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Old 03-31-2017, 08:20 AM   #1
Birddog66
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Default Hog dogging affect on deer hunting?

Here is the deal - We (my deer lease group) just found out yesterday that the farmer on our deer lease(not the LO, fyi) has recently had hog doggers out to our place in order to keep the pig population in check. Historically, we have not had many pigs, which has been somewhat surprising to me, given the general area (Hare, Tx). They move through occasionally and hit feeders, but not enough consistency to hunt, imo. Yes, we have signed lease agreements and exclusive hunting rights. Yes, we know the LO in in breach of our agreement but nobody is interested in going Johnie Cockran over some hog doggers at this point. I have zero experience with hog dogging and know nothing about the affects if has on the deer herd and deer hunting. I'm a dog guy and owned pit-bulls for 2 decades before I got into gsp's. I have always wanted to go along on a dog hog-hunt just to watch the dogs work, I think it's something I would enjoy.

Please help me with some insight from people with firsthand knowledge and experience. Our lease renewal is coming up in a couple months -

1) What kind of affect does hog dogging have on deer hunting?

2) Is it a viable method to help control the pig population?
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Old 03-31-2017, 08:23 AM   #2
Mexico
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Absolutely will help with controlling your pig population but unfortunately will run your deer to the next county if the pressure is to harsh.

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Last edited by Mexico; 03-31-2017 at 08:27 AM..
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Old 03-31-2017, 08:25 AM   #3
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Absolutely will help with controlling your pig population but unfortunately will run your deer to the next county if he pressure is to harsh.

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One lease member has trailcam pics of them showing up on a weekly basis.
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Old 03-31-2017, 08:27 AM   #4
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Absolutely will help with controlling your pig population but unfortunately will run your deer to the next county if the pressure is to harsh.

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X2
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Old 03-31-2017, 08:28 AM   #5
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This thread should get the blood flowing on the green screen early.
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Old 03-31-2017, 08:32 AM   #6
stinkbelly
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Our farmer let hog doggers on our place too. We spoke everyone and they said the will stop.

The way they hunted our place was to go to the feeder in the morning and have the dogs track away from the feeder. So they are messing up your feeder area.

It is not good and they should pay some of the bill if they are hunting it too.
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Old 03-31-2017, 08:39 AM   #7
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I would imagine how frequently they are on the property and when would be the key. I wouldn't think them doing it now would have much effect come October.


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Old 03-31-2017, 10:46 AM   #8
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I doubt it will effect your hunting as long as they stop before the fall. If you had a high pig population, it would probably help your deer hunting.
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Old 03-31-2017, 11:24 AM   #9
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Unless those dogs are running deer (not trash broken) I don't see why they would bother the deer at all. You're still seeing the deer on camera so they are still there going to the feeders as before.

Kind of depends. They can either catch and remove many of the pigs on the property, or put enough pressure on the pigs that they leave the area for a while. Doesn't kill them all just moves them to someone else property though.
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Old 03-31-2017, 11:34 AM   #10
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I was told by a dog runner that they don't really sniff/track hogs...they just run the areas that hogs hide (creeks, ravines, heavy woods, etc) and try to move them. Once they start moving then the chase is on. It s fun to do/watch.

Probably will not affect your deer overall, just temporarily...like, if you are hunting.
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Old 03-31-2017, 11:42 AM   #11
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Absolutely will help with controlling your pig population but unfortunately will run your deer to the next county if the pressure is to harsh.

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JayB I was told by a dog runner that they don't really sniff/track hogs...they just run the areas that hogs hide (creeks, ravines, heavy woods, etc) and try to move them. Once they start moving then the chase is on. It s fun to do/watch.

Probably will not affect your deer overall, just temporarily...like, if you are hunting.


Wondered about this as well, same issue, but answer seems to vary greatly.

Last edited by DesertDug; 03-31-2017 at 11:43 AM.. Reason: sorry do not know how to have two quotes
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Old 03-31-2017, 12:07 PM   #12
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Will not affect your deer what so ever...if they are good dogs. Can control the hog population if they catch and kill and the other hogs will leave your lease if they put enough pressure on them. I would not worry about it at all.
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Old 03-31-2017, 12:09 PM   #13
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Thanks for the responses, please keep them coming.

