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Old 07-16-2013, 02:11 PM   #1
Pineywoods Paul
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Default East Texas Mountain Lion or Black Panther Sightings/ Killings

We have a recent incident in our area where a freshly killed hog of the 165-200 lbs size was drug through some plantation over a quarter mile in one night. We also allegedly had a black cat with a long tail sighted by our pasture warden, and tracks that were supposed to be cougar-like. I did not see photos of the tracks, and do not know even if photos exist in this alleged case.
We are in northwest Polk County.

I've been hearing these stories and campfire rumors for years. Finally saw some trail camera photos from Newton County a year or two back, and some photos of a roadside kill somewhere near Liberty last year. Both these we're regular cougars of the brown color phase.

I'm very curious to see any recent real evidence (2012-13) like trail camera photos or kills in East Texas, either of a cougar or the more infrequently reported east Texas black panther-either brown or otherwise. Not hill country or south Texas- but East Texas. As in east of I45 to Sabine River.

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Old 07-16-2013, 02:16 PM   #2
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Don't exist. Period.
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Old 07-16-2013, 02:18 PM   #3
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The only real black panthers are probably marching in Florida right now...
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Old 07-16-2013, 02:20 PM   #4
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The only real black panthers are probably marching in Florida right now...
True dat...
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Old 07-16-2013, 02:20 PM   #5
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The great almighty black panther!! He has been on the move lately someone needs to get him
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Old 07-16-2013, 02:21 PM   #6
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Pineywoods I grew up in East TX Mountian lions do exsist My brother and I both have witnessed them Black panather i think are a old wise tail
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Old 07-16-2013, 02:25 PM   #7
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Don't exist. Period.
Cougars or black panthers or neither?
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Old 07-16-2013, 02:30 PM   #8
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A cougar is another word for a large cat. In the U.S. this is a reference to a Mountain Lion. There have been ZERO documented cases of a melanistic phase (black) mountain lion. It is not possible genetically and they do not exist.

There are black cougars in south america such as black phased jaguars. Extremely rare even down there, and their range does not extend to North America anymore - hasn't for a very long time.

If someone sees a "black panther", they were drunk, or it was a house cat they thought looked big at a distance.
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Old 07-16-2013, 02:53 PM   #9
Pineywoods Paul
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Quote:
Originally Posted by quackNthwack View Post
A cougar is another word for a large cat. In the U.S. this is a reference to a Mountain Lion. There have been ZERO documented cases of a melanistic phase (black) mountain lion. It is not possible genetically and they do not exist.

There are black cougars in south america such as black phased jaguars. Extremely rare even down there, and their range does not extend to North America anymore - hasn't for a very long time.

If someone sees a "black panther", they were drunk, or it was a house cat they thought looked big at a distance.
Makes sense to me. However, I am still curious about East Texas sightings/ killings of even the normal cougar/ mountain lion/ puma, or whatever we call it these days. Really prefer to see trailcam photos or photos of dead cats so as to sort the rumors from more substantiated incidents.

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Old 07-16-2013, 03:09 PM   #10
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Saw a young one in Polk County at about 10 yds in late 80's, scared me to death, looking back on it now, the cat was no more than 1.5 yrs and was absolutely no harm to me, but at the time it might as well have been a grizzly! We also had a couple sightings in the early 2000's a week or so apart by different people within a mile or so of each other. I did not see that with my own eyes so who knows.

I do not think there is a such thing as a Black Panther, dark phase mountain lion in late evening, maybe...black panther, no.

But hey, there are people that don't believe there are occasional mountain lions in East Texas.

Got this pick last year in Northern Polk County, don't know for sure what this is, but I sure wish I would have taken a couple of extra whacks with the machete!

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Old 07-16-2013, 03:24 PM   #11
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Sending PM.
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Old 07-16-2013, 03:29 PM   #12
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Chupracabra
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Old 07-16-2013, 03:32 PM   #13
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Si Robertson says there are black panthers and I ain't gonna argue with uncle Si
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Old 07-16-2013, 03:33 PM   #14
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Just wait by this sign and one will show up

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Old 07-16-2013, 03:34 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by quackNthwack View Post
A cougar is another word for a large cat. In the U.S. this is a reference to a Mountain Lion. There have been ZERO documented cases of a melanistic phase (black) mountain lion. It is not possible genetically and they do not exist.

