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    Building YOUR arrow...

    So, I've been playing around with arrows all year; weights, broadheads, fletching, yad yada.

    So last night I had all my arrows left from hunting this year and decided to make my GRXH arrows.

    All of these arrows had been built, and shot, before; some just at foam, others at animals; you get the idea, they are used.

    I had to drive the inserts out of the shaft after I removed the weights. I used the old drill bit trick to do this, I still lost two shafts. My thinking is they were either already damaged (I did have a few misses this year) or they were glued in so well they weren't coming out without being damaged.

    I then stripped the fletching off and preped the shafts.

    Since I had been using weights I knew exactly how much weight I wanted up front on my arrows; turn out it is 100 gr.

    I am using Gold Tip Hunter and Velocity shafts; like I said, these are leftovers from this year's hunting.

    I amusing the Gold Tip 100 gr brass inserts, so I glued them in. I am also using Grip Tip glue for the first time. If it works it will be a lot easier than needing to mix epoxy all the time.

    Then I installed the nock bushings and pin nocks. I love pin nocks and I am using the Gold Tip HD pin nocks.

    Then on to fletching. I am using Gateway Feathers Rayzr feathers; I've been using hem for a few years and they are great feathers. They are also very light, at 1.2 gr per feather instead of the 6 gr per vane of Blazers. This will in effect give me a better FOC percentage.

    I use the EZ Fletch, and the feathers can be a little finicky in the jig, but if you pay attention it is easy enough. I also use Tip Grip on the feathers; we will see.

    I ended up with two sets of arrows, Hunter and Velocity. Velocity is the lighter arrow so should give better FOC when all is said and done.

    Each arrow has the exact same components, cut to the same length; in effect, they are identical except for the GPI weight of the different model shafts.

    I ended up with this:
    Hunter: 501 gr, 20.3% FOC
    Velocity: 486 gr, 21.2% FOC

    Less then 1% difference in FOC and about 15 gr difference in weight.

    This is the arrow I want. For me it maximizes both FOC and weight, not too much of either, I can still use normal broadheads.

    This is a very easy way to get to 500 gr and/or 20% FOC without using s bunch of special stuff, like heavy broadheads or weights. Just keep in mind, everyone is a little different and results will not be the exact same for every person; but this model will get you close.

    Ranch Fairy also has a good video on this, if you haven't seen it yet, I suggest you head over and give it a watch.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LEBe-gqAoEU

    Remember, figure out what you want in your arrow and then build to that; there is no right arrow for every single person or set up.

    Last edited by Rat; 02-10-2018, 01:10 PM.

    #2
    I really need to come see you buddy. This hoyt is giving me hell. I got a dozen arrows coming on Tuesday to start fresh with. The Mathews is still shooting lasers so I'm good for granger.

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      #3
      Tagged


      Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

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        #4
        Originally posted by Stoof View Post
        I really need to come see you buddy. This hoyt is giving me hell. I got a dozen arrows coming on Tuesday to start fresh with. The Mathews is still shooting lasers so I'm good for granger.
        Whenever you get ready brutha, we can get 'er done.

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          #5
          Nice builds Rat. Id like to get where you are on my Dartons arrows. Im sitting right at 20% FOC on 575 gr for my recurve.

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            #6
            So this may be a dumb question but... I’ve seen the ranch Fairy video and it’s got me thinking. Before I go through the hassle of taking my current inserts out, how would I know if I’m weakening the spine too much by putting a 100 gr insert in?

            I’m shooting gold tip velocity 300 spine 29” out of a 65 lb bow

            Comment


              #7
              Originally posted by kd350 View Post
              So this may be a dumb question but... I’ve seen the ranch Fairy video and it’s got me thinking. Before I go through the hassle of taking my current inserts out, how would I know if I’m weakening the spine too much by putting a 100 gr insert in?

              I’m shooting gold tip velocity 300 spine 29” out of a 65 lb bow
              Take one arrow and cut the fletchings off. Then shoot one bare and one fletched at a point on target at 20 yards. Now replace both tip to a heavier tip. And reshoot. Look at how far the bare shaft is below the fletched one. If very low like 1in or more spine is prolly underspined. That’s the hard way. You could just look at a program.

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                #8
                Originally posted by enewman View Post
                Take one arrow and cut the fletchings off. Then shoot one bare and one fletched at a point on target at 20 yards. Now replace both tip to a heavier tip. And reshoot. Look at how far the bare shaft is below the fletched one. If very low like 1in or more spine is prolly underspined. That’s the hard way. You could just look at a program.


                Thanks. What program? Any of them free?


                Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

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                  #9
                  Originally posted by kd350 View Post
                  Thanks. What program? Any of them free?


                  Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro
                  Mr Newman has been busy.


                  This website is for sale! thearcheryprogram.com is your first and best source for all of the information you’re looking for. From general topics to more of what you would expect to find here, thearcheryprogram.com has it all. We hope you find what you are searching for!


                  The flow chart is slick. Click the diagram figures and theyre embedded with links.
                  Last edited by Briar Friar; 02-13-2018, 11:06 PM. Reason: MoreCopyPaste

                  Comment


                    #10
                    Originally posted by kd350 View Post
                    So this may be a dumb question but... I’ve seen the ranch Fairy video and it’s got me thinking. Before I go through the hassle of taking my current inserts out, how would I know if I’m weakening the spine too much by putting a 100 gr insert in?

                    I’m shooting gold tip velocity 300 spine 29” out of a 65 lb bow
                    That arrow is going to be fine, even if it is a little weak (which I don't think it will be) you can always adjust the height of the arrow through the Berger hole as I described above.

                    But that would be pretty close to what I am shooting, and I am shooting a heavier draw weight, so you will be good.

