NRA Caves

[RiverRat1]

Nothing.

On another forum several people suggested that they could support it, "if it's done correctly." Some suggested that to give an inch is to accept eventual defeat while others have argued that it could be a good tool if not abused. One poster suggested that this can happen to you through involuntary psychiatric commitment. He argued that this is a better alternative because it at least guarantees a hearing in front of a court. And I agree that if it's used correctly it could be a good thing. But therein lies the problem. Would even we agree with the definition of correctly?

True. When does anything not eventually end up being abused?

Because there are a lot of people on this forum who agree with it. "Rugged individualists" that believe the government can and will protect them through "common sense" legilsation.

Because "they" now interpret even the constitution differently. Even the supreme court has "opinions" out in left field.

So there's zero chance it won't get abused. ZERO.

I mean think that people can't even figure out if kids should choose their sex anymore. And people can identify as whatever they want. But these people should be able to tell if you are sane enough to own a gun to protect your family?

[Mexico]

I wonder how realistic the "legitimate evidence" is going to need to be. What's to stop a ****** off spouse, neighbor, employer etc from using this as a weapon against someone?

Exactly... you pop off at someone or get in an argument and next thing you know you're gunless? Huge mistake... we've all lost our cool once or twice but didn't go shooting up a place... this gives unparamounted power to government and will rob many of their 2nd amendment rights which they won't be able to retrieve without litigation.

[Ætheling]

Heard they were going to offering re-up bonuses on 11B again.

Heck, it might take all that bonus to buy a Yeti.

This is off topic but relevant to this post. I was at Ft. Sill in Field Artillery School in 99. Clinton had done like Obama and decimated the combat side of the Army. We had sections sitting idle with no one to man them. I **** you not I am on a transport going from the barracks to a range and on the radio they announce 20K bonuses for all combat MOS's. Every effing private that showed up to my line unit after me showed up with a giant wad of cash, half up front and the other half added to their pay over time. This was back when a private made about 675 a month. THE LUCK

[donpablo]

Correctly

My opinion of "done correctly" would be:

- The accused should be guaranteed a hearing within a couple of weeks of confiscation
- The accuser would have to prove the imminent threat at the hearing
- The accused would be guaranteed counsel while the accuser would need to provide their own
- The legislation would be liable civilly if they are found to have made the accusation wrongfully (not in good faith) and this should be included in the legislation to give it added weight
- The legislation would require that after the accused's court appearance if/when the charge is dropped the gov't should be required to return all firearms immediately in the condition they were before confiscation and should be civilly responsible for any and all damage including all attorneys fees (an attorney would be needed if the government contests the valuation of said damages)
- For this to be an improvement over the possibility of being institutionalized without due process, the legislation would have to require that a GVRO be obtained before a city/state attempts to institutionalize a gun owner
- The legislation should mandate that this bill if/when adopted supersede any and all states' laws allowing for gun confiscation

Because without these last two it's no improvement of a gun owner's rights. Rather it's just an additional means of confiscation. Now what are the odds that this legislation will have anything even remotely similar to what I suggested. If the NRA had any such contingency for their support of GVROs I'd believe it was a strategic move on their part rather than simply a concession.

[BTLowry]

My opinion of "done correctly" would be:

- The accused should be guaranteed a hearing within a couple of weeks of confiscation
- The accuser would have to prove the imminent threat at the hearing
- The accused would be guaranteed counsel while the accuser would need to provide their own
- The legislation would be liable civilly if they are found to have made the accusation wrongfully (not in good faith) and this should be included in the legislation to give it added weight
- The legislation would require that after the accused's court appearance if/when the charge is dropped the gov't should be required to return all firearms immediately in the condition they were before confiscation and should be civilly responsible for any and all damage including all attorneys fees (an attorney would be needed if the government contests the valuation of said damages)
- For this to be an improvement over the possibility of being institutionalized without due process, the legislation would have to require that a GVRO be obtained before a city/state attempts to institutionalize a gun owner
- The legislation should mandate that this bill if/when adopted supersede any and all states' laws allowing for gun confiscation

Because without these last two it's no improvement of a gun owner's rights. Rather it's just an additional means of confiscation. Now what are the odds that this legislation will have anything even remotely similar to what I suggested. If the NRA had any such contingency for their support of GVROs I'd believe it was a strategic move on their part rather than simply a concession.

And the accuser, if found to have falsely accused said person, is charged with a felony AND 5 years prison sentence with no early release

[RiverRat1]

May sound good ^

But so did the 2nd amendment.
So did the original definition of marriage.
Man and woman being equal sounds nice also. And everyone sure is equal LOL
So did lots of "regulations" and laws that our government completely ignores.

[MBV77]

FBI had what they needed on most of these kooks and did nothing. How are tohose idiots not getting drug through the mud?


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Because them doing nothing is all part of the greater plan.


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[stickerpatch59]

Because "they" now interpret even the constitution differently. Even the supreme court has "opinions" out in left field.

So there's zero chance it won't get abused. ZERO.

I mean think that people can't even figure out if kids should choose their sex anymore. And people can identify as whatever they want. But these people should be able to tell if you are sane enough to own a gun to protect your family?

the crazy folks are now running the asylum.

[stickerpatch59]

Exactly... you pop off at someone or get in an argument and next thing you know you're gunless? Huge mistake... we've all lost our cool once or twice but didn't go shooting up a place... this gives unparamounted power to government and will rob many of their 2nd amendment rights which they won't be able to retrieve without litigation.

true, and litigation = $$$$ for lawers.

[stickerpatch59]

May sound good ^

But so did the 2nd amendment.
So did the original definition of marriage.
Man and woman being equal sounds nice also. And everyone sure is equal LOL
So did lots of "regulations" and laws that our government completely ignores.

but you have to admit, it's better than anything yet to be offered.

[RiverRat1]

but you have to admit, it's better than anything yet to be offered.

Nope.. Fix the FBI

You will never stop all shootings..ever. If you can't see that then there's no point talking to you.

The FBI could/should have stopped most shootings.

[tps7742]

Politics at work here IMO!

[jer_james]

FBI needs to be fixed - People need to respond accordingly to verify the allegations that have been brought forth prior to these incidents happening.

I dont worry about restrictions. Nobody is taking anything that I may or may not have.

[Traildust]

Right after Universal Background Checks for van rentals!