where I am part of a hunting club).

I am extremely torn, and feel that I recognize the ethical boundary of this type of hunting, but also understand that this is when most of the "meat" deer are taken each year.

I have already decided that I will be participatiing this year, and I am not asking to be chastised, but more interested in the general opinion of this type of hunting. The dog owner is 65 y/o, and has been breeding this string of dogs since he was a 10 y/o Arkansas boy (his words....).

What does the green screen think about hunting deer over a pack of dogs, that have been bred (for 3 generations) to not only chase deer but drive them towards the hunting party stationed out in front of hounds.
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Old 11-09-2017, 01:03 PM   #2
TexasArchery_27
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Never been a fan of "Hunting" by running dogs. It's an extremely unfair and successful method that I would only think would be needed in a famine or serious survival situation. I know that if I harvested a deer with that method I wouldn't feel too proud or that I accomplished anything. Just my 2 pesos
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Old 11-09-2017, 01:07 PM   #3
BeetleGuy
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I grew hunting in Arkansas and have seen dogs running deer on my property. I never hunted with dogs but have killed deer that someone else dog ran past me. I think it is just another way to hunt. It is a tradition and legal. Nothing wrong with it at all in my eyes. I think it would be an exciting hunt
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Old 11-09-2017, 01:07 PM   #4
AntlerCollector
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It's a very effective way to kill a deer. Grew up in East Texas hunting that way until it was illegal. My family pretty much killed every deer around. If we saw a track we got excited and put the dogs on them. Sometimes I miss those days, but it's nice to actually have deer in the woods now.
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Old 11-09-2017, 01:09 PM   #5
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I personally have done it and Have no problem with it. I know several old timers who quit hunting when they outlawed it in Texas. They don’t see the sport in shooting one over a pile of corn or a feeder. To each their own. Have a good time.
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Old 11-09-2017, 01:12 PM   #6
LennyWayne
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wow...I'm surprised at the responses so far, and REALLY appreciate the encouragement. I'm 50 years old, and have been hunting in Texas my whole life.

I am having a hard time with this, but the positive feedback really does take some of the stress off of my decision.

Good luck to you all, and keep the comments coming, as I'm interested in hearing the opinions.
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Old 11-09-2017, 01:20 PM   #7
AntlerCollector
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A shotgun with buckshot was the weapon on choice back then. Keep us posted on your hunt
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Old 11-09-2017, 01:22 PM   #8
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You’ll have a big time! There’s nothing quite like hearing the dogs turn your way on a hot race. It got outlawed in our zone (3) when the out of state retirees moved in. It was a blast and we miss it. You might want to carry a shotgun with buckshot instead of a rifle, depending on what you’re hunting in.

Contrary to some of the previous posts, it’s not super efficient and the deer will run where they’ll run. Dogs can’t make a deer run a certain direction. I’ll go out on a limb here and say it’s a little more difficult and fun than shooting a deer over a bait pile.
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Old 11-09-2017, 01:22 PM   #9
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I remember going as a kid once, the group my dad was with (his first time hunting with them) peppered a yearling doe about 8 or 9 times before actually killing it. She was bloody from head to toe. We never did that again. I think if done right it could be a lot more ethical than what I saw, but if it's ok to run pigs and catch them with dogs what's the difference? Also from what I've read about where it is still legal most of your older mature deer are smart enough to bed down and let the dogs pass them by or circle back, most of the deer killed are younger deer.
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Old 11-09-2017, 01:22 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LennyWayne View Post
wow...I'm surprised at the responses so far, and REALLY appreciate the encouragement. I'm 50 years old, and have been hunting in Texas my whole life.

I am having a hard time with this, but the positive feedback really does take some of the stress off of my decision.