                    Comment


                      #11
                      If you want me to run your arrow...

                      Send me a PM with:

                      Your bow's make, model and year along with the current spec's (draw weight and length).

                      Your arrow build info, make model and length of arrow (carbon to carbon), fletching type and number, nock type (plus any bushings), tip weight and insert type. Anything that adds weight will also need to be included, like wraps or lighted nocks, etc.

                      Send your email in the PM and I will work it up and then send you a screen shot of the arrow as it is now and with the changes you want to make to show the difference.

                      For those of you wanting a program of your own. I use TAP Pro, this is a full ballistic program for everything. but there is also a product called Spinal TAP that is just for arrows. I have been using TAP Pro for years and is the most accurate arrow ballistic program I have found; as determined by the accuracy of the tape and cut chart outputs anyway.

                      It is not free and I don't know if there is a free trial period or not.

                      http://www.thearcheryprogram.com/products

                      Keep in mind that if you have a brand 2018 bow I will not have the specs for this bow until late Feb. or early March. But I can get it close enough for arrow spine selection.

                      Comment


                        #12
                        Originally posted by Briar Friar View Post
                        Mr Newman has been busy.


                        This website is for sale! thearcheryprogram.com is your first and best source for all of the information you’re looking for. From general topics to more of what you would expect to find here, thearcheryprogram.com has it all. We hope you find what you are searching for!


                        The flow chart is slick. Click the diagram figures and theyre embedded with links.
                        And more coming.

                        Comment


                          #13
                          Originally posted by Rat View Post
                          If you want me to run your arrow...

                          Send me a PM with:

                          Your bow's make, model and year along with the current spec's (draw weight and length).

                          Your arrow build info, make model and length of arrow (carbon to carbon), fletching type and number, nock type (plus any bushings), tip weight and insert type. Anything that adds weight will also need to be included, like wraps or lighted nocks, etc.

                          Send your email in the PM and I will work it up and then send you a screen shot of the arrow as it is now and with the changes you want to make to show the difference.

                          For those of you wanting a program of your own. I use TAP Pro, this is a full ballistic program for everything. but there is also a product called Spinal TAP that is just for arrows. I have been using TAP Pro for years and is the most accurate arrow ballistic program I have found; as determined by the accuracy of the tape and cut chart outputs anyway.

                          It is not free and I don't know if there is a free trial period or not.

                          http://www.thearcheryprogram.com/products

                          Keep in mind that if you have a brand 2018 bow I will not have the specs for this bow until late Feb. or early March. But I can get it close enough for arrow spine selection.
                          Email sent.....#PotLicking!

                          Comment


                            #14
                            Rat, after my bow experimentation, I did play with some arrows from my longbows and ran a few through my compound. I have some Gold Tip Traditional arrows spined 340, with 100 grain brass inserts. @ 20 yards the difference was minimal, but from there the gap between pin and point of impact grew substantially, which I already knew was going to be the case.
                            Point to all this.
                            I REALLY like heavy points in my traditional bows, but had not moved that route in my compound. No chronograph so no way for me to really know what the change in arrow weight does for me, but in the target, (again not scientific as density changes all over the target), but the added FOC did not change the penetration by more than 1" (close to 50 comparable shots).
                            All my tinkering came back to was, I have had great success with my past set-up and did not see enough improved penetration from adding brass inserts that I wanted to add more money per shaft.
                            Have you had a chance to put any numbers on different shafts to see what you were getting in speed, kinetic energy (I also realize there is some fault at the physical number kinetic energy when looking at arrows but it's a measurable standard) and actual penetration?
                            My current compound set-up is 68#At 27.75" draw G5 Quest Rogue. Arrows are 28" off a QAD rest.
                            Sorry for the long one, still trying to make sense of FOC and actual real results.

                            Comment


                              #15
                              Originally posted by Dry Bones View Post
                              Rat, after my bow experimentation, I did play with some arrows from my longbows and ran a few through my compound. I have some Gold Tip Traditional arrows spined 340, with 100 grain brass inserts. @ 20 yards the difference was minimal, but from there the gap between pin and point of impact grew substantially, which I already knew was going to be the case.
                              Point to all this.
                              I REALLY like heavy points in my traditional bows, but had not moved that route in my compound. No chronograph so no way for me to really know what the change in arrow weight does for me, but in the target, (again not scientific as density changes all over the target), but the added FOC did not change the penetration by more than 1" (close to 50 comparable shots).
                              All my tinkering came back to was, I have had great success with my past set-up and did not see enough improved penetration from adding brass inserts that I wanted to add more money per shaft.
                              Have you had a chance to put any numbers on different shafts to see what you were getting in speed, kinetic energy (I also realize there is some fault at the physical number kinetic energy when looking at arrows but it's a measurable standard) and actual penetration?
                              My current compound set-up is 68#At 27.75" draw G5 Quest Rogue. Arrows are 28" off a QAD rest.
                              Sorry for the long one, still trying to make sense of FOC and actual real results.

                              If I’m reading this right. You increased foc but didnt see penetration difference in a target. That is correct. You won’t. I’m suprized with the added weight you didn’t notice less penetration vs more on a lighter faster arrow.

                              When doing penetration test you cannot use targets. Targets work on friction. So a slower arrow will not penetrate as much as a faster arrow. Just how it is. Targets can grip a slow moving arrow easier

                              If you want to look at penetration sand is the best. Sand has little restriction somarrow stops when it runs out of forward momentum This is a good way to prove physics. Now a high foc arrow vs low foc same weight arrow shot into sand will have about same penetration. Foc comes into play when there is restriction on impact. Meaning to see if foc will out perform you need more restriction on impact.

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