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Old 09-09-2017, 06:12 PM   #1
txsteele
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Default Artifact Arrowhead Experts?

My wife and I decided to go to Matagorda Beach today and just chill out. She loves to search for Sea Glass and unusual shells and after big storms (Hurricane Harvey) new things wash up on shore.

She's about ten yards in front of me on the wet sand and bends over and says you're gonna **** when you see this. She walks over to me with a closed fist. When she opens her hand, she has an arrowhead??? WTH???

Two Questions.....

1. How/Why would there be an arrowhead on the beach like that?
2. What kind of arrowhead is it?

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Old 09-09-2017, 06:13 PM   #2
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Great find!
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Old 09-09-2017, 06:14 PM   #3
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Because Indians lived on the coast?
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Old 09-09-2017, 06:14 PM   #4
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Very cool!
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Old 09-09-2017, 06:16 PM   #5
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There it is! I dropped that on the beach the other day!


Skinny
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Old 09-09-2017, 06:18 PM   #6
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Carancahua Indian

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Old 09-09-2017, 06:20 PM   #7
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Very nice!!!
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Old 09-09-2017, 06:32 PM   #8
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Very cool. Yep they lived along the coast too. I imagine it's been tossed around by many hurricanes since it was made.
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Old 09-09-2017, 06:46 PM   #9
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Cool find
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Old 09-09-2017, 06:49 PM   #10
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There's some TBH'ers that can tell you all about that point, Johnny, Garguy to name a few....
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Old 09-09-2017, 06:51 PM   #11
kruppa24
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What is sea glass.
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Old 09-09-2017, 06:55 PM   #12
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Very nice.......
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Old 09-09-2017, 07:07 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kruppa24 View Post
What is sea glass.
peices of broken glass that are weathered and have smooth edges because they have been in the sand and washed over and over for decades
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Old 09-09-2017, 07:09 PM   #14
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brown is one of the most common because of old beer bottles but sometimes you will find green and blue but the most rare is the Red glass because its been there for 50+ years
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Old 09-09-2017, 07:10 PM   #15
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people use the glass for arts and crafts , jewelry, etc
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Old 09-09-2017, 07:11 PM   #16
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old broken coke bottles, medicine bottles and such
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Old 09-09-2017, 07:12 PM   #17
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Originally Posted by kruppa24 View Post
What is sea glass.
Glass that has been polished/softened/worn by tumbling in the water and sand. It's mostly just beer and liquor bottles that are broken, but depending on where it's found and it's color, it can be somewhat valuable. My wife collects it and makes stained glass windows with it.
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Old 09-09-2017, 07:13 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Skinny View Post
There it is! I dropped that on the beach the other day!


Skinny
I'll get it in the mail tomorrow for ya' big boy
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Old 09-09-2017, 07:15 PM   #19
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That isn't sea glass it's got a tea stained patina, the material it's made out of is a completely different color, soak it in vinegar overnight if you don't believe me but I wouldn't because the color gives it character. Johnny and I both calling that an Early Stemmed point, very old and a very awesome find. http://www.projectilepoints.net/Points/EarlyStem.html


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Old 09-09-2017, 08:09 PM   #20
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Originally Posted by SouthernCamo View Post
That isn't sea glass it's got a tea stained patina, the material it's made out of is a completely different color, soak it in vinegar overnight if you don't believe me but I wouldn't because the color gives it character. Johnny and I both calling that an Early Stemmed point, very old and a very awesome find. http://www.projectilepoints.net/Points/EarlyStem.html


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Thanks for the input. I know the arrow head isn't sea glass. That's just what we were looking for when she found the arrow head.

Can you expand upon what you mean about soaking it in vinegar? I wouldn't do it, but what would it look like?
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Old 09-09-2017, 08:20 PM   #21
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Originally Posted by txsteele View Post
Thanks for the input. I know the arrow head isn't sea glass. That's just what we were looking for when she found the arrow head.

Can you expand upon what you mean about soaking it in vinegar? I wouldn't do it, but what would it look like?
Soaking an artifact in vinegar overnight will remove any stains, algae and debris. It will bring out the original appearance of the material and clean it up..

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Old 09-09-2017, 08:30 PM   #22
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Originally Posted by ..Ambush.. View Post
Soaking an artifact in vinegar overnight will remove any stains, algae and debris. It will bring out the original appearance of the material and clean it up..

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Ambush nailed it. The material on that would be anything from a grey, tan, or even root beer/honey color.


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Old 09-09-2017, 10:24 PM   #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ..Ambush.. View Post
Soaking an artifact in vinegar overnight will remove any stains, algae and debris. It will bring out the original appearance of the material and clean it up..

