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Old 08-28-2019, 02:03 PM   #1
Spoiled_TN_boy
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My wife is a teacher. Being a certificate holder she is required to report activities in violation of moral/illegal conduct of colleagues.

Last spring a student of hers won a writing contest and was invited to Washington DC. Upon hearing this news, director of fine arts invited himself on the trip. While in DC, at dinner with parents and student, the director purchased a bottle of wine and consumed. He also allowed the student to drink a glass with parents permission. They were all at same table.

When group returned, student was bragging to friends at school about drinking wine with this administrator while in DC. My wife heard of this from other students and reported the incident.

She was called last week and a mtg scheduled with investigation office today. They gave her a copy of the report but she was allowed to read in the office. They did tell her they only interviewed the administrator. Student was not interviewed because he is no longer a student and at college. Also, parents were not interviewed either.

She was also told that the administrator was told her name as the person filing the report.

If a crime goes to court, I can understand facing your accuser. But in the event of an investigation where no "crimes" were found, why would they reveal the name of person filing report?

If a teacher was reported to purchase alcohol at a school related event, they would be put on leave or fired. Let alone giving the student alcohol. Why does an administrator (Director) get a pass?
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Old 08-28-2019, 02:21 PM   #2
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In most districts if you accompanied a student on a school sponsored trip and purchased and consumed alcohol you'd be be in a major bind. Even if you did not give the kid any.

I'd say the outcome depends largely on who is doing the investigating, who is being investigated and who is controlling all of that.
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Old 08-28-2019, 02:26 PM   #3
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She filed a report, on a “superior”, based on third hand gossip from teenagers? Bold move for sure.

The Admin didn’t get a “pass” yet. Sounds like the investigation is ongoing, but they should have to do something to prevent hostilities in the future. Hopefully they don’t punish your wife for doing her job. Nothing worse than that.
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Old 08-28-2019, 02:35 PM   #4
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Where’s the crime? I know they weren’t in Texas and the laws may be different there, and I may be incorrect. In Texas I was always told if the parent is there and allows a minor can consume alcohol. Also, if the kid is in college this year, that puts him at 18, it wasn’t his first drink. If the parents weren’t there I could see cause for concern.
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Old 08-28-2019, 02:38 PM   #5
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It doesn't sounds like to me that the administrator permitted the kid to drink wine. Sounds like the kid's parents permitted the kid to drink wine.
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Old 08-28-2019, 02:41 PM   #6
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Is your concern the administrator getting a pass or retaliation against your wife. If the latter and she reported this incident in good faith, I would think she would be protected under a whistleblower statute or the district should have a policy in place that protects her.
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Old 08-28-2019, 02:42 PM   #7
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It doesn't sounds like to me that the administrator permitted the kid to drink wine. Sounds like the kid's parents permitted the kid to drink wine.


This^^^^. Tell them to pound sand.
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Old 08-28-2019, 02:52 PM   #8
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It doesn't sounds like to me that the administrator permitted the kid to drink wine. Sounds like the kid's parents permitted the kid to drink wine.
Thats the way I see it. In Highschool had a teacher ask me to enter the bronc riding at ranch rodeo as part of "her" team. After said Rodeo we all sat around and had a few beers. Never thought anything about it.
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Old 08-28-2019, 02:59 PM   #9
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there may be some "loop hole" (lack of a better word here) as they were at dinner and not a school function or activity

I in no way mean to offend with the next part of this sentence -- but was reporting this incident really necessary? In my understanding there is a difference between "whistleblowing" and "snitching", what I honestly don't understand is what to consider reporting this situation...

I guess the better question I haven't seen asked -- did your wife have any of these facts before she reported the person, or was she just going off what was heard through teenage gossip?
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Old 08-28-2019, 03:03 PM   #10
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I know for the fire dept, if I allege something against a fellow employee or supervisor, I cant be anonymous. This helps keep both sides honest.

To answer your second question, a parent allowed an 18-year-old to drink wine during dinner. Nothing illegal or immoral there.
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Old 08-28-2019, 03:42 PM   #11
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It should have ended with parents at the table and gave permission.
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Old 08-28-2019, 04:03 PM   #12
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I guess the better question I haven't seen asked -- did your wife have any of these facts before she reported the person, or was she just going off what was heard through teenage gossip?
I don't disagree with you, but flip it around. What if the kid had some wine, and something bad happened to the kid alcohol related with the admin there, purchasing the wine? I personally would say the parents let him have wine, it's not that admin's fault that something happened.

