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Old 02-13-2018, 11:49 AM   #101
Mohawkman
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About to get me a new gun built. I just sold a semi custom .308 because I just want to do something different in looks and was thinking of a full on custom this time.

I do not reload and have zero plans of doing so in the near future so off the shelf ammo is what I want, even though I order most of mine from Dallas reloads.

I will sometimes try to shoot paper and stretch the legs a little at longer distances but most shots hunting will be no further than 300.

Gun will be suppressed and a 20' or shorter barrel is ideal.

Just sometimes think maybe I should get something different but I just cant come up with a good reason why so wanted to see what everyone here thought!
1000 was not mentioned!
My choices for 1000 to 1200 would be 7mm mag or 300 win mag
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Old 02-13-2018, 12:00 PM   #102
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Nice!! 180 VLD at 3070 here. So idk about eating my whole lunch
I would not want to be on the receiving end of either.

I have seen what my bullet does at 100yds............horror movies could be made from it.
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Old 02-13-2018, 12:04 PM   #103
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210gr Berger VLD (0.625 G1) at about 3050. I can probably get more velocity but at this I am one hole at 100 and about 2" groups at 300.



Now that I have my labradar I am planning on nailing the Velocity numbers down a little better.


Detracting from the original topic a bit but since you mentioned labradar, did you know that it will only pick up a 30 cal bullet out to 60 yards reliably and 80 yards on a perfect day?

If thatís the case, how does it accurately plot the trajectory at say 1000?

Seems like if it isnít capturing actual velocity then itís only marginally better than the other hypothetical ballistic charts (even though they have been pretty accurate for me).

I wanted to buy one but after talking to the guys at shot show, I decided to hold off a bit.


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Old 02-13-2018, 12:21 PM   #104
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For your usage I agree a 308 or 6.5 creed just do to ammo.
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Old 02-13-2018, 12:23 PM   #105
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Detracting from the original topic a bit but since you mentioned labradar, did you know that it will only pick up a 30 cal bullet out to 60 yards reliably and 80 yards on a perfect day?

If thatís the case, how does it accurately plot the trajectory at say 1000?

Seems like if it isnít capturing actual velocity then itís only marginally better than the other hypothetical ballistic charts (even though they have been pretty accurate for me).

I wanted to buy one but after talking to the guys at shot show, I decided to hold off a bit.


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1. My old chronograph sucks.
2. My old chronograph did not do strings
3. My old chronograph missed shots
4. My old chronograph sucks
5. My old chronograph does not do SD and I am too lazy to manually calc it.
6. My old chronograph does not do multiple data.
7. My old chronograph sucks.
8. My chronograph was only consistent on overcast days.

I needed a new one and decided to go this way. And did I mention......my chronograph sucks.

That is how it helps.....better more consistent velocity data at the beginning of the arc. Down range is not why I got it. I got it because my chronograph sucks.

To sum this up.......my chronograph sucks.
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Old 02-13-2018, 12:50 PM   #106
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Thatís why US Army, USMC, and most low enforcement agencies have used 308 since the end of WWII and still do out to 800 to 1000. They have been doing it wrong all this time. You certainly need to go straighten them out.



http://www.snipercentral.com/308-win...-62x51mm-nato/


I hate this argument so much. Your talking about the same entity that requested their be a magazine disconnect on the 1903 springfield to save money on ammo. The military doesnt decide on a caliber based on it being the best they base their decisions on it saving them money. And their love affair with the .30 cal and 5.56 is laughable. So many better options for hunting that are a million times better than both.


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Old 02-13-2018, 01:31 PM   #107
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Nothing wrong with a 308 and is a ideal hunting caliber in my book. Practical and efficient in a short action. Mild recoil, works good in short barrels, plenty of factory ammo and easy to load for if you ever decide to handload. Neglible advantage for the 6.5cm out to 500 yards. If you are planning on Shooting 1,000 yards you have much better options.