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Quote:
Originally Posted by SouthernCamo View Post
Ambush nailed it. The material on that would be anything from a grey, tan, or even root beer/honey color.


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So it's personal preference? It's the first point we have ever found.

Why wouldn't I want to see it in it's original condition?
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Old 09-09-2017, 10:32 PM   #24
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Originally Posted by txsteele View Post
So it's personal preference? It's the first point we have ever found.



Why wouldn't I want to see it in it's original condition?


It's absolutely personal preference, you won't hurt the artifact. It should become shiny instead of that crust look.


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Old 09-09-2017, 10:33 PM   #25
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Very cool, I bet high island is getting hit pretty hard by collectors this week.

Many a good point has been found on a Texas beach.
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Old 09-10-2017, 08:22 AM   #26
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Karankawas were part of the Gulf culture of native Americans and lived along the coast. Some used dugout canoes to travel. There was a vibrant trade network amongst the Texas Indians and more than likely the karankawas traded for the arrowheads with the Pueblo Indians from west Texas.
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Old 09-13-2017, 04:03 PM   #27
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Karankawas were part of the Gulf culture of native Americans and lived along the coast. Some used dugout canoes to travel. There was a vibrant trade network amongst the Texas Indians and more than likely the karankawas traded for the arrowheads with the Pueblo Indians from west Texas.
While this is very true and good info, the point he found is thousands of years older than the Karankawas or whatever they were called.
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Old 09-13-2017, 04:10 PM   #28
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The wife and I were out at the beach here in Corpus 2 weeks ago and she found one almost identical to that if I'm not mistaken. We were about 20 miles down the Padre Island National Seashore (PINS) when she found it. I thought it was weird too.
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Old 09-13-2017, 05:00 PM   #29
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GarGuy....do you agree with the link that SouthernCamo posted?

Quote:
Originally Posted by SouthernCamo View Post
That isn't sea glass it's got a tea stained patina, the material it's made out of is a completely different color, soak it in vinegar overnight if you don't believe me but I wouldn't because the color gives it character. Johnny and I both calling that an Early Stemmed point, very old and a very awesome find.

http://www.projectilepoints.net/Points/EarlyStem.html


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Old 09-13-2017, 05:39 PM   #30
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Originally Posted by Deer716 View Post
The wife and I were out at the beach here in Corpus 2 weeks ago and she found one almost identical to that if I'm not mistaken. We were about 20 miles down the Padre Island National Seashore (PINS) when she found it. I thought it was weird too.


Got a pic?


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Old 09-13-2017, 06:11 PM   #31
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Got a pic?


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I do now.
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Old 09-13-2017, 06:43 PM   #32
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I agree with Garguy that the point pre-exists the various tribes that we now know existed in Texas. But what a cool find in all that sand! What are the odds of finding a tool made thousands of years ago by the earliest settlers.
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Old 09-13-2017, 06:50 PM   #33
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GarGuy....do you agree with the link that SouthernCamo posted?
Totally. the point is what I call Early stemmed. Likely 9,000ish years old. The material has a heavy mineralization on it and is probably edwards chert.
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Old 09-13-2017, 06:53 PM   #34
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I do now.
That is probably a Wells varient. Maybe slightly younger than the op but still very old and has a similar patina. cool items. It is really fun to hold a weapon that another hunter used thousands of years ago.
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Old 09-13-2017, 07:03 PM   #35
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Totally. the point is what I call Early stemmed. Likely 9,000ish years old. The material has a heavy mineralization on it and is probably edwards chert.
WOW!!!! Who would have made it?? I mean was there a tribe back then or just Nomads?
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Old 09-13-2017, 07:04 PM   #36
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WOW!!!! Who would have made it?? I mean was there a tribe back then or just Nomads?
My understanding is that they were generally called "paleoindians". I guess that means before they formed the various tribes that we know of today.
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Old 09-13-2017, 07:36 PM   #37
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WOW!!!! Who would have made it?? I mean was there a tribe back then or just Nomads?
They had home base villages although smaller than later folks. I have dug some extensive Paleo/early Archaic sites. The Americas were pretty well settled by 9,000 years ago. Im sure they had tribal names but we certainly dont know what it was. the consistancy of point type proves the groups over a very large area had contact with each other as well as traded materials from a wide area.

Last edited by GarGuy; 09-13-2017 at 07:40 PM..
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Old 09-13-2017, 08:11 PM   #38
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Modern Indians, think Apache, Comanche Karankawa they all used the points made by the ancient people who made the one that your wife found. Modern Indians were lazy. They'd touch them up and use them and others that they found.

I've found a lot of them in cotton fields near Danevang after plowing and have found a few Perdernales points down by Oyster Lake on West Matagorda Bay. Those are 2-3,000 years old.