Sounds like the timing thing is important. My initial thoughts are that traps and rifle hunting would be a more effective means of knocking down over-all pig numbers. We are a bow only lease, but in the process of asking to rifle hunt the pigs in the off season. This whole thing kinda came out of nowhere and most of us are like"Really? a pig problem?" If I knew of a concentration of pigs on our place, I would have already been hunting them.
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Old 03-31-2017, 01:04 PM   #14
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Hog dogs will never Ever put even a small dent on the hog population. Most doggers I know do it for sport and practice for their dog training. They could care less about your deer , feeding program, hunting area ,etc. The worst thing in the world you can do for a deer place is put dogs on it and that's just a fact. The deer will flat out leave the area as the dog pressure increases. Most will never come back if they have cover ,browse,and water elsewhere.
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Old 03-31-2017, 01:12 PM   #15
32drawlength
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We have the this exact issue on our lease
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Old 03-31-2017, 01:17 PM   #16
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I let some guys run dogs on my place once a year for a spring tournament. That is it, if you own the place, gotta think about liability if one of them gets hurt or something torn up. Plus on 340 acres with 200 acres of woods, it is bedding area for deer and I don't want them to find a new bedroom.
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Old 03-31-2017, 01:27 PM   #17
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Will definitely help hog control, and in my experience it does not affect the deer hunting.
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Old 03-31-2017, 01:38 PM   #18
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Our biologist said that deer are more worried about the pigs, than dogs. We decided to let people run their dogs to help put pressure on the pigs
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Old 03-31-2017, 01:44 PM   #19
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Originally Posted by MTaylor View Post
Will not affect your deer what so ever...if they are good dogs. Can control the hog population if they catch and kill and the other hogs will leave your lease if they put enough pressure on them. I would not worry about it at all.
That's the only problem I've had. According to the dogger, all their "dogs are good". And you have to find out the hard way if they're not.
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Old 03-31-2017, 01:53 PM   #20
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We run dogs all year, even during deer season. I'll co-ordinate with the ranch, if they have hunters in the pasture we want to hunt hogs, we'll wait until about 9 AM when they are heading back to camp and turn the dogs out then. We'll run the dogs all across the ranch, past feeders, past blinds, etc. and we'll be out by about 2 PM. Hunters come back out about 3:30 and when the feeders go off at 5 PM, the deer appear.
My dogs don't give two hoots about a deer, only thing they want to run are pigs. It's a working cattle ranch, dog's don't mess with the cows either.
Do we control the hog population with dogs on the ranch? Answer is NO, but it's a fun hobby. What they use to control the population is a helicopter. They'll go up about four times every February and slay the hogs. That works.

And everybody runs dogs in south Texas, where are the deer going to run to exactly?

