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Old 04-16-2018, 11:41 AM   #1
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Default Trump attempting to Legalize.

https://reason.com/blog/2018/04/13/t...ted-support-fo

Wonder how the left could spin this if he succeeds? Looks like he's going to attempt to pull the feds out of it and leave it up to the states. I have been pro legalization for a while....I'm just ready to get it off the table once and for all. And gay marriage as well. Bigger fish to fry.
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Old 04-16-2018, 12:09 PM   #2
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Hope he gets it done.
I am tired of spending money locking up folks that are only hurting themselves.
That said
I have to wonder how the Dems will find something wrong with him doing it.
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Old 04-16-2018, 01:15 PM   #3
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He had lost me after the spending bill, he will gain favor with me for this but wont win me back completely. Throw Hillary in jail and we are friends again.
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Old 04-16-2018, 01:51 PM   #4
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So if / when every state adopts the legalization measures, will the prisons be able to release the non-violent offenders that may have been prosecuted?
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Old 04-16-2018, 02:00 PM   #5
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So if / when every state adopts the legalization measures, will the prisons be able to release the non-violent offenders that may have been prosecuted?
Good question....wonder what we did after prohibition?
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Old 04-16-2018, 02:02 PM   #6
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So if / when every state adopts the legalization measures, will the prisons be able to release the non-violent offenders that may have been prosecuted?
I would hope they would be released immediately on probation if non violent. It was illegal at the time and sending a message that the prosecutions do not count anymore would open up the govt to lawsuits.
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Old 04-16-2018, 02:06 PM   #7
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So if / when every state adopts the legalization measures, will the prisons be able to release the non-violent offenders that may have been prosecuted?
Time will tell.

If it was for simple possession for personal use, I'd be cool with them being released (Which I doubt anyone is in Prison for simple possession to begin with).

Is it safe to say the large majority serving time in prison for weed was transporting and distributing large quantities? Most also had other charges filed at the same time, like possession of a fire arm while committing other crimes.

It ain't cut and dry to say yes or no.
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Old 04-16-2018, 02:37 PM   #8
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Time will tell.

If it was for simple possession for personal use, I'd be cool with them being released (Which I doubt anyone is in Prison for simple possession to begin with).

Is it safe to say the large majority serving time in prison for weed was transporting and distributing large quantities? Most also had other charges filed at the same time, like possession of a fire arm while committing other crimes.

It ain't cut and dry to say yes or no.
You are correct. I did some research about this a while back just out of curiosity. Those "10 years for one joint!" stories we all used to hear are a thing of the past, to what degree they were ever true at all. I saw a recent headline "Man gets 12 years just for selling weed!" The guy in question was that trucking company owner from El Paso that was shipping tons of the stuff. There are very few people in prison for whom mere possession was their most serious offense unless they had bales of it. There is credence to the argument that it is a giant waste of resources to jail people for having a baggie of weed in their car, but as long as the law is on the books how can you just not enforce it? Texas will be one of the last states to come around on legalization but I also think it will happen eventually.

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Old 04-16-2018, 04:16 PM   #9
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As soon as they come up with a reliable test for employers to use determining if a person is under the influence on the job I will support legalization.

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Old 04-16-2018, 04:55 PM   #10
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As soon as they come up with a reliable test for employers to use determining if a person is under the influence on the job I will support legalization.

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put some munchies in the break room with a trail cam. question all those that partake
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Old 04-16-2018, 05:05 PM   #11
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Hope not
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Old 04-16-2018, 05:34 PM   #12
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As soon as they come up with a reliable test for employers to use determining if a person is under the influence on the job I will support legalization.

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How many people who are willing to smoke at work are abstaining from it now because itís illegal?
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Old 04-16-2018, 06:06 PM   #13
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As soon as they come up with a reliable test for employers to use determining if a person is under the influence on the job I will support legalization.

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I got a question:

How do you feel, what do you think of workers that have a margarita or two, or maybe a couple of beers while at lunch?

Wait... another question:

How does anyone doing either one effect your workday - or your life in general?
Honest questions; not trying to be argumentative.


Bob Lee

Last edited by boblee; 04-16-2018 at 06:13 PM.
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Old 04-16-2018, 06:12 PM   #14
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Default Trump attempting to Legalize.

Quote:
Originally Posted by boblee View Post
I got a question:



How do you feel, what do you think of workers that have a margarita or two, or maybe a couple of beers while at lunch?



Wait... another question:



How does anyone doing either one affect your workday - or your life in general?





Bob Lee


Depends on the job. Wouldnít want my crane operator coming back from lunch after having a couple of margaritas. I also would want my surgeon smoking a joint then coming in to do surgery. Iím all for legalizing weed but think there should be a test in place just like with alcohol. Wouldnít want someone to think itís ok to wake and bake then roll into the office.