There are black cougars in south america such as black phased jaguars. Extremely rare even down there, and their range does not extend to North America anymore - hasn't for a very long time.

If someone sees a "black panther", they were drunk, or it was a house cat they thought looked big at a distance.
I've been plenty drunk, and still have never seen a black panther.
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Old 07-16-2013, 03:37 PM   #16
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Sending PM.
PM answered.
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Old 07-16-2013, 03:38 PM   #17
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They exist
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Old 07-16-2013, 03:53 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by quackNthwack View Post
A cougar is another word for a large cat. In the U.S. this is a reference to a Mountain Lion. There have been ZERO documented cases of a melanistic phase (black) mountain lion. It is not possible genetically and they do not exist.

There are black cougars in south america such as black phased jaguars. Extremely rare even down there, and their range does not extend to North America anymore - hasn't for a very long time.

If someone sees a "black panther", they were drunk, or it was a house cat they thought looked big at a distance.
Are you 100 percent sure about this????
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Old 07-16-2013, 04:00 PM   #19
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Are you 100 percent sure about this????
yah brah, we get it, you've got proof but you will never show anyone.
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Old 07-16-2013, 04:02 PM   #20
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yah brah, we get it, you've got proof but you will never show anyone.

.......
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Old 07-16-2013, 04:02 PM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by quackNthwack View Post
A cougar is another word for a large cat. In the U.S. this is a reference to a Mountain Lion. There have been ZERO documented cases of a melanistic phase (black) mountain lion. It is not possible genetically and they do not exist.

There are black cougars in south america such as black phased jaguars. Extremely rare even down there, and their range does not extend to North America anymore - hasn't for a very long time.

If someone sees a "black panther", they were drunk, or it was a house cat they thought looked big at a distance.
From the Ellen Trout Zoo in Lufkin......not saying they are correct just sayin somebody thinks they exist
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Old 07-16-2013, 04:08 PM   #22
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I believe there are a few dark colored mountain lions in East Tx as well as scattered normal colored cats. One case is a cat that hung out in Ratcliff lake rec are for several years. She stayed pretty close during deer season as campers dressed deer in camp and she got then trimmings.
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Old 07-16-2013, 04:10 PM   #23
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Call the local game wardens if you want to hear about the mountain lions in east tx. Rusk, panola and Gregg are good to try.
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Old 07-16-2013, 07:12 PM   #24
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Originally Posted by Black Ice View Post
Just wait by this sign and one will show up

Attachment 518021
They need to place this sign on 288 in Houston.
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Old 07-16-2013, 07:29 PM   #25
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I have no pictures so call me a liar if needed. I have seen 3 live cougars/mountain lions in Texas and none were black.

One was while hog hunting in Zapata, when I saw it it was walking away around 300 yards and I thought it was a deer until it turned broadside leaving the sendero. Never got a shot. It was around 2001.

Another was between Tilden and Three Rivers around 2000. We had just picked a hunter up from a stand and headed back to the camp and when we rounded a corner the dang thing almost ran over us.

The first one was after the 1994 flood and was in Liberty county. Our deer lease is next to the Trinity river and there is a levee that keeps the river from flooding the town of Liberty. Me and my buddy were riding down the levee and it came up from the side of the levee and jumped in front of us. It turned and ran about ten yards and bailed back off the levee. I asked my buddy was that a cougar and he said yep. That was the only time we ever saw it. My buddies grandpa passed away this year at 84 years old and he used to always talk about the bear tree on our lease. It was a huge hollowed out cypress tree and he used to tell us stories about a black bear that had two cubs that stayed around there in the 60's and 70's.

