East Tx Deer Numbers Thread

[Snowflake Killa]

Our numbers were way down

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[AntlerCollector]

I’ve been hunting in east Texas my whole life and hunting has been slow these past few years. I think the herds are the healthiest I’ve seen in a while, we’ve just had so much rain over the last few years that they have lots of foliage and get to browse 24/7. Their need for corn is non-existent, and they do not have to travel far for food.

On top of that, most oaks have been covered up with acorns the last few years.

This^^^^ was my experience. The 2019 season was by far out most unproductive in the 50 year history. I hunt Polk and Hardin Counties. With all the rain the last two years the deer have plenty of natural food to eat. The acorn crop as been better than ever. I still have lots of deer on cameras that I placed away from feeders and just along game trails. It was a great season to be a deer. They are fat and happy. It sucked to be a deer hunter this year though. I hope that translates into more mature deer next season, and more deer numbers overall.

[Low Fence]

Overall my buck numbers WERE slightly higher (won’t be the case next year) but doe and deer in general were down across the board

My field in the back is typically slow until now. It will have 1-3 in it until last week of season and through youth season and then carry 18-20...... this year 0-4. I didn’t shoot a doe for the first year in as long as I can remember

[Tshelly]

East Tx Deer Numbers Thread

Tagged.

Last year (2018-19 season) I leased 1200 acres in Polk county. Low deer numbers but great genetics. Typical east texas lease, have learned most of my neighbors. Some management hunting but just normal, old school east deer leases mostly with a guy per 100 acres.

I was around 1 deer per 50-60 acres after running cameras all year. Talking to the other leases, their numbers had been in a slow fall the last few years.

We met with the biologist and came up with a plan. We had around 5-7k acres that we trapped all last spring. We killed 3 bobcats, and trapped 15 female coyotes. As well as shooting around 15 coyotes between the 3 leases. As well on 5k acres (2 of the leases) this year 0 does were killed and maybe 5 on the 3rd lease.

I’ll tell you my reasoning for low deer numbers.
1.) predators!!! Hogs have raised the overall number of predators in our woods 10 fold.
2.) does are being shot in rifle season. Used to no does got killed.
3.) fawn recruitment is lower than biologist numbers suggest on most places unless they annually trap predators and selectively harvest does.
4.) highly populated deer leases. 1 hunter per 100 acre

2019/20 deer season was very slow for us in Polk co. due to the record crop of pin oak and water oak acorns. But our deer numbers were up 30% across both leases. Our place is and will be a sanctuary. We’ve killed 3 bucks all 5.5 year old’s on the place in 18 & 19. I doubt we will shoot a doe for another 5 years.

We follow the more does=more buck fawns=more shootable bucks plan lol.




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[lovemylegacy]

Newton County. Deer sightings were down for me, but I think our numbers are fine. I hunt the highest(elevation) part of the lease, the majority of deer stay a little lower.
Browse was abundant, a couple of guys feed corn, had good numbers of doe coming to their feeder.
Less deer were killed on our lease due to few people hunting. Logging crew came in and ran off the hunters, deer stayed.
The one thing we didn't have was an abundant acorn crop. Red Oaks dropped some acorns, but I didn't see any White Oak acorns. Food plots were being used with regularity. Basically keeping it mowed down.

Logging operation opened up a bunch of ground to the sun, lots of browse on the way.

[Anvilheadtexas]

All good inputs. I am going to throw my thoughts on why I think deer maybe be down in some areas. Some will agree some won’t. Just a theory worth watching, here goes.....antler restriction has been in place for 10 years or so. The pass young bucks movement is strong, many smaller tract hunters are passing bucks both under the rules (13 inches) and volunteering (passing legal shooters). And it’s good some monsters out there including one on my place that I was never able to see in daylight.

But here could be the problem...back in the day when we lit up the woods opening day, the carnage involved bucks...generally pencil horned 6 and 8 pointers. Deer that are not even legal to harvest today. What was generally off limits back then were does. Thus season I heard many hunters say....I did not get my buck, but I got “my does”. Back in the day you got a congrats from the boys in camp when you hauled in a 2.5 year old 8 point and got snubbed by then if you used one of those old hard to get lamps permit for a doe.

If my unproven theory holds true, we will know in a few years. And if it’s true it will NOT effect everyone such as large clubs under MLD who regulate harvest. It’s going to effect those that are in areas with smaller tracts and unregulated (not necessarily illegal) doe harvest.

Someone mentioned predators and fawn recruitment. The one way to ensure a doe does not reproduce is to put it in a cooler. If this holds any water, it’s a cumulative effect. Each year there are fewer does in spring and each fall we continue to hammer ‘em. Now add that into the mix of hogs and natural predators and one could see why there might be less deer in places. Just a theory. I am not advocating anything, just suggesting we sit up and take notice.