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Old 04-16-2018, 06:21 PM   #15
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As soon as they come up with a reliable test for employers to use determining if a person is under the influence on the job I will support legalization.

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This is a legal mess in states that have legalized pot. The California Supreme Court ruled that an employee can be fired for using pot - even off the job - even though it is legal. Testing is problematic because unlike with alcohol it only proves you used at some point in the last couple of days. It is a real problem in pot-legal states especially since edibles became so available. Then you have the problem that some employees have a prescription for it. Insurance companies are freaking out about it. In my view an employer has a right to require no drugs or alcohol can be in your system during the workday. How is that remotely controversial ?
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Old 04-16-2018, 06:22 PM   #16
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If it ever gets legalized I couldnít smoke because of work . Heck now if we smoke or chew tobacco we lose our company option insurance.


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Old 04-16-2018, 06:24 PM   #17
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Depends on the job. Wouldnít want my crane operator coming back from lunch after having a couple of margaritas. I also would want my surgeon smoking a joint then coming in to do surgery. Iím all for legalizing weed but think there should be a test in place just like with alcohol. Wouldnít want someone to think itís ok to wake and bake then roll into the office.

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I'm sure my crew would not want me stoned while I drive them across town emergent in the fire truck. So, I'm wondering if old bob would think some people probably should not drink,smoke at work
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Old 04-16-2018, 06:26 PM   #18
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Depends on the job. Wouldn’t want my crane operator coming back from lunch after having a couple of margaritas. I also would want my surgeon smoking a joint then coming in to do surgery. I’m all for legalizing weed but think there should be a test in place just like with alcohol. Wouldn’t want someone to think it’s ok to wake and bake then roll into the office.

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I do agree. I'm a professional, have been throughout my working career. I'm an estimator / project manager in construction - heavy equipment, for about 20 years now. Prior to that; a design civil engineer. I can't make mistakes - or at least ****ed few.
And I enjoy a drink and a toke, have indulged in both in moderation for almost 50 years now. But not while working.

I guess my question is; if some can give a pass, a mulligan for having a drink or two during the workday, why not the other? From my simple perspective, that appears to be a double standard.

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Old 04-16-2018, 06:31 PM   #19
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I'm sure my crew would not want me stoned while I drive them across town emergent in the fire truck. So, I'm wondering if old bob would think some people probably should not drink,smoke at work
Read below.
It is my belief and my practice to abstain from both while on the clock. Or while driving.

When I'm on my own time, whatever I choose to do ain't nobody's business but my own, as long as no one is harmed or endangered.


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Old 04-16-2018, 06:35 PM   #20
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I've been told that it's a gateway drug.
Or is it a getaway drug?
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Old 04-16-2018, 06:37 PM   #21
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Either way, we shouldn't be smoking drugs it sounds like.
Especially if you are driving fire trucks, operating cranes or doing open heart surgery.
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Old 04-16-2018, 06:42 PM   #22
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Either way, we shouldn't be smoking drugs it sounds like.
Especially if you are driving fire trucks, operating cranes or doing open heart surgery.
I dont care ifyou smoke.dope or care if it's legalized. bob, asked how it would affect someone else's job or life. We just gave a few examples.
Smoke on dope heads
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Old 04-16-2018, 06:53 PM   #23
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Hey I am just trying to summarize the discussion so far. That way the dope heads can keep up.
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Old 04-16-2018, 07:02 PM   #24
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Either way, we shouldn't be smoking drugs it sounds like.
Especially if you are driving fire trucks, operating cranes or doing open heart surgery.


What if I pop and Oxy, zanax, quelude, or adderall, or shoot even grind it up and smoke it?

Prob shouldn't do those either, yet legal drugs kill way more people than the illegal ones. Why don't we test for them?


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Old 04-16-2018, 07:06 PM   #25
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Wall, Hiliary in jail and fix Obamacare.

This is just a “smoke” screen.

This past budget showed what type of president we have when it comes to real issues of the American people.
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Old 04-16-2018, 07:07 PM   #26
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I dont care ifyou smoke.dope or care if it's legalized. bob, asked how it would affect someone else's job or life. We just gave a few examples.
Smoke on dope heads
Many - I'll go so far as to say most people - that enjoy a drink from time to time (or even daily) are not alcoholics. Nor are occasional marijuana partakers all "potheads".
Sadly, some will remain to forever be unclear on the concept. You're one of them.


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Old 04-16-2018, 07:33 PM   #27
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What if I pop and Oxy, zanax, quelude, or adderall, or shoot even grind it up and smoke it?

Prob shouldn't do those either, yet legal drugs kill way more people than the illegal ones. Why don't we test for them?


