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Old 11-11-2014, 01:35 PM   #101
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Originally Posted by Pushbutton2 View Post
I'm currently shooting Beman Bowhunters they are .006 straightness.
Would there be a noticeable difference I went with a .003 or .001?

I'm seriously considering the Rampage LD in a 250 spine....

Depends, how good of a shot are you?
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Old 11-11-2014, 01:41 PM   #102
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Default FOC increase


My first group of 6 @ 20 yds, after not shooting for 2 weeks.
The high one on the left was a bad shot.
The one on the right is because I was talking
;-)

The others are some one else's..


Quote:
Originally Posted by sambo73 View Post
Depends, how good of a shot are you?

Better than you

My bows sighted in AND I have arrows ;-))

Last edited by Pushbutton2; 11-11-2014 at 01:46 PM..
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Old 11-11-2014, 02:16 PM   #103
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My first group of 6 @ 20 yds, after not shooting for 2 weeks.
The high one on the left was a bad shot.
The one on the right is because I was talking
;-)

The others are some one else's..





Better than you

My bows sighted in AND I have arrows ;-))

Thats not sayin much
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Old 11-11-2014, 02:43 PM   #104
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Originally Posted by Pushbutton2 View Post
I'm currently shooting Beman Bowhunters they are .006 straightness.
Would there be a noticeable difference I went with a .003 or .001?

I'm seriously considering the Rampage LD in a 250 spine....
I'm probably just some redneck with a keyboard talking out his backside, but with the straightness tolerances of just about any commercially available carbon arrow, I seriously doubt that it would make any appreciable difference at normal hunting ranges.

"Holy crap! These arrows have 0.006 straightness! They're crooked as ****!!!" Doesn't really hold water to me.

Then again, the 0.003 arrows may just be the culls out of a production run. It could be that those are more likely to have voids or resin imperfections and a disproportionately weak spine in one radius. Maybe those are just inherently inferior arrows that will be less consistent...
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Old 11-11-2014, 02:58 PM   #105
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If you cut both ends of the shaft you can improve the straighteness tolerance. You probably won't notice a difference other than the price and how upset you get when you damage or lose one.
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Old 11-11-2014, 03:31 PM   #106
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I only see 250 spine as the lowest in the Black Eagle shafts.
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Old 11-11-2014, 03:43 PM   #107
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I only see 250 spine as the lowest in the Black Eagle shafts.
http://www.blackeaglearrows.com/prod...rampage-ld.htm Here's what I'm looking at. The drop-down for the spine size selection indicates that there is a 150 in addition to the 250.
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Old 11-11-2014, 04:00 PM   #108
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Jumbo, thank you for the link. The website I googled for them diode not show that and I looked at every arrow they had. Again, thanks for that info and link.
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Old 11-11-2014, 05:42 PM   #109
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Sorry, Jimbo, fat fingers on the keyboard!
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Old 11-12-2014, 09:24 AM   #110
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Sorry, Jimbo, fat fingers on the keyboard!
You must have farmer hands like me... They aren't much good for keyboards.
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Old 11-12-2014, 09:31 AM   #111
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After some reflection, I would like to continue using my 100 grain heads so I'm thinking about trying to get a 100 grain insert for these .204" i.d. Black Eagles. So far, it seems like that isn't easy to come by. I'm considering buying a dozen of the 50-75 grain brass HIT inserts, breaking the 25 grain tail off of half of them and then epoxy-ing that broken-off tail piece into the arrow behind the 75 grain insert. Can anyone think of a problem with that plan?
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Old 11-12-2014, 09:41 AM   #112
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If it breaks loose when you shoot it will knock the nocks out of your arrows. And you will have wildly varying weights depending on the amount of epoxy you use to bond it to the other insert. You could also create accuracy issues if the two pieces aren't aligned perfectly. Think out of balanced tires.

I work with composites daily and if you don't prep both surfaces properly the epoxy will fail .
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Old 11-12-2014, 09:46 AM   #113
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I emailed 3riversarchery an asked them if they had a 100 grain brass insert that would fit that shaft. I'll post the link the sent me.
http://www.3riversarchery.com/Brass+..._baseitem.html
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Old 11-12-2014, 09:48 AM   #114
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They said the Beman MFX / Easton Axis will work
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Old 11-12-2014, 10:27 AM   #115
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You might look at the 10 20 and 50 grain rear insert weights that Gold Tip makes. They will screw into the back of the insert. That is how I added 150 grains up front to my arrows, but they are Gold Tip arrows and inserts but if your inserts are threaded all the way thru, then these may work.
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Old 11-12-2014, 10:55 AM   #116
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Originally Posted by Stick'n'String View Post
I emailed 3riversarchery an asked them if they had a 100 grain brass insert that would fit that shaft. I'll post the link the sent me.
http://www.3riversarchery.com/Brass+..._baseitem.html
Okay... Well then... I guess it was just difficult for ME to find 100 grain brass inserts for a .204 ID arrow shaft.