Good luck to you all, and keep the comments coming, as I'm interested in hearing the opinions.
Donít stress or feel guilty. Just a different way to hunt. Those dogs had to be trained to do this. You all have to setup correctly and safely. Still have to have a deer come by you and make a shot. It could be fast paced and I bet you enjoy it. People can find a way to judge any type of hunting.
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Old 11-09-2017, 01:23 PM   #11
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My grandfather raised running Walkers (foxhounds) in Alabama.
I enjoyed watching them and man, it was exciting hunting.
Those dogs were incredible.
I'd go, you don't have to pull the trigger to be better for the experience.
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Old 11-09-2017, 01:24 PM   #12
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I am not interested in hunting any big game with dogs, not even bears or mountain lions. But I am all for it if someone else wants to. Have fun and I hope you fill your freezer! I believe as hunters we need to support legal methods even if we don't like it. I despise trapping but recognize it is a viable form of pest and predator control so I support the right of those that enjoy trapping. Heck many gun only hunters think bowhunting is cruel. If we keep turning on each we won't need PETA or anti-hunters to ruin our beloved past time, we will do it ourselves.
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Old 11-09-2017, 01:25 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Razrbk89 View Post
Youíll have a big time! Thereís nothing quite like hearing the dogs turn your way on a hot race. It got outlawed in our zone (3) when the out of state retirees moved in. It was a blast and we miss it. You might want to carry a shotgun with buckshot instead of a rifle, depending on what youíre hunting in.

Contrary to some of the previous posts, itís not super efficient and the deer will run where theyíll run. Dogs canít make a deer run a certain direction. Iíll go out on a limb here and say itís a little more difficult and fun than shooting a deer over a bait pile.

I'm sure it can get the heart pumping, having another animal chase your target and seeing them scatter for their lives. I'm curious though, if it's more difficult what sort of preparation is needed? Do you have to scout? Trail cams? Temp matter? Wind direction matter? Because from the sound of it, all that is uneeded. Sounds like on any given day you can let the dogs loose and have a real life arcade (Like one of the games at Bass Pro Shops)
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Old 11-09-2017, 01:27 PM   #14
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Unless someone is hunting naked and strangling deer with his bare hands, they can't say **** about any legal tool choice someone else uses.

And as far as I know, Leon and maybe Burnadell are the only ones on the TBH that can do that...
so .. Good luck and enjoy yourself.
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Old 11-09-2017, 01:31 PM   #15
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This thread is bringing back memories. I hope you have a great time. There's nothing like hearing those dogs headed your direction knowing a deer is about to bust out of the woods!
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Old 11-09-2017, 01:31 PM   #16
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I seen videos of this kind of hunt and personals didn't care for it. But if given the chance I would try it. I don't think it's any more or less ethical than ringing the dinner bell and watching the deer come to you. The main thing I didn't like was there seemed to be a higher injured deer, not recovered rate. Go do it, have fun and post some pics!
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Old 11-09-2017, 01:38 PM   #17
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I can still hear the race start up in the bottoms outside Leola Arkansas, along with the whistle from the sawmill. Back then (1970s) the season was only a couple weeks long, doe days were the Thanksgiving weekend and if my memory serves me correctly every other year. The guys on the lease didnt make a lot of money anyway so they hunted for maximum meat in the freezer. I don't know what the lease fees were then, first year I had to pay (1982) I think it was $125.

Also important was the evening ritual of going to round up the dogs, hit other camps and see what was killed that day and hope someone had shot a deer in front of your dogs and offered up the usual 1/2 of the deer. My dad had beagles, others in the camp had beagles and/or walkers.

The good times can't be replaced.
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Old 11-09-2017, 01:39 PM   #18
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Go and have fun! Never done it but love running dogs on everything else.
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Old 11-09-2017, 01:43 PM   #19
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Go do it and have a blast. I've killed many deer in front of a pack of dogs in North Carolina, though most I killed were slipping out the side of the block we were hunting. I love to hear a pack in full cry. If it's an old deer, he's going to go down in the swamps and thickets and tack round and round, not coming into the open to give anyone a shot. You still have to know where to set up, most of the oldtimers will have an idea where the deer will run. I recommend a full choked 12 ga with either 00 buck or #1 buck, with the 00 being my favorite.

