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    I would say no, otherwise we would've heard about it a long time ago. If I were L&E and had a higher TDN than Antlermax or even Record Rack I certainly would've pushed that subject in my marketing. Wouldn't have you?!

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      Originally posted by mesquite View Post
      I would say no, otherwise we would've heard about it a long time ago. If I were L&E and had a higher TDN than Antlermax or even Record Rack I certainly would've pushed that subject in my marketing. Wouldn't you?!
      Yes I think they would have....so it must not be a huge deal. We know DD would be all over this

      I think in LF supplemental feeding it is not a huge deal.....if inside a breeding pen or HF with little natural browse it would be a bigger deal.

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        Originally posted by mesquite View Post
        I would say no, otherwise we would've heard about it a long time ago. If I were L&E and had a higher TDN than Antlermax or even Record Rack I certainly would've pushed that subject in my marketing. Wouldn't have you?!

        Originally posted by gingib View Post
        Yes I think they would have....so it must not be a huge deal. We know DD would be all over this

        I think in LF supplemental feeding it is not a huge deal.....if inside a breeding pen or HF with little natural browse it would be a bigger deal.
        End all be all? No but still an important number I would think. I was told my local mill NEg (net energy for gain) is more important but it looks like that kinda goes along with higher TDN seeing lab samples. You still want your minerals and stuff right for your place also. If this stuff matters for cattle you would assume it would matter in deer if you're that serious about your supplemental feeding program.

        I remember when the protein % was all that mattered to people, then minerals, then vitamins, now possibly this being a decision maker. As people learn more and more they demand more.

        Also L&E doesn't change their formulas like RR but you don't see anyone marketing that fact either and that's a much bigger deal

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          So are food plot plants 100% digestible or how do things like soybeans/lab lab ect compare in digestibility. just wondering for a reference. which are the most cost effective. not against protein and this is a good thread. when you feed the neighbors deer and they shoot more than you do you have to be cost effective as possible. thanks

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            Originally posted by Black Gold View Post
            Back to topic: Any other feeds that ween need to track down TDN's on to add to the list???

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            Any One Know The TDN for Cottonseed?

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              94%


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                Whole cotton seed is 28% protein and 90% TDN
                Cotton seed meal is 46% protein and 75% TDN
                Corn is 9.8% protein and 90% TDN

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                    What about Gossypol ?????
                    Gossypol is a phenolic compound produced by pigment glands in cotton stems, leaves, seeds, and flower buds (Gossypium spp.). Cottonseed meal is a by-product of cotton that is used for animal feeding because it is rich in oil and proteins. However, gossypol toxicity limits cottonseed use in animal feed. High concentrations of free gossypol may be responsible for acute clinical signs of gossypol poisoning which include respiratory distress, impaired body weight gain, anorexia, weakness, apathy, and death after several days. However, the most common toxic effects is the impairment of male and female reproduction. Another important toxic effect of gossypol is its interference with immune function, reducing an animal’s resistance to infections and impairing the efficiency of vaccines. Preventive procedures to limit gossypol toxicity involve treatment of the cottonseed product to reduce the concentration of free gossypol with the most common treatment being exposure to heat. However, free gossypol can be released from the bound form during digestion. Agronomic selection has produced cotton varieties devoid of glands producing gossypol, but these varieties are not normally grown because they are less productive and are more vulnerable to attacks by insects.

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                      During the cotton seed pressing process the gossypol levels drop to such negligible levels it should not cause concerns ruminant feeds.
                      Much like how soybeans are processed and handled.


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                        Thats not what the article says. and a lot of the deer hunters feed whole cottonseed along with the protein. (that has cottonseed in it)

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                          This is the conclusion of the article.

                          10. Conclusions and Future Research Directions

                          The ingestion of gossypol present in cottonseed and its products (cakes and meal) may promote clinical poisoning, liver damage, male and female reproductive toxicity, and immunological impairment. The acute poisoning is not currently a significant problem but the reproductive damage causes serious economic losses to the livestock industry. Even though the male reproductive toxicity is well known, there is a need for more studies to understand the female reproductive damage promoted by gossypol. The immunotoxicity of gossypol is far from being completely elucidated, but it impacts animals by reducing their resistance to infections and by impairing the efficiency of vaccines. Extensive research is needed to develop more efficient and inexpensive technologies to reduce gossypol toxicity.

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                            Isn't the whole issue with gossypol only if a deer eats a high % of his diet in cottonseed? From the studies I have read, a free range buck/doe will not eat a high enough % of their diet in cottonseed. Therefore, they don't see the effects of gossypol. The articles I am speaking of are from Caesar Kleberg.

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                              Originally posted by JWHunt View Post
                              Thats not what the article says. and a lot of the deer hunters feed whole cottonseed along with the protein. (that has cottonseed in it)
                              That's almost exactly what the article reads. Gossypol is an issue in Whole Cottonseed. Always has been and always will be. When it is processed into cottonseed meal, almost all the oil is removed. During this process, gossypol is transformed from "free" to "bound". Bound gossypol or d-gossypol is considered to be inactive in feed ingredients. Furthermore, the heat process and diluting of cottonseed meal with other ingredients in a pellet form make it non existent.

                              As for it's concentration in whole cottonseed, it is hard to detect. You could hold out two handfuls and one would contain 12,000 parts and the other 0. But the supplement nutritional value is a risk many deer hunters are willing to take.

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                                Originally posted by bgleaton View Post
                                Isn't the whole issue with gossypol only if a deer eats a high % of his diet in cottonseed? From the studies I have read, a free range buck/doe will not eat a high enough % of their diet in cottonseed. Therefore, they don't see the effects of gossypol. The articles I am speaking of are from Caesar Kleberg.
                                You are correct. Most of these studies, like the one quoted above, are directed to dairy cattle.

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