Thanks for the input, gentlemen.
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Old 11-12-2014, 11:08 AM   #117
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Okay... Well then... I guess it was just difficult for ME to find 100 grain brass inserts for a .204 ID arrow shaft.

Thanks for the input, gentlemen.
Not just you having trouble. I emailed Easton, GT, Lancaster, and finally 3 rivers archery before I found some
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Old 11-12-2014, 01:39 PM   #118
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I know that Gold Tip screw in weights come in 20grain and 50 grains. I have 2 - 20's in my Gold Tip arrow and my buddy put the 50's in his Deer Crossing Archery arrows
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Old 11-12-2014, 07:18 PM   #119
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I know that Gold Tip screw in weights come in 20grain and 50 grains. I have 2 - 20's in my Gold Tip arrow and my buddy put the 50's in his Deer Crossing Archery arrows
also come in 10 gr. you would think a 25 gr. would be a good seller?
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Old 11-12-2014, 09:34 PM   #120
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Shows up on my IPhone as invalid url
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Old 11-12-2014, 10:07 PM   #121
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Shows up on my IPhone as invalid url
Shows up on my iPad just fine. Could be because it is a .pdf file, and the iPhone can't open it. Try it on a desk top, or laptop If you have one handy.
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Old 11-12-2014, 10:29 PM   #122
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Heres my new arrows
Name:  ImageUploadedByTapatalk1415849228.606240.jpg
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Size:  43.5 KBName:  ImageUploadedByTapatalk1415849242.033772.jpg
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Bloodsport fps hunters 350 spine carbon to carbon is 25.5" they have a 4" bohning wrap, 3 nitro vanes, nock, insert with 50gr weight and 100gr tip. FOC is 16.3%
Havent weighed it yet. Hope to get to shoot tomorrow to see how they fly.

Bow is xpedition xcentric 27/67ish
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Old 11-12-2014, 11:05 PM   #123
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Looking good.

I just got 3 blood sport 2. I got 300 spine at 26.5 in with 215 gn tip and a 57 gn screw behind the insert. Arrow is 557 gn with 23.9% foc
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Old 11-13-2014, 01:08 AM   #124
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I buried my bloodsport all the way up to the red label in my brand new block with a much lower FOC than yall, so yall should get some good penetration. Idk what targets yall shoot, but the red label and graphic will smear to nothing if you shoot it that far into a target like I did, just an FYI. I didn't mind though, I'm not about aesthetics
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Old 11-13-2014, 04:08 AM   #125
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Originally Posted by Stick'n'String View Post
I buried my bloodsport all the way up to the red label in my brand new block with a much lower FOC than yall, so yall should get some good penetration. Idk what targets yall shoot, but the red label and graphic will smear to nothing if you shoot it that far into a target like I did, just an FYI. I didn't mind though, I'm not about aesthetics

Thx for heads up
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Old 11-15-2014, 02:57 PM   #126
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How is it possible to have negative FOC %?
here's my measurements.
Valley of nock to Carbon 29 1/16" (TAL)
Valley of nock to Balance point 14 1/4" (BP)
so here's the math
(BP/TAL)-.5x100=FOC%

14.25 / 29.0625=.4903225

.4903225 - .5=-0.0096775

-0.0096775 X 100=-0.96775

I even used this calculator
http://www.tuffhead.com/education/formulas_FOC.html
it gives the same answer...

I removed the field tip before determining the BP
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Old 11-15-2014, 03:37 PM   #127
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Originally Posted by enewman View Post
Looking good.

I just got 3 blood sport 2. I got 300 spine at 26.5 in with 215 gn tip and a 57 gn screw behind the insert. Arrow is 557 gn with 23.9% foc

How do they group?
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Old 11-15-2014, 04:55 PM   #128
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How do they group?
I hope good I did a fast set up so I could hunt this weekend Got one turkey so far Lots of doe and fawn
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Old 11-15-2014, 04:58 PM   #129
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pushbutton2 View Post
How is it possible to have negative FOC %?
here's my measurements.
Valley of nock to Carbon 29 1/16" (TAL)
Valley of nock to Balance point 14 1/4" (BP)
so here's the math
(BP/TAL)-.5x100=FOC%

14.25 / 29.0625=.4903225

.4903225 - .5=-0.0096775

-0.0096775 X 100=-0.96775

I even used this calculator
http://www.tuffhead.com/education/formulas_FOC.html
it gives the same answer...

