Shocking?

[tex4k]

Simply believing isn't enough, it's a matter of living your beliefs.

[Snowflake Killa]

Y'all need to get off the pulpit and go stick something with your bow.....



.....or eat a Snickers!

Back button.

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[RattlesnakeDan]

When I was born-again from above, I was radically changed, I was given a new Spirit. I was set free from the world, whom He sets free is free indeed. I was fully freed from my sins, not partially. God is not a God of chaos, that comes from the evil one.
I went through a hard time for a brief period, real trial, I was in the Spirit and crying and I questioned my salvation for a brief moment in time. God took me to Heaven I guess is where it was and showed me a book, the pages of the book were made of stone and I saw my name being written, Daniel Joseph Fisher, it was in a cursive but not our cursive but I knew exactly what it said. The ink was liquid gold and when it flowed onto the page it was in the stone permanently and I saw the pen stop at the end and push down like making a period. God showed me that my name was written in the book of life and could not be removed or erased. I cried for days when I came back to myself.
His point was that I was saved, wholly and fully, not half way to earn something I can not. The Bible tells us that all things are legal for me but not all things are profitable, so will I do sinful things in the flesh, of course, but do I live a sinful life, of course not.
Many Christians refuse to remove the chains of the past and continue to drag around dead weight. The old law is no longer valid when the new law takes place. Be free in Christ people.

[Mertzon Man]

What a great discussion to this point in this thread. Some very good thoughts posted, and even thoughts from some that I have had discussion with who actually struggle with the whole "God" and "religion" thing.


It is true that Satan himself believes in Jesus Christ. He just chose to NOT follow His teachings and in fact being a "fallen angel" is "hell-bent" on destroying as many believers as he can. He even tempted Jesus after God led him into the wilderness and back to "town". Satan used his words that if Jesus had been unknowing of God's (His) Word could have fallen victim to Satan and thus been destroyed. But Jesus defeated and survived the temptation by casting off Satan's attempts at trying to get him to fall by using God's Word to defeat him. Congrats

The same is true for all of us. When we in fact do accept Jesus as our Lord and Savior, a new life is created. We are immediately justified in Christ and saved, but the process of "sanctification" is a process. We refer to it as a "walk". We have prayed to God and asked Him to change us and save us from our sin. We must learn how to do that. If our heart is changed, we indeed will grow closer to Christ-like living as long as we live on this earth or until Jesus returns. For instance, the thief on the cross next to Jesus asked Him to remember him right after he had made a profession to the other thief who had rejected him telling him that this "man" had done nothing wrong, but that he and the other thief he was talking to deserved the punishment they were receiving. Jesus did not... Professing that belief, the asking Jesus to remember him, Jesus told him straight up that he'd see him in Paradise. When the Reverend Bill Graham was saved, he spent the next 70+ years actively serving Christ and His bride the Church... These are two extremes. Both men went to heaven when they died and both had cups that runneth over with peace, joy and everlasting happiness and life... It's just that their cups are not the same size so to speak. Both are just as saved and both perfectly formed and full of eternal joy and happiness.



For us to receive that same eternal joy and happiness will be different for each and everyone of us, but since Jesus knows the very numbers of hairs on your head, he knows everything you do and most importantly what is in your heart... If your heart is changed and your efforts and intentions are to serve Him, when you mess up, asking, you will be forgiven. If there's no change in heart or attitude, there's no "justification" to begin with and no "sanctification" process was begun... whether it was 10 minutes ago, on 100 years ago...


Paul wrote to the Corinthians very clearly about this and then further clarified it to the Galatians


2Co 5:17 Therefore if anyone is in Christ, he is a new creature; the old things passed away; behold, new things have come.



Gal 6:15 For neither is circumcision anything, nor uncircumcision, but a new creation.

Amen!!

[Playa]

So how does this preacher reconcile the thief on the cross? Was that guy just #blessed that he died moments after encountering Jesus? How does he define lawlessness? Is that referring to the law given by God in the OT? If not where is this law stated?

I’ll admit I’m jaded. For a belief system predicated on “one truth”, that truth sure seems to be open to interpretation and misunderstanding. Can’t even agree on the most fundamental aspect, which is how to “become a Christian.”

I grew weary of church because it was an expense of my time to to be spoon fed messages that may or may not be “true” based on interpretation, all while surrounded by people that don’t seem to give a crap about me 6 days of the week.

[Hooverfb]

So how does this preacher reconcile the thief on the cross? Was that guy just #blessed that he died moments after encountering Jesus? How does he define lawlessness? Is that referring to the law given by God in the OT? If not where is this law stated?

I’ll admit I’m jaded. For a belief system predicated on “one truth”, that truth sure seems to be open to interpretation and misunderstanding. Can’t even agree on the most fundamental aspect, which is how to “become a Christian.”

I grew weary of church because it was an expense of my time to to be spoon fed messages that may or may not be “true” based on interpretation, all while surrounded by people that don’t seem to give a crap about me 6 days of the week.