The fact that military snipers in all branches have used the round for many years definitely doesn't prove it is superior, it just proves it is adequate and practical in the right hands.
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Old 02-13-2018, 01:41 PM   #108
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Originally Posted by Outbreaker View Post
1. My old chronograph sucks.
2. My old chronograph did not do strings
3. My old chronograph missed shots
4. My old chronograph sucks
5. My old chronograph does not do SD and I am too lazy to manually calc it.
6. My old chronograph does not do multiple data.
7. My old chronograph sucks.
8. My chronograph was only consistent on overcast days.

I needed a new one and decided to go this way. And did I mention......my chronograph sucks.

That is how it helps.....better more consistent velocity data at the beginning of the arc. Down range is not why I got it. I got it because my chronograph sucks.

To sum this up.......my chronograph sucks.
Have you ever had a chronograph that sucks?
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Old 02-13-2018, 10:46 PM   #109
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I want to build a 270 wsm or 7mm wsm

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Old 02-14-2018, 10:16 AM   #110
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Nothing wrong with a .308.

But if you decide you want a 20" 6.5 Creedmoor, I have one in the classifieds

http://discussions.texasbowhunter.co...d.php?t=678208
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Old 02-14-2018, 10:24 AM   #111
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Have you ever had a chronograph that sucks?
Now that you mention it........I have.
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Old 02-14-2018, 10:36 AM   #112
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https://ronspomeroutdoors.com/blog/7...beats-the-308/

I don't have much experience with either caliber but found the article linked above interesting. I also don't know anything about the author. Good luck with your decision. Sounds like you can't go wrong with whatever you choose.
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Old 02-14-2018, 10:51 AM   #113
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Originally Posted by TB80 View Post
https://ronspomeroutdoors.com/blog/7...beats-the-308/

I don't have much experience with either caliber but found the article linked above interesting. I also don't know anything about the author. Good luck with your decision. Sounds like you can't go wrong with whatever you choose.
1. Those numbers are misleading at best, cooked at worst. Factory .308 ammo can push 165 gn bullets 2840+ MV.

2. And the synopsis: *slightly* better performance at 600 yds and *slightly* less recoil outweighs *much* better ammo availability because the author reloads. Well, great. So who is this for? An experienced reloader is probably not reading a primer comparing two of the most popular cartridges made... they're on the other blog reading 280AI vs. 28 Nosler.

Last edited by Balcones_Walker; 02-14-2018 at 10:56 AM.
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Old 02-14-2018, 11:03 AM   #114
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1. Those numbers are misleading at best, cooked at worst. Factory .308 ammo can push 165 gn bullets 2840+ MV.

2. And the synopsis: *slightly* better performance at 600 yds and *slightly* less recoil outweighs *much* better ammo availability because the author reloads. Well, great. So who is this for? An experienced reloader is probably not reading a primer comparing two of the most popular cartridges made... they're on the other blog reading 280AI vs. 28 Nosler.
Don't kill the messenger. Like I said, I don't have much experience with either. I just read the article and passed it on.
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Old 02-14-2018, 11:20 AM   #115
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I'm not much of a long range shooter like some of these guys, but I have been really pleased with a 155 vld at my normal hunting distances out of a 24" Rem 700 5R. Never really stretched it out past 300 either.
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Old 02-14-2018, 11:47 AM   #116
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Don't kill the messenger. Like I said, I don't have much experience with either. I just read the article and passed it on.
No doubt - my quarrel is with the author, not with you
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Old 02-14-2018, 02:57 PM   #117
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Detracting from the original topic a bit but since you mentioned labradar, did you know that it will only pick up a 30 cal bullet out to 60 yards reliably and 80 yards on a perfect day?
Am I missing something?
Why or how would you expect a chrono to profile velocity down range?
I use mine to get accurate MV, as well as ES & SD to help you tighten up variables. I'm not trying to determine my own BCs, just feed the right starting info into a calculator.
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Old 02-14-2018, 03:17 PM   #118
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im not a gun nut like most of you but how does a 6.5-284 stack up against a 308?
and keeping it within the parameters the OP is asking
just doing a quick search, it looks like the 6.5-284 slightly outperforms even the 260 and 6.5 creedmore. is this correct?
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Old 02-14-2018, 03:24 PM   #119
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Don't do it...I tried.
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Old 02-14-2018, 03:29 PM   #120
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Am I missing something?
Why or how would you expect a chrono to profile velocity down range?
I use mine to get accurate MV, as well as ES & SD to help you tighten up variables. I'm not trying to determine my own BCs, just feed the right starting info into a calculator.
The Labradar will give down range velocity to an extent.

