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Old 04-20-2018, 05:52 PM   #1
OldRiverRat
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Default Civil war

How do civil wars happen?

Two or more sides disagree on who runs the country. And they canít settle the question through elections because they donít even agree that elections are how you decide whoís in charge.

Thatís the basic issue here. Who decides who runs the country? When you hate each other but accept the election results, you have a country. When you stop accepting election results, you have a countdown to a civil war.

The Mueller investigation is about removing President Trump from office and overturning the results of an election. We all know that. But itís not the first time theyíve done this. The first time a Republican president was elected this century, they said he didnít really win. The Supreme Court gave him the election. Thereís a pattern here.

What do sure odds of the Democrats rejecting the next Republican president really mean? It means they donít accept the results of any election that they donít win. It means they donít believe that transfers of power in this country are determined by elections.

Thatís a civil war.

Thereís no shooting. At least not unless you count the attempt to kill a bunch of Republicans at a charity baseball game practice. But the Democrats have rejected our system of government.

This isnít dissent. Itís not disagreement. You can hate the other party. You can think theyíre the worst thing that ever happened to the country. But then you work harder to win the next election. When you consistently reject the results of elections that you donít win, what you want is a dictatorship.

Your very own dictatorship.

The only legitimate exercise of power in this country, according to Democrats, is its own. Whenever Republicans exercise power, itís inherently illegitimate. The Democrats lost Congress. They lost the White House. So what did they do? They began trying to run the country through Federal judges and bureaucrats. Every time that a Federal judge issues an order saying that the President of the United States canít scratch his own back without his say so, thatís the civil war.

Our system of government is based on the constitution, but thatís not the system that runs this country. The Democrat's system is that any part of government that it runs gets total and unlimited power over the country.

If the Democrats are in the White House, then the president can do anything. And I mean anything. He can have his own amnesty for illegal aliens. He can fine you for not having health insurance. His power is unlimited. Heís a dictator.

But when Republicans get into the White House, suddenly the President canít do anything. He isnít even allowed to undo the illegal alien amnesty that his predecessor illegally invented. A Democrat in the White House has ďdiscretionĒ to completely decide every aspect of immigration policy. A Republican doesnít even have the ďdiscretionĒ to reverse him. Thatís how the game is played. Thatís how our country is run. Sad but true, although the left hasnít yet won that particular fight.

When a Democrat is in the White House, states arenít even allowed to enforce immigration law. But when a Republican is in the White House, states can create their own immigration laws. Under Obama, a state wasnít allowed to go to the bathroom without asking permission. But under Trump, Jerry Brown can go around saying that California is an independent republic and sign treaties with other countries.

The Constitution has something to say about that.

Whether itís Federal or State, Executive, Legislative or Judiciary, the left moves power around to run the country. If it controls an institution, then that institution is suddenly the supreme power in the land. This is what I call a moving dictatorship.

Donald Trump has caused the Shadow Government to come out of hiding: Professional government is a guild. Like medieval guilds. You canít serve in if youíre not a member. If you havenít been indoctrinated into its arcane rituals. If you arenít in the club. And Trump isnít in the club. He brought in a bunch of people with him who arenít in the club.

Now weíre seeing what the pros do when amateurs try to walk in on them. They spy on them, they investigate them and they send them to jail. They use the tools of power to bring them down.

Thatís not a free country.

Itís not a free country when FBI agents who support Hillary take out an ďinsurance policyĒ against Trump winning the election. Itís not a free country when Obama officials engage in massive unmasking of the opposition. Itís not a free country when the media responds to the other guy winning by trying to ban the conservative media that supported him from social media. Itís not a free country when all of the above collude together to overturn an election because the guy who wasnít supposed to win.

Have no doubt, weíre in a civil war between conservative volunteer government and a leftist Democrat professional government.


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Old 04-20-2018, 09:13 PM   #2
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I will probably get in trouble for this but I agree with you. Never thought anyone would see it the same way I do.
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Old 04-20-2018, 10:13 PM   #3
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well said, and I agree!
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Old 04-20-2018, 10:27 PM   #4
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Nailed it
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Old 04-21-2018, 06:24 AM   #5
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That's a pretty good statement.

One day in 150years someone is going to ask the question, What happened to America?
And the answer is going to be.....Democrats destroy everything they touch.
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Old 04-21-2018, 07:05 AM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by flywise View Post
That's a pretty good statement.