But, in today's society, those same parents could easily flip it around to something bad happened to our kid because the teacher gave him/her wine. We didn't know it was wine. We thought it was grape juice. I see where OP's wife is coming from. Not sure if there is a better way to handle it, and there are a few holes in the story too. Like why it took more than six months to investigate.
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Old 08-28-2019, 04:09 PM   #13
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So.....I'm understanding kids parents were present and allowed said kid to drink and OP wife hears 3rd hand kid drank and reports to administration..........I would say wife should have minded her own business.
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Old 08-28-2019, 04:13 PM   #14
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All I can do is shake my head...
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Old 08-28-2019, 04:22 PM   #15
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From your statement, I don't see that your wife has any proof of 'immoral/illegal activity, Just heresay.
Reporting everything highschool kids say will probably cause her more grief than she is looking for.
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Old 08-28-2019, 04:25 PM   #16
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Oh man I had plenty of beers with my old ag teachers while in school.
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Old 08-28-2019, 05:38 PM   #17
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I've got so much to say but I will leave it alone. I would just say to make sure your wife adheres to all policies and procedures from here on out and pray this year is a good one with no issues. She's got a target on her back now. People can claim whistleblower act all they want but they will come up with a "Constructive Discharge" scenario very easily, no matter how good her record may be. Most all teachers are on a 1 year contract these days so it's very easy to non renew with no explanation.

She needs to feel it out this Fall and have a backup plan to find another place to teach just in case.
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Old 08-28-2019, 05:39 PM   #18
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This is how fake news works...you gotta validate at this level or will bite you back.
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Old 08-28-2019, 06:23 PM   #19
Spoiled_TN_boy
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Thank you for all the replies.
We live and work in Texas.
Student gossip was confirmed when parents were asked, as we are friends outside of school.

I tried to talk her into letting this go, but she couldn't get over the fact that a school official was drinking with a student at a school related event.

My wife's Principal is the one who recommended she file a report.

At any rate, it's almost hunting season.
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Old 08-28-2019, 07:04 PM   #20
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sorry...I understand the moral issue but since the folks were there it probably shouldn't have been pushed unless the parents were indeed uncomfortable, but that isn't the case.

If they could prove the teacher was the one who started/instigated drinking with a minor then you would think there's still trouble simply due to the rules of the game. I find it hard to see an experienced teacher take such action as it's explained.
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Old 08-29-2019, 07:48 AM   #21
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Having just sat through an hour long refresher with the company lawyer last week, some of these situations were discussed.
Representing your employer (in my case wearing my FRC's in public) and doing something questionable like drinking or acting in any way inappropriate can be held against you even if you are off duty. Same can be said about sending offensive items either by email or text on personal phone to business computer or other employee personal phone.
Everything is ok until it isn't.
Let the student's parents get mad about something and see if this comes back up.
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Old 08-29-2019, 07:54 AM   #22
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in 14 more years my youngest will be 18. I will then sell everything so I can move into the Wilderness far away from other humans and this trivial crap.
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Old 08-29-2019, 08:03 AM   #23
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I'm curious if the Admin expenses the dinner ( Wine included) to the district or not?

If the district didn't actually pay for the wine, I dont see a problem.

Last edited by Mayhem; 08-29-2019 at 08:26 AM.
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Old 08-29-2019, 08:09 AM   #24
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Quote:
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I'm curious if the Admin expenses the dinner ( Wine included) to the district or not? If the district didn't actually play for the wine, there is no problem.
FIFY,

This is my take on the deal. In reality, I can't see a District funding a trip to DC from Texas for a student and admin to accept an award. I think this is a pay your own way situation, therefore not a school trip.

Last edited by Mike; 08-29-2019 at 08:12 AM.
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Old 08-29-2019, 08:16 AM   #25
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for me it depends on if the person tried to pass wine off on an expense account...most corporations wont allow that, neither should a school...tax dollars and all that. If he paid for it, then reporting it just creates unnecessary drama for everyone.
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Old 08-29-2019, 08:25 AM   #26
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In my opinion nothing wrong occurred other than your wife overstepped her bounds. I am sure it will work out. I do hope the administrators career is not messed up simply because they drank a glass of wine with dinner.

