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Old 04-10-2017, 07:58 PM   #51
BrandonA
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Originally Posted by RodinaRanč View Post
Fact of the matter is ...this too will pass & they know it...next time someone books a flight...if united is 20-30% cheaper than the next guy...you will buy it, so will i & a whole host of other folks
No , no I won't but that's just me. Depending on how United handles this will determine if I ever fly with them.

Last edited by BrandonA; 04-10-2017 at 08:02 PM..
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Old 04-10-2017, 07:59 PM   #52
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Originally Posted by CaptainDave View Post
I would wager the airlines budget for a certain level of expected passenger vouchers considering overbooking is not uncommon. It's probably written off as a cost of doing business based on their best execution model for booking flights (or whatever they want to call it).

To me it was just a stupid decision for the airline. Why didn't they just up the voucher until another passenger accepted?
This^^^ & they should have reconciled seats to confirmations before boarding
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Old 04-10-2017, 07:59 PM   #53
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Originally Posted by jerp View Post
As has been said above, overbooking is part of the deal when you fly. You don't have any "right" to that seat - they own the airplane so if they tell you to get off, you get off. You can then decide to never fly United again if you want. The airline handled it poorly, no doubt. They should have upped the bid until they got a taker. Or, the captain says "ok, we are going to sit here until someone gets off"
X2 poorly handled situation. Just think of the irony here "United" unless your selected & dragged off
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Old 04-10-2017, 08:02 PM   #54
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Originally Posted by outlook8 View Post
I can guarantee you that if I had paid for a seat on that plane and didn't want to take a later flight, they would have to drag me out kicking and screaming too...not any passengers fault united didn't plan ahead!
You and I both, Brother! When people are treated poorly, they tend to take it badly. I hope he sues and wins BIGLY (as Trump says).
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Old 04-10-2017, 08:03 PM   #55
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Originally Posted by RodinaRan View Post
Fact of the matter is ...this too will pass & they know it...next time someone books a flight...if united is 20-30% cheaper than the next guy...you will buy it, so will i & a whole host of other folks
Actually that's not always true. I had a really bad experience once with Delta about 14 years ago. They tried to make my 2 year old sit across the aisle from me where it was just a single seat (this was a small plane with one double row and one single row). They refused to try to facilitate a switch saying it waz their policy not to make any changes after ticketing is done and had a horrible attitude about the entire incident. Finally another passenger and her husband agreed to switch seats with my child and I so my 2 year old wasn't stuck alone. It was ridiculous. I called Delta and they ended up giving me $800 in vouchers for the inconvenience and insensitivity of the crew but I never used them and never will. I don't care how much Delta could save me on a trip, after that, they lost my business for good.
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Old 04-10-2017, 08:03 PM   #56
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Originally Posted by jerp View Post
As has been said above, overbooking is part of the deal when you fly. You don't have any "right" to that seat - they own the airplane so if they tell you to get off, you get off. You can then decide to never fly United again if you want. The airline handled it poorly, no doubt. They should have upped the bid until they got a taker. Or, the captain says "ok, we are going to sit here until someone gets off"
This is my thoughts on it. I've been on multiple flights where volunteers were asked to give up a seat and there is always a number you can hit to have people catch a later flight.
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Old 04-10-2017, 08:04 PM   #57
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Originally Posted by jerp View Post
As has been said above, overbooking is part of the deal when you fly. You don't have any "right" to that seat - they own the airplane so if they tell you to get off, you get off. You can then decide to never fly United again if you want. The airline handled it poorly, no doubt. They should have upped the bid until they got a taker. Or, the captain says "ok, we are going to sit here until someone gets off"
Doesnt work that way either...when it comes down to it...lowest cost seat on the plane get ls the boot (unless that person has status)...right/wrong or indifferent & every contract of carriage i've ever read stated exactly that
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Old 04-10-2017, 08:06 PM   #58
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Originally Posted by RodinaRanč View Post
Fact of the matter is ...this too will pass & they know it...next time someone books a flight...if united is 20-30% cheaper than the next guy...you will buy it, so will i & a whole host of other folks
Not everyone... as a matter of fact I've flown alot with southwest(multiple years reaching their companion pass status) and was recently thinking about starting to fly United more. Not now, I think I'll stick with southwest.
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Old 04-10-2017, 08:08 PM   #59
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Originally Posted by nursejenn View Post
Actually that's not always true. I had a really bad experience once with Delta about 14 years ago. They tried to make my 2 year old sit across the aisle from me where it was just a single seat (this was a small plane with one double row and one single row). They refused to try to facilitate a switch saying it waz their policy not to make any changes after ticketing is done and had a horrible attitude about the entire incident. Finally another passenger and her husband agreed to switch seats with my child and I so my 2 year old wasn't stuck alone. It was ridiculous. I called Delta and they ended up giving me $800 in vouchers for the inconvenience and insensitivity of the crew but I never used them and never will. I don't care how much Delta could save me on a trip, after that, they lost my business for good.
Yes...everyone that flies has a "story"....fact is every airline competes for the same traveler's $....& if you or i don't buy the seat...someonelse will & if not, most airlines will not fly a negative margin flight unless they need an asset or resource in a specific place...they will cancel flights before they loose $
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Old 04-10-2017, 08:09 PM   #60
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Originally Posted by RodinaRanč View Post
Doesnt work that way either...when it comes down to it...lowest cost seat on the plane get ls the boot (unless that person has status)...right/wrong or indifferent & every contract of carriage i've ever read stated exactly that
Your full of ****... That's exactly how it works. Airlines will negotiate. I don't fly as much as I use to but my question is what position do you have with United?
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Old 04-10-2017, 08:11 PM   #61
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Originally Posted by RodinaRanč View Post
Doesnt work that way either...when it comes down to it...lowest cost seat on the plane get ls the boot (unless that person has status)...right/wrong or indifferent & every contract of carriage i've ever read stated exactly that
I think most people are aware of the selection process if you're going to remove a passenger against their will. What most people are agreeing to is that you shouldn't have to forcibly remove a passenger so that you have a PR issue as well as a possible lawsuit. They could've offered $10,000 for a volunteer, I guarantee the headline would've been different and they wouldve came out cheaper than this will cost them.
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Old 04-10-2017, 08:11 PM   #62
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Lol ok ...you're right!
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Old 04-10-2017, 08:11 PM   #63
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Originally Posted by RodinaRanč View Post
It happened to me plenty...it's called customer loyalty....if you owned the airline, would you prefer me happy ....or the guy that buys the $300 ticket once every 5 years? Ignorance of a contract is well...ignorance. Don't like the policy...don't buy the ticket
With all due respect, this is some of the dumbest crap I have heard. Show us where in the contract it says, you can be removed from your seat, forcibly, because the company made a bad decision and needed to now get 4 of their own on the flight to another location? I will wait.
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Old 04-10-2017, 08:12 PM   #64
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Anyone wanna wager....i'll say United stock won't drop a $1 between now & end of 2nd qtr....any takers?
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Old 04-10-2017, 08:13 PM   #65
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Originally Posted by bigbad243 View Post
With all due respect, this is some of the dumbest crap I have heard. Show us where in the contract it says, you can be removed from your seat, forcibly, because the company made a bad decision and needed to now get 4 of their own on the flight to another location? I will wait.
Read any airline contract of carriage...i'll wait...
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Old 04-10-2017, 08:13 PM   #66
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Originally Posted by BrandonA View Post
Your full of ****... That's exactly how it works. Airlines will negotiate. I don't fly as much as I use to but my question is what position do you have with United?
I believe you are right.
From another forum:
Quote:
When your flight is oversold and you're denied boarding, federal law requires an airline to pay you 200% of your one-way ticket price — up to $650 — if you're delayed by one hour, and 400% of your one-way ticket price — up to $1,300 — if you're delayed by two or more hours. But airlines don't always offer the full amount, instead dangling restrictive travel vouchers that expire after a year in front of their customers.