The thief changed his heart. Christ doesnt put a condition on you must do xyz, but he does want a genuine heart. It's like in micah 6:8 (I think), where it points out God doesnt want a sacrifice externally. Theres nothing you can do to earn salvation. What does God want? Seek justice, love mercy, walk humbly with God. The thief acknowledged his wrong, accepted the truth of Christ, and even defended Christ against the other thieves. Theres no time table on salvation, but with that your actions vs knowledge of salvation will be judged by God since He is Lord. That addresses the situation of well what if I just wait to the last second to repent. Would you say your heart was really seeking God if you had knowledge of Him and chose to ignore Him to play a game of life essentially?

I'll agree with you that the modern church, especially around cities, does a poor job of actually being the church. Being brothers and sisters, fellowshipping, helping, serving,caring. I taught a young adult study where everyone had 5-10 years on me and most everyone couldn't give up any of their daily scrubles to bother to serve, or get involved with other Christian's, then wonder why their life is always the same.

[Pineywoods]

The thief truly believed, confessed, repented, and Jesus knew the sincerity of his heart. He didn't have to perform any works to be saved neither does anyone else. The bible doesn't teach a works based salvation and that isn't what Paul Washer was teaching. The bible does teach that a true saving faith, given by grace alone will naturally produce good works and evidence (fruit) as that person submits to and grows in Christ. If the thief were to have lived, we would have seen a changed life, not just that profession alone on the cross. We know that because he was justified and those He justifies, He will also sanctify (process of making you holy). There are death bed conversions like the example at the cross. But for those of us alive today and not on our death bed right now, is our heart today to surrender our will to Christ? Is he Master over our life? Is there a process happening in our life that is constantly showing us the areas of our lives that do not line up with God's word and drawing us to conform to the example of Jesus? Do we hate the sin in our lives and love righteousness? Do we love God's people/His Church? Do we get it all right?...no, absolutely not. Do we blow it?...yes. Are we deeply convicted and drawn to confess our sin to the Father and ask for forgiveness when we sin?... I hope so as I don't see how a true believer could be comfortable in their sin and continue to live an ongoing habitual lifestyle of sin and hold on to a one time profession as their free ticket to heaven. Again, I think the problem is with the word believe. Some see it as just a head knowledge of who Jesus is and what He did. But a biblical belief changes the heart, which changes a life, which produces a life that seeks to glorify God in all that's said and done. We are not our own if we belong to Christ. We were bought at a great price. Though grace was freely given to us, it was not free. Jesus paid a great price to rescue me from my sin. Grace was not and is not cheap so how could we profess to be Christian's and trample on the blood of Jesus by treating it as cheap when we live however WE want yet claim to follow Him.

[Rudyl]

Tagged for listening later.

[RiverRat1]

In my opinion a way to look at it is to ask the question, Does the person feel guilt when sinning? And repent? If a Christian struggles for real like Paul in Romans 7 as he cries to God saying I know what I'm not supposed to do but still do it! That person is most likely saved.

On the flip side if a person visits church one time, says they accept Jesus, and then goes right back into sinning without guilt, remorse and anguish they are probably not saved.

[3DW5]

So how does this preacher reconcile the thief on the cross? Was that guy just #blessed that he died moments after encountering Jesus? How does he define lawlessness? Is that referring to the law given by God in the OT? If not where is this law stated?

I’ll admit I’m jaded. For a belief system predicated on “one truth”, that truth sure seems to be open to interpretation and misunderstanding. Can’t even agree on the most fundamental aspect, which is how to “become a Christian.”

I grew weary of church because it was an expense of my time to to be spoon fed messages that may or may not be “true” based on interpretation, all while surrounded by people that don’t seem to give a crap about me 6 days of the week.

Very simple, the thief was under the old law because Jesus had not died yet, also Jesus being the son of God had the power to take away sins.

I hate to hear that going to church is a expense of your time, I am sure God will over look it and let you slide.

[Saltaholic]

People want this Josh, not the Gospel. I want the gospel.




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No need to throw stones at Joel. He’s great at getting people’s attention then from there it’s up to them how to draw closer.

It’s in the scripture

[Mayhem]

No need to throw stones at Joel. He’s great at getting people’s attention then from there it’s up to them how to draw closer.

It’s in the scripture

Actually its his job to share the plan of salvation with them, not pump sunshine up their butts.

[manwitaplan]

No need to throw stones at Joel. He’s great at getting people’s attention then from there it’s up to them how to draw closer.

It’s in the scripture

What verse is that?


Sent from my iPhone

[Saltaholic]

Actually its his job to share the plan of salvation with them, not pump sunshine up their butts.

Well I’m not going to argue but I will never understand how a Christian can judge another who brings millions of people to the faith by preaching hope. It’s not the full gospel but it’s definitely a part of it and it’s very useful to gain attention in a dark world. I have met Joel and spoken with him, he loves the Lord and he’s fulfilling his calling. I’m in ministry myself and fully understand that his messages are surface only and a deeper level relationship is needed after but can’t get mad at anyone for opening the door....

Steve

[Saltaholic]

What verse is that?


Sent from my iPhone

Philippians 1:15