Last edited by Phillip Fields; 11-09-2017 at 01:46 PM..
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Old 11-09-2017, 01:53 PM   #20
LennyWayne
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You guys have changed my opinion, and these posts have been fantastic.

I will take some pictures and share them on Tuesday morning, so be sure to look for this thread, and I'll also share my experience.

thank you ALL!
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Old 11-09-2017, 01:54 PM   #21
Razorback01
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Mr. Fields hit it on the head, the dogs were used to keep the deer moving, not often was a deer shot in front of the dogs. Similar to the feeder strategy used here, if we didn't have feeders, you would never see a deer. No, I'm not hating on feeders.
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Old 11-09-2017, 02:03 PM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LennyWayne View Post
wow...I'm surprised at the responses so far, and REALLY appreciate the encouragement. I'm 50 years old, and have been hunting in Texas my whole life.

I am having a hard time with this, but the positive feedback really does take some of the stress off of my decision.

Good luck to you all, and keep the comments coming, as I'm interested in hearing the opinions.
It is legal there and given the opportunity I would certainly jump on it. From someone stating earlier that it isnt fair. But it is certainly more sport in it than hunting in a blind over food. How many deer get away compared to getting killed? I am sure the deer get away their fair share as well. Watching good dogs work in any aspect is my favorite thing to do.
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Old 11-09-2017, 02:05 PM   #23
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Its legal and a part of the traditions of where your going so absolutely do it with a clear conscious! I am all about experiencing things new things in new places!

I did it a few times when it was still legal in East Texas. Remember it being a big social gathering and a good time. I never killed any doing it but others did. It definitely isn't a slam dunk hunt!

Enjoy it and take some pics for a report when you get back!
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Old 11-09-2017, 02:06 PM   #24
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Im sure coyotes and wolves dont think their method of hunting is 'unsporting'.
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Old 11-09-2017, 02:08 PM   #25
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Personally wouldn't do it for any game animal, but it's really up to the individual.
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Old 11-09-2017, 02:10 PM   #26
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Not a fan...Why? Is is that tough get a deer hunting in a blind over a trail or something?
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Old 11-09-2017, 02:14 PM   #27
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Back in the 80's I was invited to a hunting club in Arkansas around El Dorado. That is the way they hunted - in fact to be a member you had to own at least 3 deer dogs. We all went out to our stands then somebody would take the dogs out and turn them loose. I have to say it was exciting to hear the dogs when they got on a deer and wondering what they might chase in your direction. They were really old school - they didn't shoot does but if it had any antlers at all, BOOM! Not my favorite way to hunt but it was fun to do once.
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Old 11-09-2017, 02:14 PM   #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TexasArchery_27 View Post
I'm sure it can get the heart pumping, having another animal chase your target and seeing them scatter for their lives. I'm curious though, if it's more difficult what sort of preparation is needed? Do you have to scout? Trail cams? Temp matter? Wind direction matter? Because from the sound of it, all that is uneeded. Sounds like on any given day you can let the dogs loose and have a real life arcade (Like one of the games at Bass Pro Shops)
Why so quick to totally criticize/dismiss a tradition that you know nothing of?
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Old 11-09-2017, 02:17 PM   #29
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I would try it.
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Old 11-09-2017, 02:34 PM   #30
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Never been a fan of "Hunting" by running dogs. It's an extremely unfair and successful method that I would only think would be needed in a famine or serious survival situation. I know that if I harvested a deer with that method I wouldn't feel too proud or that I accomplished anything. Just my 2 pesos
Quote:
Originally Posted by TexasArchery_27 View Post
I'm sure it can get the heart pumping, having another animal chase your target and seeing them scatter for their lives. I'm curious though, if it's more difficult what sort of preparation is needed? Do you have to scout? Trail cams? Temp matter? Wind direction matter? Because from the sound of it, all that is uneeded. Sounds like on any given day you can let the dogs loose and have a real life arcade (Like one of the games at Bass Pro Shops)
Quote:
Originally Posted by boy wonder View Post
Why so quick to totally criticize/dismiss a tradition that you know nothing of?
EXACTLY!!
He jumped right in there bashing right away while all the time admitting he'd never actually been on a hunt like this... knows absolutely nothing about what to do to hunt with dogs, and nothing about what is required to be successful... You know this is the perfect illustrations about the similarities between opinions and *******s... Some of the young folks on here should probably take up the tension on their triggers a bit... They might learn something...