But you are right. I got it for everything you stated and one more.

My chronograph sucks.
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Old 02-14-2018, 03:50 PM   #121
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Not to hijack thread but for 500yds and in on anything from elk to Texas whitetail what is the preferred round. Obvious everyone has an opinion but I am really in the same boat as op looking for a hunting rifle little to no range shooting. This thread has my head spinning between 308,6.5, 7 08.
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Old 02-14-2018, 03:55 PM   #122
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terrible gun for squirrel hunting, ruins the meat ....um, yeah, so don't get it
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Old 02-14-2018, 04:08 PM   #123
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Not to hijack thread but for 500yds and in on anything from elk to Texas whitetail what is the preferred round. Obvious everyone has an opinion but I am really in the same boat as op looking for a hunting rifle little to no range shooting. This thread has my head spinning between 308,6.5, 7 08.
The fact is that they are so close ballistically in the real world it wont make a rat's ***** which one you pick. Between the three the 308 Win has more factory ammo and firearms available to choose from.
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Old 02-14-2018, 04:29 PM   #124
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im not a gun nut like most of you but how does a 6.5-284 stack up against a 308?
and keeping it within the parameters the OP is asking
just doing a quick search, it looks like the 6.5-284 slightly outperforms even the 260 and 6.5 creedmore. is this correct?
I always cringe at "outperforms". It has more powder, recoil, and can make bullets go faster, yes.

I'm having a 6.5x284 made because it will hit slightly harder than 6.5CM at 500 yds. I have some fixed positions where I know the exact distance and can shoot at them prone and thus feel comfortable taking shots at pigs from that distance. Otherwise I would not.

There are some significant tradeoffs you should consider.

First, you really have to reload. Factory ammo is going to be basically indistinguishable from 6.5CM. Experimenting with Retumbo, R22, and H1000 is where you're going to see those real gains in velocity, and you should plan to invest in several if you don't already have them. Sure, the H4350 you have will work, but it won't get the extra oomph.

Second, get ready for a 25 and preferably a 26" barrel. You're trying to squeeze all the velocity you can out of some really slow burning powders.

Third, people do sometimes squeeze them into a short action, but to realize the performance gains you're looking for with those nice long 143 ELD-Xes you probably want a long action for it. That adds weight and throw.


In summary, I can't wait for my 6.5x284. But be aware you have to make some real tradeoffs to get that 200 fps gain.
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Old 02-14-2018, 10:41 PM   #125
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The fact is that they are so close ballistically in the real world it wont make a rat's ***** which one you pick. Between the three the 308 Win has more factory ammo and firearms available to choose from.
Thank you for the concise answer.

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Old 02-14-2018, 10:57 PM   #126
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Am I missing something?

Why or how would you expect a chrono to profile velocity down range?

I use mine to get accurate MV, as well as ES & SD to help you tighten up variables. I'm not trying to determine my own BCs, just feed the right starting info into a calculator.


Well I was under the impression it would take samples further downrange. The reason that info would be useful is to verify BC which in turn can verify ballistic profiles for building your drop charts.

If accuracy at 100 yards is all you are chasing then yeah it doesnít matter.


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Old 02-15-2018, 05:24 AM   #127
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Well I was under the impression it would take samples further downrange. The reason that info would be useful is to verify BC which in turn can verify ballistic profiles for building your drop charts.