-john
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Old 08-29-2019, 09:11 AM   #27
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part of the problem
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Old 08-29-2019, 09:38 AM   #28
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Honestly Im glad she got dimed out for diming someone else out and trying to poop on someone elses party. She is now...That Person. Sorry Dude.
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Old 08-29-2019, 09:57 AM   #29
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I don't understand these days why some people are so worried about what others do
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Old 08-29-2019, 10:28 AM   #30
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All y'all dingles ragging on his wife need to get off your high horses.

"My wife is a teacher. Being a certificate holder she is required to report activities in violation of moral/illegal conduct of colleagues."

She is legally required to report this or she could lose her livelihood.

It's a tough situation for sure, mind your own business and lose your job or rat out the boss and possibly lose your job...
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Old 08-29-2019, 12:06 PM   #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jspradley View Post
All y'all dingles ragging on his wife need to get off your high horses.

"My wife is a teacher. Being a certificate holder she is required to report activities in violation of moral/illegal conduct of colleagues."

She is legally required to report this or she could lose her livelihood.

It's a tough situation for sure, mind your own business and lose your job or rat out the boss and possibly lose your job...
Only problem with this is that I can't find a moral or illegal violation. It's not immoral or illegal for a kid to drink alcohol with their parents permission. It's not immoral or illegal for a school administrator to buy dinner and wine for the parents and student. It's not immoral or illegal for a school administrator to have wine on a school trip. Wine is LEGAL. I also think that it's somewhat telling how there was a little dig of "the Director of Fine Arts invited himself on the trip".
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Old 08-29-2019, 12:13 PM   #32
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Quote:
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Only problem with this is that I can't find a moral or illegal violation. It's not immoral or illegal for a kid to drink alcohol with their parents permission. It's not immoral or illegal for a school administrator to buy dinner and wine for the parents and student. It's not immoral or illegal for a school administrator to have wine on a school trip. Wine is LEGAL. I also think that it's somewhat telling how there was a little dig of "the Director of Fine Arts invited himself on the trip".
When dealing with hearsay it could have very well felt obligated or even required...
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Old 08-29-2019, 12:31 PM   #33
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I think the Administrator used poor judgement by introducing alcohol. Whether legal or not, it shows poor judgement on his part.
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Old 08-29-2019, 12:33 PM   #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jspradley View Post
All y'all dingles ragging on his wife need to get off your high horses.

"My wife is a teacher. Being a certificate holder she is required to report activities in violation of moral/illegal conduct of colleagues."

She is legally required to report this or she could lose her livelihood.

It's a tough situation for sure, mind your own business and lose your job or rat out the boss and possibly lose your job...
I doubt you would lose your job for not reporting a rumor.....
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Old 08-29-2019, 12:42 PM   #35
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Originally Posted by tx_basser View Post
I think the Administrator used poor judgement by introducing alcohol. Whether legal or not, it shows poor judgement on his part.
Why? I don't understand this reasoning. Wine is not illegal. I read nowhere where the alcohol was expensed to the district. I read nowhere that he was inebriated. He was at dinner with other consenting adults and their kid whom they gave consent to partake. Outside of a Baptist gossip session, I just don't see the "poor judgement" part.

I sat on my local school board for 7 years and was President for 3. I have seen "poor judgment" in school employees, administrators, etc. in ways that you can't imagine.
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Old 08-29-2019, 12:49 PM   #36
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This is where I think about my 6 year old son and what he always tells his sister.

"worry about yourself"

I see no harm or foul by the Admin since parents were there.
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Old 08-29-2019, 12:50 PM   #37
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Parents were there....parents decision Trump's any teachers imo and the parents are the ones responsible for them at that time, no expert here but just the way if see it if it was my kid and I allowed it, wouldn't be a school employees problem.

BTW our head football coach was also a golf coach. He drank a beer or two when we played golf. No one ever batted an eye.
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Old 08-29-2019, 12:53 PM   #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rick View Post
I doubt you would lose your job for not reporting a rumor.....
Who honestly knows with the way schools work now...

One more reason I'm glad I don't work for the government! I like being able to mind my own business.
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Old 08-29-2019, 01:34 PM   #39
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Code of conduct seems to spell out this item, and the Director should understand that he is a representative of the school 24x7 traveling or on school trips. His actions will be viewed in that light and as such the associated perception.

It's also legal for him to do a myriad of things, but that does mean it is acceptable under code of conduct.
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