Last edited by Capt.Bryan; 07-16-2013 at 07:30 PM.. Reason: spelling
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Old 07-16-2013, 07:52 PM   #26
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I worked nights at the old Albertsons DC in Katy back in 98' and we had a black panther/cat that was pacing the fence line by our fuel pumps. My spotter came running in to grab me cause i didn't believe him. And sure enough, there was one. Being 21 and full of stupidity i had the idea to get a pallet and try to corner it. I got within about 10' of it and it jumped the fence and took off. The back stood about 24" and it was about 6' long tip of tail to nose. Never saw it after that night. Side story, I had a mountain lion at the lease in Aspermont stalk me and another hunter coming back one night. He was on a ledge about 7' above us and if it wasn't for another member getting charged by a herd of pigs and hopping in his 4 wheeler to come tell us about it. We could have been dinner.
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Old 07-16-2013, 07:55 PM   #27
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Man, I hate to say it but until one defecates in their bed or drags off a prized hunting dog, most of these guys will never believe in the existence...I believe in the big cats...definitely bigger than bob cats...
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Old 07-16-2013, 08:01 PM   #28
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[quote=thorshammer;7256395]I worked nights at the old Albertsons DC in Katy back in 98' and we had a black panther/cat that was pacing the fence line by our fuel pumps. My spotter came running in to grab me cause i didn't believe him. And sure enough, there was one. Being 21 and full of stupidity i had the idea to get a pallet and try to corner it. I got within about 10' of it and it jumped the fence and took off. The back stood about 24" and it was about 6' long tip of tail to nose. Never saw it after that night. Side story, I had a mountain lion at the lease in Aspermont stalk me and another hunter coming back one night. He was on a ledge about 7' above us and if it wasn't for another member getting charged by a herd of pigs and hopping in his 4 wheeler to come tell us about it. We could have been dinner.[/


Uhhhmmm, Wow....

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Old 07-16-2013, 08:14 PM   #29
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Sure there are big cats. Just not black panthers. Unless they hang with Bigfoot...
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Old 07-16-2013, 08:18 PM   #30
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Originally Posted by EastTXHunter View Post
Man, I hate to say it but until one defecates in their bed or drags off a prized hunting dog, most of these guys will never believe in the existence...I believe in the big cats...definitely bigger than bob cats...
I think I'd be in big trouble if the elusive black panther deficates in my bed. Said panther would not be the only deficator at that point...
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Old 07-16-2013, 08:29 PM   #31
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Sure there are big cats. Just not black panthers. Unless they hang with Bigfoot...
Agreed.... I think folks are confusing the sentiment. I don't see anybody claiming there are no regular mountain lions. There are plenty of pictures and actual recorded kills to show there are respectable populations. It is the mystical, mythical, elusive black ones without as much as a picture most don't believe.
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Old 07-16-2013, 08:35 PM   #32
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Big cats in East Texas? you bet

Big BLACK cats in East Texas? I will have to see some definitive proof before I will believe

There was a pic of a mountain lion near Carthage on here last year or before
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Old 07-16-2013, 08:42 PM   #33
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I've never seen a black one but I have seen a few regular ones. Saw one last week behind my house. I have a game cam back there now trying to get a pic but I'm thinking he was just passing through.
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Old 07-16-2013, 08:58 PM   #34
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When I was about 10 or so, I heard one behind our house one night. Talk about give you the willies. My uncle said he saw one one evening while running his dogs on a timber plantation by his house. Another on reported just up the road from us in some friends pasture right off the highway. All this was on 255 from colmesneil to jasper. When I was in high school, supposedly someone's horse was killed by one behind the sheriffs office in woodville. They are there, that thick timber will hide more things than you know it.
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Old 07-16-2013, 09:10 PM   #35
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Maybe it was a big cat that was in the oil spill
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Old 07-16-2013, 09:13 PM   #36
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I'm always perplexed when someone says there is NO such thing as a black panther in Texas.

There may not be a "natural native black cat" in Texas but CERTAINLY someone could have released a black cat pet (or 2 or 3 or 10) and they could be around or even mated.

"Some" of the people who claimed to see them might not be lying. They may have really seen one.

I have a rancher cousin in Grayson county who says he sees one on his property about 1 or 2 times a year. He isn't a drunk. Never lies and is a church going dude I believe him.

It is NOT impossible that a black cat is roaming Texas without being on a trail cam. Have you ever seen albino horny toads? Or a baby dove? Doesn't mean they don't exist.
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Old 07-16-2013, 09:15 PM   #37
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I saw a baby dove a few weeks ago
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Old 07-16-2013, 09:17 PM   #38
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I saw a baby dove a few weeks ago
See, so black panthers DO exist.
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Old 07-16-2013, 09:23 PM   #39
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They need to place this sign on 288 in Houston.
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Old 07-16-2013, 09:30 PM   #40
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I was shown a TC pic 3yrs ago of one at about 40' out. It was walking directly under the feeder so there was clear reference as to size.
I would like to say I am very knowledgeable about wildlife in my areas and if this was not a black cougar, it was DARK CHOCOLATE colored.
I have seen a cougar(mt. lion, same thing) in the wild in California as well as in zoos and my field guide to N. American mammals and what I was shown is definately a cougar in east Texas.
The place the pic was taken is off of FM 14 in wood county just NW of Holly Lake.
That is about 20 miles, as the crow flies from my lease and WAYYYY to close for my comfort !
As of now, I have seen no sign of them(prints, scratching posts,kills) out there and I really don't know what I'd do if I did.
Those are about the only critters that make me nervous to be out in the woods after dark !
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Old 07-16-2013, 09:31 PM   #41
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My grandfather always told me about panthers following him in the moonlight right across the boarder in Louisiana when he was a young man!