Here's how the numbers break down: In 2013, the average denied-boarding compensation was $643. Only about one in 10 bumped passengers will challenge their involuntary denied-boarding compensation, because they aren't aware that they could be entitled to much more than airline funny money.
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Old 04-10-2017, 08:13 PM   #67
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Originally Posted by jerp View Post
As has been said above, overbooking is part of the deal when you fly. You don't have any "right" to that seat - they own the airplane so if they tell you to get off, you get off. You can then decide to never fly United again if you want. The airline handled it poorly, no doubt. They should have upped the bid until they got a taker. Or, the captain says "ok, we are going to sit here until someone gets off"
X2
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Old 04-10-2017, 08:14 PM   #68
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Originally Posted by RodinaRanč View Post
Read any airline contract of carriage...i'll wait...
Good one, now time for you to man up and prove your point instead of talking in circles.
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Old 04-10-2017, 08:15 PM   #69
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Originally Posted by RodinaRanč View Post
Anyone wanna wager....i'll say United stock won't drop a $1 between now & end of 2nd qtr....any takers?
So you're a stockholder... Airlines have been struggling to stay afloat for yrs. does this incident effect stock price may may not. Starbucks hiring refugees stance **** sure did.
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Old 04-10-2017, 08:16 PM   #70
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Originally Posted by HogHunter34 View Post
He must have drawn shortest straw....seriously though must be more to it than just random selection & he gone
He was randomly chosen by their computer.
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Old 04-10-2017, 08:16 PM   #71
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So your wager is how much Brandon?