I removed the field tip before determining the BP
Haha How did you do that And I got the same answer I guess if you left the tip out when you measured it you could get what you got
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Old 11-15-2014, 05:11 PM   #130
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Finally made a choice on arrows.
I'm getting Gold Tip XT Hunters 8.9 GPI, 340 spine at 29 1/16" long.
I'm adding 50 grains to the tip. Gives me 19.2473% FOC :-)

My est weight is 448 grains. Which puts me at 6.5882 grains/ pound.

Last edited by Pushbutton2; 11-15-2014 at 05:14 PM..
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Old 11-15-2014, 05:13 PM   #131
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Haha How did you do that And I got the same answer I guess if you left the tip out when you measured it you could get what you got

I looked and looked to see if you balance with or without the tip. I thought the tech said with out last weekend. I just asked again, they said with the tip.
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Old 11-15-2014, 07:02 PM   #132
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Originally Posted by Pushbutton2 View Post
Finally made a choice on arrows.
I'm getting Gold Tip XT Hunters 8.9 GPI, 340 spine at 29 1/16" long.
I'm adding 50 grains to the tip. Gives me 19.2473% FOC :-)

My est weight is 448 grains. Which puts me at 6.5882 grains/ pound.

They came in around 452 grains.

I'm thinking of getting some Bloodsport fps hunters setup the same way. They are a heavier arrow so I'll have less FOC but more weight
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Old 11-15-2014, 07:52 PM   #133
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Well dang I just spine a hog Bloodsport can't handle a thrashing hog Haha
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Old 11-15-2014, 07:54 PM   #134
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Originally Posted by Pushbutton2 View Post
They came in around 452 grains.

I'm thinking of getting some Bloodsport fps hunters setup the same way. They are a heavier arrow so I'll have less FOC but more weight
Do some looking at arrows That's a long arrow to put 50 guns up front on a 340 spine
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Old 11-15-2014, 08:00 PM   #135
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Consulted with muddy gunna put my wife on a 26" carnivore foc is predicted at 20%!plus coming in at 370 gr +/-
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Old 11-15-2014, 08:00 PM   #136
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Well dang I just spine a hog Bloodsport can't handle a thrashing hog Haha
No tracking needed
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Old 11-15-2014, 08:03 PM   #137
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Do some looking at arrows That's a long arrow to put 50 guns up front on a 340 spine
I was thinking the same thing
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Old 11-15-2014, 08:19 PM   #138
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I know!!
Brian at On Target reassured me it was plenty.
I expressed my concern and willingness to jump to a 300 or 250.
When they built them they cut from both ends and they indexed them for me.
I wasn't able to shoot them because I asked them to use the 2 Part Epoxy glue.

My buddy recently recommended me some Deer Crossing Archery arrows.
We was sighting in his new sight at On Target. He hit the wood and broke his arrow, that was the first time it'd ever been shot. I'm still shooting Beman Bowhunter I hit wood with. I'm not not saying the Deer Crossing Archery arrows are a bad arrow. But based on this experience, I'm not willing to shoot them.
He's out hunting this weekend, he's shooting Bloodsports....
I might try them.

I'm also considering Black Eagle Rampage LD in 250.
Just need to save my ¢ first.

Last edited by Pushbutton2; 11-15-2014 at 08:42 PM..
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Old 11-15-2014, 08:30 PM   #139
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Do some looking at arrows That's a long arrow to put 50 guns up front on a 340 spine

I know!
That's one of the reasons I started this thread.

According to the Goldtip Website. They recommend a 340 spine for 65 - 69# Draw and 28" - 30" arrows.

My bow draws 68# & my arrows are 29"

http://<br /> http://www.goldtip.com...ge=chart<br />

Last edited by Pushbutton2; 11-15-2014 at 09:04 PM..
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Old 11-15-2014, 08:52 PM   #140
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pushbutton2 View Post
Finally made a choice on arrows.
I'm getting Gold Tip XT Hunters 8.9 GPI, 340 spine at 29 1/16" long.
I'm adding 50 grains to the tip. Gives me 19.2473% FOC :-)

My est weight is 448 grains. Which puts me at 6.5882 grains/ pound.

My calculations were off on my new arrows.
My BP is 19.125 not 20.125...
That changes my FOC to 15.80645.

I'm a little disappointed.
I really wanted to be knocking on 20%
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Old 11-15-2014, 09:02 PM   #141
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Originally Posted by Pushbutton2 View Post
I know!
That's one of the reasons I started this thread.