[splitfinger]

I live and hunt on my own property in NW Jasper Co. and for years we had (still have) a hunting club (Campbell Land) on my Western boundary. Fortunately over the past couple of years this club has lost about 140 acres to a private buyer and I bought 64 additional acres of this land for my family to hunt. Since our purchase and the hunting club further West, we are seeing more deer and definitely more bucks. I must agree though that the deer have more than enough to eat and do not frequent the feeders unless they just want to snack.

I am blessed to be able to hunt at least 5 sits/week and this year I counted 60 sightings whereas in past years the most I ever saw was 37 and that was last year. I have at least 15 different bucks on camera, most of which are up and comers because the hunting club pressure is much less now than before. Hopefully in a couple of years some of these up and comers will blossom into some great shooters for my family.

Shoot Straight.

Doug

[Low Fence]

All good inputs. I am going to throw my thoughts on why I think deer maybe be down in some areas. Some will agree some won’t. Just a theory worth watching, here goes.....antler restriction has been in place for 10 years or so. The pass young bucks movement is strong, many smaller tract hunters are passing bucks both under the rules (13 inches) and volunteering (passing legal shooters). And it’s good some monsters out there including one on my place that I was never able to see in daylight.

But here could be the problem...back in the day when we lit up the woods opening day, the carnage involved bucks...generally pencil horned 6 and 8 pointers. Deer that are not even legal to harvest today. What was generally off limits back then were does. Thus season I heard many hunters say....I did not get my buck, but I got “my does”. Back in the day you got a congrats from the boys in camp when you hauled in a 2.5 year old 8 point and got snubbed by then if you used one of those old hard to get lamps permit for a doe.

If my unproven theory holds true, we will know in a few years. And if it’s true it will NOT effect everyone such as large clubs under MLD who regulate harvest. It’s going to effect those that are in areas with smaller tracts and unregulated (not necessarily illegal) doe harvest.

Someone mentioned predators and fawn recruitment. The one way to ensure a doe does not reproduce is to put it in a cooler. If this holds any water, it’s a cumulative effect. Each year there are fewer does in spring and each fall we continue to hammer ‘em. Now add that into the mix of hogs and natural predators and one could see why there might be less deer in places. Just a theory. I am not advocating anything, just suggesting we sit up and take notice.

Before “doe days” existed I was and still am the only bow hunter in at least 1.5-2 miles. I would kill 1-2 doe depending on numbers per location. My neighbors yo this day have never killed a doe and refuse too. So 3 years ago I quit shooting them at “the dairy”. All I did was work all year on plots and feed to “scatter the flock” for them to reap full benefits.

Fawn recruitment is definitely low this year on all properties. I didn’t see many fawns this year.... combine that with everyone around me will hunt down a spike like he’s a terrorist. I believe the late fawn births are a big part. I saw a buck bed down a doe last week. And have seen bucks physically breed doe in late February.

I coyote can only eat so many fawns before there are easier options. But when you have a few in May,June,July, August and even September vs may, June those few start to make a big difference!!! And shooting coyotes on 40-200 acres won’t make a drop in the bucket

Until people quit killing the factory ( breeding age bucks, and breeding age does) I don’t see how they can expect an increase? It can’t happen

Feeding a doe that had her August fawn die didn’t add anything to the herd

[bollomb]

Trinity County here, I will say for my area I saw more deer on stand this year than any of the last 7 yrs on my place. Having said that mature buck sightings were definitely a lot lower than years past, both on hoof and on the cameras. The area I hunt is pretty heavily pressured but the gun shots heard close by is definitely down from years past. We have a good crop of 2-3 yr old deer but when everyone is hunting the same 2-3 mature bucks they feel that pressure quick. It took me 31 sits to get it done this yr but I finally connected, just took longer than normal. Fawn crop was definitely down this year and coyote sightings went up. We will have to work on that this year

[Yamahamma]

^^Agree^^

Although a MLD, we killed too many does. This year, our hunters killed too many under 2-1/2 yr old. My cameras caught three and that is all that visited my plot the all year. As of two weeks ago, all three came by while I was on stand. One is a shooter, her fawn and a tag along. Didn't consider shooting them although we had the tags to do it. Lease kill 60 deer this year. 48 does (almost half too young for shooting), 12 bucks, a few culls, 5 were too young, a couple of management and keepers.

We levy fines but apparently not enough. It happens every weekend.


Restraint or lose the herd.

[Anvilheadtexas]

^^Agree^^

Although a MLD, we killed too many does. This year, our hunters killed too many under 2-1/2 yr old. My cameras caught three and that is all that visited my plot the all year. As of two weeks ago, all three came by while I was on stand. One is a shooter, her fawn and a tag along. Didn't consider shooting them although we had the tags to do it. Lease kill 60 deer this year. 48 does (almost half too young for shooting), 12 bucks, a few culls, 5 were too young, a couple of management and keepers.

