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Old 06-25-2018, 11:03 AM   #1
hrdwrkncwby76
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Default Texas gun control on the table

Sounds like Austin/California is rubbing off on Abbott.


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Old 06-25-2018, 11:09 AM   #2
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Hmmm I hope Abbott don't lean left ?
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Old 06-25-2018, 12:20 PM   #3
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Got a link?

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Old 06-25-2018, 12:30 PM   #4
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https://www.texastribune.org/2018/05...plan-what/amp/


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Old 06-25-2018, 01:00 PM   #5
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The whole article is just soft language, so I would need to see specifics before any opinion could be made.

Bottom line is guns help far more people than they hurt. So to do nothing is better than the potential loss of 2nd Amendment rights.

I just want to know why the NRA hasn't blasted him yet like they did Yeti.
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Old 06-25-2018, 01:01 PM   #6
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I read the article. Would any of those proposed laws prevented any school shootings? Honest question. I don’t know any of the details of how the shooters got the guns. My stance has always been that, for the most part, you can’t legislate morality. It’s already illegal to kill people..
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Old 06-25-2018, 01:02 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WItoTX View Post
The whole article is just soft language, so I would need to see specifics before any opinion could be made.

Bottom line is guns help far more people than they hurt. So to do nothing is better than the potential loss of 2nd Amendment rights.

I just want to know why the NRA hasn't blasted him yet like they did Yeti.


Itís coming. This just happened today. Saw some of the live video feed.


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Old 06-25-2018, 01:03 PM   #8
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Originally Posted by ahlongslide View Post
I read the article. Would any of those proposed laws prevented any school shootings? Honest question. I donít know any of the details of how the shooters got the guns. My stance has always been that, for the most part, you canít legislate morality. Itís already illegal to kill people..


Exactly!!


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Old 06-25-2018, 01:08 PM   #9
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https://www.facebook.com/TexasFirear...7139914045242/
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Old 06-25-2018, 01:08 PM   #10
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Originally Posted by WItoTX View Post
The whole article is just soft language, so I would need to see specifics before any opinion could be made.

Bottom line is guns help far more people than they hurt. So to do nothing is better than the potential loss of 2nd Amendment rights.

I just want to know why the NRA hasn't blasted him yet like they did Yeti.
Agreed, this is very weak.. more of just talking points. There will be no special session called either. Its an election year
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Old 06-25-2018, 11:05 PM   #11
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Hmmm, a little bit of a curve from Abbott or election year smoke?
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Old 06-26-2018, 04:13 AM   #12
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A better question; Why would anyone trust a politician??
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Old 06-26-2018, 05:47 AM   #13
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Abbott recently spent time with some of the Santa Fe victims and their families. Very possible this has made him think twice and reconsider some things.
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Old 06-26-2018, 10:03 AM   #14
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The only thing that will prevent mass shootings is better parenting. Everyone wants to blame something but it all comes down to better parenting. Too much access to ****, parents fault. Too much time spent playing violent video games parents fault. Unaddressed mental health issues, parents fault. Mentally unstable kid with access to guns, parents fault. Kids with morality issues or doesn't value life, parents fault. Why don't we try to improve parenting issues then we will see change. With the nuclear family disappearing these shootings are increasing. Stop putting your kid in front of an electronic babysitter, get involved and teach them things.

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Old 06-26-2018, 10:34 AM   #15
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Originally Posted by fulmer34 View Post
The only thing that will prevent mass shootings is better parenting. Everyone wants to blame something but it all comes down to better parenting. Too much access to ****, parents fault. Too much time spent playing violent video games parents fault. Unaddressed mental health issues, parents fault. Mentally unstable kid with access to guns, parents fault. Kids with morality issues or doesn't value life, parents fault. Why don't we try to improve parenting issues then we will see change. With the nuclear family disappearing these shootings are increasing. Stop putting your kid in front of an electronic babysitter, get involved and teach them things.

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AMEN!!


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Old 06-26-2018, 10:42 AM   #16
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Here's the full document from Gov. Abbott: https://gov.texas.gov/uploads/files/...n_05302018.pdf

The vast majority of it looks good to me. There's a big focus on mental health, school security, making sure the background check system has current and complete information, etc.... Nothing would prevent ALL crimes, obviously. But these types of things would help to prevent some. The big one that everybody is all worked up about is the red flag law stuff. Abbott recommended that the legislature consider the merits of a red flag law that wouldn't allow removing a person's firearms without FIRST going through due process. A quote....