Lol i don't own a dime of any airline...but i'll take your $ & buy some...lol

Last edited by RodinaRanč; 04-10-2017 at 08:25 PM..
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Old 04-10-2017, 08:19 PM   #72
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Originally Posted by bigbad243 View Post
Good one, now time for you to man up and prove your point instead of talking in circles.

Since google doesn't work for ya...here's an example...i'm sure u can find united's on your own now. I'm quite sure i avoided circular references as well & instead have stated fact

http://www.delta.com/content/dam/del...dom.pdf#page10

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Old 04-10-2017, 08:24 PM   #73
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Originally Posted by RodinaRanč View Post
So your wager is how much Brandon?

Lol i dont own a dime of any airline...
I'm not wagering anything but your stance is BS. I don't care if you have flown a million miles or whatever . I've flown on flights where the **** plane was practically empty. Most recent to Bahamas .
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Old 04-10-2017, 08:24 PM   #74
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Originally Posted by Shane View Post
They should have started offering cash or vouchers and just upped the number until they got enough takers. Dragging a guy screaming from the plane isn't the best PR move an airline ever made.
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Originally Posted by jerp View Post
As has been said above, overbooking is part of the deal when you fly. You don't have any "right" to that seat - they own the airplane so if they tell you to get off, you get off. You can then decide to never fly United again if you want. The airline handled it poorly, no doubt. They should have upped the bid until they got a taker. Or, the captain says "ok, we are going to sit here until someone gets off"
I thought they started at $400 and still had no takers at $800. That's when they called LEOs to remove someone.

For those saying that if you don't like the policy then don't fly that ariline..well that's pretty jacked up. They ALL have those policies. Airlines are to intertwined with government BS. You sort of "have to" fly when you go a long way so you really don't have a choice.
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Old 04-10-2017, 08:26 PM   #75
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Originally Posted by BrandonA View Post
I'm not wagering anything but your stance is BS. I don't care if you have flown a million miles or whatever . I've flown on flights where the **** plane was practically empty. Most recent to Bahamas .
My stance is simply the way it works...no more/no less! If that's the case there was a reason they flew it...they didn't fly it b/c they liked you & wanted you to enjoy yourself...lol, they did it b/c it was hard or soft revenue driven to do so...airlines are one of the most cut throat industries around...right next to grocery & contract mfg. most could/would go belly up if fuel contracts are off by mere $.05's per gallon

Dang! Was hoping to get in the airline business off of ya...lol

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Old 04-10-2017, 08:26 PM   #76
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Originally Posted by Pedernal View Post
I agree that it was a horrible move by United, but I have to disagree that there were millions of dollars worth of "damages" done to the passenger. And no I have no idea what this man is owed for this type of treatment.



I say we add United to the TBH boycott list.


Man now you're crazy. That will plum put them out of business.

I just want a damage award that prevents this from ever happening again.




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Old 04-10-2017, 08:26 PM   #77
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Originally Posted by RodinaRanč View Post
Anyone wanna wager....i'll say United stock won't drop a $1 between now & end of 2nd qtr....any takers?
Lol they could lose $100,000 on this deal and their stock not change by $1, does that mean it was a good business decision... No. There are other factors besides the bottom line you should consider as well, do you want to be the airline known to drag passengers off an overbooked flight.
I will bet that some United official will make a statement apologizing soon if they haven't already and usually you don't want people having to make public apologies. Wanna wager?
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Old 04-10-2017, 08:28 PM   #78
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Originally Posted by RodinaRanč View Post
My stance is simply the way it works...no more/no less!

Dang! Was hoping to get in the airline business off of ya...lol
And your stance the way it works is wrong 100%.
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Old 04-10-2017, 08:32 PM   #79
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Lol they could lose $100,000 on this deal and their stock not change by $1, does that mean it was a good business decision... No. There are other factors besides the bottom line you should consider as well, do you want to be the airline known to drag passengers off an overbooked flight.
I will bet that some United official will make a statement apologizing soon if they haven't already and usually you don't want people having to make public apologies. Wanna wager?
UAL is down 92 cents per share afterhours So take the bet quick Brandon LOL