He was born in 1903
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Old 07-16-2013, 09:57 PM   #42
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I know it's tough to argue about the existence of black ones without proof but I know atleast one exists.
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Old 07-16-2013, 10:19 PM   #43
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Quote:
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The only real black panthers are probably marching in Florida right now...
I can always count on you for an LOL or a well placed zinger.
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Old 07-16-2013, 11:20 PM   #44
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Interesting thread.... never thought about that... but come to think of it the only big cat ive seen that black are jaguars. Not lions... wasnt there talk about the jags in nexici moving north into texas... or sone other kind of big cat thats not a regular mountain lion..


For the record... mountain lion is some darn good eatin!!!!!
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Old 07-16-2013, 11:23 PM   #45
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Not easy Texas but i know what i saw in erath county belas daylight was black long tail and could run fast saw it at coret yards i will never forget it . I dont know hy there are not alt of pics of them but if not what the hell did i see?
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Old 07-17-2013, 07:53 AM   #46
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^^^^^^^^^ edit your post into english please!
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Old 07-17-2013, 08:45 AM   #47
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Four years ago during the spring of 2009, my wife and mother-in-law were walking from her field back to camp which is about a 200 yd walk. Halfway back they heard one roar and said every hair they had on their body stood on end. Needless to say they picked up the pace and got back to the truck pretty quickly. Also, last fall, just a few miles from Rivercrest high school in the southern part of our county, a 140 inch Tenpoint was found mauled With deep scratch marks beginning in its rib cage and ending and it's hindquarters. The game warden was at a football game on Friday night and got the call to come investigate. I talked to him at my work about a week later and he confirmed to me that yes, while no one saw a big cat kill the animal, the evidence on the carcass Definitely pointed toward a big cat. The words "yes the deer was killed by a Mountain lion" came out of his mouth. This is in Northeast Texas. So yes, I believe mountain lions do exist in this part of the state, but not sure about their coloration.
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Old 07-17-2013, 09:00 AM   #48
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Joogers neighbor in Huntington sees them nearly every day, just ask Jooger....granted the guy goes through a case of Jim Beam in about a week.

Gotta think there are one or two melanistic gato grandes out there somewhere, but until I see one with its ****** in the dirt, I will be hesitant to believe all of the "sightings"
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Old 07-17-2013, 09:08 AM   #49
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I have seen one mountain lion in Crane Co when I was a kid. My parents and I were on a Sunday drive out between Crane and McCamey going to King Mountain and Castle Gap and one ran across and down the oil road in front of us in broad daylight.
I used to coon hunt with my Dad a lot and twice we have seen Jaguarundis in the woods. Yep, up close and personal as the dogs had em treed. Both times they were up a Bois D'arc tree. The first Jag we treed was on the LBJ Grassland right near Twin Lakes. Second was on Caney Creek north of Bonham about 1/2 mile from the river. These cats are not all that big but definitely bigger than a house cat, more like the size of a good Bobcat and they do appear black.
Stupid cats jumped right out on top of them 2 redbones. Yeah we got a real close look.
As for black panthers, I still with Uncle Si on that.
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Old 07-17-2013, 09:11 AM   #50
ezypikns
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Default From a TPWD Publication.....

Quote:
Mountain lions are native to Texas and classified as non-game species. They occur in the Trans Pecos in primarily large undeveloped tracts of land. TPWD has records of mountain lions occurring in every county of Texas except for the northernmost counties of the Panhandle. Presently Texas regulations allow for the management of lion populations and lions may be controlled year-round. Other states have become more restrictive in their regulations, making it difficult to manage expanding predator populations and an increase in human injury has occurred.
My guess is that anywhere you have a decent deer population they'll be there.


a black lion seems unlikely, though.
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