If accuracy at 100 yards is all you are chasing then yeah it doesnít matter.


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Or you could use a Bullet mfg that has a good history of solid BC numbers that are not inflated.
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Old 02-15-2018, 05:53 AM   #128
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Or you could use a Bullet mfg that has a good history of solid BC numbers that are not inflated.
Still have to prove out your BC. Velocity can change that to a point. And before you say no it doesn't, check it. Their numbers will get you real close.
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Old 02-15-2018, 08:20 AM   #129
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Still have to prove out your BC. Velocity can change that to a point. And before you say no it doesn't, check it. Their numbers will get you real close.
Boolean fluid dynamics have proven it for many years. Air acts like a thin liquid and just like pushing a boat different velocities will affect the flow of a liquid/gas.

No argument here.

You will have to admit many bullet mfg inflate their BC. And some have pushed to use G7 models as they are more accurate (Berger).
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Old 02-15-2018, 08:24 AM   #130
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The fact is that they are so close ballistically in the real world it wont make a rat's ***** which one you pick. Between the three the 308 Win has more factory ammo and firearms available to choose from.
308 is available in lots of loads, shot the "Lite Hornady" ammo with my stepson recently, he loved it. Rem 700 with short fat barrel and can. I've shot an elk and multiple deer. You can do it with many calibers, but as Sendit said....
Lots of Ammo!
And I can barely see 300 yards anyway, so I guess I'm one of the few that doesn't shoot 600 yards regularly.
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Old 02-15-2018, 04:44 PM   #131
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Not to hijack thread but for 500yds and in on anything from elk to Texas whitetail what is the preferred round. Obvious everyone has an opinion but I am really in the same boat as op looking for a hunting rifle little to no range shooting. This thread has my head spinning between 308,6.5, 7 08.
30.06, 7mm mag, 7mm WSM, 300 wm, 300wsm

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Old 03-18-2018, 07:23 PM   #132
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Bringing this back up. Stainless action will be here this week and trigger will be ordered soon. Already have my McMillan stock. Just can't decide on caliber.

Looked at 280 but not a lot of bullet selection. Also looked at 260 but looks like a barrel of 20" would hurt it. So basically down to 7-08 and 308.
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Old 03-18-2018, 07:59 PM   #133
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Bringing this back up. Stainless action will be here this week and trigger will be ordered soon. Already have my McMillan stock. Just can't decide on caliber.

Looked at 280 but not a lot of bullet selection. Also looked at 260 but looks like a barrel of 20" would hurt it. So basically down to 7-08 and 308.


So basically down to the same thing lol.

I shoot my GAP 308 with factory Federal Gold Medal Match to 1000 with a 1/2 MOA group. So any one that tells you itís hard or canít be done is flat out wrong to put it politely .

Stick with the 308 for a hunting rifle inside 300 yards and then build you a long range hammer in your choice of caliber later on. Ask me how I know lol.


Sierracharlie outÖ
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Old 03-18-2018, 09:49 PM   #134
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Bringing this back up. Stainless action will be here this week and trigger will be ordered soon. Already have my McMillan stock. Just can't decide on caliber.

Looked at 280 but not a lot of bullet selection. Also looked at 260 but looks like a barrel of 20" would hurt it. So basically down to 7-08 and 308.
Well the 280 is a long action anyway.
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Old 03-18-2018, 09:55 PM   #135
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Well the 280 is a long action anyway.
good thing I ruled it out then.
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Old 03-18-2018, 09:56 PM   #136
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good thing I ruled it out then.
Lol yep.

Iíd do 7-08 out of those 2 but Iíve vented my 308 hate
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Old 03-18-2018, 10:00 PM   #137
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Not sure why you think the 260 wouldnít work in a 20Ē barrel. Iím bumping 3000fps with 129 grain ABLR out of my 22Ē 260 all factory rifle.

And Iíd pick 260 over 308 or 7-08.


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