Last edited by bushwacker361; 03-31-2017 at 01:56 PM..
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Old 03-31-2017, 02:02 PM   #21
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Hog dogs will never Ever put even a small dent on the hog population. Most doggers I know do it for sport and practice for their dog training. They could care less about your deer , feeding program, hunting area ,etc. The worst thing in the world you can do for a deer place is put dogs on it and that's just a fact. The deer will flat out leave the area as the dog pressure increases. Most will never come back if they have cover ,browse,and water elsewhere.
Sorry, but I couldn't disagree more. We've got a pretty bad hog problem on my place in Art, and I've found that dogs are the BEST way to keep them on the move. My buddies dogs are trash broke and won't mess with deer or livestock. I'm going to fill protein feeders and chase hogs this weekend
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Old 03-31-2017, 02:31 PM   #22
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I can see this thread going the way of the "pig poison" threads, way to much emotion attached to the argument. Fact of it is dogs will scare the deer away, plus rabbits, turkey, butterflies, cows, sheep, Javelinas, and roadrunners, but they'll only go as far as necessary to escape the threat. If the dogs are trash broke they won't be a problem. The only exception I would throw in would be if does are dropping fawns, they probably wouldn't care to have dogs out stirring things up.
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Old 03-31-2017, 03:21 PM   #23
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I have no emotion one way or another. Every man has a right to his opinion and I respect that. I can only speak for me and my situation. And I sure wish I could run those d%#m javelina off by just running the dogs. Nothing runs those things off. As far as that whole list of birds and animals listed, again, on my place, the dogs, if we can run them enough will do as Iceman states, we will keep them on the move. The rest of those critters are still there, not sure how a dog could run a roadrunner out of the country?
They go up in a helicopter, buzz the landscape all day, blasting 400 rounds off killing pigs, leaving carcasses scattered all over the place, while doing a deer count, and the next day a repeat. Four days of aerial shooting, hundreds of hogs killed, and deer still in the same areas as they were the day before.
A biologist once told us a deer will live and die within 500 yards of where it was born. I have no idea if that is truth or not, but deer are not nomadic like hogs are. Hogs migrate depending on water and food. Deer are localized, trail cameras prove that. Sure, bucks will roam during the rut looking for does, but trail camera pictures of the same deer coming into the feeder, every day, day in and day out. It's why people name them, they see their picture so much, or at least I do.
Again, I have no emotion as I type this, not mad or upset, just stating what I know to take place on the land that I hunt.
I have a feeling if that poison proves to work, the ranch will be giving it a try, but I don't know, it is a working cattle ranch and I'm not sure they are willing to take that chance?
just emotionless me....
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Old 03-31-2017, 03:39 PM   #24
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This place isnt by any means typical hill country deer . It is 85 percent crop land with very little cover throughout the entire place. Most of the cover is small 40 yard across river bottom and a few dry creek thickets in cattle pastures. The deer surveys for the past 2 years have averaged 25 to 30 deer total. The surrounding areas have much larger tracts of woodlands. These deer are on high alert 24 7 and very hard to even see them under a feeder with zero preasure on them. We have seen about 7 pigs in 2 years. I can tell ya that when the cow guy rotates his cattle into an area where the deer have been for 6 months prior simply just disapper the day he turns them out . I also had deer patterned every day in another area from june til October 1st when 4 stray hounds showed up for about a week prior and those deer have yet to return ....

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Old 03-31-2017, 03:47 PM   #25
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As a land owner there is no way it's happening on my place. If your looking to control your hog population there are MUCH more efficient and productive methods. Not a fan of hog dogging what so ever.
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Old 03-31-2017, 04:13 PM   #26
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Originally Posted by bushwacker361 View Post
We run dogs all year, even during deer season. I'll co-ordinate with the ranch, if they have hunters in the pasture we want to hunt hogs, we'll wait until about 9 AM when they are heading back to camp and turn the dogs out then. We'll run the dogs all across the ranch, past feeders, past blinds, etc. and we'll be out by about 2 PM. Hunters come back out about 3:30 and when the feeders go off at 5 PM, the deer appear.
My dogs don't give two hoots about a deer, only thing they want to run are pigs. It's a working cattle ranch, dog's don't mess with the cows either.
Do we control the hog population with dogs on the ranch? Answer is NO, but it's a fun hobby. What they use to control the population is a helicopter. They'll go up about four times every February and slay the hogs. That works.

And everybody runs dogs in south Texas, where are the deer going to run to exactly?
X2........ a buddy of mine has a lease and we run the hell out of the dogs in the off season usually stop a month before bow season. Haven't seen it affect his deer hunting yet and been doing it for about 5 years.
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Old 03-31-2017, 04:33 PM   #27
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Dogs running deer off a property is a BS wives tale. Of course they get spooked, but they dont leave. They get spooked by your truck, filling feeders, walking to your stand, winding your fart in the stand, etc. They dont leave. Deer getting spooked is Temporary.

Hogs are Nomadic and will leave if there is pressure from dogs. Deer will get spooked but not leave their pocket. They like their pocket, its all they know. They get spooked and chased by predators regularly, they still like their pocket.