One day in 150years someone is going to ask the question, What happened to America?
And the answer is going to be.....Democrats destroy everything they touch.
Yup..................

Got one sleeping in the 3rd bed room this weekend. Grrrrr.........
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Old 04-21-2018, 11:52 AM   #7
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Well said
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Old 04-21-2018, 12:01 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by flywise View Post
That's a pretty good statement.

One day in 150years someone is going to ask the question, What happened to America?
And the answer is going to be.....Democrats destroy everything they touch.
And Republicans just stood by and watched it happen.
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Old 04-21-2018, 12:55 PM   #9
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agreed
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Old 04-21-2018, 06:47 PM   #10
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And Republicans just stood by and watched it happen.
And this is the part of the story we really should be ashamed of!!!!
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Old 04-21-2018, 08:07 PM   #11
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And Republicans just stood by and watched it happen.
Enough did for sure
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Old 04-22-2018, 02:19 PM   #12
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And this is the part of the story we really should be ashamed of!!!!
You're right of course, and I would like to think it's because we aren't as mean as they are, but more and more, I think that we're just complacent.
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Old 04-22-2018, 02:43 PM   #13
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Just to play devil's advocate, couldn't democrats have said the same thing during Obama's administration?
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Old 04-22-2018, 06:03 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Johnny Dangerr View Post
Yup..................

Got one sleeping in the 3rd bed room this weekend. Grrrrr.........
Got a bunch on my father's side. I don't even bother making up excuses why I don't go to family reunions anymore.
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Old 04-23-2018, 07:25 AM   #15
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Originally Posted by Drycreek3189 View Post
You're right of course, and I would like to think it's because we aren't as mean as they are, but more and more, I think that we're just complacent.
I'm not sure what it is but it is not good whatever it is and we need to get serious about changing or it will be too late..
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Old 04-23-2018, 07:44 AM   #16
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Originally Posted by grizzman View Post
Got a bunch on my father's side. I don't even bother making up excuses why I don't go to family reunions anymore.
Good weekend. Not a word about politics and lots of laughing.
After 37 years maybe we have figured out what not to discuss.......
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Old 04-23-2018, 08:52 AM   #17
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Probably one of the best posts I have read on this site. Could not agree more.
They could not do it without the main stream media helping along the way.
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Old 04-23-2018, 10:14 AM   #18
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Excellent Post and Spot on
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Old 04-23-2018, 10:40 AM   #19
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Quote:
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Just to play devil's advocate, couldn't democrats have said the same thing during Obama's administration?
This a joke?

Name one relevant thing that even remotely compares to what has been happening to Trump..
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Old 04-23-2018, 10:51 AM   #20
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Great post!! Nail meet hammer!! I will gladly buy you an adult beverage or five if you are ever in southwest Texas!!
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Old 04-23-2018, 11:49 AM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Johnny Dangerr View Post
Good weekend. Not a word about politics and lots of laughing.
After 37 years maybe we have figured out what not to discuss.......
Yeah, my father finally came to the realization that we weren't politically aligned and I wasn't going to cave to his arguments just because he was my father.

It's funny because two of his brothers (one still living) were more in line with me than him. Their kids are more in line with me also but their kids aren't.
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Old 04-23-2018, 12:41 PM   #22
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Originally Posted by RiverRat1 View Post
This a joke?



Name one relevant thing that even remotely compares to what has been happening to Trump..


Trump is getting the special treatment because he doesnít play the game. So not only is he a detestable a-hole to some people, he is unapologetic and unafraid. Therefore, a threat not just to their platform but to the game and the rules used to keep them in power.

Republicans cannot whine and complain though because when given the chance lately theyíve done a ****ty job. Their actions speak louder than their BS words.
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Old 04-25-2018, 07:22 AM   #23
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My point was dems try to act like both parties act the same. Like Obama and Trump are/were equally mistreated by the opposing party. That's BS10

If someone can't see the difference between asking for a birth certificate versus someone's personal tax filings they're an idiot.

And I still ask liberals "What exactly has Trump done to make you hate him?" Funny when you get vague retarded answers like.. He's a pervert! Or whatever the media is pushing at the time with ZERO evidence or proof whatsoever.
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Old 04-25-2018, 08:39 AM   #24
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Im not a huge fan of a parliamentary system of democratic governorship but I do like the idea they have in Europe and the UK that if the party (in our case it would just be the president) doesn't get a certain percentage of the vote than they don't get to rule. They must reach out to another party and make compromises to form a government. If you think about it we are at a point where basically half or less than half of the populace will be served by a President they actually voted for. Making an amendment to the COTUS to somehow encompass something like this I think would one; destroy the two party system, and two; would force apart the polarization of the country. Say 52 percent is the magic number for ****s and grins.