"Mental Health Protective Order procedures would allow law enforcement, a family member, school employee, or a district attorney to file a petition seeking the removal of firearms from a person proven to be dangerous to himself or to others. The courts would then provide that person notice and a hearing, and only upon a finding that they pose a significant risk of danger to themselves or others would the court order law enforcement to take possession of firearms. These protective orders should be for a limited duration, provide for mental health treatment, and have a clear path to the full restoration of rights and return of firearms when the person is no longer a danger."

Again, it wouldn't prevent all bad things from happening. But it would prevent some. And it wouldn't allow anyone's guns to be taken away until after a court looked at all the facts and determined that there is reason to do so - unlike some states' laws and Trump's previous recommendation that would allow for immediate confiscation of firearms before due process. Abbott's recommendation is the right way to do it - AFTER due process.

The other stuff about firearms storage and reporting lost/stolen firearms is the least helpful stuff in the entire document, in my opinion. Laws like those won't do much at all, I don't think.

But overall, the recommendations look good to me. None of these laws and policies can replace what should be done by parents in raising their kids, of course. But there are far too many parents who don't have a clue how and/or refuse to be good parents and teach their kids right and wrong and how to be respectful and responsible citizens. Laws can't fix that. All we can do is our part with our families, and then do whatever we can to protect ourselves from the bad guys and nutjobs.

Last edited by Shane; 06-26-2018 at 10:46 AM.
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Old 06-26-2018, 10:56 AM   #17
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Originally Posted by fulmer34 View Post
The only thing that will prevent mass shootings is better parenting. Everyone wants to blame something but it all comes down to better parenting. Too much access to ****, parents fault. Too much time spent playing violent video games parents fault. Unaddressed mental health issues, parents fault. Mentally unstable kid with access to guns, parents fault. Kids with morality issues or doesn't value life, parents fault. Why don't we try to improve parenting issues then we will see change. With the nuclear family disappearing these shootings are increasing. Stop putting your kid in front of an electronic babysitter, get involved and teach them things.

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Yes x1000
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Old 06-26-2018, 11:00 AM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shane View Post
"Mental Health Protective Order procedures would allow law enforcement, a family member, school employee, or a district attorney to file a petition seeking the removal of firearms from a person proven to be dangerous to himself or to others. The courts would then provide that person notice and a hearing, and only upon a finding that they pose a significant risk of danger to themselves or others would the court order law enforcement to take possession of firearms. These protective orders should be for a limited duration, provide for mental health treatment, and have a clear path to the full restoration of rights and return of firearms when the person is no longer a danger."
I agree with this in spirit, but I just see a really slippery slope if it goes through.

Where I see the slippery slope is say a soldier comes home, and gets hit with PTSD hard. That same soldier definitely shouldn't be able to buy a gun, and this law would allow the seizure of his guns (PTSD fact, most PTSD victims just want the pain to go away, and do not intend to harm anyone but themselves; taking the firearm away will protect them in that moment).

But what happens once that soldier goes to rehab (lets say Camp Hope here in Houston), deals with his demons, and is living a clean life, but they still have this proactive order on their record? I see a DA saying nope, you can't have your guns back cause we never know if you will relapse again. And that's the only reason I would hold out on full support of this law.

That's just me. I really do see the benefit of this law. I just worry about my scenario above.
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Old 06-26-2018, 11:27 AM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fulmer34 View Post
The only thing that will prevent mass shootings is better parenting. Everyone wants to blame something but it all comes down to better parenting. Too much access to ****, parents fault. Too much time spent playing violent video games parents fault. Unaddressed mental health issues, parents fault. Mentally unstable kid with access to guns, parents fault. Kids with morality issues or doesn't value life, parents fault. Why don't we try to improve parenting issues then we will see change. With the nuclear family disappearing these shootings are increasing. Stop putting your kid in front of an electronic babysitter, get involved and teach them things.

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Amen!
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Old 06-26-2018, 11:46 AM   #20
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Originally Posted by fulmer34 View Post
The only thing that will prevent mass shootings is better parenting. Everyone wants to blame something but it all comes down to better parenting. Too much access to ****, parents fault. Too much time spent playing violent video games parents fault. Unaddressed mental health issues, parents fault. Mentally unstable kid with access to guns, parents fault. Kids with morality issues or doesn't value life, parents fault. Why don't we try to improve parenting issues then we will see change. With the nuclear family disappearing these shootings are increasing. Stop putting your kid in front of an electronic babysitter, get involved and teach them things.

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Preach!
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Old 06-26-2018, 11:50 AM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WItoTX View Post
I agree with this in spirit, but I just see a really slippery slope if it goes through.