If dogs really run deer off a property, then tell me how a hunt club works in states where they can run deer dogs? They have leases just like we have here, but they run dogs on deer all season. They are specifically targeting DEER and they dont leave. They are like big rabbits, they only run as far as they need to, to escape the immediate threat. Then they go about their business.
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Old 04-01-2017, 07:06 AM   #28
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If it just happened you'll be fine.
It took 2 months for me to see a deer/hog return on one property.
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Old 04-01-2017, 07:17 AM   #29
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We ran dogs all during last deer season. Has zero negative effect. Let your farmer run the dogs. The more hogs that are gone, the higher tonnage of whatever he farms, the more food for your deer without you spending a dime or breaking a sweat.
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Old 04-01-2017, 07:30 AM   #30
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Originally Posted by DirtyDave View Post
Dogs running deer off a property is a BS wives tale. Of course they get spooked, but they dont leave. They get spooked by your truck, filling feeders, walking to your stand, winding your fart in the stand, etc. They dont leave. Deer getting spooked is Temporary.

Hogs are Nomadic and will leave if there is pressure from dogs. Deer will get spooked but not leave their pocket. They like their pocket, its all they know. They get spooked and chased by predators regularly, they still like their pocket.

If dogs really run deer off a property, then tell me how a hunt club works in states where they can run deer dogs? They have leases just like we have here, but they run dogs on deer all season. They are specifically targeting DEER and they dont leave. They are like big rabbits, they only run as far as they need to, to escape the immediate threat. Then they go about their business.
X2.

I grew up running walkers for deer and there were many mornings where we'd jump the same deer in the same place that we had the day before.

If deer ran off and left every time something chased/spooked them, NOONE would be able to track a certain buck for 3 or 4 years....
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Old 04-01-2017, 07:48 AM   #31
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Originally Posted by Birddog66 View Post
Thanks for the responses, please keep them coming.

Sounds like the timing thing is important. My initial thoughts are that traps and rifle hunting would be a more effective means of knocking down over-all pig numbers. We are a bow only lease, but in the process of asking to rifle hunt the pigs in the off season. This whole thing kinda came out of nowhere and most of us are like"Really? a pig problem?" If I knew of a concentration of pigs on our place, I would have already been hunting them.


On an archery only lease, I would be ******.... although dogs generally won't displace deer out of their home ranges, you better bet it will effect their comfort and patterning on a property. I would say don't let them run them any closer than 2 months before season. Otherwise, you will end up with nocturnal, pressured bucks much earlier than normal.


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Old 04-01-2017, 08:09 AM   #32
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I lived on a ranch off 57 when I was in my 20s. We ran hogs 3 to 4 nights a week at the request of the farmer tenant. The deer we saw just stood and stared for the most part and the deer hunters on the lease continued to see lots of deer.and took some good bucks. So, from experience, I say that good clean dogs will.not scare off the deer at all.
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Old 04-01-2017, 08:50 AM   #33
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On an archery only lease, I would be ******.... although dogs generally won't displace deer out of their home ranges, you better bet it will effect their comfort and patterning on a property. I would say don't let them run them any closer than 2 months before season. Otherwise, you will end up with nocturnal, pressured bucks much earlier than normal.


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Yes and as Rack stated, these particular deer are spooky as heck. Toughest deer to hunt I've ever seen, and most others on lease say the same thing. That was before the dogs.

