single vs dual cams real question

[HdFilmmaker]

OK, I have two bows both DW# set to 65. The dual seems harder to pull then the single. Is this just my own weird thoughts or is there really a difference in pulling two different designs. I'm sure that "cam-over" has something to do with the "ease" of pulling. Also, will the exact same arrow fly faster or different in either bow?

thanks

[Larry]

Single cams are typically smoother drawing. It does depend on which bow models you're dealing with, though. Older Bowtech models would have smooth and fast draw mods that you could tweak the draw smoothness of the dual cams. As for the speed of the arrows, again it depends on the bow. Every bow is going to have a slightly different (and sometimes drastic) speed difference depending on the model, cams, etc.

[HdFilmmaker]

The Bear I'm shooting is their Mauler they gave me, it has the dual cam. I'm 6'6 245# and I can only pull this bow about 18 shots at the range. The other bow, I can do 30 or 40 shots?

[Larry]

How do you know they're both set at 65#? It's possible that the Mauler is set heavier than you think unless you're sure. My only experience with dual cam bows is with Bowtech. There's one particular model that I had for a few months that was the harshest dual cam bow I've ever drawn. Didn't keep it long and went back to something easier on the shoulder. Someone with Bear bow experience can weigh in on the Mauler.

I just googled Bear Mauler, and it looks to be a single cam?

[HdFilmmaker]

Yes you are correct I got my models backwards. The bear is the harder one. I had them both on the poundage at Smithfield. I had a High Country that had duals and it was set at around 65 and shot as straight as an arrow. oh wait. lol I think The Bear (single cam) set at 65 is shooting slower then the dual cam set at 65. Thats just based on my eyes of the arrow flight.

[Shaft_Slinger]

Did a side by side comparison thru the chrono today my 2014 PSE DNA Dream season vs my Mathews HTR no cam both set at 29" draw and 65# with my beeman arrows (415g) 340 spine DNA-291 HTR-279 with gold tip hunters 350 spine (382g total) DNA-305 HTR-293 I can't pick between the two of which one I like best I'm comfortable with both and can shoot either with confidence

[Bowtech38]

I know my bowtech assassin is a dual cam and its pretty stuff to break over the cams but to let it down itll almost rip your arm off.

[Larry]

Not unusual for a single cam to shoot slower than a dual cam. High Country bows are typically pretty stout on the draw cycle. They're usually fast shooting bows, as a result.

I vote stick to the easier to draw single cam. Don't worry much about speed. Worry more about comfort and ease of shooting, in my opinion. The Mauler is plenty fast.

[Rubi513]

Everybody has their own opinion.
Here is mine.
I like to go off of the speed I wish to achieve and it still be smooth.
A lot of folks talk about how smooth the elite bows or Mathews no cam bows are. While they are smooth, they are also slow.
You can shoot a speed bow at less poundage than either the elite or Mathews and yet still achieve the same speed or more and it feel just as smooth.

[Kirby86]

I own a Bear Mauler (first compound) and an Obsession Knightmare.

The Knightmare is a stiffer draw cycle but once it hits peak weight, its steady throughout the cycle. The Mauler (like most solo cams) has a bit of build up then a slight bump before dropping off into the valley.
As a result, the Knightmare is the faster bow, but the draw cycle is technically "smoother" as there are no humps or bumps between it and the valley.
Your definition of "smooth" and mine, or Bob or Joe's will be subjective. The best thing to look at if you want to get super technical with it, is to look at a draw force curve.

Also, if you really want to make that Mauler feel like a totally different bow, swap out the stock cable slide for a Saunders Hyperglide, and look into a Bomar Cable Stop. That bow has a LONG valley, and the wall is pretty mushy with the stock cable stop, and the bomar will firm it up in a really awesome way. You'll lose a little valley, but not much.

[HdFilmmaker]

I own a Bear Mauler (first compound) and an Obsession Knightmare.

The Knightmare is a stiffer draw cycle but once it hits peak weight, its steady throughout the cycle. The Mauler (like most solo cams) has a bit of build up then a slight bump before dropping off into the valley.
As a result, the Knightmare is the faster bow, but the draw cycle is technically "smoother" as there are no humps or bumps between it and the valley.
Your definition of "smooth" and mine, or Bob or Joe's will be subjective. The best thing to look at if you want to get super technical with it, is to look at a draw force curve.

Also, if you really want to make that Mauler feel like a totally different bow, swap out the stock cable slide for a Saunders Hyperglide, and look into a Bomar Cable Stop. That bow has a LONG valley, and the wall is pretty mushy with the stock cable stop, and the bomar will firm it up in a really awesome way. You'll lose a little valley, but not much.

Kirby thanks for the info. I was thinking there were performance upgrades to do to the Bear. But noone ever talks about those types of upgrades. What else do guys change out for performance?

[Kirby86]

I picked up a few lbs and a few fps with the saunders.

Not really much else you can change to get more performance besides making sure the timing is correct and in spec. Proper tuning, whether it be paper tuning, modified french tuning or broadhead tuning will also net you a few FPS, though paper tuning is just to make sure that the arrow is coming off your bow level.

One thing that the bear models from that particular time frame were notorious for were draw lengths coming in too long. I'm a 30 inch draw length, but I actually shoot a 29 inch mod for that reason. If you look online, a few places still carry the mod. Its the same mod as the Carnage, Attack and Assault.

The only thing I don't really care for on that bow is where the string stops are placed. Since they're placed lower than most other string stops (a lot like the Mathews Chill-R), you can get string slapped pretty easily if your DL is too long.

Only other things I did to mine were Bowjax on the limbs, and Rizr-Jax on the riser, along with some cat whiskers on the string. It's one of the quieter bows I've ever been around as a result.

Back before I switched to the 29in mod, I was getting 265fps @ 72/30 with a 460gr arrow.

[HdFilmmaker]

I picked up a few lbs and a few fps with the saunders.

Not really much else you can change to get more performance besides making sure the timing is correct and in spec. Proper tuning, whether it be paper tuning, modified french tuning or broadhead tuning will also net you a few FPS, though paper tuning is just to make sure that the arrow is coming off your bow level.

One thing that the bear models from that particular time frame were notorious for were draw lengths coming in too long. I'm a 30 inch draw length, but I actually shoot a 29 inch mod for that reason. If you look online, a few places still carry the mod. Its the same mod as the Carnage, Attack and Assault.

The only thing I don't really care for on that bow is where the string stops are placed. Since they're placed lower than most other string stops (a lot like the Mathews Chill-R), you can get string slapped pretty easily if your DL is too long.

Only other things I did to mine were Bowjax on the limbs, and Rizr-Jax on the riser, along with some cat whiskers on the string. It's one of the quieter bows I've ever been around as a result.

Back before I switched to the 29in mod, I was getting 265fps @ 72/30 with a 460gr arrow.

What kind of mod did you do to your DL? Thats actually one of the issues with this bow is it seems "long". But perhaps I need to change this too a 29.

[Kirby86]

The mauler has a draw length specific module on the bottom cam. If you look closely, you'll see that its held in place by two allen screws. Of course, if you move it, you will need to move the cable stop to the corresponding peg so that you have the proper setting for your draw length.

If you don't yet know your draw length, try this
http://www.huntersfriend.com/bow_siz...ent_guide.html or go by a shop and have it measured.