According to Goldtips Website. They recommend a 340 spine 65 - 69# Draw and 28" - 30" arrows.

http://<br /> http://www.goldtip.co...ge=chart<br />
The problem with charts they don't take account of dynamic spine that's the good thing about ontarget program I can make a 340 with 50 gn and a 125 gn tip shoot good but that arrow is 26.5 long if this Bria guy is saying it will work I would go for it
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Old 11-16-2014, 12:09 AM   #142
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The problem with charts they don't take account of dynamic spine that's the good thing about ontarget program I can make a 340 with 50 gn and a 125 gn tip shoot good but that arrow is 26.5 long if this Bria guy is saying it will work I would go for it
Brian's the owner, and he has a 31+" Draw length as well. Worst that can happen is they don't work out.

I should be able to resell them fairly easily...
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Old 11-16-2014, 06:00 AM   #143
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pushbutton2 View Post
I know!!
Brian at On Target reassured me it was plenty.
I expressed my concern and willingness to jump to a 300 or 250.
When they built them they cut from both ends and they indexed them for me.
I wasn't able to shoot them because I asked them to use the 2 Part Epoxy glue.

My buddy recently recommended me some Deer Crossing Archery arrows.
We was sighting in his new sight at On Target. He hit the wood and broke his arrow, that was the first time it'd ever been shot. I'm still shooting Beman Bowhunter I hit wood with. I'm not not saying the Deer Crossing Archery arrows are a bad arrow. But based on this experience, I'm not willing to shoot them.
He's out hunting this weekend, he's shooting Bloodsports....
I might try them.

I'm also considering Black Eagle Rampage LD in 250.
Just need to save my first.
Let me say it for you then. Deer crossing arrows are a bad arrow. I would not reccomend them for any situation. They are cheap(poor quality) arrows.

Bummer about your FOC, but are you starting to see just how difficult it is to get to the numbers you are trying to get to?
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Old 11-16-2014, 08:17 AM   #144
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pushbutton2 View Post
I know!!
Brian at On Target reassured me it was plenty.
I expressed my concern and willingness to jump to a 300 or 250.
When they built them they cut from both ends and they indexed them for me.
I wasn't able to shoot them because I asked them to use the 2 Part Epoxy glue.

My buddy recently recommended me some Deer Crossing Archery arrows.
We was sighting in his new sight at On Target. He hit the wood and broke his arrow, that was the first time it'd ever been shot. I'm still shooting Beman Bowhunter I hit wood with. I'm not not saying the Deer Crossing Archery arrows are a bad arrow. But based on this experience, I'm not willing to shoot them.
He's out hunting this weekend, he's shooting Bloodsports....
I might try them.

I'm also considering Black Eagle Rampage LD in 250.
Just need to save my ¢ first.

Im hunting but im flinging 140gr accubonds
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Old 11-16-2014, 08:17 AM   #145
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...........

Bummer about your FOC, but are you starting to see just how difficult it is to get to the numbers you are trying to get to?
I knew it was going to be a challenge! I have some great friends on here, who are far more experienced than me, that told me it was going to be :-)

Last edited by Pushbutton2; 11-16-2014 at 08:20 AM..
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Old 11-16-2014, 09:22 AM   #146
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Originally Posted by hoyt21 View Post
Consulted with muddy gunna put my wife on a 26" carnivore foc is predicted at 20%!plus coming in at 370 gr +/-
this build will be in the mid to high 20's fellas! this lady is going to have more foc than most of you guys..................man cards................who needs em.
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Old 11-16-2014, 09:30 AM   #147
hoyt21
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Originally Posted by muddyfuzzy View Post
this build will be in the mid to high 20's fellas! this lady is going to have more foc than most of you guys..................man cards................who needs em.
I can't wait to see these bad boys. I'm more excited about these arrows than her. Then again she won't understand the thump behind them !
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Old 11-16-2014, 01:05 PM   #148
sambo73
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May have to get muddy to build my next set
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Old 11-16-2014, 07:48 PM   #149
enewman
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Originally Posted by Pushbutton2 View Post
Brian's the owner, and he has a 31+" Draw length as well. Worst that can happen is they don't work out.

I should be able to resell them fairly easily...
Ok I just got in from hunting. I open the ontarget program. All I put in is the Moxie bow at 68 lb. 32 in draw and Beamon ics speed arrow. With a 125 tip

I know there other inputs but I would think this is close. If what I have put in is correct

It shows to be .063 weak from a 340 spine. A 300 spine it still shows this to be .023 weak. So program is showing optimal spine is .2772. That is with a 125 gn head and 22 gn insert. Changing to a 50 gn insert it shows a .2682 spine

This is the program in hunting filter.

You can always make a weak arrow shoot. I'm not saying Brian is wrong. Maybe I'm doing the program wrong.

It's just a little more info before you spend your money

Last edited by enewman; 11-16-2014 at 07:58 PM..
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Old 11-16-2014, 08:15 PM   #150
sambo73
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Enewman, pm sent sir
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