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Old 04-01-2017, 08:58 AM   #34
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On my place dogs will run deer off and they stay off for a few days. Difference it the neighbors dogs are always "hunting" anything they can chase within a couple of miles of their house. I have TC pics of them on my place and have seen them several times. I have seen them "hunting" while I was in the deer blind. One morning they chased some deer off of another feeder then came into where I was hunting. I saw 34 deer that morning and the next 3 days in 6 hunts I did not see that many deer combined. Now if any dog or coyote or hog or bobcat is seen at a blind it will spook deer as soon as the deer see it. Just dogs barking get the deer nervous enough for them to ease away from the noise. Hog dogs in my area will do the same thing.
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Old 04-01-2017, 09:27 AM   #35
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I have had dogs ruin my hunts a few times and not all were chasing the deer. One thing I have learned dogs will back track the way they came when they get tired of chasing.
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Old 04-02-2017, 10:23 AM   #36
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Ask if you can go with them if you want to see dogs work. They wo y run the deer off.
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Old 04-02-2017, 11:30 AM   #37
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Here is the deal - We (my deer lease group) just found out yesterday that the farmer on our deer lease(not the LO, fyi) has recently had hog doggers out to our place in order to keep the pig population in check. Historically, we have not had many pigs, which has been somewhat surprising to me, given the general area (Hare, Tx). They move through occasionally and hit feeders, but not enough consistency to hunt, imo. Yes, we have signed lease agreements and exclusive hunting rights. Yes, we know the LO in in breach of our agreement but nobody is interested in going Johnie Cockran over some hog doggers at this point. I have zero experience with hog dogging and know nothing about the affects if has on the deer herd and deer hunting. I'm a dog guy and owned pit-bulls for 2 decades before I got into gsp's. I have always wanted to go along on a dog hog-hunt just to watch the dogs work, I think it's something I would enjoy.

Please help me with some insight from people with firsthand knowledge and experience. Our lease renewal is coming up in a couple months -

1) What kind of affect does hog dogging have on deer hunting?

2) Is it a viable method to help control the pig population?
As long as you stop it before the fawns are born, I think it causes minimal effect
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Old 04-02-2017, 12:09 PM   #38
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X2.

I grew up running walkers for deer and there were many mornings where we'd jump the same deer in the same place that we had the day before.

If deer ran off and left every time something chased/spooked them, NOONE would be able to track a certain buck for 3 or 4 years....
I still go every year and do the same thing and know we can jump deer in the same location two days in a row. so you should be fine. we have a member on our deer lease running dogs about every weekend and I am fine with it.
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Old 04-02-2017, 01:26 PM   #39
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I still go every year and do the same thing and know we can jump deer in the same location two days in a row. so you should be fine. we have a member on our deer lease running dogs about every weekend and I am fine with it.

We may hunt the same place. This is my first year on a place in Corrigan and we have dogs being run too. But to the OPs point, I have no issue with this being done, and no lack of deer on camera.
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Old 04-03-2017, 01:23 PM   #40
Birddog66
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As long as you stop it before the fawns are born, I think it causes minimal effect
It appears the hog doggers have been given free run of the place, not a lot we can do or say about it, other than not renew. I'm going to ask for some kind of a "time-frame" as far as hunting season goes.

One more question - Do you guys run dogs throughout the summer? Does it ever get too hot for your dogs? I'm in Eastern portion of Central Texas and it gets very humid/hot in July-Aug.
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Old 04-03-2017, 01:30 PM   #41
Saltyag15
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I agree with what some others have said. If they are good dogs and do not run deer, I don't think they should be too big of a problem.
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Old 04-03-2017, 04:11 PM   #42
IkemanTX
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Default Hog dogging affect on deer hunting?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Birddog66 View Post
It appears the hog doggers have been given free run of the place, not a lot we can do or say about it, other than not renew. I'm going to ask for some kind of a "time-frame" as far as hunting season goes.



One more question - Do you guys run dogs throughout the summer? Does it ever get too hot for your dogs? I'm in Eastern portion of Central Texas and it gets very humid/hot in July-Aug.


If your signed lease says "exclusive hunting rights" I would push for at least a partial refund if the LO isn't willing to keep them off during/before season.