But being it's market cap is 22.5 Billion they would need to lose multi-millions to chance the stock price very much.
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Old 04-10-2017, 08:33 PM   #80
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Originally Posted by be12hunt View Post
Lol they could lose $100,000 on this deal and their stock not change by $1, does that mean it was a good business decision... No. There are other factors besides the bottom line you should consider as well, do you want to be the airline known to drag passengers off an overbooked flight.
I will bet that some United official will make a statement apologizing soon if they haven't already and usually you don't want people having to make public apologies. Wanna wager?
Yeah...silly shareholders...what do they care about stock price...lol...i would invest more b/c of good PR & negative margins...lol

& I don't suspect they lost a dime on this particular flight...i suspect the decision made margin...not erode it
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Old 04-10-2017, 08:34 PM   #81
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So much for owners rights. "I said get your *** up and get off my plane!"
Sound like a bunch of them snowflakes I keep hearing about.
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Old 04-10-2017, 08:36 PM   #82
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Originally Posted by RodinaRanč View Post
My stance is simply the way it works...no more/no less! If that's the case there was a reason they flew it...they didn't fly it b/c they liked you & wanted you to enjoy yourself...lol, they did it b/c it was hard or soft revenue driven to do so...airlines are one of the most cut throat industries around...right next to grocery & contract mfg. most could/would go belly up if fuel contracts are off by mere $.05's per gallon

Dang! Was hoping to get in the airline business off of ya...lol
No you posted earlier if the flight is not profitable they will cancel it. I've been on several overbooked flights and everyone of them came over the loud speaker and negotiated until they fulfilled their needs. I gave up my seat several times for a later flight. Never have I seen an airline drag somebody off a plane to accomidate crew

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Old 04-10-2017, 08:37 PM   #83
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This is what Delta's contract of carriage says about refusing to transport... taken from page 13...

"Delta may refuse to transport any passenger, and may remove any passenger from its aircraft
at any time, for any of the following reasons:
A) Government Request or Regulations
Whenever such action is necessary to comply with any government regulations, directives, or
instructions; or to comply with any governmental request for emergency transportation in
connection with the national defense, or whenever such action is necessary or advisable by
reason of weather or other conditions beyond its control (including but without limitation, acts of
God, force majeure, strikes, civil commotions, embargoes, wars, hostilities, or disturbances)
actual, threatened, or reported.
B) Search of Passenger or Property
When a passenger refuses to permit search of his person or property for explosives, weapons,
dangerous materials, or other prohibited items.
C) Proof of Identity
When a passenger refuses on request to produce positive identification; provided, however, that
Delta shall have no obligation to require positive identification of persons purchasing tickets
and/or presenting tickets for the purpose of boarding aircraft.
D) Travel Across International Boundaries
When a passenger is traveling across any international boundary if:
1) the travel documents of such passenger are not in order; or
2) such transportation would be unlawful
E) Failure to Comply with Delta’s Rules or Contract of Carriage
When a passenger fails or refuses to comply with any of Delta’s rules or regulations or any term
of the contract of carriage.
F) Passenger’s Conduct or Condition
Delta will not refuse to provide transportation to a passenger with a disability, as defined in 14
C.F.R. § 382.5 and 382.31, based upon the passenger’s disability, except as as allowed or
required by law. Delta will not refuse to provide transportation based upon race, color, national
origin, religion, sex, or ancestry. Subject to those qualifications, Delta may refuse to transport
any passenger, or may remove any passenger from its aircraft, when refusal to transport or
removal of the passenger is reasonably necessary in Delta’s sole discretion for the passenger’s
comfort or safety, for the comfort or safety of other passengers or Delta employees, or for the
prevention of damage to the property of Delta or its passengers or employees. By way of
example, and without limitation, Delta may refuse to transport or may remove passengers from
its aircraft in any of the following situations:
1) When the passenger’s conduct is disorderly, abusive or violent;
*2) When the passenger is barefoot;
3) When the passenger appears to be intoxicated or under the influence of drugs;
4) When the passenger attempts to interfere with any member of the flight crew in the pursuit of
his or her duties, or fails to obey the instruction of any member of the flight crew;
5) When the passenger has a contagious disease that may be transmissible to other passengers
during the normal course of the flight;
6) When the passenger has a malodorous condition;
7) When the passenger is unable to sit in a seat with the seatbelt fastened;
8) When the passenger’s behavior may be hazardous to himself/herself, the crew, or other
passengers;
9) When the passenger is seriously ill, and fails to provide a physician's written permission to fly.
10) When the passenger’s conduct creates an unreasonable risk of offense or annoyance to
other passengers;
11) When the passenger’s conduct creates a risk of harm or damage to the carrier’s aircraft
and/or property, or the property of other passengers"