Where I see the slippery slope is say a soldier comes home, and gets hit with PTSD hard. That same soldier definitely shouldn't be able to buy a gun, and this law would allow the seizure of his guns (PTSD fact, most PTSD victims just want the pain to go away, and do not intend to harm anyone but themselves; taking the firearm away will protect them in that moment).

But what happens once that soldier goes to rehab (lets say Camp Hope here in Houston), deals with his demons, and is living a clean life, but they still have this proactive order on their record? I see a DA saying nope, you can't have your guns back cause we never know if you will relapse again. And that's the only reason I would hold out on full support of this law.

That's just me. I really do see the benefit of this law. I just worry about my scenario above.
Abbott's recommendation addresses that....

"These protective orders should be for a limited duration, provide for mental health treatment, and have a clear path to the full restoration of rights and return of firearms when the person is no longer a danger."
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Old 06-26-2018, 01:36 PM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shane View Post
Abbott's recommendation addresses that....



"These protective orders should be for a limited duration, provide for mental health treatment, and have a clear path to the full restoration of rights and return of firearms when the person is no longer a danger."


It doesnít place a timeline on the duration though. That would have to be clearly spelled out.


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Old 06-26-2018, 06:43 PM   #23
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Who is going to return firearms to someone with a history, or possible history, of mental health treatment? I would think that a history of "probable cause", aka speculation, would keep that from happening. I don't think there is a single psychiatrist out there that would be willing to say that a person who has been "treated" for such, would be trustworthy in society with a firearm. I think our current laws already address this issue, do they not?
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Old 06-27-2018, 06:55 AM   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ahlongslide View Post
I read the article. Would any of those proposed laws prevented any school shootings? Honest question. I donít know any of the details of how the shooters got the guns. My stance has always been that, for the most part, you canít legislate morality. Itís already illegal to kill people..
At the point of attack you cannot stop a person that is dedicated and has time to plan.

You might stop it before it gets to the onset of any attack like from intel or some kind of physiological intervention. The door of a school is a bad place to try and stop an incident. Once it starts, all that can be done is to lessen the damage.

In my opinion
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Old 06-27-2018, 07:31 AM   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fulmer34 View Post
The only thing that will prevent mass shootings is better parenting. Everyone wants to blame something but it all comes down to better parenting. Too much access to ****, parents fault. Too much time spent playing violent video games parents fault. Unaddressed mental health issues, parents fault. Mentally unstable kid with access to guns, parents fault. Kids with morality issues or doesn't value life, parents fault. Why don't we try to improve parenting issues then we will see change. With the nuclear family disappearing these shootings are increasing. Stop putting your kid in front of an electronic babysitter, get involved and teach them things.

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agree 100% but the sad reality is that its not going to happin , majority of parents don't care , baby daddy not a round , baby momma have to many , kids having kids , grandparents to old to raise them ,to much Hollywood and volient video games and on and on . punishment doesn't fit the crime these days . sad sad world we live in. the real issues are never addressed .
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Old 06-27-2018, 08:12 AM   #26
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https://www.counseling.org/docs/defa...ental-health.p
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Old 07-04-2018, 07:17 AM   #27
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You’re not going to stop wackos with guns killing people. There are twice as many people now hence twice as many wackos... and everyone hears about a greater percentage of them because of the internet. It’s just a problem we are going to have to live with.
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Old 07-04-2018, 02:15 PM   #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shane View Post
Abbott's recommendation addresses that....

"These protective orders should be for a limited duration, provide for mental health treatment, and have a clear path to the full restoration of rights and return of firearms when the person is no longer a danger."
There's only one problem with this and that is if you give the libs an inch they will take 5 miles. All they are looking for is one tiny crack in the dam.
I don't think the plan sounds all that bad but you know how the libs work.

If a wacko is intent on a mass shooting or mass killings, taking away their guns ain't gonna do squat. They will just steal a gun or a car or a truck and run over a crowd or set a building of fire.

The real fix is generations away. Kids have to be raised differently and it's far too late for millions of the dirty little bastages.

I'm more in favor of mandatory neutering.
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Old 07-08-2018, 10:27 AM   #29
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ANY government entity that promises " limited duration " is ****ing lying.
There is NO such thing.
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Old 07-08-2018, 11:52 AM   #30
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Personal responsibility... TEACH IT... ENFORCE IT...

If a man tells me he is going to kill me.. I will take him at his word...

If a man posts on social media that he is going to be the next school shooter... TAKE HIM AT HIS WORD..
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