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Old 04-04-2017, 08:04 AM   #43
bushwacker361
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Quote:
One more question - Do you guys run dogs throughout the summer? Does it ever get too hot for your dogs? I'm in Eastern portion of Central Texas and it gets very humid/hot in July-Aug.
Yes, I run mine year round, but again, my favorite time is during deer season. Temps are cooler and the hogs are hitting the feeders as they go off in the first part of the season. When hogs come out, the deer leave. So a deer hunting operation that only sees hogs at the feeder and no deer...hmmmm, not good. Run the dogs and the hogs will do two things, move away from the pressure and go nocturnal. Now deer come out when the feeder goes off and the hunters are happy. If only those freakin' javelina would do the same. Hate those things...corn thieves and dog killers.
I bow hunt on the ranch as well, I believe I am the only one that does, and I see the same deer on my trail cam pics everyday, like clockwork.
The original poster stated his particular conditions. Small property, crop land, etc., and so for him, dogs could be a problem. But it's been repeated here in this thread, deer don't just leave the country when a dog comes through. They are hunted everyday of their lives by coyotes, bobcats, roaming dogs, and mt. lions, they just don't pack up and move into a safe zone.
There is a man that hunts the ranch that I hunt on and thankfully he doesn't make any decisions on the ranch, but he initially bad mouthed my running the dogs every chance he got telling the foreman it would ruin the deer hunting and my atvs would tear up the land. After 15 years, the deer hunting has improved and my atvs have not torn up the land. Hogs on the other hand continually root the roads up so badly you can't hardly drive on them in many areas and they will ruin a deer hunt every time they show up. He has since changed his toon and has no problem with the dogs, my atvs, or when I hunt. So it proves, you can teach an old dog new tricks.
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Old 04-04-2017, 08:21 AM   #44
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So your saying you are off the property by 2. hunters go out around 3ish I would be interested in the number of mature bucks that show up during daylight hours not the young and dumb bucks
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Old 04-04-2017, 08:31 AM   #45
redfishted
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Default Hot Dogs

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Originally Posted by RACK View Post
Hog dogs will never Ever put even a small dent on the hog population. Most doggers I know do it for sport and practice for their dog training. They could care less about your deer , feeding program, hunting area ,etc. The worst thing in the world you can do for a deer place is put dogs on it and that's just a fact. The deer will flat out leave the area as the dog pressure increases. Most will never come back if they have cover ,browse,and water elsewhere.
I disagree with this, I'll start by saying I do not or have never owned or ran hog dogs personally. My family owns about 500 acres in Madison County, sometimes we get so covered up with hogs that they move the deer around. I have used guy's with dogs to catch and run the hogs off our place, it's amazing how far they run sometimes. Running the hogs a few times usually the same week tends to clear them off our place, the deer generally show right back up, usually better than when we had the hog problems, I would not make a habit out of using the dogs, but used correctly they help us.
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Old 04-04-2017, 08:53 AM   #46
IkemanTX
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If actually reducing the pig population was my goal, I'd do this instead of hog dogs any day...
https://youtu.be/tKy6yozXgSA



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Old 04-04-2017, 09:12 AM   #47
NAVY CHIEF
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My advice to you is if you decide to pay 2000 dollars for a hog dogged bow only lease! U might as well just take that 2K and donate it to st Jude or your favorite charity because y'all ain't gonna kill no deer or pigs anymore! Plus the extra foot pressure of hog doggers is gonna open doors for trespassers and all y'alls stuff gonna get stolen plus u will just be feeding cows and racoons....basically if u stay on this lease with the landowner slapping u in the face like this you are a dumbarse sucker!!!!!hahahaha

Last edited by NAVY CHIEF; 04-04-2017 at 09:18 AM..
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Old 04-04-2017, 09:14 AM   #48
NAVY CHIEF
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Shane I don't even think you would even get to shoot the baby yearlings anymore!! Hahaha
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Old 04-04-2017, 09:32 AM   #49
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Everyone that says hog dogging does not effect the deer should just stick to fishing maybe! Wow...
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Old 04-04-2017, 09:42 AM   #50
NAVY CHIEF
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RACK View Post
Hog dogs will never Ever put even a small dent on the hog population. Most doggers I know do it for sport and practice for their dog training. They could care less about your deer , feeding program, hunting area ,etc. The worst thing in the world you can do for a deer place is put dogs on it and that's just a fact. The deer will flat out leave the area as the dog pressure increases. Most will never come back if they have cover ,browse,and water elsewhere.
This!!!!
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