As to denied boarding...
" DENIED BOARDING COMPENSATION (from page 43)
*
*A) Overbooking of Flights
Because passengers with confirmed reservations on a flight sometimes fail to show, Delta
reserves the right to sell more tickets for travel on each flight than there are seats available on
the aircraft. In some cases, this may result in a flight in which Delta cannot accommodate one or
more passengers with confirmed reservations (an “oversold flight”). Delta may deny boarding to
passengers with confirmed reservations on an oversold flight as set forth in this rule. The rights
of passengers who are denied boarding shall be governed by this rule.
B) Request For Volunteers
Before denying boarding to any passenger holding a confirmed reservation on an oversold
flight, Delta will ask other passengers on the flight to voluntarily give up their seat in exchange
for compensation in an amount and form to be determined by Delta in its sole discretion. If a
sufficient number of volunteers agree to give up their seats in response to Delta’s offer, then no
passenger with a confirmed reservation will be involuntarily denied boarding due to the oversale
of the flight. If there are more volunteers than required, selection of the volunteer(s) to receive
compensation shall be subject to Delta’s sole discretion.
C) Involuntary Denied Boarding
If an insufficient number of passengers volunteer to give up their seats in response to Delta’s
offer, Delta may involuntarily deny boarding to one or more passengers on the oversold flight
according to the following boarding priority rules:
1) Passengers Holding Tickets for Travel in Premium Cabin, SkyMiles members identified
with a Diamond Medallion (“DM”), Platinum Medallion (“PM”), or Gold Medallion (“GM”)
elite-status designation, and passengers holding tickets purchased under a DL
corporate travel agreement.
Passengers holding tickets for confirmed space in the First or Business class cabin,
SkyMiles members identified with a DM, PM, or GM elite-status designation, and
passengers holding tickets purchased under a DL corporate travel agreement will be
accommodated before other passengers holding tickets and/or boarding passes for
confirmed space in the coach cabin.
2) Passengers With Boarding Passes
Subject to the terms set forth in Rule 245(c )(1) and (4), passengers holding boarding
passes who check in and present themselves at the departure gate in compliance with
Rule 135(c) will be accommodated before passengers traveling in the same cabin who
have not been issued boarding passes or who fail to comply with applicable check-in
requirements. Subject to the availability of seats on the aircraft, boarding passes may
be obtained by passengers who hold tickets for confirmed reserved space in the
following manner:
a) for passengers traveling on electronic tickets, through the Online Check-in feature
on Delta.com within 24 hours of scheduled departure.

*b) for passengers traveling on electronic tickets, through a Delta airport kiosk within
four hours of scheduled departure
c) from a Delta airport ticket counter and/or the check-in desk located in the departure
area.
3) Passengers Without Boarding Passes
Passengers, who are not governed by Rule 245(c)(1) or (4), with confirmed reservations
who have not been issued a boarding pass and present themselves at the departure
gate in compliance with rule 135(c) will be accommodated according to the following
priority rules:
a) Passengers who have been rebooked to the present flight as a result of an irregular
operation (e.g., delay, cancellation) of a previously booked flight.
b) SkyMiles members identified with a Silver Medallion (“FO”) elite-status designation.
c) Passengers with a SkyTeam Elite or Elite Plus status.
d) Passengers without any elite-status designation.
Within each of the foregoing groups, passengers are prioritized first by class of service
and then by time of check-in."



The issue here is that the guy had ALREADY BOARDED...
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Old 04-10-2017, 08:38 PM   #84
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As has been said above, overbooking is part of the deal when you fly. You don't have any "right" to that seat - they own the airplane so if they tell you to get off, you get off. You can then decide to never fly United again if you want. The airline handled it poorly, no doubt. They should have upped the bid until they got a taker. Or, the captain says "ok, we are going to sit here until someone gets off"
Problem is once your butt hits the seat, then the game changes for folks in their mind...this should have been handled before they all boarded. Leave it in the lobby/gate. Good gosh, can't someone freak'n count??

It was really stupid of them to not keep upping the offer till someone bit. Man, if I owned an airline there would have been a cash offer starting at $100 & bumped up $100 every minute till someone accepted. Keep going at the accepted number till the number needed are off the plane. Everyone is happy & life goes on.

What's the new bill gonna cost them...unacceptable actions. I don't fly much but as a guy who lives & breathes customer service?? How could you assault a paying customer for the services you offered to provide and then failed??

