Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

Militarized police

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

    #61
    Well this thread will be deleted within two hours...

    Comment


      #62
      Originally posted by narco1 View Post
      This same type of vehicle was used by San Marcos PD to get kids out of schools during the floods
      don't get me wrong, i'm not against them having a couple of these around, but wouldn't a boat be the better choice in the scenario you are talking about? and a lot cheaper to buy/operate i'm sure.
      kinda like bringing out a few ladder trucks to block traffic at a fender bender instead of an old red school bus. yeah I know it's not near as sexy, but a lot less expensive for the taxpayer.

      Comment


        #63
        Originally posted by Jmh05 View Post
        To me it's a public perception, one that most Americans are finding unease with. Police looking like the military invokes the perception of war. We should not wonder if it's the police or the Army patrolling our streets. We need police and they need the tools to deal with civil issues, but I don't think MRAPS, bayonets (federal government gave 15k or so to police departments through that program), the army's latest camo etc are necessary. There are other uniforms, patterns and vehicles they can use to help keep a separation between our civil servants and our soldiers. We need a strong police presence to preserve and protect...not militarily intimidate here in America.

        And Hooligan said it best.
        So should they just paint all the MRAPS pink and coat them with bunnies, would that make you feel better? The only weapons in these vehicles are the ones the officers are carrying. There is nothing militarized about these vehicles, they just stop bullets.

        It's amazing you think a local government would be allowed to have anything they don't really need. Some police departments struggle to get decent pens. You don't get most of what you really need. You don't know what you're talking about and no one is going to convince you.

        You're in the military and can't see the advantage of an armored vehicle in a gunfight? Or you just want the police at a disadvantage?

        Comment


          #64
          Originally posted by Iehooligan11b View Post
          I've seen your points and pretty much agreed with you until this point. Us Fighting insurgents in Afghanistan is much different than the typical duties of police protecting and serving the citizens of the United States over here. We don't patrol in Afghanistan to give traffic tickets and respond to burglaries, robberies, etc. We go find engage, close with and destroy the enemy. To compare those two is a bit of a stretch I believe. How many officers have you known to have their patrol car hit an IED here in the states? Two different jobs, needing two different sets of tools.

          Now don't get me wrong, I'm not in the group of oh police shouldn't have any military gear. I think yall should have whatever you need to do your job and get home to your families at the end of the day. But it's that mentality that's becoming so common of what seems like Us vs them with police that is a bit nerve racking. If you look at a daily patrol in your community, neighborhood which you chose to serve and protect, in your mind the same as an infantryman on mission in a combat zone, deployed to war.. Is it hard to see why people get uneasy?
          The police aren't patrolling and running traffic in these vehicles. I respect the officer that puts on a uniform and goes to work everyday just the same as I do our service men and women that do the same. The next time you leave home may be your last for law enforcement or the military personnel.

          Comment


            #65
            .

            Originally posted by stickerpatch59 View Post
            don't get me wrong, i'm not against them having a couple of these around, but wouldn't a boat be the better choice in the scenario you are talking about? and a lot cheaper to buy/operate i'm sure.
            kinda like bringing out a few ladder trucks to block traffic at a fender bender instead of an old red school bus. yeah I know it's not near as sexy, but a lot less expensive for the taxpayer.
            These vehicles are surplus from the government, surplus meaning "already available in large quantities". They either get used or turned into scrap, why not give them out to local PD's and SO's to use (for free) which they are, since they were already paid for by taxes with the Iraq war in mind.

            Comment


              #66
              Originally posted by Tower43 View Post
              So should they just paint all the MRAPS pink and coat them with bunnies, would that make you feel better? The only weapons in these vehicles are the ones the officers are carrying. There is nothing militarized about these vehicles, they just stop bullets.

              It's amazing you think a local government would be allowed to have anything they don't really need. Some police departments struggle to get decent pens. You don't get most of what you really need. You don't know what you're talking about and no one is going to convince you.

              You're in the military and can't see the advantage of an armored vehicle in a gunfight? Or you just want the police at a disadvantage?
              Dang you guys get emotional...and your reading comprehension sucks! Calm down and re-read some of the post brosef. There isn't one person on here that doesn't back our guys in BLUE

              Comment


                #67
                Originally posted by Jmh05 View Post
                To me it's a public perception, one that most Americans are finding unease with. Police looking like the military invokes the perception of war. We should not wonder if it's the police or the Army patrolling our streets. We need police and they need the tools to deal with civil issues, but I don't think MRAPS, bayonets (federal government gave 15k or so to police departments through that program), the army's latest camo etc are necessary. There are other uniforms, patterns and vehicles they can use to help keep a separation between our civil servants and our soldiers. We need a strong police presence to preserve and protect...not militarily intimidate here in America.

                And Hooligan said it best.

                1. Normal patrolmen don't patrol in jungle cammies or black suits with masks and goggles on.

                2. I would love for you to find me a legitimate patrol officer that has a bayonet attached to his patrol rifle. I'll wait.

                3. MRAPS have already been explained in this thread, they serve a legitimate police purpose.

                4. Regardless of whether or not SWAT teams storm a barricaded suspect's house in Barney the dinosaur suits or jungle camo, the weapons and tactics are going to be the same.