OP: I grew up hunting this way, and let me tell you, there's nothing more exciting than to hear the hounds on a hot trail... My family raised several breeds for hunting deer, but mostly Walker's and Redbones... They've got a bark like nothing else in the woods... I still have my grandpa's horn and it's one of my most cherished possessions because of the memories it brings back... My first good buck is hanging on my wall right now that my dad got mounted for me... I killed him with a brand new Browning 3" magnum shotgun he bought me for Christmas... Don't know who was more proud... me for getting the buck, or my dad seeing me do it... You go have a great time and absorb it all in! You'll likely make memories that will be with you the rest of your life!

Of course, it's not legal in Texas any longer and it's a dying sport, but it is sure fun, and a bigger challenge than sitting over a feeder as far as being able to dependably kill a deer. I can tell you that from close to 50 years experience at doing both... I no longer hunt that way, and I do prefer the way it is now... that the dogs aren't in the woods running deer, but in my younger days, there was no more fun times than deer camp, with the dogs tied up at the edge of the light, and all the men sitting around the campfire telling stories, then finally going to bed on a pallet on the ground and so excited there's no way to possibly go to sleep...

You go have fun and come back and tell us about it... Oh yea, and yes, pics or it didn't happen!
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Old 11-09-2017, 02:34 PM   #31
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I never really got to do it BUT
I was 6 or 7 years old hunting squirrels at my grandparents house and had a pack of dogs come through the bottom chasing a deer with a man on a horse with them.
It was the coolest thing I had ever seen.

It is one of my earliest memories.

I bet you have a great time

Last edited by Buff; 11-09-2017 at 02:36 PM..
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Old 11-09-2017, 02:41 PM   #32
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Saltwater, I forgot about the mouth-blown bullhorn. I'll have to ask my dad if he still has it. Real bullhorn with molded mouthpiece. I can't recall how they formed the mouthpiece, but vinegar seems to ring a bell.
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Old 11-09-2017, 02:49 PM   #33
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Not my thing, but if it is a legal means of hunting where you are - to each his own.
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Old 11-09-2017, 02:52 PM   #34
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Yep, my grandpa's was an old horn and his just had a whittled out mouthpiece that wasn't more than the sharp point of the horn cut off and rounded and a hand drilled/whittled hole through to the inside of the horn... had a groove whittled about an inch or so in front of the mouthpiece that has a leather string tied around it tight in the groove for a lanyard... It's packed away in a box from our move... I need to dig that thing out and put it on display in my man-cave/office...
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Old 11-09-2017, 02:55 PM   #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SaltwaterSlick View Post
EXACTLY!!
He jumped right in there bashing right away while all the time admitting he'd never actually been on a hunt like this... knows absolutely nothing about what to do to hunt with dogs, and nothing about what is required to be successful... You know this is the perfect illustrations about the similarities between opinions and *******s... Some of the young folks on here should probably take up the tension on their triggers a bit... They might learn something...

OP: I grew up hunting this way, and let me tell you, there's nothing more exciting than to hear the hounds on a hot trail... My family raised several breeds for hunting deer, but mostly Walker's and Redbones... They've got a bark like nothing else in the woods... I still have my grandpa's horn and it's one of my most cherished possessions because of the memories it brings back... My first good buck is hanging on my wall right now that my dad got mounted for me... I killed him with a brand new Browning 3" magnum shotgun he bought me for Christmas... Don't know who was more proud... me for getting the buck, or my dad seeing me do it... You go have a great time and absorb it all in! You'll likely make memories that will be with you the rest of your life!