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I would not suggest any heavy machinery operation, or surgery.
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Old 04-16-2018, 07:39 PM   #28
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Hey I am just trying to summarize the discussion so far. That way the dope heads can keep up.
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Old 04-16-2018, 07:55 PM   #29
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huh, wait ... I thought this was supposed to be about states rights
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Old 04-16-2018, 07:59 PM   #30
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There any drought resistant varieties? I don’t smoke, never have, but I could get on it as a new cash crop. Course you’d have to keep a night watchman to keep the teens from picking your field to nothing but seeds and stems.

It will be too expensive once big Agra starts growing GMO varieties and Uncle Sam gets his taxes out of it
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Old 04-16-2018, 08:39 PM   #31
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Seems like most cities, counties here in NM charge a 25 dollar civil tax if you donít have a medical cannabis card. As long as you have a small amount < 4 ounces or something similar.
I would think most law Enforcement has much more important stuff to deal with other than cannabis. So it probably donít even register on the radar of law Enforcement.

What is the current crime/ penalty for small amounts of cannabis in your areas?
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Old 04-16-2018, 09:21 PM   #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by boblee View Post
I got a question:

How do you feel, what do you think of workers that have a margarita or two, or maybe a couple of beers while at lunch?

Wait... another question:

How does anyone doing either one effect your workday - or your life in general?
Honest questions; not trying to be argumentative.


Bob Lee
You know if they were at work with alcohol in their system the could/should be fired. We worked around high voltage, hazardous chemicals, in confined spaces, at high elevations and with large rotating machinery.
My crews needed to have their heads on straight because their health and lives depended on it.

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Old 04-16-2018, 09:31 PM   #33
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Originally Posted by batmaninja View Post
What if I pop and Oxy, zanax, quelude, or adderall, or shoot even grind it up and smoke it?

Prob shouldn't do those either, yet legal drugs kill way more people than the illegal ones. Why don't we test for them?


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They do. Iím pretty sure if you have any of the ones listed in your system on a random pee test you would be fired without a script. If you have a script and are injured or injure someone you will have severe consequences.


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Old 04-16-2018, 10:26 PM   #34
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I’ve said before, and again, my problem with legalized pot is that there is no test that can measure a persons’s “impairedness” while on pot. It’s different from an alcohol BAC measure. That’s my main hesitation against legalizing it. There is no way to regulate it once it becomes legal
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Old 04-16-2018, 10:33 PM   #35
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Doesn't the Police have a way to determine if you're "on the pot" during a traffic stop now?
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Old 04-16-2018, 10:46 PM   #36
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Doesn't the Police have a way to determine if you're "on the pot" during a traffic stop now?
Nothing that holds water in court.
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Old 04-17-2018, 08:16 AM   #37
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Time will tell.

If it was for simple possession for personal use, I'd be cool with them being released (Which I doubt anyone is in Prison for simple possession to begin with).

Is it safe to say the large majority serving time in prison for weed was transporting and distributing large quantities? Most also had other charges filed at the same time, like possession of a fire arm while committing other crimes.

It ain't cut and dry to say yes or no.
My thoughts as well - probably very few actually in jail for personal use. That's also why I believe it may be easier to get them out if there are any.

Hardly anyone on most levels are in for a certain specific incident. Usually a trail of charges.
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Old 04-17-2018, 08:20 AM   #38
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I've been told that it's a gateway drug.
Or is it a getaway drug?
If you mean a gateway to awesomeness then yes by all means
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Old 04-17-2018, 08:27 AM   #39
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My thoughts as well - probably very few actually in jail for personal use. That's also why I believe it may be easier to get them out if there are any.

Hardly anyone on most levels are in for a certain specific incident. Usually a trail of charges.
The simple possession thing works like this and I know because a friend from HS went this route and is still wanted in the state of TX but Cali wont follow extradition for pot related crimes for simple possession.

1. Gets caught with a joint/personal amount of marijuana
2. Is sentenced to probation that includes drug testing (states make millions off of probation) but fails a test for smoking A joint so is arrested and put in jail
3. Is released on probation and again must take drug tests. Smokes a joint and fails and goes back to jail

4. Is released on probation and feels like having a joint so moves to Cali and throws the deuce at Texas.

Point is basically as far as the law was concerned here my friend was in and out of prison at a felony level for what is known to be personal use amounts. It definitely does happen.

Last edited by J Sweet; 04-17-2018 at 08:31 AM.
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Old 04-17-2018, 08:49 AM   #40
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The simple possession thing works like this and I know because a friend from HS went this route and is still wanted in the state of TX but Cali wont follow extradition for pot related crimes for simple possession.