                Comment


                  #68
                  Originally posted by Jmh05 View Post
                  Dang you guys get emotional...and your reading comprehension sucks! Calm down and re-read some of the post brosef. There isn't one person on here that doesn't back our guys in BLUE

                  His response wasn't emotional at all. I think you're misinterpreting adult and rational debate for emotion. No one has called anyone names and there's been no disrespect. Let's keep it that way.

                  Comment


                    #69
                    Originally posted by Jmh05 View Post
                    Dang you guys get emotional...and your reading comprehension sucks! Calm down and re-read some of the post brosef. There isn't one person on here that doesn't back our guys in BLUE
                    So back the blue with armored vehicles, they wouldn't drive them if they didn't need them. Whatever it takes to get the job done and stay safe. Anyone who thinks our police look militarized has never been in a combat zone and seen what a real militarized truck looks like

                    Comment


                      #70
                      Originally posted by jshouse View Post
                      Daniel and/or Tvc184, how do you think your department, your chief, your fellow officers would respond to "the government" telling them to start rounding up weapons in their neighborhoods?
                      I imagine that they/he/we would tell them to take a hike.

                      Like all questions however, it depends on what you mean. What is "round ing up"?

                      The phrase to me it sounds like going into people's home or vehicles with no warrant with a concerted effort to remove something and in this case, firearms. That simply won't happen when I am on duty as a supervisor. On the other hand I have been rounding up firearms for the last 32+ years. When having a handgun in public had no CHL to make carry lawful was a crime, I have arrested people for UCW. That doesn't sound roundup-ish to me but I am sure that some people might think so if they don't agree with the UCW law then and even now.

                      In 1763 William Pitt, a member of the British House of Commons (and later Prime Minister), addressed that body and stated, .........."The poorest man may in his cottage bid defiance to all the forces of the crown. It may be frail; its roof may shake; the wind may blow through it; the storm may enter; the rain may enter; but the King of England cannot enter - all his force dares not cross the threshold of the ruined tenement!".

                      We teach that in the police academy (I taught it two weeks ago) and unfortunately some officers sometimes forget that. It is just as correct today as it was 250 years ago.

                      Comment


                        #71
                        I am about as suspicious of the government as anybody, and I don't really have a problem with the police having these, unless they start buying hundreds of them

                        The real rub for me is why don't I have one for myself

                        And what I hope the men and women in blue will remember is that our rights as citizens are not going to be taken away immediately in some quick overnight event, they will erode slowly and overtime and taking away guns from normal people will just seem like the right thing to do. I just hope that if and when the time comes the majority of local LEOs side with the Constitution.

                        Assuming the constitution even exist at that point.
                        Last edited by flatlander; 02-26-2016, 06:50 PM.

                        Comment


                          #72
                          Originally posted by deerslay3r View Post
                          These vehicles are surplus from the government, surplus meaning "already available in large quantities". They either get used or turned into scrap, why not give them out to local PD's and SO's to use (for free) which they are, since they were already paid for by taxes with the Iraq war in mind.
                          as I stated, i'm not against them having some of them. I was just talking about using the right equip for the job.

                          Comment


                            #73
                            The term militarized police is a loose term created by the media to scare people, it builds a lot of hype and they can use any cop with a gun to fit the image. Police are very militarized and not in the way that everyone is thinking. I would guess about half of all cops are former military. So what is more dangerous a little bit of equipment or a few hundred guys with military training, including former spec ops guys? That is militarized! But it means nothing, and has been going on for 100 years.

                            Comment


                              #74
                              Why does the idea of "it's better to have it and not need it than to need it and not have it" apply to those civilians who carry a handgun and it doesn't apply to LEOs with an armored vehicle?

                              You don't carry a gun for the 99.99999% of interactions with strangers, you carry for the .00001%! Same goes for officers and armored vehicles. Most situations don't call for it but when a situation comes up where they do need it, it's probably a blessing to have one parked at the station.

                              Comment


                                #75
                                Originally posted by Daniel75 View Post
                                1. Normal patrolmen don't patrol in jungle cammies or black suits with masks and goggles on.

                                2. I would love for you to find me a legitimate patrol officer that has a bayonet attached to his patrol rifle. I'll wait.

                                3. MRAPS have already been explained in this thread, they serve a legitimate police purpose.

                                4. Regardless of whether or not SWAT teams storm a barricaded suspect's house in Barney the dinosaur suits or jungle camo, the weapons and tactics are going to be the same.
                                Bro Daniel, I'm not starting a fight with ya or making it personal. Heck I will buy ya a beer if we ever meet up for some TBH event.

                                No normal patrol men don't swat out, but I have actually seen a few beat guys wearing full kit. 2) of course not. But on the list of materials released to civilian police departments, thousands of bayonets were issued- that's a fact. 3) is your opinion- I respect that. 4) I agree with, it's my opinion there are alternate uniforms than current military issue patterns.

                                It's turning in to a broken record around here. I'm all for the police having what they need, just not EXACTLY what our 11 series and CAR's need. I want a protected America not a militarized civilian servant America.

                                I've got deer tenderloins to cook and a frozen mug to pour a beer in. Best wishes- and thanks for your LEO service.

                                Comment

                                Working...
                                X