Of course, it's not legal in Texas any longer and it's a dying sport, but it is sure fun, and a bigger challenge than sitting over a feeder as far as being able to dependably kill a deer. I can tell you that from close to 50 years experience at doing both... I no longer hunt that way, and I do prefer the way it is now... that the dogs aren't in the woods running deer, but in my younger days, there was no more fun times than deer camp, with the dogs tied up at the edge of the light, and all the men sitting around the campfire telling stories, then finally going to bed on a pallet on the ground and so excited there's no way to possibly go to sleep...

You go have fun and come back and tell us about it... Oh yea, and yes, pics or it didn't happen!

The appeal to tradition is a fallacy in an argument, and not a good one for making a convincing argument. There's a reason it's outlawed in almost 80% of our states. In my post were several questions and opportunities to educate those of us that have never partaken in this method. Yet, you decide to attack me, rather than my argument after the OP ASKED FOR OPINIONS.
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Old 11-09-2017, 02:59 PM   #36
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Iíd like to try it. Sounds like it would be a blast, like dove hunting but a whole lot bigger and I might be able to hit one because I can take the plug out

My dad killed his first deer running dogs and a single shot 12 gauge
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Old 11-09-2017, 03:04 PM   #37
kenfa03
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Originally Posted by Razrbk89 View Post
Youíll have a big time! Thereís nothing quite like hearing the dogs turn your way on a hot race. It got outlawed in our zone (3) when the out of state retirees moved in. It was a blast and we miss it. You might want to carry a shotgun with buckshot instead of a rifle, depending on what youíre hunting in.

Contrary to some of the previous posts, itís not super efficient and the deer will run where theyíll run. Dogs canít make a deer run a certain direction. Iíll go out on a limb here and say itís a little more difficult and fun than shooting a deer over a bait pile.


This. Grew up running walker hounds.


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Old 11-09-2017, 03:05 PM   #38
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That's how my dad, uncles and granddaddy all hunted growing up. Before my time, but I loved hearing the stories. I'd jump on it in a heartbeat if I had a chance to go.
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Old 11-09-2017, 03:07 PM   #39
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Originally Posted by TexasArchery_27 View Post
The appeal to tradition is a fallacy in an argument, and not a good one for making a convincing argument. There's a reason it's outlawed in almost 80% of our states. In my post were several questions and opportunities to educate those of us that have never partaken in this method. Yet, you decide to attack me, rather than my argument after the OP ASKED FOR OPINIONS.
Whats the reason is what outlawed?
I mean the real reason ..not the perceived one of it being 'unethical'...'unfair'...etc... laws dont get passed if there isnt a monetary loss somewhere..
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Old 11-09-2017, 03:13 PM   #40
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You're asking for an objective answer, while also supporting your reasoning with a subjective statement. LOLOLOL
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Old 11-09-2017, 03:13 PM   #41
SaltwaterSlick
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Originally Posted by TexasArchery_27 View Post
The appeal to tradition is a fallacy in an argument, and not a good one for making a convincing argument. There's a reason it's outlawed in almost 80% of our states. In my post were several questions and opportunities to educate those of us that have never partaken in this method. Yet, you decide to attack me, rather than my argument after the OP ASKED FOR OPINIONS.
Actually I COULD go into addressing your questions, but that didn't seem to me the focus of your posts... Your posts were an attack on something you know nothing about...but frankly, you're not worth the effort. My interest was in addressing the OP's post not yours...
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Old 11-09-2017, 03:15 PM   #42
LennyWayne
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WOW...

Now, after all of these posts, I'M ALL IN.

I promise to post on my experience.

Texas Archery_27 It is clear you are intelligent, and I appreciate you taking time to post. I do ask that you understand how passionate the guys that have done this in the past can be, as they (we) are simply watching a tradition die away. I see a where it's hard not to take things personally, and especially when you feel attacked, but I also understand the passion of those that wish they could do it....but can't because of lawmakers that fall prey to the "tree huger" mentality.