1. Gets caught with a joint/personal amount of marijuana
2. Is sentenced to probation that includes drug testing (states make millions off of probation) but fails a test for smoking A joint so is arrested and put in jail
3. Is released on probation and again must take drug tests. Smokes a joint and fails and goes back to jail

4. Is released on probation and feels like having a joint so moves to Cali and throws the deuce at Texas.

Point is basically as far as the law was concerned here my friend was in and out of prison at a felony level for what is known to be personal use amounts. It definitely does happen.
Taxpayer money well spent
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Old 04-17-2018, 08:54 AM   #41
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Taxpayer money well spent
Even worse is Texas considers hash and extracts to not be marijuana by law and carries an even harsher sentence than flower. Its the same drug (THC) from the same plant but these idiots will actually put someone in prison for years for less than a joint. Absolutely disgusting. We are either a society of free persons or we are not. Which is it?


http://norml.org/laws/item/texas-penalties-2
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Old 04-17-2018, 09:01 AM   #42
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Even worse is Texas considers hash and extracts to not be marijuana by law and carries an even harsher sentence than flower. Its the same drug (THC) from the same plant but these idiots will actually put someone in prison for years for less than a joint. Absolutely disgusting. We are either a society of free persons or we are not. Which is it?


http://norml.org/laws/item/texas-penalties-2
We are not.

Not as long as I am forced to buy other people's health insurance.
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Old 04-17-2018, 09:24 AM   #43
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We are not.

Not as long as I am forced to buy other people's health insurance.
Haha, you aint lyin! It was somewhat rhetorical. We are by no means a free people here.
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Old 04-17-2018, 10:43 AM   #44
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The problem we have now is no one can take care of themselves. Yet most are unwilling to let others go without food, insurance etc. Doesn't make sense to me other than people are stupid.

Once the crap hits the fan people will be forced to take care of themselves. I hope I'm around to see it.
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Old 04-17-2018, 10:58 AM   #45
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Even worse is Texas considers hash and extracts to not be marijuana by law and carries an even harsher sentence than flower. Its the same drug (THC) from the same plant but these idiots will actually put someone in prison for years for less than a joint. Absolutely disgusting. We are either a society of free persons or we are not. Which is it?


http://norml.org/laws/item/texas-penalties-2
We stopped being a society of free persons the second we decided the Gov. knows how to take care of us better than we do.
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Old 04-17-2018, 11:01 AM   #46
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Hey I am just trying to summarize the discussion so far. That way the dope heads can keep up.
Thank you!! Y'all were starting to lose me there.
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Old 04-17-2018, 11:34 AM   #47
miket
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Originally Posted by batmaninja View Post
What if I pop and Oxy, zanax, quelude, or adderall, or shoot even grind it up and smoke it?

Prob shouldn't do those either, yet legal drugs kill way more people than the illegal ones. Why don't we test for them?


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I dont know about criminally, but every employer I have had in that I can recall does indeed test for those drugs. When it comes up positive if you dont provide a prescription you are terminated.
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Old 04-17-2018, 11:44 AM   #48
systemnt
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I dont know about criminally, but every employer I have had in that I can recall does indeed test for those drugs. When it comes up positive if you dont provide a prescription you are terminated.
I'm pretty sure that is some sort of violation of HIPAA.... could be wrong..but dont see how it wouldn't be. Its not against the law to take those drugs.. might be company policy to not operate equipment while on them..but asking if you are on them without some sort of justifiable cause... maybe?

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Questions regarding prescription drug use may be considered a medical-related inquiry under the ADA. Therefore, employer inquiries regarding the use of prescription medications may be prohibited under the ADA in all but a few circumstances.

The EEOC has issued guidance explaining the exceptions to the medical inquiries limitations. The guidance states that in general, employers may not ask all employees about the prescription drugs they take. Asking all employees about their use of prescription drugs is rarely job-related and consistent with business necessity. Therefore, only a handful of occupations will be able to demonstrate that prescription-related inquiries would be job-related and consistent with business necessity. The example the EEOC provides is police officers. In occupations of this type, because of the significant safety risk involved with the use of certain prescription medications, employers may be able to demonstrate that asking employees about their prescription drug use is job-related and consistent with business necessity. Conversely, administrative positions such as accountants, information technology professionals, administrative assistants, human resource professionals and most management positions would not face significant job-related safety risks associated with side effects caused by prescription medications.

Last edited by systemnt; 04-17-2018 at 11:49 AM.
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Old 04-18-2018, 09:17 AM   #49
AZST_bowhunter
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Originally Posted by batmaninja View Post
What if I pop and Oxy, zanax, quelude, or adderall, or shoot even grind it up and smoke it?

Prob shouldn't do those either, yet legal drugs kill way more people than the illegal ones. Why don't we test for them?


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you'll just work harder if you take adderall
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Old 04-18-2018, 09:34 AM   #50
batmaninja
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Personally I would prefer my surgeon to be on adderall, truck drivers to be on as much caffeine and nicotine as possible, and my hometown NFL team to be on as much of the pot as they can handle. Lots of people are on the drugs these days, illegal ones and legal ones.

Obama released 1,000s of drug related criminals, dont know what it would be any different with Trump.
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