Example, in the last election neither Trump nor Hillary broke the 40s in terms of percentages of the vote so lets say since Trump won using our current electoral system he would then need to go make concessions and deals with the Libertarian party to get those votes. Now we have a ruling government that represents more than one party and an absolute majority of the vote of the citizenry.
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Old 04-25-2018, 09:46 AM   #25
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Im not a huge fan of a parliamentary system of democratic governorship but I do like the idea they have in Europe and the UK that if the party (in our case it would just be the president) doesn't get a certain percentage of the vote than they don't get to rule. They must reach out to another party and make compromises to form a government. If you think about it we are at a point where basically half or less than half of the populace will be served by a President they actually voted for. Making an amendment to the COTUS to somehow encompass something like this I think would one; destroy the two party system, and two; would force apart the polarization of the country. Say 52 percent is the magic number for ****s and grins.

Example, in the last election neither Trump nor Hillary broke the 40s in terms of percentages of the vote so lets say since Trump won using our current electoral system he would then need to go make concessions and deals with the Libertarian party to get those votes. Now we have a ruling government that represents more than one party and an absolute majority of the vote of the citizenry.


One additional potential tweak from the Canadian side is that cabinet members must also be elected vs appointed. Not a guaranteed fix and would come with its own problems, but it has the potential to act as an additional check and balance and tempering of a newly elected President.

I donít think any party will risk introducing the possibility of a Constitutional amendment, because things are so contentious that they would get in a tit for tat amendment battle just like they do with everything else and potentially get a very damaging amendment (to their platform) passed by a later administration
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Old 04-25-2018, 10:06 AM   #26
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Originally Posted by txpitdog View Post
One additional potential tweak from the Canadian side is that cabinet members must also be elected vs appointed. Not a guaranteed fix and would come with its own problems, but it has the potential to act as an additional check and balance and tempering of a newly elected President.

I donít think any party will risk introducing the possibility of a Constitutional amendment, because things are so contentious that they would get in a tit for tat amendment battle just like they do with everything else and potentially get a very damaging amendment (to their platform) passed by a later administration
That Dr. Peterson has you following Canadian politics I see
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Old 04-25-2018, 10:52 AM   #27
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That Dr. Peterson has you following Canadian politics I see

Interestingly I picked that up from a completely random encounter with a Canadian while on business in DC. We were both in the hotel restaurant eating dinner separately but both watching coverage of the 2012 election. The Canadian asked me something about how American politics works, and the conversation took off from there. Thatís where I learned that they supposedly also have to elect cabinet members, which could be elected from a party different from the one the elected PM represents.

But yes, Dr Peterson has a lot of good stuff to say and I do follow much of his interviews and speeches.
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Old 04-25-2018, 11:10 AM   #28
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Originally Posted by txpitdog View Post
Interestingly I picked that up from a completely random encounter with a Canadian while on business in DC. We were both in the hotel restaurant eating dinner separately but both watching coverage of the 2012 election. The Canadian asked me something about how American politics works, and the conversation took off from there. Thatís where I learned that they supposedly also have to elect cabinet members, which could be elected from a party different from the one the elected PM represents.

But yes, Dr Peterson has a lot of good stuff to say and I do follow much of his interviews and speeches.
You going to his lecture next month? Ill PM you so we don't derail the thread.
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Old 04-25-2018, 11:53 AM   #29
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Just to play devil's advocate, couldn't democrats have said the same thing during Obama's administration?
Yes..they could have said everything democrats touch turns to ****... but they didnt.. they kept on being democrats.
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Old 04-25-2018, 06:28 PM   #30
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Well said
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Old 05-02-2018, 01:47 PM   #31
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My Opinion - A fundamental problem of the US political system is only 2 parties. This drives severe partisanship. Right now, it seems like there is no allowance for a middle ground on most issues.

Now, I'm also not saying that more than 2 is perfect. Although I now live in the great state of Texas, I came from Alberta. Alberta is currently controlled by a very left government that didn't come close to winning the popular vote (there were 2 parties on the right that split the vote and 1 on the left).
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