I bet this never would have happened before 9-11...I loathe commercial travel ever since. So glad I don't have to fly very often.



~~~~~~~~~~~


I would have left peacefully, but my final free speech would have been: "I believe in fate & don't wanna be on a plane that crashes...adios!!"
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Old 04-10-2017, 08:38 PM   #85
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BrandonA View Post
And your stance the way it works is wrong 100%.
Not if i'm in business to make $ it isn't...in any business you won't make 100% of folks happy 100% of the time...

& I respectfully disagree...if i pay $100k yr to an airline & you pay $300...i should take precedence over you on a flight...i'm simply a better customer, even if i pay less than you on 1 particular flight
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Old 04-10-2017, 08:44 PM   #86
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nursejenn View Post
This is what Delta's contract of carriage says about refusing to transport... taken from page 13...

"Delta may refuse to transport any passenger, and may remove any passenger from its aircraft
at any time, for any of the following reasons:
A) Government Request or Regulations
Whenever such action is necessary to comply with any government regulations, directives, or
instructions; or to comply with any governmental request for emergency transportation in
connection with the national defense, or whenever such action is necessary or advisable by
reason of weather or other conditions beyond its control (including but without limitation, acts of
God, force majeure, strikes, civil commotions, embargoes, wars, hostilities, or disturbances)
actual, threatened, or reported.
B) Search of Passenger or Property
When a passenger refuses to permit search of his person or property for explosives, weapons,
dangerous materials, or other prohibited items.
C) Proof of Identity
When a passenger refuses on request to produce positive identification; provided, however, that
Delta shall have no obligation to require positive identification of persons purchasing tickets
and/or presenting tickets for the purpose of boarding aircraft.
D) Travel Across International Boundaries
When a passenger is traveling across any international boundary if:
1) the travel documents of such passenger are not in order; or
2) such transportation would be unlawful
E) Failure to Comply with Delta’s Rules or Contract of Carriage
When a passenger fails or refuses to comply with any of Delta’s rules or regulations or any term
of the contract of carriage.
F) Passenger’s Conduct or Condition
Delta will not refuse to provide transportation to a passenger with a disability, as defined in 14
C.F.R. § 382.5 and 382.31, based upon the passenger’s disability, except as as allowed or
required by law. Delta will not refuse to provide transportation based upon race, color, national
origin, religion, sex, or ancestry. Subject to those qualifications, Delta may refuse to transport
any passenger, or may remove any passenger from its aircraft, when refusal to transport or
removal of the passenger is reasonably necessary in Delta’s sole discretion for the passenger’s
comfort or safety, for the comfort or safety of other passengers or Delta employees, or for the
prevention of damage to the property of Delta or its passengers or employees. By way of
example, and without limitation, Delta may refuse to transport or may remove passengers from
its aircraft in any of the following situations:
1) When the passenger’s conduct is disorderly, abusive or violent;
*2) When the passenger is barefoot;
3) When the passenger appears to be intoxicated or under the influence of drugs;
4) When the passenger attempts to interfere with any member of the flight crew in the pursuit of
his or her duties, or fails to obey the instruction of any member of the flight crew;
5) When the passenger has a contagious disease that may be transmissible to other passengers
during the normal course of the flight;
6) When the passenger has a malodorous condition;
7) When the passenger is unable to sit in a seat with the seatbelt fastened;
8) When the passenger’s behavior may be hazardous to himself/herself, the crew, or other
passengers;
9) When the passenger is seriously ill, and fails to provide a physician's written permission to fly.
10) When the passenger’s conduct creates an unreasonable risk of offense or annoyance to
other passengers;
11) When the passenger’s conduct creates a risk of harm or damage to the carrier’s aircraft
and/or property, or the property of other passengers"

As to denied boarding...
" DENIED BOARDING COMPENSATION (from page 43)
*
*A) Overbooking of Flights
Because passengers with confirmed reservations on a flight sometimes fail to show, Delta
reserves the right to sell more tickets for travel on each flight than there are seats available on
the aircraft. In some cases, this may result in a flight in which Delta cannot accommodate one or
more passengers with confirmed reservations (an “oversold flight”). Delta may deny boarding to
passengers with confirmed reservations on an oversold flight as set forth in this rule. The rights
of passengers who are denied boarding shall be governed by this rule.
B) Request For Volunteers
Before denying boarding to any passenger holding a confirmed reservation on an oversold