We levy fines but apparently not enough. It happens every weekend.


Restraint or lose the herd.

On how many acres? 60 deer may be too high and maybe not?

[JhuntsAlot]

I hunt in Houston County on around 200 acres and the quality seemed better, at least that I caught on camera, but the numbers seemed about the same. It was rare seeing them during daylight and definitely not on corn very often at all. And when I say the same I mean they seem low.

I am coming to find that "low" is a norm for the area. It is certainly not like West or South Texas hunting.

It is rough hunting, but I really like hunting in the woods and the cool things I have seen. Had some beautiful mornings in the tree stand.


J

[tbgascorer]

Good thread Brandon. Y’all definitely used to see more deer and bigger deer , does and bucks. I don’t think you have enough hogs to deter them too much. I know you attracted lots of bucks when you fed protein and I think they hung around longer. Haven’t y’all been planting less and less acreage the last few years? Could that be why fewer deer sightings? I would agree that maybe too much pressure on the doe segment might have them more skittish. I also wouldn’t discount the pressure on 13”+ bucks. Someone else mentioned spikes as well. Why kill your yearling bucks and then complain 4 years later about why fewer mature animals to harvest? While I am in favor of the AR, you’ve heard me say for years that it has put too much pressure on the bucks in my part of the state. We had the worst few years I have ever seen up there. Not quantity, but quality. It’s been declining since AR inception. Too much pressure on that one type of deer. They don’t have a chance. I wouldn’t discount weather either. We haven’t had much cold weather . Hell, my flowering plants in the front yard haven’t even died off this year. Not much cold to knock back the native browse. Also, banner years for acorns in a lot of areas. Not sure about Polk.

[Bayouboy]

Renfro Hunting Club. Angelina County. 22 does and 18 bucks. Way down. Some very nice bucks were killed. But, deer numbers and sightings were way down. No major cold fronts to kill off the browse left deer with plenty of food choices besides corn. Surrounding leases pretty much had the same type of year. Glad I was able to get mine early.

[Anvilheadtexas]

Good thread Brandon. Y’all definitely used to see more deer and bigger deer , does and bucks. I don’t think you have enough hogs to deter them too much. I know you attracted lots of bucks when you fed protein and I think they hung around longer. Haven’t y’all been planting less and less acreage the last few years? Could that be why fewer deer sightings? I would agree that maybe too much pressure on the doe segment might have them more skittish. I also wouldn’t discount the pressure on 13”+ bucks. Someone else mentioned spikes as well. Why kill your yearling bucks and then complain 4 years later about why fewer mature animals to harvest? While I am in favor of the AR, you’ve heard me say for years that it has put too much pressure on the bucks in my part of the state. We had the worst few years I have ever seen up there. Not quantity, but quality. It’s been declining since AR inception. Too much pressure on that one type of deer. They don’t have a chance. I wouldn’t discount weather either. We haven’t had much cold weather . Hell, my flowering plants in the front yard haven’t even died off this year. Not much cold to knock back the native browse. Also, banner years for acorns in a lot of areas. Not sure about Polk.

Jason. Thank you. Let me see if I can answer... yes we plant less, but when we were more active we rarely saw a deer during the peak rut spend a lot of time on the food plots. The plots we planted this fall already have those long looking shoots of oats normally they are clipped down. And as you know we have never relied on feeders to shoot deer but we do run them on the property . Anyone who has a few years of East Texas hunting under their belt should know early to mid November the woods are going to be full of acorns and other food every year...the feeders just don’t pull the deer like other parts of Texas.

Weather...I hunted hard this year during the peak of the rut and I just did not see deer....years past I saw deer chase on 70to 80 degree days. With all due respect the weather has nothing to do with this.

Pressure...nah. It’s the same pressure that has always been there. it’s just now the pressure has been on all four classes ... old bucks, young bucks (unbranched) and does for several years. Again it’s cumulative it’s not just one year of a neighbor hammering deer (which you know I do not have neighbors who unmercifully hammer deer that I know of). I do have neighbors who take deer legally every year and that starts to add up when you’re productive does end up in coolers . My place has always died after Nov 20th or so, just like many places in east tx. By thanksgiving this year I decided to lay off does and not shoot any this year (not that we ever hammered them anyways). It was an irrelevant declaration since I literally did not see any after mid November.

Regarding your thoughts on I used to have bigger deer that’s not necessarily true we had two very nice deer on camera ...one that spent more time on the MLB club to my north and was ultimately taken by a member and then another but we had one daylight picture of him. Back in the day we did see those mature dear and it usually involves them chasing a doe . More importantly it’s interesting how a lot of responses on this thread automatically migrate towards the discussion of old mature bucks and whether or not they saw many of the season and that’s not really where we should be focusing our attention’s at the moment. We should be focusing our attention on does.

Let’s see what others say....