In truth, I believe that I might just be blessed with sharing the experience of an opportunity that many hunters may never get.
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Old 11-09-2017, 03:15 PM   #43
SaltwaterSlick
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Whats the reason is what outlawed?
I mean the real reason ..not the perceived one of it being 'unethical'...'unfair'...etc... laws dont get passed if there isnt a monetary loss somewhere..
Just go back and look at his posts in just about any thread that he participates in and you'll see he's a troll and not worth your efforts either...
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Old 11-09-2017, 03:16 PM   #44
systemnt
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TexasArchery_27 View Post
You're asking for an objective answer, while also supporting your reasoning with a subjective statement. LOLOLOL
hmm
you stated.. and I quote:

Quote:
Originally Posted by TexasArchery_27 View Post
There's a reason it's outlawed in almost 80% of our states.
I asked:
Quote:
Originally Posted by systemnt
Whats the reason is what outlawed?
I mean the real reason ..not the perceived one of it being 'unethical'...'unfair'...etc... laws dont get passed if there isnt a monetary loss somewhere..
Pretty straight forward.. you said it was outlawed for a reason.. whats the reason?
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Old 11-09-2017, 03:17 PM   #45
Clark
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Originally Posted by LennyWayne View Post
You guys have changed my opinion, and these posts have been fantastic.

I will take some pictures and share them on Tuesday morning, so be sure to look for this thread, and I'll also share my experience.

thank you ALL!
Have fun and good luck.
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Old 11-09-2017, 03:24 PM   #46
Buff
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Originally Posted by SaltwaterSlick View Post
Just go back and look at his posts in just about any thread that he participates in and you'll see he's a troll and not worth your efforts either...
I was thinking the same thing.
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Old 11-09-2017, 03:26 PM   #47
LennyWayne
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Unless someone is hunting naked and strangling deer with his bare hands, they can't say **** about any legal tool choice someone else uses.

And as far as I know, Leon and maybe Burnadell are the only ones on the TBH that can do that...
so .. Good luck and enjoy yourself.
This post made me LOL...I've been following Burnadell stories for years, and someday I hope that I have the opportunity to shake this man's hand! GREATNESS....LOL!

I can almost hear his mama saying...."NOW Burnadell, You know that I told you not to go running around NAKED, and STRANGL'N those dang deer! Go get me a switch!"
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Old 11-09-2017, 03:26 PM   #48
TexasArchery_27
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Originally Posted by SaltwaterSlick View Post
Actually I COULD go into addressing your questions, but that didn't seem to me the focus of your posts... Your posts were an attack on something you know nothing about...but frankly, you're not worth the effort. My interest was in addressing the OP's post not yours...
Lol, you got your old condescending panties in a wad when I went after your what you feel is a time honored tradition because you're emotionally attached to those memories. Now you're making an excuse for your own laziness and even trying to belittle me as if that puts you higher on the pedestal.

If you haven't noticed, this is a public forum with the opportunity for many eyes to see and would be an excellent opportunity for you to educate the viewers on the ins/outs of using dogs as a method of hunting. Don't get so offended at an opposing opinion on this controversial method, especially when the opinion is warranted (whether it be for or against)
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Old 11-09-2017, 03:28 PM   #49
Phillip Fields
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hmm
you stated.. and I quote:



I asked:


Pretty straight forward.. you said it was outlawed for a reason.. whats the reason?
There are several reasons that factored in. The primary one being the same one that causes a lot of problems with hog doggers in Texas. Dogs can't read No Trespassing signs. With the population growing and property being broken up into smaller and smaller parcels along with increasing development the large tracts of land where dogs could run without going onto a neighbors property are disappearing. The first states that outlawed dog hunting were in the Northeast where the population grew fastest.
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Old 11-09-2017, 03:28 PM   #50
Eastwood
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My dad grew up in Malvern, Ark. and he has some interesting stories from the 50's and 60's. He said some hunters would line up on the county roads to shoot the deer as they crossed because that was some of the only open space to be had in the timber. He said that older deer that had survived a few seasons would run toward the sound of a pulp wood truck coming down the road. The deer would pass behind the truck because it would create a cloud of dust to conceal them. Nothing wrong with it, just a different way to kill deer. My dad also jokes that he didn't know that people hunted deer during the day till he moved to Texas!
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