flight, Delta will ask other passengers on the flight to voluntarily give up their seat in exchange
for compensation in an amount and form to be determined by Delta in its sole discretion. If a
sufficient number of volunteers agree to give up their seats in response to Delta’s offer, then no
passenger with a confirmed reservation will be involuntarily denied boarding due to the oversale
of the flight. If there are more volunteers than required, selection of the volunteer(s) to receive
compensation shall be subject to Delta’s sole discretion.
C) Involuntary Denied Boarding
If an insufficient number of passengers volunteer to give up their seats in response to Delta’s
offer, Delta may involuntarily deny boarding to one or more passengers on the oversold flight
according to the following boarding priority rules:
1) Passengers Holding Tickets for Travel in Premium Cabin, SkyMiles members identified
with a Diamond Medallion (“DM”), Platinum Medallion (“PM”), or Gold Medallion (“GM”)
elite-status designation, and passengers holding tickets purchased under a DL
corporate travel agreement.
Passengers holding tickets for confirmed space in the First or Business class cabin,
SkyMiles members identified with a DM, PM, or GM elite-status designation, and
passengers holding tickets purchased under a DL corporate travel agreement will be
accommodated before other passengers holding tickets and/or boarding passes for
confirmed space in the coach cabin.
2) Passengers With Boarding Passes
Subject to the terms set forth in Rule 245(c )(1) and (4), passengers holding boarding
passes who check in and present themselves at the departure gate in compliance with
Rule 135(c) will be accommodated before passengers traveling in the same cabin who
have not been issued boarding passes or who fail to comply with applicable check-in
requirements. Subject to the availability of seats on the aircraft, boarding passes may
be obtained by passengers who hold tickets for confirmed reserved space in the
following manner:
a) for passengers traveling on electronic tickets, through the Online Check-in feature
on Delta.com within 24 hours of scheduled departure.

*b) for passengers traveling on electronic tickets, through a Delta airport kiosk within
four hours of scheduled departure
c) from a Delta airport ticket counter and/or the check-in desk located in the departure
area.
3) Passengers Without Boarding Passes
Passengers, who are not governed by Rule 245(c)(1) or (4), with confirmed reservations
who have not been issued a boarding pass and present themselves at the departure
gate in compliance with rule 135(c) will be accommodated according to the following
priority rules:
a) Passengers who have been rebooked to the present flight as a result of an irregular
operation (e.g., delay, cancellation) of a previously booked flight.
b) SkyMiles members identified with a Silver Medallion (“FO”) elite-status designation.
c) Passengers with a SkyTeam Elite or Elite Plus status.
d) Passengers without any elite-status designation.
Within each of the foregoing groups, passengers are prioritized first by class of service
and then by time of check-in."



The issue here is that the guy had ALREADY BOARDED...
Refusing to transport & overselling are 2 different things...So is capacity & each are addressed under separate rules (for delta anyway)...the rules can be enforced independently or in conjunction with other rules

They can refuse to transport for alot of reasons...drunk, loud, saying something insulting, etc.
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Old 04-10-2017, 08:46 PM   #87
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RodinaRan View Post
Refusing to transport & overselling are 2 different things...So is capacity & each are addressed under separate rules (for delta anyway)...the rules can be enforced independently or in conjunction with other rules

They can refuse to transport for alot of reasons...drunk, loud, saying something insulting, etc.
None of which he did... and obviously he wasn't an extra on the flight if his butt was already in a seat... i posted both parts because he didnt fit into the denied boarding part because he was already on board so then it would have to fall back to refusal to transport...

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Old 04-10-2017, 08:47 PM   #88
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Artos View Post
Problem is once your butt hits the seat, then the game changes for folks in their mind...this should have been handled before they all boarded. Leave it in the lobby/gate. Good gosh, can't someone freak'n count??

It was really stupid of them to not keep upping the offer till someone bit. Man, if I owned an airline there would have been a cash offer starting at $100 & bumped up $100 every minute till someone accepted. Keep going at the accepted number till the number needed are off the plane. Everyone is happy & life goes on.

What's the new bill gonna cost them...unacceptable actions. I don't fly much but as a guy who lives & breathes customer service?? How could you assault a paying customer for the services you offered to provide and then failed??

I bet this never would have happened before 9-11...I loathe commercial travel ever since. So glad I don't have to fly very often.