Great find, bet she was excited!
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Old 09-13-2017, 08:20 PM   #39
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Really nice find.

About the only thing I like as much as hunting or fishing is looking for arrowheads.
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Old 09-13-2017, 08:32 PM   #40
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Cool find..........
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Old 09-13-2017, 08:53 PM   #41
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GarGuy View Post
That is probably a Wells varient. Maybe slightly younger than the op but still very old and has a similar patina. cool items. It is really fun to hold a weapon that another hunter used thousands of years ago.
A question if that point was that old how would it have been used. Thanks.
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Old 09-13-2017, 09:32 PM   #42
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A question if that point was that old how would it have been used. Thanks.
Yes this?????

A friend of ours who lives on the Lower Brazos River and hunts/collects arrow heads on the river banks thinks this is a spear head not an arrow head.

Thoughts??
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Old 09-13-2017, 09:44 PM   #43
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I have found a few points over the years. How does one go about finding info about how old they may be, who made them, etc?
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Old 09-13-2017, 09:50 PM   #44
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Very cool to find on the beach!

I find it fascinating that the ocean level was lower in the fairly recent past and that these cultures lived what would now be many many miles offshore. Here are some articles of an ancient forest found in 60 feet of water....10 miles off the Alabama coast.

http://http://blog.al.com/live/2012/09/ancient_forest_lies_10_miles_o.html

http://http://www.al.com/news/mobile/index.ssf/2017/06/underwater_forest_discovered_alabama.html

Think of all the artifacts that are still under the water many miles offshore.
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Old 09-13-2017, 11:38 PM   #45
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Awesome find. My husbands aunt owns Karankawa village (with the teepee pulling into matagorda). I know many said this is much older than the karankawas. I'm a realtor and was in Thompson land company's office in Bay City last week. He has an entire 8 foot display case FULL of arrowheads, some of which he found in matagorda. You could probably learn a lot from stopping in and talking with him. But if you decide to buy property or a beach lot in matagorda, let me know, because we don't work together!


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Old 09-14-2017, 12:02 AM   #46
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Very cool to find on the beach!

I find it fascinating that the ocean level was lower in the fairly recent past and that these cultures lived what would now be many many miles offshore. Here are some articles of an ancient forest found in 60 feet of water....10 miles off the Alabama coast.

http://http://blog.al.com/live/2012/09/ancient_forest_lies_10_miles_o.html

http://http://www.al.com/news/mobile/index.ssf/2017/06/underwater_forest_discovered_alabama.html

Think of all the artifacts that are still under the water many miles offshore.
Yes,I find that fascinating too. Apparently the sea level rose at least 60 feet in the last 10-14 thousand years. Corresponds with the end of the last ice age. The Earth warmed without Man's Industrial Age of the last 200 years being the cause. Now, that is an inconvenient truth.
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Old 09-14-2017, 05:29 AM   #47
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Thats too cool
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Old 09-14-2017, 08:43 AM   #48
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Yes,I find that fascinating too. Apparently the sea level rose at least 60 feet in the last 10-14 thousand years. Corresponds with the end of the last ice age. The Earth warmed without Man's Industrial Age of the last 200 years being the cause. Now, that is an inconvenient truth.
Huge inconvenient truth! In one of those articles a paleo-climatologist says that at one point sea levels rose 75 feet in a ~ 1000 years. I assume because of massive rate in glacier melt. Pretty impressive.
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Old 09-14-2017, 09:17 AM   #49
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Yes this?????

A friend of ours who lives on the Lower Brazos River and hunts/collects arrow heads on the river banks thinks this is a spear head not an arrow head.

Thoughts??
He is absolutely correct. it was hand thrown (likely with an atlatl). the bow and arrow wasnt invented in the Americas until roughly 2500 years ago. the little points we call ""Bird" points are actually true arrow points.

Someone mentioned earlier that later Natives used stuff from the older groups. this is to some degree true but the weapons evolved so much that it is highly unlikely that this point was ever used later than the group that made it. Its been lost for thousands of years. The site where these folks live during a time known as the Younger/Dryas is likely ten miles off shore now.
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Old 09-14-2017, 09:21 AM   #50
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Awesome find. My husbands aunt owns Karankawa village (with the teepee pulling into matagorda). I know many said this is much older than the karankawas. I'm a realtor and was in Thompson land company's office in Bay City last week. He has an entire 8 foot display case FULL of arrowheads, some of which he found in matagorda. You could probably learn a lot from stopping in and talking with him. But if you decide to buy property or a beach lot in matagorda, let me know, because we don't work together!


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The Matagorda area has been inhabited for 13,000 years. the Karankawas were there less than a thousand of that. It is very likely that the majority of his collection are from peoples much older than Karankawa.
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