~~~~~~~~~~~


I would have left peacefully, but my final free speech would have been: "I believe in fate & don't wanna be on a plane that crashes...adios!!"
In all honesty....it was worse before 9-11...port pass, tsa-pre, global entry programs have taken away some of the airline "discretion" in putting their rules/contracts in action...esp true of international travel

I have literally sat on a flight where they removed the passenger (at the passenger's request), but refused to de-plane that passenger's carry-on bag....needless to say...i requested to be de-planed & rebooked

Last edited by RodinaRanč; 04-10-2017 at 08:51 PM..
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Old 04-10-2017, 08:48 PM   #89
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The other question is this. If it was you getting screwed and kicked off, how would you handle it?

A) be understandably mad, argue your case then leave peaceably swearing to never fly with them again. Write letters of complaint, blog about it and tell everyone you know.
B) lay on the floor and act like a toddler throwing a fit at WalMart because MeeMaw won't by you gummy bears

Have some self respect dude.

Last edited by jerp; 04-10-2017 at 08:51 PM..
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Old 04-10-2017, 08:49 PM   #90
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RodinaRanč View Post
Not if i'm in business to make $ it isn't...in any business you won't make 100% of folks happy 100% of the time...

& I respectfully disagree...if i pay $100k yr to an airline & you pay $300...i should take precedence over you on a flight...i'm simply a better customer, even if i pay less than you on 1 particular flight
Neither should get kicked off...one is agreeable to compensation from the airline & walks off on his own satisfied.


You do not ever assault a paying customer for his peaceful purchase...you compensate him for what they will agree, or you pay much more in legal fees & get horrible feedback on social media.

Either that or you suck at business...this is going to hurt united for a while. I bet cancellations are happening now.
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Old 04-10-2017, 08:51 PM   #91
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RodinaRanč View Post
So your wager is how much Brandon?

Lol i don't own a dime of any airline...but i'll take your $ & buy some...lol
I'll wager you that United cuts a check to the guy that's of an undisclosed amount and no attorneys are involved. I'll wager you $400 that it's more than the voucher offered.
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Old 04-10-2017, 08:56 PM   #92
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nursejenn View Post
None of which he did... and obviously he wasn't an extra on the flight if his butt was already in a seat... i posted both parts because he didnt fit into the denied boarding part because he was already on board so then it would have to fall back to refusal to transport...

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G935A using Tapatalk
They are covered in F) 4
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Old 04-10-2017, 08:56 PM   #93
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nursejenn View Post
None of which he did... and obviously he wasn't an extra on the flight if his butt was already in a seat... i posted both parts because he didnt fit into the denied boarding part because he was already on board so then it would have to fall back to refusal to transport...

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G935A using Tapatalk
He was an "extra" b/c they didn't reconcile seat count to confirmed seats before boarding...they should have no doubt, but this oversight is fairly common place given asset changes due to maintenance issues, etc where assets are switched & seat configurations are different...one A319 may have 225 seats, another 223, another 235 seats...the relief for such problem is compensation & rebooking...not being an arse b/c you didnt read/understand the contract you agreed to when purchased
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Old 04-10-2017, 08:57 PM   #94
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Originally Posted by Ironman View Post
They are covered in F) 4
Depends on point of view... one could argue that they were refusing to transport prior to his disobedience...
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Old 04-10-2017, 09:00 PM   #95
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hydestik View Post
I'll wager you that United cuts a check to the guy that's of an undisclosed amount and no attorneys are involved. I'll wager you $400 that it's more than the voucher offered.
I'll take that bet & double it!! They won't pay him a dime besides a voucher to use on another flight, a food voucher, maybe some airline mile or a gift card if he has some lower level of status & rebook him on the next available flight. Even with diamond status on delta for 10+ consecutive years, an annual pricing contract in place & being a 1M miler...i wouldn't receive any better.

Without reading or hearing about it in the news....how do you suggest we decide who won the wager?

Last edited by RodinaRanč; 04-10-2017 at 09:06 PM..
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Old 04-10-2017, 09:01 PM   #96
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Originally Posted by boh347 View Post
Meh...I go through the same thing every morning getting the kids ready for school.
Bwahaaaaa. Hilarious..................
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Old 04-10-2017, 09:01 PM   #97
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Originally Posted by nursejenn View Post
Depends on point of view... one could argue that they were refusing to transport prior to his disobedience...
That's not what F 4 says. It states interfering with flight crews duties or failing to obey flight crews instructions. The instructions were, get yo *** up and get off the plane.
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Old 04-10-2017, 09:04 PM   #98
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That's not what F 4 says. It states interfering with flight crews duties or failing to obey flight crews instructions. The instructions were, get yo *** up and get off the plane.
Again... he wasn't interfering or being diobedient until they told him that... the airline made the first move.

They said that before he said hell nah...
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Old 04-10-2017, 09:08 PM   #99
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Same here. Status rules everything and if it did happen I would have had concierge calling, points, etc without ever asking.


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Old 04-10-2017, 09:09 PM   #100
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Again... he wasn't interfering or being diobedient until they told him that... the airline made the first move.

They said that before he said hell nah...
He was low ticket price on the plane, with no status...right/wrong or indifferent...he's it....before he checked in/after, before boarding/after doesn't matter...it's not like they randomly selected the guy...lol

& he better hope he doesn't have a frequent flier # he booked with...lol
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